Is the UK now owned by muslims?

[Ignatius the Kiwi]

No, there are immigration controls but people with British citizenship can come and live here, as far as I'm aware. I've looked it up and it's a complicated issue.

What immigration controls are there in the UK? Haven't the last few years been particularly high for immigration, both legal and illegal?

 

[Ignatius the Kiwi]

Of course, it's a dog whistle for "too many brown people".

Do all societies have to become multi ethnic, multicultural and multireligious societies fire? Or just the ones you dislike?

 

[rebornfree]

I’m from the UK and I think this rioting is disgusting. However, I do have serious concerns about immigration as many Brits do. We are a small country, already over-crowded. Our free healthcare system is crumbling. I have seen this as I work in healthcare. There are not enough houses to house everyone. We have veterans sleeping on the streets yet people seeking asylum are prioritised for housing. Many Brits who have paid into the system their whole lives cannot get a dentist unless they pay privately and struggle to get a GP appointment.

In an ideal world, yes, we should welcome everyone BUT we are a small country, already over-crowded and we do not have the space or resources to just let everybody in. It’s only going to get worse. I am not ‘far-right’. I pray for peace and I completely understand why people flee from their countries and seek asylum…but I am also very concerned about the future of this country.

I agree that we need to control the numbers and have felt for a while that we need to distinguish between economic migrants and refugees. The former should take their place in the queue, as we would if emigrating to another country.The latter we should help, along with other 'safe' countries imo.

I wonder what people are told about Britain before they come here. Do they think it's paved with gold (jobs, homes) when it's paved with the homeless? I met a homeless lady from an eastern European country. She said that she had to share a bed with her children in her home country. Not ideal, but better than sleeping on the pavement in a foreign country I would think.

I think it's the difficulty of controlling the small boats coming across the Channel (and the lack of resources for everyone, as you mentioned) which has caused tensions to rise, and then the misinformation about the culprit in the Southport stabbings causing the anger to be wrongly directed at the Muslim community.

It depends on whether you see "your" country as truly yours or belongs to God.

Biblically - speaking, we are to welcome foreigners. The only exceptions are foreigners who only intend to do evil. Yet, we do not keep everyone out because some did evil. We must examine each one individually, not discriminate a whole ethnic or religious group.

We must not judge anyone by their ability to make money as well. God doesn't.

Agreed.

I have thought for some time that our country is being ruled by fear.
We are afraid of offending anyone because the more extreme Muslims may get violent. It is the extremists who are doing the damage; peace-loving Muslims say they are damaging the faith and distance themselves from them. I seem to remember a "not in my name" hashtag that was trending a few years ago.

I think that's a really important point - to distinguish between the extreme Muslims, who have been behind terror attacks, and the moderates who just want to live their lives peacefully

 

[rebornfree]

What immigration controls are there in the UK? Haven't the last few years been particularly high for immigration, both legal and illegal?

Apparently there are six categories of British citizenship/nationality/subject which are taken into account.
Immigration has been high due to wars in the Middle East and maybe unstable regimes in some countries, which of course makes the immigrants refugees. This all needs to be processed which takes time.

 

[Ignatius the Kiwi]

Apparently there are six categories of British citizenship/nationality/subject which are taken into account.
Immigration has been high due to wars in the Middle East and maybe unstable regimes in some countries, which of course makes the immigrants refugees. This all needs to be processed which takes time.

And why does the UK have to accept these people?

 

[rebornfree]

And why does the UK have to accept these people?

Compassion for the refugees and, imo, a moral obligation to those from former colonies.

 

[Ignatius the Kiwi]

Compassion for the refugees and, imo, a moral obligation to those from former colonies.

Is this a universal duty of all countries, nationalities and peoples?

 

[timewerx]

Can you demonstrate to me where in the bible foreigners are to be welcomed and that this is the universal Christian policy? Where did Jesus advocate this policy?

Leviticus 19:34
The alien who resides with you shall be to you as the citizen among you; you shall love the alien as yourself, for you were aliens in the land of Egypt: I am the Lord your God.

A simple search and I found this as well:

22 Bible Verses on Welcoming Immigrants

‘Cursed is anyone who withholds justice from the foreigner, the fatherless or the widow.’

sojo.net

Why can't a society look at someone and see how they will or will not contribute to society financially and whether or not they will be a net benefit? Is everyone entitled to live anywhere they want and have taxpayers cover their expense?

Unbelievers may think in such ways because they don't know the ways of our Lord.

But we Christians who keeps on reading acts of mercy towards the unfortunate in the Bible, it doesn't make sense to take up actions to contradict our own beliefs.

Besides, rich countries already benefit financially from poor people in other countries by outsourcing manufacturing to poor countries.

It would be a huge act of injustice and hypocrisy to deny them a chance at living a better life both from a secular and Christian perspective.

 

[FireDragon76]

I doubt it has anything to do with color. Its just the media narrative. It was not so long ago when Brits hated the Eastern European workers (white people and culturally compatible).

When media shout "racism", its almost always something else.

It's color and race. At one time in the UK, not too long ago, it wasn't uncommon for English people to consider even Irish to be a different and inferior race. Eastern Europeans wouldn't be that different.

 

[timewerx]

Is this a universal duty of all countries, nationalities and peoples?

Yes for countries that are regarded as "Christian".

 

[Ignatius the Kiwi]

Leviticus 19:34
The alien who resides with you shall be to you as the citizen among you; you shall love the alien as yourself, for you were aliens in the land of Egypt: I am the Lord your God.

So the Israelites had a duty to incorporate aliens into their society? Isn't that what lead them astray since they intermingled with Pagans and began worshipping foreign gods?

A simple search and I found this as well:

22 Bible Verses on Welcoming Immigrants

‘Cursed is anyone who withholds justice from the foreigner, the fatherless or the widow.’

sojo.net

Unbelievers may think in such ways because they don't know the ways of our Lord.

So our Lord would support the forced taking of wealth and it being given to those who didnt earn it?

But we Christians who keeps on reading acts of mercy towards the unfortunate in the Bible, it doesn't make sense to take up actions to contradict our own beliefs.

and we require the government to do this?

Besides, rich countries already benefit financially from poor people in other countries by outsourcing manufacturing to poor countries.

Does that benefit the poorer classes in their native countries?

It would be a huge act of injustice and hypocrisy to deny them a chance at living a better life both from a secular and Christian perspective.

So we have to allow the entire world into our countries?

 

[Ignatius the Kiwi]

Yes for countries that are regarded as "Christian".

Can you name a Christian country?

 

[timewerx]

Can you name a Christian country?

Christian state - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Includes Britain.

 

[Ignatius the Kiwi]

Christian state - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Includes Britain.

I thought the UK was a secular Liberal Democracy.

 

[timewerx]

So the Israelites had a duty to incorporate aliens into their society? Isn't that what lead them astray since they intermingled with Pagans and began worshipping foreign gods?

God punished both Israelites who goes after pagan gods and also the pagans so this isn't just the fault of aliens.

So our Lord would support the forced taking of wealth and it being given to those who didnt earn it?

European conquests of the centuries past also took vast amounts of wealth from foreign lands while also abusing and killing people from these lands.

Rich countries still take advantage of the cheap labor of people living in poor countries.

Is it okay with the Lord if white people pillaged the whole world centuries ago but not okay if colored people wants to immigrate to the lands of white people?

By account of generational sins alone, these poor immigrants are indeed entitled to your tax contributions even if they don't work for it.

Even if we ignore the fact that historically, Europeans pillaged many countries of resources, including slave labor (especially if USA) and still taking advantage of cheap labor and resources of poor countries. We should still show mercy and kindness to our poor neighbors.

 

[Ignatius the Kiwi]

God punished both Israelites who goes after pagan gods and also the pagans so this isn't just the fault of aliens.

Yes but it's your contention that in the Old Testament there is no distinguishing between the Alien and the Israelite, when one of the main themes of the Old Testament is for the Israelites to keep themselves separate from the Pagans so they would not be polluted. This is why they were forbidden to intermarry with non Israelites and were not to tolerate (at all) any establishment of altars and preaching to foreign Gods. The reason why is obvious, doing so would lead them astray. Yet you're almost saying they should have done that, something God punished them routinely for.

European conquests of the centuries past also took vast amounts of wealth from foreign lands while also abusing and killing people from these lands.

Just so we're clear, past European behavior justifies the demographic, cultural and religious change in Europe?

Rich countries still take advantage of the cheap labor of people living in poor countries.

Ok, and?

Is it okay with the Lord if white people pillaged the whole world centuries ago but not okay if colored people wants to immigrate to the lands of white people?

I think you're embracing a narrative that is rather simplistic, as if the Europeans only exploited and never helped foreign peoples. Infrastructure and civilization were bought to many parts of the world via European colonization and if it wasn't the Europeans under the aegis of Christianity, it would have been other civilizations that attempted this, Islam or Asian societies. But here's the thing, what would be your argument to the Native Americans who resisted English colonialism? Based on how you are arguing now, it seems they had no choice but to accept European settlers. No one has the right to resist or complain about migrants.

By account of generational sins alone, these poor immigrants are indeed entitled to your tax contributions even if they don't work for it.

Oh so the white man must pay for the sins of his ancestors. Interesting.

Even if we ignore the fact that historically, Europeans pillaged many countries of resources, including slave labor (especially if USA) and still taking advantage of cheap labor and resources of poor countries. We should still show mercy and kindness to our poor neighbors.

How does encouraging the entire world to migrate to Europe help your poor neighbours? Especially African ones? If the solution for the average African isn't to stay in Africa and develop that society how will Africa ever get to the point of Europe? How is it merciful and kind to the native populations of Europe who contribute to society to pay for all the costs of those new arrivals? It's a suicidal.

 

[Merrill]

I am of the firm belief that demographic changes, immigration, and cultural changes in the UK will result in England becoming a Muslim country within 10-15 years

what this means is that a majority of the politicians and officials will be of the Muslim faith, and some of them will be white/British Muslims. The political system will be modified to accommodate Islam. Many churches will be converted into mosques

now this doesn't mean the country turns into Afghanistan or Somalia. It will probably look something like Lebanon or Egypt

but one thing I can promise, the political and social far-left, with its kiddie drag shows, brothels, hard drugs, mass homelessness, transgenderism, etc. will not be tolerated. That stuff goes away when conservative Muslims take charge

 

[Arcangl86]

I am of the firm belief that demographic changes, immigration, and cultural changes in the UK will result in England becoming a Muslim country within 10-15 years

what this means is that a majority of the politicians and officials will be of the Muslim faith, and some of them will be white/British Muslims. The political system will be modified to accommodate Islam. Many churches will be converted into mosques

Muslims currently make up a whopping 6.5% of UK citizens. And based on historical trends they will only be at about 8-9% in 10 years. And right now with 6.5% of the population being Muslim, only about 4% of the House of Commons is Muslim. So if parliament is less representative than the UK right now, the only way for its politicians and officials to be majority Muslim is for a large majority of the population to become so, and that's not likely at all.

 

[FireDragon76]

Muslims currently make up a whopping 6.5% of UK citizens. And based on historical trends they will only be at about 8-9% in 10 years. And right now with 6.5% of the population being Muslim, only about 4% of the House of Commons is Muslim. So if parliament is less representative than the UK right now, the only way for its politicians and officials to be majority Muslim is for a large majority of the population to become so, and that's not likely at all.

Indeed.

Is tolerance and acceptance being confused with approval or agreement? I think that's the issue. Religions like Islam in western countries don't typically get alot of converts.

I see the same kind of delusive thinking among Orthodox Christians. They think because a few high profile Evangelicals become Orthodox, that somehow there's growth happening, but it's always been offset by the fact churches like the Orthodox bleed members continually due to attrition, intermarriage, and secularism.

 

[Adam56]

The very least we can do is allow them to come here, which is their right, and make them welcome.

Immigration is not a right, it’s a privilege.

Also, do you work for the UK government? Because they’re the ones who decide who gets to come in.