Is the Church a higher authority than the scripture?

[HypoTypoSis]

• Which comes first, the Constitution or the people?
• Who is saved, the scriptures or the people?
• Which is saved, the writings or to whom the writings are meant for?
• Who shall be with, in and where the Father and Son are, 50 jillion mass printed copies of the bible or those that are saved in Christ Jesus?
• Which was made for the other, the bible for the people or the people for the bible or, for that matter,
• The Constitution for the people or the people for the Constitution?

 

[Albion]

"Those in Christ, i.e The Church, are above Scripture."

It would be interesting to debate that proposition, Hypo. What would "above" mean in that sentence, I am wondering? Anyway, this isn't the question asked by this thread.

 

[HypoTypoSis]

"Those in Christ, i.e The Church, are above Scripture."

this isn't the question asked by this thread.

Oh, but it is:

"Is the Church a higher authority than the scripture?"

Those in Christ ARE The Church.

Above = greater authority.

 

[Phitz]

Is Church a higher authority than the scriptures?... The Church is not God. God is the Church. The scriptures in the bible are spiritual inspirational truths that that most churches abide by to use as a guide for faith.
There is no such thing as a higher or lesser authority regarding Church in comparison to the scriptures. With out one the other don't exist... Without God both the Church and the Scriptures would not exist. Our Faith is based on what the Churches teach according to the scriptures... and the scriptures truth according to the inspiration of the holy spirit by God, to its people by faith.

 

[Albion]

Oh, but it is:

"Is the Church a higher authority than the scripture?"

Those in Christ ARE The Church.

Above = greater authority.

If that's what you mean--that "above" means "authority" when you use it. Without that explanation, however, we could understand quite a lot of different ideas by way of the word "above."

But is the Church, as you've defined it, a higher authority that the Scriptures? That may also require an inquiry as to what it meant by the words used here.

By "authority" the previous posters meant that which is the final say, the most entitled to decide doctrine for everyone else.

You may be meaning something else as you use the word. However, in the sense that the discussion had been using it, the people of God, i.e. the invisible "Church," cannot be above the Word of God unless the people have a right to make doctrine for themselves completely independent of Scripture.

I'm still asking where such an idea would come from. If I (or any of us) am to accept your contention as correct, it is necessary to know what it is based upon. Otherwise, we simply have an opinion to read and nothing more, with no way of knowing why anyone would think such a thing.

 

[Rick Otto]

quote=HypoTypoSis;
Ahh, but while all Zondervan has is a fat bank account I contain God, Himself.

Holy Tupperware!

Someday, you'll understand.

Perhaps if I become so full of myself I think I'm God, I will.

 

[HypoTypoSis]

The Church is not God.

Quite true, it is the people that make up the Church, ie those in Christ.

The scriptures in the bible are spiritual inspirational truths

No-o, the bible says, all scripture is given by inspiratin of God. Which is somewhat different from what you stated. Wherein God is specific we must not change.


There is no such thing as a higher or lesser authority regarding Church in comparison to the scriptures.

Again, the scriptures were written for man, specifically, those in Christ and that puts the Church, ie the members that make up the Church, above Zondervan's printed book.

With out one the other don't exist...

Not true, as Jesus Himself said, shutting up the word would only cause nature itlsef (the stones themselves) to cry out.

 

[HypoTypoSis]

Holy Tupperware!

Perhaps if I become so full of myself I think I'm God, I will.

Either you are not being truthful by altering what I said or you are incapable of comprehending what is written. What I said, in essence, was, He lives within me. Go back and check it again and, next time, correctly quote.

 

[HypoTypoSis]

...and I'll keep posting it as long as ya'll keep ignoring it....

Which comes first, the Constitution or the people?
Who is saved, the scriptures or the people?
Which is saved, the writings or to whom the writings are meant for?
Who shall be with, in and where the Father and Son are, 50 jillion mass printed copies of the bible or those that are saved in Christ Jesus?
Which was made for the other, the bible for the people or the people for the bible or, for that matter,
The Constitution for the people or the people for the Constitution?

 

[JoabAnias]

Holy Tupperware!

Perhaps if I become so full of myself I think I'm God, I will.

 

[Rick Otto]

God is the Church.

 

[Rick Otto]

Quote:
Originally Posted by sunlover1
You have more authority than God's words?
That's what the Zondervan's mass produced Bible
contains, God's Words.
Ahh, but while all Zondervan has is a fat bank account I contain God, Himself.

Someday, you'll understand.

Either you are not being truthful by altering what I said or you are incapable of comprehending what is written. What I said, in essence, was, He lives within me. Go back and check it again and, next time, correctly quote.

Well, there it is, Hyp. All I did was hit the quote button & it came up exactly the same. Go figure, eh?

Whatever it is you think, or I think, you're saying, it lacks any reason to supercede the authority of scripture, the word & Word of God, which had truth in it long before you were a gleam in your daddy's eye.

 

[JoabAnias]

long before you were a gleam in your daddy's eye.

Hey no profane to me? Im disappointed. And I bowed before you and everything too! Bah thats it, Im splitting off of the Church of Rick.

 

[Rick Otto]

If I have to slap ya around a little just to keep ya loyal & happy, let me see what I can do...

quote=JoabAnias;It can't be shown in Holy Scritpure where it says the canon of the Church is the highest authority.

Scripture is lousy with examples of it being the leash, & us being the dog (so to speak). The leash does not wear the dog, the dog does not lead the leash (not a on a good dog, anyway*):
First Things First:
John 1:1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
The Tail does not Wag the Dog:
Ps 119:105 - Thy word is a lamp unto my feet, and a light unto my path.
NOT "My feet are a lamp unto your word, and provide a path unto its light.

Authority comes from God and sometimes through men.

And the sometimes it comes thru men, it must be tested whether these men & what they're sellin' is for real:

Acts 17:11 These were more noble than those in Thessalonica, in that they received the word with all readiness of mind, and searched the scriptures daily, whether those things were so.

Now be a good dog & go lay down by your bowl!

*Do NOT ask me about my dog!

 

[sunlover1]

...and I'll keep posting it as long as ya'll keep ignoring it....

Which comes first, the Constitution or the people?
Who is saved, the scriptures or the people?
Which is saved, the writings or to whom the writings are meant for?
Who shall be with, in and where the Father and Son are, 50 jillion mass printed copies of the bible or those that are saved in Christ Jesus?
Which was made for the other, the bible for the people or the people for the bible or, for that matter,
The Constitution for the people or the people for the Constitution?

But we're not talking about the constitution.
I dont think you've been ignored, just some
different beliefs here.

God's Words does have authority over God's peeps.
In fact, His Words created God's peeps.

1 O give thanks unto the LORD; for he is good:
for his mercy endureth for ever.
2 O give thanks unto the God of gods:
for his mercy endureth for ever.
3 O give thanks to the Lord of lords:
for his mercy endureth for ever.
4 To him who alone doeth great wonders:
for his mercy endureth for ever.
5 To him that by wisdom made the heavens:
for his mercy endureth for ever.
6 To him that stretched out the earth above the waters:
for his mercy endureth for ever.
7 To him that made great lights:
for his mercy endureth for ever:
8 The sun to rulea by day:
for his mercy endureth for ever:
9 The moon and stars to rule by night:
for his mercy endureth for ever.
10 To him that smote Egypt in their firstborn: for his mercy endureth for ever:
11 And brought out Israel from among them:
for his mercy endureth for ever:
12 With a strong hand, and with a stretched out arm:
for his mercy endureth for ever.
13 To him which divided the Red sea into parts:
for his mercy endureth for ever:
14 And made Israel to pass through the midst of it:
for his mercy endureth for ever:
15 But overthrewb Pharaoh and his host in the Red sea:
for his mercy endureth for ever.
16 To him which led his people through the wilderness:
for his mercy endureth for ever.
17 To him which smote great kings:
for his mercy endureth for ever:
18 And slew famous kings:
for his mercy endureth for ever:
19 Sihon king of the Amorites:
for his mercy endureth for ever:
20 And Og the king of Bashan:
for his mercy endureth for ever:
21 And gave their land for an heritage:
for his mercy endureth for ever:
22 Even an heritage unto Israel his servant:
for his mercy endureth for ever.
23 Who remembered us in our low estate:
for his mercy endureth for ever:
24 And hath redeemed us from our enemies:
for his mercy endureth for ever.
25 Who giveth food to all flesh:
for his mercy endureth for ever.
26 O give thanks unto the God of heaven:
for his mercy endureth for ever. ​

 

[HypoTypoSis]

Quote:
Originally Posted by HypoTypoSis
Ahh, but while all Zondervan has is a fat bank account I contain God, Himself.


Quote:
23 I in them, and thou in me, that they may be made perfect in one; and that the world may know that thou hast sent me, and hast loved them, as thou hast loved me.

Quote:
26 And I have declared unto them thy name, and will declare it: that the love wherewith thou hast loved me may be in them, and I in them.


Quote:
What I said, in essence, was, He lives within me.

Whatever...[]...it lacks any reason to supercede the authority of scripture

Had you been following the thread and comprehending what had been said you would have understood it.

According to the following, can you comprehend and understand that I have the mind of God, that He through His Spirit lives within me, that I judge all things and, yet, am judged by no man or is it just foolishness to you?

14 But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.
15 But he that is spiritual judgeth all things, yet he himself is judged of no man.
16 For who hath known the mind of the Lord, that he may instruct him? But we have the mind of Christ.

According to the following the authority of the Church is preeminent to and takes precedent to the scriptures:

17 And he is before all things, and by him all things consist.
18 And he is the head of the body, the church: who is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead; that in all things he might have the preeminence.

• He is before all things... (which means He is above all bibles including Zondervan's, the Gideon's and the Vatican's versions)
• He is the head of the body, the church... (which means there is nothing above the Church)
• in all things He has preeminence (which means nothing is above the Church of which He is the Head)

Sure sounds like, according to the scriptures, the Church plainly takes first place.

Which is to say, the scriptures plainly state the Church is above everything, including the scriptures themselves.

 

[JoabAnias]

If I have to slap ya around a little just to keep ya loyal & happy, let me see what I can do...

Ok this is wierd. I replyed to this once and its gone? Hmmm, let me try this again.

Scripture is lousy

Oh no you didn't! Lol J/K

with examples of it being the leash, & us being the dog (so to speak). The leash does not wear the dog, the dog does not lead the leash (not a on a good dog, anyway*):

Exactly. Just as the word canon is translated as the measuring rod. The question is, what is it a measuring rod of? What is the leash necessary for?

First Things First:
John 1:1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.

Ok, Jesus is the word in this scripture. Which word do you think John was talking about? The Septuagint?

Ps 119:105 - Thy word is a lamp unto my feet, and a light unto my path.
NOT "My feet are a lamp unto your word, and provide a path unto its light.

Ok, Jesus is the light to our path and without Him we're in darkness. I fail to see where this is authority of a book but of He who is our light.

And the sometimes it comes thru men, it must be tested whether these men & what they're sellin' is for real:

Whose truth are you buying and does everyone agree with it?

Acts 17:11 These were more noble than those in Thessalonica, in that they received the word with all readiness of mind, and searched the scriptures daily, whether those things were so.

What word were they searching exactly, couldn't have been the New Testament as it didn't exist yet.

Now be a good dog & go lay down by your bowl!

*Do NOT ask me about my dog!

woof


Peace.

 

[Rick Otto]

Whose truth are you buying and does everyone agree with it?

Get right with God, not with everyone.

What word were they searching exactly, couldn't have been the New Testament as it didn't exist yet.

The word of God.
The NT isn't all by itself the word of God.

 

[JoabAnias]

Get right with God, not with everyone.

For sure but does everyone have the same interpretation of what that is?

The word of God.
The NT isn't all by itself the word of God.

True. Have you ever wondered how they determined the difference between the Abrahamic Law and the Mosaic Laws that were fulfilled by Jesus as those are contrary to what the Apostles were doing?

Peace.

 

[Rick Otto]

Stop with the worryin' 'bout everyone already. Tht's God's job. When everyone begins to worry about themselves in relation to God, everyone will be a whole lot less of a problem. Model that for everyone.

True. Have you ever wondered how they determined the difference between the Abrahamic Law and the Mosaic Laws that were fulfilled by Jesus as those are contrary to what the Apostles were doing?

JC & the Apostles didn't contradict. Rethink that.