Is Showing Cleavage Immodest? What Does the Bible Say?

[pgp_protector]

Well it looks like XSpiritualX removed her picture and deleted everything on her profile. Is she even a member now? >.<

On a side note I talked to my new pastor and he said two things abot "showing clevage".

The account is still active (You can tell by rep power) but they were active today (Last Activity: 17th January 2012)

1. If clevage is showing, by default people will notice. Most people do not look on purpose. Its built into us. He said its doesn't excuse a man from looking though, so the man is wrong on that part. But the woman he said is just as sinful for tempting a man. I asked him what if she wasn't meaning to? He said God says we are to dress modestly. So therefor a woman showing clevage is going against Gods rule.

I don't think Looking is an issue, leering on the other hand.
You have to walk around with your eyes open in life, or you're going to end up walking into trouble.
blinders only work when you're being guided at all times.

2. He said if someone has to ask the question "Is showing clevage a sin?", then they know they are wrong. The only reason to ask a question about something like that is if your feeling guilty inside about it.

I don't think that would really apply on this site given how many of the "is doing xyz a sin" threads their are. (some quite silly in actuality)

He also pointed out if any woman tries defending her right to show clevage, then she is feeling guilty inside and is lashing out because she doesn't want to accept that the guilt she feels is from God.

Would that also go for those that don't feel like they should wear berkas?

He is right. How many times as christians do we ask about something that we know is a sin and yet we should be realizing if you have to ask, then you already know the answer.

unless you don't know the answer.
Is it still a sin to eat shrimp?
Wear mixed fabric clothing?
Work on Saturday / Sunday ?
Ect...

 

[3rdHeaven]

I saw nothing offensive with XSpiritualX avatar and was FAR from explicit. One would have to be a total dork to consider it sexually explicit!

I had no idea this forum is that strict, just a hop skip and a jump from Islam

 

[pgp_protector]

I saw nothing offensive with XSpiritualX avatar and was FAR from explicit. One would have to be a total dork to consider it sexually explicit!

I had no idea this forum is that strict, just a hop skip and a jump from Islam

Thing is it might not of been the forum that did it, but the people crying about their avatar that drove them away.

 

[3rdHeaven]

Thing is it might not of been the forum that did it, but the people crying about their avatar that drove them away.

Dorks are every where!

 

[CounselorForChrist]

I don't think Looking is an issue, leering on the other hand.

Well yeah. Sometimes I do "look" and quickly look away. Most women are suprised that I can look at their eyes instead of their chest first. lol

Would that also go for those that don't feel like they should wear berkas?

Well technically thats a Muslim thing. Not the same religion or God. As long as the three basics are covered...breasts, butt and genitals, then in my mind our dressed modestly. Although there are some outfits today that could be seen as tempting to like really short shorts or the super tiny tank tops.

unless you don't know the answer.

Well in that case you shouldn't be feeling guilt. If you really don't know then you may just feel confused more then anything else. The feeling of guilt when you already know the answer is very diffrent. Its the Holy Spirit telling you its wrong.

If some has been a christian lets say 10 years, then they should know what the bible states by now. So therefor asking the question would be silly. Example... "Is it ok if I steal this movie?". If you know your ten commandments (and most should since its part of the core if the bible), it says "Thou shall not steal."

Most christians will ask a question they know the answer too because they are trying to justify in their head why its ok to do what is it they are going to do/have done. Heck I did that myself. I justified why it was ok to copy movies I rented. I asked on another forum years ago knowing full well it was stealing. Now I don't own anymore copied movies because they guilt God put on me (especially agfter reading this one book) made me overwhelmed. So I got rid of the stuff. And I feel 10000% better now. Its like a weight has been lifted off of my shoulders.

 

[Nienna_Lady_of_Tears]

We see enough cleavage on the Internet and the tube... Why bring it to CF?

Use Firefox and the Ad Block Plus add-on. I guarantee you won't see cleavage if you're not looking for it. I don't see ANY ads, whatsoever.

 

[Asvin]

I saw nothing offensive with XSpiritualX avatar and was FAR from explicit. One would have to be a total dork to consider it sexually explicit!

I had no idea this forum is that strict, just a hop skip and a jump from Islam

I considered it to be sexually explicit.. according to your definition, I might be a dork, but I don't care about your judgment because I know only God can judge me! God bless!

 

[pgp_protector]

I considered it to be sexually explicit.. according to your definition, I might be a dork, but I don't care about your judgment because I know only God can judge me! God bless!

You need to know what sexually explicit is then.

 

[Asvin]

What's your definition?

 

[znr]

I admit my mistake.. Not rape.. but other sins such as lusting and masturbation thinking about that particular woman! In today's culture, I don't think I need to explain to you how many people lust and touch over pictures that reveal too much!

Yep, people lust over pictures that reveal nudity. This has zero to do with whether or not a woman is sinning by showing cleavage. Quit blaming women for men's problems. It's an excuse.

Breasts are not apples either.. What's your point? The particular person I was addressing thought it was "sexy" to show cleavage.. What distinguishes that from a person who thinks its "sexy" to show their genitals.. my original question was where would one draw the line? 1/4 inch of cleavage? 1 inch? 3 inches? Whole breast? Nudity? Naked?

Your original statement, not a question, is here:

I believe it is a sin to show cleavage.. when you wear a dress that shows cleavage knowingly, you are obviously committing a sin because it obviously temps men!

So "how much" you now ask? according to you, the answer is "I believe it is a sin to show cleavage"

The next time a woman shows her ample cleavage you should turn your head the other way, or get out of a thread where cleavage is showing. Problem solved. I thought her cleavage was very sexy, beautiful even, but I can see how some men might be tempted by it and I can see the appropriateness of her removing the photo on a Christian forum--but to accuse a woman of sinning by revealing her cleavage is backwards, insane thinking, along the lines of the more radical fundamentalists.

My other question also stands.. What would Jesus dress like if he was a woman? Would he show cleavage? From the characteristics of the Jesus I know from the Bible, I believe he is against comfort, which many claim to be the reason why they wear revealing clothing, and would prefer women and men to think how their dressing may affect other people!

If you were seeking an honest answer that would be one thing, but you're not. You've already decided that a woman who shows any cleavage is sinning. (you said so above)

 

[Asvin]

Yep, people lust over pictures that reveal nudity. This has zero to do with whether or not a woman is sinning by showing cleavage. Quit blaming women for men's problems. It's an excuse.



Your original statement, not a question, is here:



So "how much" you now ask? according to you, the answer is "I believe it is a sin to show cleavage"

The next time a woman shows her ample cleavage you should turn your head the other way, or get out of a thread where cleavage is showing. Problem solved. I thought her cleavage was very sexy, beautiful even, but I can see how some men might be tempted by it and I can see the appropriateness of her removing the photo on a Christian forum--but to accuse a woman of sinning by revealing her cleavage is backwards, insane thinking, along the lines of the more radical fundamentalists.



If you were seeking an honest answer that would be one thing, but you're not. You've already decided that a woman who shows any cleavage is sinning. (you said so above)

I guess I made a lot of mistakes commenting on this thread.. I am sorry! I was just stating my opinion and what I believed was sinful based on what I've read in the Bible.. I will take your advice and not blame people for my weaknesses.. Thank you!

God bless!

 

[jpcedotal]

All these kind of threads are the same...they always deteriorate to "it is the guy's fault for thinking sinful thoughts when looking at a woman"...let the bra burning begin

 

[znr]

All these kind of threads are the same...they always deteriorate to "it is the guy's fault for thinking sinful thoughts when looking at a woman"...let the bra burning begin

You can twist words if you want but don't twist mine until I log off for the night.

 

[jpcedotal]

You can twist words if you want but don't twist mine until I log off for the night.

heh, i didn't have anyone particular in mind...just fishing for one of those over the top woman libers...

 

[znr]

I guess I made a lot of mistakes commenting on this thread.. I am sorry! I was just stating my opinion and what I believed was sinful based on what I've read in the Bible.. I will take your advice and not blame people for my weaknesses.. Thank you!

God bless!

I thought I would feel better by trying to prove my point. I still agree with myself but I don't want you to feel like you cannot have your opinion or that you make mistakes by stating how you feel. We're all learning. I hope we can work this all through together...know what I mean?

 

[znr]

heh, i didn't have anyone particular in mind...just fishing for one of those over the top woman libers...

Well, if I were one of those "over the top woman libers" and I took your bait abnd made myself angry over it I would have to blame myself for that ...

 

[jpcedotal]

The real question is:

Is there a line that a woman can cross where at least some of the blame must be on her shoulders for the way she dresses...from a Christian viewpoint?

I mean, if it was legal and socially acceptable for women to walk around topless...is it still the man's fault for having sexual thoughts?

To me, Proverbs covers this completely. There are two female types in that book, one is the wisdom of God and the other is the "harlot" of the world.

I bet only one would show cleavage....in simple Biblical terms

 

[UTVols345]

I think causing your brother in Christ not to stumble is a very good reason, however I also think that when the Bible says 'dress modestly', we should out of our love for God. Besides...I don't want some creepy dude lookin down my shirt. Yuck.

 

[wayfaring man]

I guess I made a lot of mistakes commenting on this thread.. I am sorry! I was just stating my opinion and what I believed was sinful based on what I've read in the Bible.. I will take your advice and not blame people for my weaknesses.. Thank you!

God bless!

Well, it does seem quite clear that some forms of "showing nakedness" are sinful, but not merely because someone can "see some skin", but because of what's going on in the person's mind and heart at the time.

And yes, The Bible does warn about being immodest. (1st Timothy 2:9)

Yet, it also speaks of much liberty. (1st Corinthians 10:23)

Taken together, one can say, we should all honor the principle in whatever way we are persuaded is appropriate, (and this has to do somewhat with our current culture/company), without being overly critical or judgmental if others are not compelled to honor the principle in the exact same way.

Sometimes due to varied associations what is sinful in one person's mind, is not sinful in another's...this mainly applies to what one may call "lesser things", which tend to vary substantially within different places, customs, and times.

wm

 

[jpcedotal]

I like the stumbling angle the best. Even if u feel it is ok, if one cause another Christian to stumble then do not do it...