Is Remaining in Illness God's Will?

[Frogster]

Really? let's do that.

But first, let's look at the verses in 2 Cor 11 you conveniently left out.

22 Are they Hebrews? So am I. Are they Israelites? So am I. Are they the seed of Abraham? So am I. 23 Are they ministers of Christ?—I speak as a fool—I am more: in labors more abundant, in stripes above measure, in prisons more frequently, in deaths often. 24 From the Jews five times I received forty stripes minus one. 25 Three times I was beaten with rods; once I was stoned; three times I was shipwrecked; a night and a day I have been in the deep; 26 in journeys often, in perils of waters, in perils of robbers, in perils of my own countrymen, in perils of the Gentiles, in perils in the city, in perils in the wilderness, in perils in the sea, in perils among false brethren; 27 in weariness and toil, in sleeplessness often, in hunger and thirst, in fastings often, in cold and nakedness— 28 besides the other things, what comes upon me daily: my deep concern for all the churches. 29 Who is weak, and I am not weak? Who is made to stumble, and I do not burn with indignation?​

Those my friend, are Paul's infirmities - he describes them quite specifically. You will notice that there is NO mention of sickness or disease. None, not one.

Now finish where you started:

2 Cor 11:30 If I must boast, I will boast in the things which concern my infirmity. (described in the preceding verses)31 The God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who is blessed forever, knows that I am not lying. 32 In Damascus the governor, under Aretas the king, was guarding the city of the Damascenes with a garrison, desiring to arrest me; 33 but I was let down in a basket through a window in the wall, and escaped from his hands.

12 It is doubtless not profitable for me to boast. I will come to visions and revelations of the Lord: 2 I know a man in Christ who fourteen years ago—whether in the body I do not know, or whether out of the body I do not know, God knows—such a one was caught up to the third heaven. 3 And I know such a man—whether in the body or out of the body I do not know, God knows— 4 how he was caught up into Paradise and heard inexpressible words, which it is not lawful for a man to utter. 5 Of such a one I will boast; yet of myself I will not boast, except in my infirmities. 6 For though I might desire to boast, I will not be a fool; for I will speak the truth. But I refrain, lest anyone should think of me above what he sees me to be or hears from me. 7 And lest I should be exalted above measure by the abundance of the revelations, a thorn in the flesh was given to me, a messenger of Satan to buffet me, lest I be exalted above measure. 8 Concerning this thing I pleaded with the Lord three times that it might depart from me. 9 And He said to me, “My grace is sufficient for you, for My strength is made perfect in weakness.” Therefore most gladly I will rather boast in my infirmities, that the power of Christ may rest upon me. 10 Therefore I take pleasure in infirmities, in reproaches, in needs, in persecutions, in distresses, for Christ’s sake. For when I am weak, then I am strong.
​

That's pretty easy to see, there is no mention of sickness before or after the mention of the 'thorn in the flesh'.

So there is no connection in these verses between infirmity and sickness, but there is a connection between infirmity and weakness.

Maybe that is why not every version uses the word infirmity.

As an example: 2 cor 11:30

ASV :30 If I must needs glory, I will glory of the things that concern my weakness.

CEV: 30 If I have to brag, I will brag about how weak I am.

Holman: 30 If boasting is necessary, I will boast about my weaknesses.

NASB: 30 If I have to boast, I will boast of what pertains to my weakness.

NCV: 30 If I must brag, I will brag about the things that show I am weak.

NIV 30 If I must boast, I will boast of the things that show my weakness.

NLV: 30 If I must talk about myself, I will do it about the things that show how weak I am.

NLT: 30 If I must boast, I would rather boast about the things that show how weak I am.

NRSV: 30 If I must boast, I will boast of the things that show my weakness.

Not one version uses sickness.

Sorry J it just doesn't hold water.

who would't get ill after reading all that Paul went through. It's called infections, open sores, no sleep, cold, hungry, naked...floating a day and a night at sea, getting stoned, beaten with rods, shipwrecked 3, plus one more that is not in 2 cor 11, whipped 5 times, opening up his back..

get sick? yes!

 

[Frogster]

There are also those who believe that Paul had poor eyesight that he was never healed of, and that's the reason he wrote in large letters.

Gal 4:15 What happened to this sense of being blessed you had? For I testify to you that, if possible, you would have torn out your eyes and given them to me.

Gal 6:11 Look at what large letters I use as I write to you in my own handwriting.

there was a common eye disease in asia, opthomolia (check spelling), very repulsive to look at, a trial for the galatians, plus in galatians 4:14, he said they "did not spit" in the greek, that was a pagan custom when they saw disease, the very superstitious pagans would spit to ward off disease when they saw it, yes paul preached there out of illness, good post you made.

 

[JimB]

There are also those who believe that Paul had poor eyesight that he was never healed of, and that's the reason he wrote in large letters.

*****

For some, if Paul would have said, “I have poor eyesight from which I have not been healed and that’s why I write with large letters,” I am convinced that some would find a way to explain it away to fit their theology.

 

[Always in His Presence]

For some, if Paul would have said, “I have poor eyesight from which I have not been healed and that’s why I write with large letters,” I am convinced that some would find a way to explain it away to fit their theology.

. People who rise to the eye disease theory also believe that the Apostles all drove Honda's because it says in Acts the were in one accord.

Others don't swallow the old company line and stand on the word with no experts explanation, believing is is simple enough to understand on its own

.

 

[Frogster]

. People who rise to the eye disease theory also believe that the Apostles all drove Honda's because it says in Acts the were in one accord.

Others don't swallow the old company line and stand on the word with no experts explanation, believing is is simple enough to understand on its own

.

large letters, given your eyes for me, opthomolia? hmmmmmm

it says illness in galatians 4.

17 From now on let no one cause me trouble, for I bear on my body the marks of Jesus.

 

[Always in His Presence]

As for the eye problem


The claims of tradition.

This study would not be complete unless we looked at the scriptures quoted to support the view of sickness, particularly the theory that Paul had Chronic Ophthalmia.

Halley’s Bible Handbook quotes the following:


“There are various opinions as to what this was. The view quite generally held, and to us, seems most likely to be correct, is that it was Chronic Ophthalmia, a disease of the eyes, which was not extremely painful, but at times made him look repulsive in appearance. This seems to be borne out of the language of the Epistles. It came upon Paul 14 years before he wrote this Epistle which was about the time of his entrance into Galatia, on his first missionary journey. His entrance into Galatia was occasioned by some sort of physical infirmity, Gal 4:13, so offensive in appearance that it constituted a sore trial to anyone in his presence. Gal 4:14 They would have given their own eyes, Gal 4:15, Why eyes unless that was his particular need? Paul’s customary large handwriting, Galatians 6:11, amy have been due to poor eye-sight. This may have been the reason Paul dictated his epistles to some of his helpers.”


Let’s look at these two main points, (1) The ailment mentioned in Gal 4:13-15 and (2) The “large” handwriting mentioned, and other possible reasons for these.
1. The ailment - Gal 4:15 “Where then is the blessing ye spake of? For I bear you record, that, if (it had been) possible, ye would have plucked out your own eyes and given them to me.”
Here Paul speaks specifically of having a “physical infirmity”, and there is no doubt that he had some type of physical ailment that had something to do with his eyes. From this scripture we can come to three basic conclusions about this ailment.

1. Since this ailment was not specifically named and the word infirmity can mean both sickness and malady (injury), there can be no specific conclusion as to what it was specifically.

2. We can safely assume that this infirmity was healed, because there is no other mention of it in all of scripture. To follow this line of thought you would have to ask if Paul was seriously injured around this time.

3. Did something happen to Paul on his first missionary journey in Galatia. The answer is Yes.

We have to remember that Galatia is an area in the middle east that incorporates a variety of cities. Turn to Acts to see the account of his first missionary journey and your will find:
Acts 14:19-20 NKJV “then the Jews from Antioch and Iconium (cities just outside Galatia) came there; and having persuaded the multitudes, they stoned Paul and dragged him out of the city, supposing him to be dead. However, the disciples gathered around him, he rose up and went into the city. And the next day he departed with Barnabus to Derbe(the first city in the region of Galatia).”
Just before entering Galatia the Jews stoned Paul to the point they though he was dead. Paul had to be a mass of bruises and welts especially around the head. The head was the main target of those doing the stoning. It is very possible that Paul was beaten so badly that his injuries made him look pitiful.

But what about the “large writing”, the scriptural answer to this is clearer than his ailment. Let’s look at some examples;
1Cor 16:21 “the salutation of (me) Paul’s with mine own hand.”

Gal 6:11 “Ye see how large a letter I have written unto you with mine own hand.”

2Thess 3:17 “the salutation of Paul with mine own hand, which is the token in every epistle: so I write.”

Phil 1:19 “I Paul have written it with mine own hand…”
We have to remember that during the first century, writing was something not known by everyone. In fact, the Scribes and Pharisees are partnered throughout scripture, because it was the Scribes that wrote the words of the Pharisees. For Paul (a Pharisee) to be able to write was an unusual talent at that time. That is also why he and so many of the other writers had scribes to do their writing.
In regards to Gal 6:11 “ye see how large a letter…” The word translated large is the Greek word is pelikos - a quantitative form. The word literally has to do with the quantity of the letter, not the size. This shows clearly Paul is speaking about how long a letter he had written.
Because of these, I don’t believe that Paul’s thorn was a sickness or disease, and that Paul’s infirmity was most probably due to the stoning he suffered at the hands of the Jews.

 

[Always in His Presence]

Just to put a bowtie on the subject!

Gal 6: Ye see 1492 how large 4080 a letter 1121 I have written 1125 unto you 5213 with mine own 1699 hand 5495.

The word letter is referenced in Strongs to 1121 to which I quote:

1) a letter
2) any writing, a document or record
a) a note of hand, bill, bond, account, written acknowledgement of a debt
b) a letter, an epistle
c) the sacred writings (of the OT)
3) letters, i.e. learning
a) of sacred learning


The word doesn't even mean a single letter (character) it means a document or record - an epistle

Like the Epistle or Paul to the Galatians - see what a large Epistle it is



That is why you have to add things or ignore things to believe this false teaching.

 

[Frogster]

As for the eye problem


The claims of tradition.

This study would not be complete unless we looked at the scriptures quoted to support the view of sickness, particularly the theory that Paul had Chronic Ophthalmia.

Halley’s Bible Handbook quotes the following:


“There are various opinions as to what this was. The view quite generally held, and to us, seems most likely to be correct, is that it was Chronic Ophthalmia, a disease of the eyes, which was not extremely painful, but at times made him look repulsive in appearance. This seems to be borne out of the language of the Epistles. It came upon Paul 14 years before he wrote this Epistle which was about the time of his entrance into Galatia, on his first missionary journey. His entrance into Galatia was occasioned by some sort of physical infirmity, Gal 4:13, so offensive in appearance that it constituted a sore trial to anyone in his presence. Gal 4:14 They would have given their own eyes, Gal 4:15, Why eyes unless that was his particular need? Paul’s customary large handwriting, Galatians 6:11, amy have been due to poor eye-sight. This may have been the reason Paul dictated his epistles to some of his helpers.”


Let’s look at these two main points, (1) The ailment mentioned in Gal 4:13-15 and (2) The “large” handwriting mentioned, and other possible reasons for these.
1. The ailment - Gal 4:15 “Where then is the blessing ye spake of? For I bear you record, that, if (it had been) possible, ye would have plucked out your own eyes and given them to me.”
Here Paul speaks specifically of having a “physical infirmity”, and there is no doubt that he had some type of physical ailment that had something to do with his eyes. From this scripture we can come to three basic conclusions about this ailment.

1. Since this ailment was not specifically named and the word infirmity can mean both sickness and malady (injury), there can be no specific conclusion as to what it was specifically.

2. We can safely assume that this infirmity was healed, because there is no other mention of it in all of scripture. To follow this line of thought you would have to ask if Paul was seriously injured around this time.

3. Did something happen to Paul on his first missionary journey in Galatia. The answer is Yes.

We have to remember that Galatia is an area in the middle east that incorporates a variety of cities. Turn to Acts to see the account of his first missionary journey and your will find:
Acts 14:19-20 NKJV “then the Jews from Antioch and Iconium (cities just outside Galatia) came there; and having persuaded the multitudes, they stoned Paul and dragged him out of the city, supposing him to be dead. However, the disciples gathered around him, he rose up and went into the city. And the next day he departed with Barnabus to Derbe(the first city in the region of Galatia).”
Just before entering Galatia the Jews stoned Paul to the point they though he was dead. Paul had to be a mass of bruises and welts especially around the head. The head was the main target of those doing the stoning. It is very possible that Paul was beaten so badly that his injuries made him look pitiful.

But what about the “large writing”, the scriptural answer to this is clearer than his ailment. Let’s look at some examples;
1Cor 16:21 “the salutation of (me) Paul’s with mine own hand.”

Gal 6:11 “Ye see how large a letter I have written unto you with mine own hand.”

2Thess 3:17 “the salutation of Paul with mine own hand, which is the token in every epistle: so I write.”

Phil 1:19 “I Paul have written it with mine own hand…”
We have to remember that during the first century, writing was something not known by everyone. In fact, the Scribes and Pharisees are partnered throughout scripture, because it was the Scribes that wrote the words of the Pharisees. For Paul (a Pharisee) to be able to write was an unusual talent at that time. That is also why he and so many of the other writers had scribes to do their writing.
In regards to Gal 6:11 “ye see how large a letter…” The word translated large is the Greek word is pelikos - a quantitative form. The word literally has to do with the quantity of the letter, not the size. This shows clearly Paul is speaking about how long a letter he had written.
Because of these, I don’t believe that Paul’s thorn was a sickness or disease, and that Paul’s infirmity was most probably due to the stoning he suffered at the hands of the Jews.

To try to lock galatians with the historical narrative in acts, is hard, there is so much diverse opinion on the chronology of it. Some scholars like Charles B Williams have it written around 55 ad.

it says illness, and they did not spit.

The whole thing hinges on common sense, how could he not get sick, with all he went through?

 

[Frogster]

As for the eye problem


The claims of tradition.

This study would not be complete unless we looked at the scriptures quoted to support the view of sickness, particularly the theory that Paul had Chronic Ophthalmia.

Halley’s Bible Handbook quotes the following:


“There are various opinions as to what this was. The view quite generally held, and to us, seems most likely to be correct, is that it was Chronic Ophthalmia, a disease of the eyes, which was not extremely painful, but at times made him look repulsive in appearance. This seems to be borne out of the language of the Epistles. It came upon Paul 14 years before he wrote this Epistle which was about the time of his entrance into Galatia, on his first missionary journey. His entrance into Galatia was occasioned by some sort of physical infirmity, Gal 4:13, so offensive in appearance that it constituted a sore trial to anyone in his presence. Gal 4:14 They would have given their own eyes, Gal 4:15, Why eyes unless that was his particular need? Paul’s customary large handwriting, Galatians 6:11, amy have been due to poor eye-sight. This may have been the reason Paul dictated his epistles to some of his helpers.”


Let’s look at these two main points, (1) The ailment mentioned in Gal 4:13-15 and (2) The “large” handwriting mentioned, and other possible reasons for these.
1. The ailment - Gal 4:15 “Where then is the blessing ye spake of? For I bear you record, that, if (it had been) possible, ye would have plucked out your own eyes and given them to me.”
Here Paul speaks specifically of having a “physical infirmity”, and there is no doubt that he had some type of physical ailment that had something to do with his eyes. From this scripture we can come to three basic conclusions about this ailment.

1. Since this ailment was not specifically named and the word infirmity can mean both sickness and malady (injury), there can be no specific conclusion as to what it was specifically.

2. We can safely assume that this infirmity was healed, because there is no other mention of it in all of scripture. To follow this line of thought you would have to ask if Paul was seriously injured around this time.

3. Did something happen to Paul on his first missionary journey in Galatia. The answer is Yes.

We have to remember that Galatia is an area in the middle east that incorporates a variety of cities. Turn to Acts to see the account of his first missionary journey and your will find:
Acts 14:19-20 NKJV “then the Jews from Antioch and Iconium (cities just outside Galatia) came there; and having persuaded the multitudes, they stoned Paul and dragged him out of the city, supposing him to be dead. However, the disciples gathered around him, he rose up and went into the city. And the next day he departed with Barnabus to Derbe(the first city in the region of Galatia).”
Just before entering Galatia the Jews stoned Paul to the point they though he was dead. Paul had to be a mass of bruises and welts especially around the head. The head was the main target of those doing the stoning. It is very possible that Paul was beaten so badly that his injuries made him look pitiful.

But what about the “large writing”, the scriptural answer to this is clearer than his ailment. Let’s look at some examples;
1Cor 16:21 “the salutation of (me) Paul’s with mine own hand.”

Gal 6:11 “Ye see how large a letter I have written unto you with mine own hand.”

2Thess 3:17 “the salutation of Paul with mine own hand, which is the token in every epistle: so I write.”

Phil 1:19 “I Paul have written it with mine own hand…”
We have to remember that during the first century, writing was something not known by everyone. In fact, the Scribes and Pharisees are partnered throughout scripture, because it was the Scribes that wrote the words of the Pharisees. For Paul (a Pharisee) to be able to write was an unusual talent at that time. That is also why he and so many of the other writers had scribes to do their writing.
In regards to Gal 6:11 “ye see how large a letter…” The word translated large is the Greek word is pelikos - a quantitative form. The word literally has to do with the quantity of the letter, not the size. This shows clearly Paul is speaking about how long a letter he had written.Because of these, I don’t believe that Paul’s thorn was a sickness or disease, and that Paul’s infirmity was most probably due to the stoning he suffered at the hands of the Jews.

the only thing is, galatians is not long, compare to romans.

 

[Frogster]

Just to put a bowtie on the subject!

Gal 6: Ye see 1492 how large 4080 a letter 1121 I have written 1125 unto you 5213 with mine own 1699 hand 5495.

The word letter is referenced in Strongs to 1121 to which I quote:

1) a letter
2) any writing, a document or record
a) a note of hand, bill, bond, account, written acknowledgement of a debt
b) a letter, an epistle
c) the sacred writings (of the OT)
3) letters, i.e. learning
a) of sacred learning


The word doesn't even mean a single letter (character) it means a document or record - an epistle

Like the Epistle or Paul to the Galatians - see what a large Epistle it is



That is why you have to add things or ignore things to believe this false teaching.

Vincent's Word StudiesHow large a letter (πηλίκοις γράμμασι&#957

More correctly, with how large letters. Γράμματα may mean an epistle, as Lat. literae, or epistles; but Paul habitually uses ἐπιστολή for an epistle. Γράμμασιν means with characters, and πηλίκοις refers to their size. It is claimed by some that the large characters are intended to call the attention of the readers to the special importance of the close of the letter.

 

[Frogster]

Scofield Reference Notes
[1] large Gr. "with how large letters . . .mine own hand." The apostle was, it appears from many considerations, afflicted with ophthalmia, a common disease in the East, to the point almost of total blindness (e.g.) Gal 4:13-15. Ordinarily, therefore, he dictated his letters. But now, having no amanuensis at hand, but urged by the spiritual danger of his dear Galatians, he writes, we cannot know with what pain and difficulty, with his own hand, in the "large letters" his darkened vision compelled him to use.

 

[Frogster]

just sayinnnnn

 

[Frogster]

Point made, we are down to common sense, to much scholarly divide out there..

 

[Always in His Presence]

Someone tell pinetree I have him on ignore. Looks like he is getting ready to stroke out.

 

[Frogster]

As for the eye problem


The claims of tradition.

This study would not be complete unless we looked at the scriptures quoted to support the view of sickness, particularly the theory that Paul had Chronic Ophthalmia.

Halley’s Bible Handbook quotes the following:


“There are various opinions as to what this was. The view quite generally held, and to us, seems most likely to be correct, is that it was Chronic Ophthalmia, a disease of the eyes, which was not extremely painful, but at times made him look repulsive in appearance. This seems to be borne out of the language of the Epistles. It came upon Paul 14 years before he wrote this Epistle which was about the time of his entrance into Galatia, on his first missionary journey. His entrance into Galatia was occasioned by some sort of physical infirmity, Gal 4:13, so offensive in appearance that it constituted a sore trial to anyone in his presence. Gal 4:14 They would have given their own eyes, Gal 4:15, Why eyes unless that was his particular need? Paul’s customary large handwriting, Galatians 6:11, amy have been due to poor eye-sight. This may have been the reason Paul dictated his epistles to some of his helpers.”


Let’s look at these two main points, (1) The ailment mentioned in Gal 4:13-15 and (2) The “large” handwriting mentioned, and other possible reasons for these.
1. The ailment - Gal 4:15 “Where then is the blessing ye spake of? For I bear you record, that, if (it had been) possible, ye would have plucked out your own eyes and given them to me.”
Here Paul speaks specifically of having a “physical infirmity”, and there is no doubt that he had some type of physical ailment that had something to do with his eyes. From this scripture we can come to three basic conclusions about this ailment.

1. Since this ailment was not specifically named and the word infirmity can mean both sickness and malady (injury), there can be no specific conclusion as to what it was specifically.

2. We can safely assume that this infirmity was healed, because there is no other mention of it in all of scripture. To follow this line of thought you would have to ask if Paul was seriously injured around this time.

3. Did something happen to Paul on his first missionary journey in Galatia. The answer is Yes.

We have to remember that Galatia is an area in the middle east that incorporates a variety of cities. Turn to Acts to see the account of his first missionary journey and your will find:
Acts 14:19-20 NKJV “then the Jews from Antioch and Iconium (cities just outside Galatia) came there; and having persuaded the multitudes, they stoned Paul and dragged him out of the city, supposing him to be dead. However, the disciples gathered around him, he rose up and went into the city. And the next day he departed with Barnabus to Derbe(the first city in the region of Galatia).”
Just before entering Galatia the Jews stoned Paul to the point they though he was dead. Paul had to be a mass of bruises and welts especially around the head. The head was the main target of those doing the stoning. It is very possible that Paul was beaten so badly that his injuries made him look pitiful.

But what about the “large writing”, the scriptural answer to this is clearer than his ailment. Let’s look at some examples;
1Cor 16:21 “the salutation of (me) Paul’s with mine own hand.”

Gal 6:11 “Ye see how large a letter I have written unto you with mine own hand.”

2Thess 3:17 “the salutation of Paul with mine own hand, which is the token in every epistle: so I write.”

Phil 1:19 “I Paul have written it with mine own hand…”
We have to remember that during the first century, writing was something not known by everyone. In fact, the Scribes and Pharisees are partnered throughout scripture, because it was the Scribes that wrote the words of the Pharisees. For Paul (a Pharisee) to be able to write was an unusual talent at that time. That is also why he and so many of the other writers had scribes to do their writing.
In regards to Gal 6:11 “ye see how large a letter…” The word translated large is the Greek word is pelikos - a quantitative form. The word literally has to do with the quantity of the letter, not the size. This shows clearly Paul is speaking about how long a letter he had written.
Because of these, I don’t believe that Paul’s thorn was a sickness or disease, and that Paul’s infirmity was most probably due to the stoning he suffered at the hands of the Jews.

alot of diversity out there bro, the northern galatia theory asks how could Acts 14 that u posted, be connected to galatians 4?

In galatians 4, it says they treated him as an angel, as Christ himself.

really? Acts 14 says they stoned paul, and called barnabas Zeus, and Paul, Hermes,


How does that tie in with this? Was paul treated as an angel, or like Christ? no, stoned and called Greek gods not as heavenly angels, not exactly like Christlike as far as treatment of paul goes, it does not fit the Acts 14 narrative.

14 and though my condition was a trial to you, you did not scorn or despise me, but received me as an angel of God, as Christ Jesus.

Again, we just need to know that paul got sick, reading all he went through, and it says he preached out of illness, eyes, or bodily cuts that cause infections, or both.

 

[K2K]

There is something written about you have not because you have not asked!

I wear glasses and a talk the Lord about many things, but rarely about Him fixing my eyes!

I could, and perhaps I should. If I did wouldn't He consider my request?

I have found that He does consider my requests made to Him. Indeed, I have reason to believe that He always takes them into account. Which doesn't mean that He answers them the way I want, but rather how He thinks best.

So would He fix me eyes if I asked. I think He would. But how would He fix them and when? Well - I don't exactly know, but I already have glasses and they seem to work fine. I suspose He might have me get contacts, but I don't really think I would like them better than glasses. Perhaps He would provide me with larger print books to read? And now a days He could have me get laser surgery. It might work. And thought some might not believe it, He can certainly just fix my eye also. Yet I wouldn't consider Him unkind or unloving if He just asked me to continue wearing my glasses.

He my Lord has done serveral miracle healing on me during the last dozen years or so that I have known and found out that I can hear from Him. Yet I havn't spent a lot of time talking to Him about my eyes that require glasses. Not too long ago I did though. It seemed that my glasses were a bit weak. He told me to go to Walmart and their vision center. That might not be what He tells you, but it worked for me.

So all this talk about Paul and his poor eyes seems a bit off. It seems like some might be suggesting that because Paul didn't have good eyes, that God doesn't mind us remaining in illness. That seems like a particularly poor example if you ask me. And if you suggest that God will heal everything exactly like you think, that doesn't really make sense either.

From what I have learned from dealing with Him, it seems that God does want to help us. He seems fully capable of helping us in any way He wants to, if we care to believe that. Yet He is God, and His thoughts are not my thoughts, so it might not happen like I think. That shouldn't stop me from asking Him and talking to Him about it. Perhaps He will leave a blessing, and whether that means growing a new limp, or giving me wings like angels, or maybe just having me get a new pair of glasses from Walmart, it is still nice to know that He is God and cares. Can you believe that, and then perhaps talk to Him about your problems?

 

[Source Scripture]

alot of diversity out there bro, the northern galatia theory asks how could Acts 14 that u posted, be connected to galatians 4?

In galatians 4, it says they treated him as an angel, as Christ himself.

really? Acts 14 says they stoned paul, and called barnabas Zeus, and Paul, Hermes,


How does that tie in with this? Was paul treated as an angel, or like Christ? no, stoned and called Greek gods not as heavenly angels, not exactly like Christlike as far as treatment of paul goes, it does not fit the Acts 14 narrative.

14 and though my condition was a trial to you, you did not scorn or despise me, but received me as an angel of God, as Christ Jesus.

Again, we just need to know that paul got sick, reading all he went through, and it says he preached out of illness, eyes, or bodily cuts that cause infections, or both.

Good work!

 

[Always in His Presence]

Good work!

No, not really. A simple look at a map explains.

We have to remember that Galatia is an area in the middle east that incorporates a variety of cities. Turn to Acts to see the account of his first missionary journey and your will find:
Acts 14:19-20 NKJV “then the Jews from Antioch and Iconium (cities just outside Galatia) came there; and having persuaded the multitudes, they stoned Paul and dragged him out of the city, supposing him to be dead. However, the disciples gathered around him, he rose up and went into the city. And the next day he departed with Barnabus to Derbe(the first city in the region of Galatia).”

Paul wasn't stoned in Galatia

 

[Source Scripture]

No, not really. A simple look at a map explains.

We have to remember that Galatia is an area in the middle east that incorporates a variety of cities. Turn to Acts to see the account of his first missionary journey and your will find:
Acts 14:19-20 NKJV “then the Jews from Antioch and Iconium (cities just outside Galatia) came there; and having persuaded the multitudes, they stoned Paul and dragged him out of the city, supposing him to be dead. However, the disciples gathered around him, he rose up and went into the city. And the next day he departed with Barnabus to Derbe(the first city in the region of Galatia).”

Paul wasn't stoned in Galatia

Frogster didn't say Paul was stoned in Galatia, he was just showing you that your usage of Acts 14, that you connected to the Galatians 4 account, does not fit. Paul was not treated as an angel of God, as Christ Jesus, he was treated as a false god, and was stoned, not exaclty the loving reception he talked about in Galatians 4, being stoned would not be an example of being received as Christ. Again, he was also showing you that there is alot of divide on certain issues with commentators, and his point is valid, Paul obviously was ill, and it says so in the passage. Thanks, Source.

 

[JimB]

the only thing is, galatians is not long, compare to romans.

Don’t you love these long, twisted misinterpretations of scripture just to try to prove an obviously erroneous point? I'll say it again (because it so irritating to some), scripture is so simple you have to have help (with long, twisted misinterpretations) to misunderstand it.