Is it okay for a U.S. christian to own a liquor store?

[Bible Highlighter]

Legalists will not inherit the Kingdom of God either.

Legalism is a term that is thrown around a lot falsely. I have only encountered one Christian in many discussions on Christian forums over the years who appear to believe we are saved by Law Alone-ism.

But obeying God's commands as a part of inheriting eternal life (Matthew 19:17-19) (Luke 10:25-28) is not in conflict with God's grace (Ephesians 2:8-10). We are first saved by God's grace without works, and then we are to obey and walk with the Lord as a part of salvation (See: John 5:24, 2 Thessalonians 2:13, and James 2:24). A believer can deny God by a lack of works (Titus 1:16). We are told that without holiness, no man shall see the Lord (Hebrews 12:14).

 

[Bible Highlighter]

The bible records ONE instance of his being drunk and many folks try to say that he was a raging alcoholic. The bible doesn't support such a thing. Nor does the bible say he wouldn't be saved because of that single instance of being drunken. The recompense of an single error is one thing but the idea that you'd lose salvation for it is quite another nor is it biblical.

I never said Noah was a raging alcoholic his whole life. But his one sin of alcoholism led to great harm to his family.

 

[1Reformedman]

You are not your brother's keeper.....and I do not aim to convince you otherwise....nor do I see any fault in it. Thanks for the conversation.

my brothers are those who do the will of God. An unsaved one isnt my brother. Oh and being a brother's keeper isn't about trying to force others to not sin as pothers here are attempting to do by blaming the store owner for selling alcohol. Its the drunkard's choice to continue abusing alcohol not the one who sells it.

 

[jimmyjimmy]

Legalism is a term that is thrown around a lot falsely. I have only encountered one Christian in many discussions on Christian forums over the years who appear to believe we are saved by Law Alone-ism.

But obeying God's commands as a part of inheriting eternal life (Matthew 19:17-19) (Luke 10:25-28) is not in conflict with God's grace (Ephesians 2:8-10). We are first saved by God's grace without works, and then we are to obey and walk with the Lord as a part of salvation (See: John 5:24, 2 Thessalonians 2:13, and James 2:24).

The Apostle Paul would beg to differ. He claimed that *any* works mixed with grace = works.

 

[1Reformedman]

I'm not sure it possible to reason with a person who thinks that Jesus created grape juice for a wedding feast, do you?

I think its pretty clear contextually that the wine was more than grape juice. They wedding attendant said it was the best wine. It was obviously fermented.

 

[jimmyjimmy]

I think its pretty clear contextually that the wine was more than grape juice. They wedding attendant said it was the best wine. It was obviously fermented.

Yes. It's obviously to all — but our friend.

 

[1Reformedman]

Yes. It's obviously to all — but our friend.

I have heard others throughout the years who believed this theory as well. I was not one who could ascribe to it because it does not match the greek grammar or the context.

 

[SkyWriting]

Nobody kills other people in a car accident generally by food consumption. Alcohol and driving leads to tons of deaths each year. Alcohol has destroyed many families. Alcohol leads to unwanted pregnancies, and fornication, etc.; Food really does not do that. A person who is a light weight can sin by just one glass of hard liquor because they get drunk off one glass of hard liquor. Drunkards will not inherit the kingdom of God.

I wonder what scripture says though?

Philippians 3:19
Their end is destruction, their god is their belly, and they glory in their shame, with minds set on earthly things.

Proverbs 23:20-21
Be not among drunkards or among gluttonous eaters of meat, for the drunkard and the glutton will come to poverty, and slumber will clothe them with rags.

Proverbs 23:2
And put a knife to your throat if you are given to appetite.

Proverbs 23:21
For the drunkard and the glutton will come to poverty, and slumber will clothe them with rags.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

The Apostle Paul would beg to differ. He claimed that *any* works mixed with grace = works.

You no doubt think this way because of an incorrect understanding on Romans 11:6. Paul was talking about "Works Alone Salvationism" (Without God's grace) via by the 613 laws of Moses. Paul was talking about the salvation of Jews in Romans 9-11. The Jews obviously needed to accept Jesus as their Savior by His grace (which is a process of salvation that is based on God's grace and mercy and not works, i.e. Justification). Hence, why Paul spoke the way that he did. But Paul was for Sanctification (after Justification) as a part of salvation: See Romans 8:13, Titus 1:16, Titus 2:11-12, and 2 Thessalonians 2:13.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

I wonder what scripture says though?

Philippians 3:19
Their end is destruction, their god is their belly, and they glory in their shame, with minds set on earthly things.

Proverbs 23:20-21
Be not among drunkards or among gluttonous eaters of meat, for the drunkard and the glutton will come to poverty, and slumber will clothe them with rags.

Proverbs 23:2
And put a knife to your throat if you are given to appetite.

Proverbs 23:21
For the drunkard and the glutton will come to poverty, and slumber will clothe them with rags.

I didn't say gluttony was not a grievous sin that can condemn a person.
But again, food does not lead to the scores of problems that alcohol causes. You need food to live. You don't need alcohol.

 

[jimmyjimmy]

I wonder what scripture says though?

Philippians 3:19
Their end is destruction, their god is their belly, and they glory in their shame, with minds set on earthly things.

Proverbs 23:20-21
Be not among drunkards or among gluttonous eaters of meat, for the drunkard and the glutton will come to poverty, and slumber will clothe them with rags.

Proverbs 23:2
And put a knife to your throat if you are given to appetite.

Proverbs 23:21
For the drunkard and the glutton will come to poverty, and slumber will clothe them with rags.

Therefore, to follow the logic of Bible Highlighter, Chic-Fil-A is responsible for "sending people to Hell".

 

[1Reformedman]

Legalism is a term that is thrown around a lot falsely. I have only encountered one Christian in many discussions on Christian forums over the years who appear to believe we are saved by Law Alone-ism.

But obeying God's commands as a part of inheriting eternal life (Matthew 19:17-19) (Luke 10:25-28) is not in conflict with God's grace (Ephesians 2:8-10). We are first saved by God's grace without works, and then we are to obey and walk with the Lord as a part of salvation (See: John 5:24, 2 Thessalonians 2:13, and James 2:24). A believer can deny God by a lack of works (Titus 1:16). We are told that without holiness, no man shall see the Lord (Hebrews 12:14).

when one uses the term legalist its usually a reference to trying to put believers under an additional burden such as you saying its wrong for someone to own a store that sells alcohol. You seem to think that just because its available for purchase that when one purchases some this means it's going to automatically mean that everyone who buys alcohol is going to get drunk on it and that simply isnt true nor does it match reality.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

my brothers are those who do the will of God. An unsaved one isnt my brother. Oh and being a brother's keeper isn't about trying to force others to not sin as pothers here are attempting to do by blaming the store owner for selling alcohol. Its the drunkard's choice to continue abusing alcohol not the one who sells it.

Jesus says we are to pray, love, and do good towards our enemies. This is why we should be concerned for lost souls and to help them to see that they are influencing others to sin by their sinful deeds.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

when one uses the term legalist its usually a reference to trying to put believers under an additional burden such as you saying its wrong for someone to own a store that sells alcohol. You seem to think that just because its available for purchase that when one purchases some this means it's going to automatically mean that everyone who buys alcohol is going to get drunk on it and that simply isnt true nor does it match reality.

Name one liquor store that does not lead it's community into drunkenness and you may have a case that you might be right here.

 

[1Reformedman]

Nobody kills other people in a car accident generally by food consumption. Alcohol and driving leads to tons of deaths each year. Alcohol has destroyed many families. Alcohol leads to unwanted pregnancies, and fornication, etc.; Food really does not do that. A person who is a light weight can sin by just one glass of hard liquor because they get drunk off one glass of hard liquor. Drunkards will not inherit the kingdom of God.

you are missing one KEY thing: The fallen nature. The sin nature is what causes these things to come to pass. Its not that the product is available for sale that is the problem because it can be consumed responsibly. Once again you speak out of a lack of knowledge.

 

[jimmyjimmy]

when one uses the term legalist its usually a reference to trying to put believers under an additional burden such as you saying its wrong for someone to own a store that sells alcohol. You seem to think that just because its available for purchase that when one purchases some this means it's going to automatically mean that everyone who buys alcohol is going to get drunk on it and that simply isnt true nor does it match reality.

Creating extra-biblical laws and condemning those who don't follow them is a grievous sin. Jesus had much to say about it.

There is no biblical prohibition to drinking alcohol. Bible Highlighter is adding to scripture and playing God in the giving of commands. Not a very safe thing to do. . .

 

[Bible Highlighter]

when one uses the term legalist its usually a reference to trying to put believers under an additional burden such as you saying its wrong for someone to own a store that sells alcohol. You seem to think that just because its available for purchase that when one purchases some this means it's going to automatically mean that everyone who buys alcohol is going to get drunk on it and that simply isnt true nor does it match reality.

 

[1Reformedman]

Jesus says we are to pray, love, and do good towards our enemies. This is why we should be concerned for lost souls and to help them to see that they are influencing others to sin by their sinful deeds.

Doing good is one thing for others is one thing. What they do with it is another thing entirely. Once again You keep conflating the drunkard's decisions after the purchase with the fact that it can be consumed responsibly after the purchase and many people who do drink do so in that responsible manner. You've targeted a specific type of person, the addict, not all people in general and then in the process you have tried to condemn the store owner. I don't think you recognize your own category error.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

Creating extra-biblical laws and condemning those who don't follow them is a grievous sin. Jesus had much to say about it.

There is no biblical prohibition to drinking alcohol. Bible Highlighter is adding to scripture and playing God in the giving of commands. Not a very safe thing to do. . .

Paul commands us believers to do this:

We should live soberly, righteously, and godly, in this present world; Looking for that blessed hope, and the glorious appearing of the great God and our Saviour Jesus Christ (Titus 2:12-13).​

Is a person less sober after their first drink?
Were they not more sober before the drink?
A person's judgment is slowly impaired even after one drink.
A person is less sober than they were before.

 

[1Reformedman]

Creating extra-biblical laws and condemning those who don't follow them is a grievous sin. Jesus had much to say about it.

There is no biblical prohibition to drinking alcohol. Bible Highlighter is adding to scripture and playing God in the giving of commands. Not a very safe thing to do. . .

I agree. He's trying to condemn a store owner for an alcoholic's choice to keep drinking. He keeps showing he doesn't know much about addictions or how they come to fruition.