Is it a sin to remain poor?

[SpiritPsalmist]

...What a bunch of nonsense! Nowhere in the bible does it say being poor is a sin, rather, if don't know already, sin is transgression of the God's law (1 John 3:4).

...Nowhere in Gods law does it say, "Thou shalt not be poor.".....

It does tell us to give to the poor. . .how can we obey that if we are the poor?

 

[blixation]

It does tell us to give to the poor. . .how can we obey that if we are the poor?

Yes we are to give to the poor, but in no way is being poor a sin or a result of not trusting God; or else many today are still living in sin with no way out. To think that being poor is foolish and unlearned.

 

[SpiritPsalmist]

Some people cant help being poor, not everyone gets the good luck that you did.
There are millions of good poor Christians who pray to the good Lord daily for help, but for reasons only known to God, have not received the help they need.
You make it sound like you got bored of being poor, you prayed to God and hey presto all your problems were over. Well that's good for you, but not everyone gets a fairy tale ending.

Scripture says the "steps of a righteous man are ordered of the Lord". There is no such thing as luck for a child of God.

God promises provision. If we are walking in less than provision. . .it is due to something we are doing wrong. . .not just because God feels like blessing one child but the other He feels like making them suffer. That's called favoratism and neglect.

I may be faithful to the Lord, but if I am walking in ignorance in the area of my finances, I'm in this position due to my lack of knowledge. It's God Who said, "My people parish for lack of knowledge".

We all have lack of knowledge on something, but to choose to remain in that lack of knowledge on purpose and not learn something simply because of laziness, depression, insecurity, fear, etc., is sin.

 

[Follower of Christ too]

Paul said, Silver and gold have I none but such as I have I give unto you.............Paul also said he had a time with having money and a time without and he said to be content in whatever state you are in

 

[SpiritPsalmist]

Paul said, Silver and gold have I none but such as I have I give unto you.............Paul also said he had a time with having money and a time without and he said to be content in whatever state you are in

Being content is a key emotion here. If we wander around moaning and groaning we may find ourselves wanding in the wilderness just like the children of Israel did.

They had much to be thankful for. They had been freed from their slave masters and left Egypt carrying the riches of those they had been slaves to. Yet due to there constant grumbling and complaining they wandered as vagabonds for 40 years.

 

[SavedByGrace3]

Some people cant help being poor, not everyone gets the good luck that you did.
There are millions of good poor Christians who pray to the good Lord daily for help, but for reasons only known to God, have not received the help they need.
You make it sound like you got bored of being poor, you prayed to God and hey presto all your problems were over. Well that's good for you, but not everyone gets a fairy tale ending.

Hello Rainbow.
Rainbows are one of my favorite things. I actually took a picture of a rainbow and had it made into a postcard!

I know exactly what you mean when you talk about millions of Christians being poor. It is so sad. There is no lack of poverty in the body of Christ, and that is a shame because He has made provision for us to live in this life at the same level as our spirits live. Abundantly!!

But to overcome poverty takes more than prayer. It takes belief. Lots of people pray, but are they believing? God is there waiting for faith to reach out and touch his provisions. Simply believe that you have received the things that you have asked for.

Mar 11:24
24 That's why I tell you to have faith that you have already received whatever you pray for, and it will be yours.

When people understand this, their prayer and praise lives explode!
Pray for you needs, and then begin to praise God that He has given you the provisions you need to take care of your family. Do not wait for them to come... begin immediately to praise Him instantly as you pray. After all, you have already received them!

This is not luck dear heart... this is the power and provision of God. It was not luck that drove Jesus to the cross to become a curse for us so that we could be redeemed from the curse of the law. It was not luck that caused all the promises of God to be Yes and Amen to us because of what Jesus did. Please do not give luck the credit for what Jesus did for us. Instead, give Jesus the praise! Thank you Lord!!

I really did not get "bored" of being poor.. but it certainly did get old. And thank God he lead me out of that mentality. There is a religious spirit out there that deceives people into thinking that poverty somehow makes then holy. How sad! Jesus and Jesus alone makes us Holy. He has accomplished everything needed to effect our salvation from sin, sickness, poverty, deomns, and the second death. There is another religious spirit out there that tells people that the will of God is different for them.. that they are special for some reason and the Word does not really apply to them. But that is a lie. It does apply to you! Every word of it. He has redeemed you just like He was redeemed us all. They make Him mysterious and strange... and try to say His ways are unknowable. But Jesus came to show us the Father! He did not fail. The ways of God have been clearly and plainly shown to us in the ministry and passion of Jesus.
The word of God is no fairy tale... it is quick and powerful. It goes out and accomplishes. It is alive. Begin to thank Him for all He has done for you!

 

[SavedByGrace3]

Paul said, Silver and gold have I none but such as I have I give unto you.............Paul also said he had a time with having money and a time without and he said to be content in whatever state you are in

I have a question FOC2. Do you take this to mean that we should not pray for things that will better our lives. Should I have looked at my 3 little children and told them: "sorry kids... I have to be content to see you poor, hungry, cold, and sick."
I really do not think that is what Paul was getting at when he said this.

 

[SavedByGrace3]

Matthew 8:20
And Jesus saith unto him, The foxes have holes, and the birds of the air have nests; but the Son of man hath not where to lay his head.

Gee that sounds like wealth to me . . . yup . . . um hum . . .

If Jesus was rich, how could he relate to the pains and sufferings of poverty?

Or redeem us from them??

I also wonder why some folks use this verse to justify poverty. If they really believe this is what God wants for us, then why do they live in houses? Why are they not living out in a field in the snow and cold?
It is because in their heart they know better. It is not the will of God that we suffer in this way. He wants good things for us and our children.

 

[Follower of Christ too]

I have a question FOC2. Do you take this to mean that we should not pray for things that will better our lives. Should I have looked at my 3 little children and told them: "sorry kids... I have to be content to see you poor, hungry, cold, and sick."
I really do not think that is what Paul was getting at when he said this.

I was just pointing out some scriptures I have read. You ask me what should you pray for? The Bible teaches He knows what we need before we pray-even the hairs on our heads are numbered..I have said a prayer in my heart and it was answered in 5 minutes- I didn't even know God heard it! The prayer was for specific food needs. Several grocery items I didn't have. God supplied that need..... I have also said in my heart I would like to be rich and I am not. Being rich is not a need, but being full and warm is...Also I want to add that I have come to know it is better to give than recieve. It is so much better to be on the giving end than the reciever. I certainly have no intention on offending anyone

 

[LeeS]

. Instead, give Jesus the praise! Thank you Lord!!

I really did not get "bored" of being poor.. but it certainly did get old. And thank God he lead me out of that mentality. There is a religious spirit out there that deceives people into thinking that poverty somehow makes then holy. How sad! Jesus and Jesus alone makes us Holy. He has accomplished everything needed to effect our salvation from sin, sickness, poverty, deomns, and the second death. There is another religious spirit out there that tells people that the will of God is different for them.. that they are special for some reason and the Word does not really apply to them. But that is a lie. It does apply to you! Every word of it. He has redeemed you just like He was redeemed us all. They make Him mysterious and strange... and try to say His ways are unknowable. But Jesus came to show us the Father! He did not fail. The ways of God have been clearly and plainly shown to us in the ministry and passion of Jesus.
The word of God is no fairy tale... it is quick and powerful. It goes out and accomplishes. It is alive. Begin to thank Him for all He has done for you!

The walk of praise and worship is an area that I am working on maintaining.

Years ago it seemed that I had no doubs whatsoever that God would meet my needs and it never failed that He came through. Oft times in what seemed to me and others as miraculous ways. I look back and see that I spent countless hours before the Lord just loving on Him.

But as I've gotten older it seems that I have become distracted by everyday stuff and while I still make time for Him it's not the same spontanious time that I did before.

I find myself many times simply overwhelmed by my bills. I got myself into this mess and for years have been struggling to get out from under it all. As far as I am able, in the natural I am doing everything right. However, I'm overcome with bills I cannot, at this point in time, pay.

What God has shown me is that my eyes have become focused on the wrong place. Instead of seeing Jesus, my provider and resting in Him, knowing that He will provide and praising Him in that provision even though I don't yet see it, I have become fearful and depressed, ever wondering "what am I going to do"?

At this point, there is nothing I can do, except lay it all in His hands. Get my eyes totally focused on Him and praise Him despite the threats of man. Fear and depression only get in the way of His provision.

Please pray for me in this area.

Thank you,

Lee

 

[razzelflabben]

Wow, I just read this thread and I don't know where to begin.

When we left everything to follow God's call on our lives, it took a lot of faith. Especially with 3 young children. It also took a lot of prayer and soul searching. A lot of blessings to us and others, a lot of lessons, and poverty. This is when I started studying in earnest what the scriptures said about poverty.

At the current moment, I can't give you all the scriptures, the study was done over 8 years ago, but I still remember the basics so here goes.

Each scripture that deals with poverty has words of a feeling of urgency but not to the poor, in fact, God says that the poor you will always have with you. The urgency is on those whom God has blessed with money. The poor are a challenge to the "rich" to be faithful and giving of the gifts that God has given to them.

Second, there are two kinds of poverty, those who do not work and those who are living in poverty because of oppresion. Again, the responsibility of the second kind of poverty is on those whom God has given riches.

Thirdly, poverty can be a blessing and teach us many things about God, faith, trust, etc. we just need to submit to God's authority in our lives just as we should if we have wealth.

In a nutshell, poverty is not a sin, being blessed monetarily by God and doing nothing to meet the needs of the poor is a sin. Then we can talk about Godly business practices but that may be best left for another forum.

 

[Follower of Christ too]

Wow, I just read this thread and I don't know where to begin.

When we left everything to follow God's call on our lives, it took a lot of faith. Especially with 3 young children. It also took a lot of prayer and soul searching. A lot of blessings to us and others, a lot of lessons, and poverty. This is when I started studying in earnest what the scriptures said about poverty.

At the current moment, I can't give you all the scriptures, the study was done over 8 years ago, but I still remember the basics so here goes.

Each scripture that deals with poverty has words of a feeling of urgency but not to the poor, in fact, God says that the poor you will always have with you. The urgency is on those whom God has blessed with money. The poor are a challenge to the "rich" to be faithful and giving of the gifts that God has given to them.

Second, there are two kinds of poverty, those who do not work and those who are living in poverty because of oppresion. Again, the responsibility of the second kind of poverty is on those whom God has given riches.

Thirdly, poverty can be a blessing and teach us many things about God, faith, trust, etc. we just need to submit to God's authority in our lives just as we should if we have wealth.

In a nutshell, poverty is not a sin, being blessed monetarily by God and doing nothing to meet the needs of the poor is a sin. Then we can talk about Godly business practices but that may be best left for another forum.

I like your reply.... We are supposed to lean on Him for all things...

 

[SavedByGrace3]

Thirdly, poverty can be a blessing and teach us many things about God, faith, trust, etc. we just need to submit to God's authority in our lives just as we should if we have wealth.....

I like your reply.... We are supposed to lean on Him for all things...

I have never met anyone who was truely impoverished that thought poverty was a blessing. There is nothing blessed about cold and hungry kids who are sick. Nowhere in the word of God is poverty called a blessing.. rather it is called a curse over and over again. Nowhere are we told to pray for this "blessing", or to simply accept it as the ultimate will of God for our lives.
You are correct that we are to lean on Him for all things... but isn't one of those things deliverance from poverty?
You are correct that we need to submit to God's athority in our lives... and is not that the Word of God that tells us to prosper and be in health even as our souls prosper?
If poverty teaches us about faith and trust... then to what end are we having faith? For more poverty? For more sickness? I do not think so. Eventually we are to have faith toward an end that God has established in His word.
Faith does not come by suffering. It comes by hearing God in your heart and hearing God in your heart comes by a word spoken from Christ. No where are we told that enduring sickness and poverty increases our spirituality or faith one itoa. In every case we are told to trust Him for deliverance, healing, and having needs met.
I pray that people's eyes are opened and that they see what the Father is truely like. He is good and His mercy endures forever. He is the Lord that is more than enough.

 

[SavedByGrace3]

At this point, there is nothing I can do, except lay it all in His hands. Get my eyes totally focused on Him and praise Him despite the threats of man. Fear and depression only get in the way of His provision.

Please pray for me in this area.

Thank you,

Lee

My heavenly Father I lift up my dear friend and saint LeeS. I praise you for this child of yours who is your servant and slave for the gospel. Thank you that she has blessed me again and again with her stalwart profession of faith. I praise you Lord for the provision that you have set aside for this saint.
I pray my God and Father that you look upon this your child and take notice of her needs. Bless her my Father God in the name of Jesus with the provisions declared in your Word. I thank you Lord Jesus that you loved us so much that you took upon yourself the curse of the law. You loved her so much that you endured this curse for her and delivered her from it. Free her now accordingly and let the provision manifest in her life and even in those around her and in her sphere. Let you blessings flow in and out of her life dear Father God so that your love and glory will be manifest to all who witness her manner of life. Let her deliverance be a signpost to all who see her and let your salvation shine forth for all to see. Let this be a testimony to your power and glory, your gospel, and your word. Lord Jesus, let her joy be full at this time as you glorify the Father with the supplying of your provision. Every need met and every care addressed in the name of Jesus. Every foe vanquished and every barrier crushed in the name of Jesus. Lord let a spirit of wisdom and revelation flow forth in the knowledge of the provisions of the gospel. Speak into her heart the realities of the word. Break every fetter and loose every bond in the holy and powerful name of JESUS!

 

[pmarquette]

poor in pocket or poor in spirit ?
money enables us to do what is good or evil , depending upon the desires of our heart .

as in the parable of the talents , what is the return on His investment in you ? are you a good steward of your monthly income : giving tithes , offerings , doing the work of the kingdom ? Or are you in it for self satisfaction and the money : filthy lucre ?

2 Peter 3.4 sincere , honest , meek , humble , quiet
your heart is right , soon your head will follow

 

[razzelflabben]

I have never met anyone who was truely impoverished that thought poverty was a blessing. There is nothing blessed about cold and hungry kids who are sick. Nowhere in the word of God is poverty called a blessing.. rather it is called a curse over and over again. Nowhere are we told to pray for this "blessing", or to simply accept it as the ultimate will of God for our lives.
You are correct that we are to lean on Him for all things... but isn't one of those things deliverance from poverty?
You are correct that we need to submit to God's athority in our lives... and is not that the Word of God that tells us to prosper and be in health even as our souls prosper?
If poverty teaches us about faith and trust... then to what end are we having faith? For more poverty? For more sickness? I do not think so. Eventually we are to have faith toward an end that God has established in His word.
Faith does not come by suffering. It comes by hearing God in your heart and hearing God in your heart comes by a word spoken from Christ. No where are we told that enduring sickness and poverty increases our spirituality or faith one itoa. In every case we are told to trust Him for deliverance, healing, and having needs met.
I pray that people's eyes are opened and that they see what the Father is truely like. He is good and His mercy endures forever. He is the Lord that is more than enough.

I hear so much fear in peoples voices and in many of the posts I read on poverty. A fear of poverty itself. Mt 10:28-31 says that we should not fear anything but God. Where is all this fear coming from. Poverty is nothing to fear if we have learned to trust God for our every need. If God uses poverty to teach you this valuable lesson, then poverty is a blessing to you for it has been the instrument God has chosen to use to draw you into a very real and closer walk with him.

As to the issue raised about faith not coming from suffering, when were we instructed to throw James 1:2-11 out of our Bibles (at the moment I am short on time so I will let you look it up yourselves) Suffice to say that it is the very trial we try so hard to avoid that hold the greatest blessings for us. Oh, and don't forget to read vs.9-11 in the discussion we are having for it speaks volumes about what God thinks of riches. At least the earthly kind.

 

[LeeS]

I hear so much fear in peoples voices and in many of the posts I read on poverty. A fear of poverty itself. Mt 10:28-31 says that we should not fear anything but God. Where is all this fear coming from. Poverty is nothing to fear if we have learned to trust God for our every need. If God uses poverty to teach you this valuable lesson, then poverty is a blessing to you for it has been the instrument God has chosen to use to draw you into a very real and closer walk with him.

As to the issue raised about faith not coming from suffering, when were we instructed to throw James 1:2-11 out of our Bibles (at the moment I am short on time so I will let you look it up yourselves) Suffice to say that it is the very trial we try so hard to avoid that hold the greatest blessings for us. Oh, and don't forget to read vs.9-11 in the discussion we are having for it speaks volumes about what God thinks of riches. At least the earthly kind.

Lowly and poverty are two different words. Poverty means lack of money or material possessions, and want. In soil it means poor quality. Lowly on the other hand means humble and meek. Or, ranking low in some hierarchy.

To say that God wants some to be in poverty completetly contradicts what scripture says. Specifically the 23rd Psalm, verse 1, "The Lord is my Shepherd, I shall NOT want".

The scriptures you referrrenced are telling us that True riches are found in being children of God. No one is able to buy their way into eternal life. The lowly individual is to rejoice that while they are not RICH in earthly possessions (this has nothing to do w/poverty), they are rich in heavenly things. Likewise, the rich are to rejoice that though their earthly riches will pass away, their eternal riches will not. Whatever earthly thing we pursue will at some point fade away. But Jesus will never fade. Our eternal riches will never fade. Both rich and lowly may rejoice in this.

I don't want to be "Filthy Rich". I want to pay my bills. There is nothing glorious about having to decide whether to pay the electric bill or the rent. There is nothing glorious about whether to pay the auto insurance or gasoline so that you can get to work for the next week. There is nothing glorious about having creditors automatically taking the money from your checking acct and not having money to pay all of the above. I think it would be great to live w/o needing any of these things but in this day and age they call that being a hermit.

I want to not only just pay my bills but I want to be able to help other's pay theirs. I want to give to missions. I want go on missions trips. Missionaries do not survive without provision in some form.

I can't remember the scripture ref but there is a scripture that says something about the riches of the heathen being stored up for the righteous. We need it. To further the Kingdom. Unfortionately, many are turning it away, because they think it's bad.

 

[Rainbow.]

Hello Rainbow.
Rainbows are one of my favorite things. I actually took a picture of a rainbow and had it made into a postcard!

I know exactly what you mean when you talk about millions of Christians being poor. It is so sad. There is no lack of poverty in the body of Christ, and that is a shame because He has made provision for us to live in this life at the same level as our spirits live. Abundantly!!

But to overcome poverty takes more than prayer. It takes belief. Lots of people pray, but are they believing? God is there waiting for faith to reach out and touch his provisions. Simply believe that you have received the things that you have asked for.

Mar 11:24
24 That's why I tell you to have faith that you have already received whatever you pray for, and it will be yours.

When people understand this, their prayer and praise lives explode!
Pray for you needs, and then begin to praise God that He has given you the provisions you need to take care of your family. Do not wait for them to come... begin immediately to praise Him instantly as you pray. After all, you have already received them!

This is not luck dear heart... this is the power and provision of God. It was not luck that drove Jesus to the cross to become a curse for us so that we could be redeemed from the curse of the law. It was not luck that caused all the promises of God to be Yes and Amen to us because of what Jesus did. Please do not give luck the credit for what Jesus did for us. Instead, give Jesus the praise! Thank you Lord!!

I really did not get "bored" of being poor.. but it certainly did get old. And thank God he lead me out of that mentality. There is a religious spirit out there that deceives people into thinking that poverty somehow makes then holy. How sad! Jesus and Jesus alone makes us Holy. He has accomplished everything needed to effect our salvation from sin, sickness, poverty, deomns, and the second death. There is another religious spirit out there that tells people that the will of God is different for them.. that they are special for some reason and the Word does not really apply to them. But that is a lie. It does apply to you! Every word of it. He has redeemed you just like He was redeemed us all. They make Him mysterious and strange... and try to say His ways are unknowable. But Jesus came to show us the Father! He did not fail. The ways of God have been clearly and plainly shown to us in the ministry and passion of Jesus.
The word of God is no fairy tale... it is quick and powerful. It goes out and accomplishes. It is alive. Begin to thank Him for all He has done for you!

I think your getting the wrong end of the stick here, maybe because i used the work luck.
Well i will change that word to blessed.
I myself am not poor, i was just stating that there are many poor people out there which have not been blessed in the way you were.
When i read some of the stuff that some people are saying on this subject, it's clear to me that they will never know what it's like to be truly poor or hungry, and i dont know of any poor people who feel holy by their poorness!
When you say
"But to overcome poverty takes more than prayer. It takes belief. Lots of people pray, but are they believing? God is there waiting for faith to reach out and touch his provisions. Simply believe that you have received the things that you have asked for. "
Dont you think the starving children and their mothers have tried all this, yet are still going to bed with hunger pains in their bellies.
Sometimes people are on this earth to suffer, and no amount of prayer and faith will help them. The only comfort from that i get is that they will be the first through the narrow gates of heaven!
And as for not giving God the credit and saying it was luck, well that's fair enough maybe i used the wrong words there, what i should have said was.... There but for the grace of God there go i....

 

[SavedByGrace3]

I hear so much fear in peoples voices and in many of the posts I read on poverty. A fear of poverty itself. Mt 10:28-31 says that we should not fear anything but God. Where is all this fear coming from. Poverty is nothing to fear if we have learned to trust God for our every need.

Then you are not in poverty are you? If you trust God and have every need supplied, then you are prosperous.

We are saying the same thing!

Needs met = prosperous
Needs not met = poverty

If God uses poverty to teach you this valuable lesson, then poverty is a blessing to you for it has been the instrument God has chosen to use to draw you into a very real and closer walk with him.

What is this lesson that He is using poverty to teach you? I understand the NT and the gospel to say that Jesus has done everything needed to bring us all the way to God. We are not brought one inch closer to God by our own efforts, whether the efforts be works or suffering. In the end, there is only one thing that is going to bring to the Father, and that is Jesus. All esle is dead works.

As to the issue raised about faith not coming from suffering, when were we instructed to throw James 1:2-11 out of our Bibles (at the moment I am short on time so I will let you look it up yourselves) Suffice to say that it is the very trial we try so hard to avoid that hold the greatest blessings for us.

I love James. Lets read the verses that you are speaking about:

James 1:2-4 KJV
2 My brethren, count it all joy when ye fall into divers temptations;
3 Knowing this, that the trying of your faith worketh patience.
4 But let patience have her perfect work, that ye may be perfect and entire, wanting nothing.

I notice that in verse 2 it specifically speaks of temptations. These verses speak about sins and using our faith to overcome them. It really is not talking about God using sickness or proverty to try us does it? Of course resisting temptation has the end result of being perfect.! Praise God!

Oh, and don't forget to read vs.9-11 in the discussion we are having for it speaks volumes about what God thinks of riches. At least the earthly kind.

I am wondering if you are suggesting that verse 2 is talking about trials as in afflictions and poverty. If so, let's be sure to continue this train of thought throughout. Especially verse 13.


James 1:13 BBE
Let no man say when he is tested, I am tested by God; for it is not possible for God to be tested by evil, and he himself puts no man to such a test:

We have to be consistant. If these verse are talking temptation to sin, then they have nothing to do with sickness and poverty. If they are talking about evils that come upon us, then verse 13 says that they do not come from God. If they do not come from God then we should rebuke them and overcome them.

 

[Follower of Christ too]

I am not in poverty either. There was a time though......I must say that in my sufferings was the glory of God revealed in a magnificent way.....Have you ever been hungry, and the hand of God fed you? I'm not talking about not having money to go to Burger King...I have been so poor and lived so far in a hollar with no way out..So, in some of the sufferings I went through it was by His Hand that we were often fed and always healed. Once my son was raised from the dead............So, IMO if you are in the position your first stop can't be the E.R. it's good to be on the side of Jesus