Is celebrating xmas a sin??

[gadar perets]

Gadar, someone messed it up BIG TIME. I will show you who.

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If the first church to branch off from the NT was this, we are not of the Covenant at all. Who will we say we are? The LORD Abhorred it and somebody took off with a Church that's more Pagan that I don't even know if the LORD would want to come to earth to stay even for a micro-second. Look even if Jesus was a prophet of God he abhorred this and even if he had disciples they abhorred this too. I know they were Jews and even if they did something new to you they observed all the Commandments. At least, they did Otherwise, I renounce this!

I renounce it as well.

 

[Linet Kihonge]

Our forefathers, ate beef and Chicken most of the time, despite our traditions I happen to prefer beef and chicken. On the other hand, even if we felt most of the Leviticus unclean animals were impure to us to and a few other things, under the New Testament we reserve comments/prejudice. Otherwise, with all due respect let YHWH be.

 

[CodyFaith]

So, your defense of Christmas is Hollywood fantasy and what unbelievers think? Where is your Biblical foundation for loving what the world loves? It's a window of opportunity to lead them out darkness by using untruths and more darkness? Is the preaching of the Gospel through a Spirit filled believer not enough so that we have to resort to lying to the world about Christmas being the Savior's birthday in order to draw them in?

No, as I believe Christmas truly is Christ's birthday. It's a window of opportunity because of alll the light that's shining in the world at that time. Satan has tried to get rid of Christ's influence in Christmas (Satan Claws, 12 apostles 12 raindeer, Santa knowing when you're awake or sleeping, etc. - a counterfeit Christ), but just because Satan's influence is present and he's tried to commercialize Christmas as much as possible, doesn't mean that's all Christmas is.

There's too much light for it not to be true. It's too blessed.

 

[gadar perets]

No, as I believe Christmas truly is Christ's birthday. It's a window of opportunity because of alll the light that's shining in the world at that time. Satan has tried to get rid of Christ's influence in Christmas (Satan Claws, 12 apostles 12 raindeer, Santa knowing when you're awake or sleeping, etc. - a counterfeit Christ), but just because Satan's influence is present and he's tried to commercialize Christmas as much as possible, doesn't mean that's all Christmas is.

There's too much light for it not to be true. It's too blessed.

2 Corinthians 11:14-15 And no marvel; for Satan himself is transformed into an angel of light.
Therefore it is no great thing if his ministers also be transformed as the ministers of righteousness; whose end shall be according to their works.
​

If this can be true of Satan and his ministers, then their works can appear as light or righteous or blessed as well. It is all part of the deception.

Do you have any historical or Biblical proof that "Christmas truly is Christ's birthday"?

 

[Linet Kihonge]

Friends (the pro December), the person you don't know is the "Serpent" He doesn't come in horns and dracula teeth. He comes dressed in white and with a smile that would make you think twice about the LORD you preach. Let me tell you now, lest you fall prey to his jaws of death. He's gonna sing along, "Hark Now, hear the angels sing," He'll hum to "Silent Night" and Jeer on, "Parara pam pam parara pam pam" and guess what, He won't stop you because you think you are singing to God. NO! DON'T EXPECT that. He Knows, he's takin' you on a roller coaster to NO GOOD! All the same, sing your Christmas songs but Just remember, The LORD ain't involved!

 

[CodyFaith]

2 Corinthians 11:14-15 And no marvel; for Satan himself is transformed into an angel of light.
Therefore it is no great thing if his ministers also be transformed as the ministers of righteousness; whose end shall be according to their works.
​

If this can be true of Satan and his ministers, then their works can appear as light or righteous or blessed as well. It is all part of the deception.

Do you have any historical or Biblical proof that "Christmas truly is Christ's birthday"?

Too much love, light, joy, helping of the poor, focus on Christ, etc. to be something that's of Satan. There's Satanic influence, yes, as I've already said Satan tries to corrupt what is blessed and good and holy. But that's all it is, influence, the days and season themselves are still blessed.

I can prove it biblicalally by "the tree and it's fruit"(although I'm sure you'd just start naming off the fruits of Satan's influence instead of the true meanings of Christmas). I can prove it biblically by all the verses about love, giving to the poor, etc.

Where's your evidence that it's not? Because it's too cold for shepherds to shepherd? As if that somehow makes it impossible.

 

[W2L]

No, as I believe Christmas truly is Christ's birthday. It's a window of opportunity because of alll the light that's shining in the world at that time. Satan has tried to get rid of Christ's influence in Christmas (Satan Claws, 12 apostles 12 raindeer, Santa knowing when you're awake or sleeping, etc. - a counterfeit Christ), but just because Satan's influence is present and he's tried to commercialize Christmas as much as possible, doesn't mean that's all Christmas is.

There's too much light for it not to be true. It's too blessed.

Don't let it bother you. Its just a holiday that people argue over. Don't let it cause you to stumble.

 

[Linet Kihonge]

2 Corinthians 11:14-15 And no marvel; for Satan himself is transformed into an angel of light.
Therefore it is no great thing if his ministers also be transformed as the ministers of righteousness; whose end shall be according to their works.
​

If this can be true of Satan and his ministers, then their works can appear as light or righteous or blessed as well. It is all part of the deception.

Do you have any historical or Biblical proof that "Christmas truly is Christ's birthday"?

I warned about this debate :?

 

[gadar perets]

Too much love, light, joy, helping of the poor, focus on Christ, etc. to be something that's of Satan. There's Satanic influence, yes, as I've already said Satan tries to corrupt what is blessed and good and holy. But that's all it is, influence, the days and season themselves are still blessed.

I can prove it biblicalally by "the tree and it's fruit"(although I'm sure you'd just start naming off the fruits of Satan's influence instead of the true meanings of Christmas). I can prove it biblically by all the verses about love, giving to the poor, etc.

Where's your evidence that it's not? Because it's too cold for shepherds to shepherd? As if that somehow makes it impossible.

No one knows the date of his birth. I can produce my Biblical evidence which can be countered by other "evidence". The fact is, YHWH never commanded us to remember his birth every year. He did command us to remember his death and resurrection. His death took place on Abib 14 (Passover). Do you celebrate Passover? Do you remember his death on Abib 14 every year through partaking of the bread and cup on Abib 14? He resurrected on the day the wave sheaf was offered during the Feast of Unleavened Bread. Do you celebrate his resurrection during the Feast of Unleavened Bread every year or do you go with man's invented resurrection day called "Easter" (the first Sunday after the first full moon in the Spring)?

I choose to celebrate those events when YHWH brought them to pass on His calendar, not man's. He commanded it to be so in Leviticus 23. He did not command us to celebrate Christmas. If you answered "no" to the questions above, why would you be so particular about celebrating a man-made holiday on a spurious date, but reject celebrating major Biblical events on true dates?

 

[danny ski]

You will partake of the same w the Almighty lifts the blindness from Israel (Romans 11:7-8, 25-26; 2 Corinthians 3:6-16). Then you will receive Messiah Yeshua as YHWH's Maschiach, King and Savior (Zechariah 12:10-14; Revelation 1:7). Then you and I will stroll through the streets of New Jerusalem and talk about how loving and merciful YHWH is and I'll tell you all about what you missed by not receiving Yeshua earlier in your life as many of your brothers did.

When the blindness is introduced to a conversation it always means two things. One, you run out of the Scriptural argument. Two, it's time for this Jew to leave.

 

[gadar perets]

When the blindness is introduced to a conversation it always means two things. One, you run out of the Scriptural argument. Two, it's time for this Jew to leave.

You even blind yourself to the blindness prophesied by Isaiah?

Isaiah 29:9-14 Stay yourselves, and wonder; cry ye out, and cry: they are drunken, but not with wine; they stagger, but not with strong drink.
For YHWH has poured out upon you the spirit of deep sleep, and has closed your eyes: the prophets and your rulers, the seers has He covered.
And the vision of all is become unto you as the words of a book that is sealed, which men deliver to one that is learned, saying, Read this, I pray thee: and he saith, I cannot; for it is sealed:
And the book is delivered to him that is not learned, saying, Read this, I pray thee: and he says, I am not learned.
Wherefore Adonai said, For as much as this people draw near me with their mouth, and with their lips do honor me, but have removed their heart far from me, and their fear toward me is taught by the precept of men:
Therefore, behold, I will proceed to do a marvelous work among this people, even a marvelous work and a wonder: for the wisdom of their wise men shall perish, and the understanding of their prudent men shall be hid.
​

Thankfully Israel in the flesh will not remain blinded.

 

[CodyFaith]

No one knows the date of his birth. I can produce my Biblical evidence which can be countered by other "evidence". The fact is, YHWH never commanded us to remember his birth every year. He did command us to remember his death and resurrection. His death took place on Abib 14 (Passover). Do you celebrate Passover? Do you remember his death on Abib 14 every year through partaking of the bread and cup on Abib 14? He resurrected on the day the wave sheaf was offered during the Feast of Unleavened Bread. Do you celebrate his resurrection during the Feast of Unleavened Bread every year or do you go with man's invented resurrection day called "Easter" (the first Sunday after the first full moon in the Spring)?

I choose to celebrate those events when YHWH brought them to pass on His calendar, not man's. He commanded it to be so in Leviticus 23. He did not command us to celebrate Christmas. If you answered "no" to the questions above, why would you be so particular about celebrating a man-made holiday on a spurious date, but reject celebrating major Biblical events on true dates?

Christmas, to me, is special. I never cared for Easter, regardless of whether or not it's the true date of the resurrection (which it seems to be apparent it's not, as you make good points). The only argument I have for Christmas are the arguments I've already stated. I believe in Christmas. I don't know how it came about that man started celebrating it, I don't particularly care for secular history myself but secular history dates it all the way to close of the beginning of the church (couple hundred years off), so it's very possible in my eyes that it's been around since the beginning of the church.

Why would the early church not want to celebrate Christ's birth, if they knew about it already, is a question I ask myself. The day also could have been established by a prophet, I don't know.

I'm not Messianic, so without getting into a debate whether or not I celebrate Passover or other festivals in the law, I'll simply leave it at no I don't. I celebrate Christmas because I can recognize a blessed day when I see one/experience one. I grew up celebrating it, and had nothing but positive, loving Christmas's. It's more than tradition to me.

 

[Linet Kihonge]

A tradition made by man doesn't make it GOD's and doesn't mean Jesus was born on that day. So December makes man Happy but the LORD GOD of Jacob/Israel ABHORS IT! Simply because it was fun it doesn't mean he likes it! He just gave you another chance to see another YEAR! That's all.

 

[pat34lee]

I would be interested to see that laid out in another thread.

Here are 2 where it was discussed.

http://www.christianforums.com/threads/did-yeshua-read-on-yom-kippur-in-the-synagogue.7845288/

http://www.christianforums.com/threads/time-line-of-yeshuas-ministry.7845527/

 

[Linet Kihonge]

You even blind yourself to the blindness prophesied by Isaiah?

Isaiah 29:9-14 Stay yourselves, and wonder; cry ye out, and cry: they are drunken, but not with wine; they stagger, but not with strong drink.
For YHWH has poured out upon you the spirit of deep sleep, and has closed your eyes: the prophets and your rulers, the seers has He covered.
And the vision of all is become unto you as the words of a book that is sealed, which men deliver to one that is learned, saying, Read this, I pray thee: and he saith, I cannot; for it is sealed:
And the book is delivered to him that is not learned, saying, Read this, I pray thee: and he says, I am not learned.
Wherefore Adonai said, For as much as this people draw near me with their mouth, and with their lips do honor me, but have removed their heart far from me, and their fear toward me is taught by the precept of men:
Therefore, behold, I will proceed to do a marvelous work among this people, even a marvelous work and a wonder: for the wisdom of their wise men shall perish, and the understanding of their prudent men shall be hid.
​

Thankfully Israel in the flesh will not remain blinded.

It shall come to pass because Jews were his first fruits too. Only will the House of Jacob will come forth a great and righteous men to stand before the Throne of Elohim.

 

[Linet Kihonge]

When the blindness is introduced to a conversation it always means two things. One, you run out of the Scriptural argument. Two, it's time for this Jew to leave.

He will SAVE Israel

 

[danny ski]

He will SAVE Israel

Who and from what?

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

Who and from what?

What does Yhwh say in Torah ?
Yhwh watches over His Word to Guard it,
even more than He watches over and Guards His Own Name,
it is written.

 

[Lulav]

HELLO!

Now that I've got your attention please read the following message.

This thread has a lot of participants that we don't have

listed in the Thread Sticked at the top of the Forum.

Now to avoid any violations I am requesting all of you who

haven't read this Thread

"You must read and agree before posting in this forum"

Please go and do so. If you want to continue to participate here
you need to agree and post that you do so please do so Now.

In case some of you haven't noticed you are in the
Messianic Judaism forum.
It is not traditional for MJ's to celebrate Christ's Mass
Most celebrate Hanukah
So arguing against that here is a No-No. ​

 

[gadar perets]

Why would the early church not want to celebrate Christ's birth, if they knew about it already, is a question I ask myself. The day also could have been established by a prophet, I don't know.

Good question. The Jewish historian Josephus, who was born shortly after Yeshua resurrected, wrote;

Nay, indeed, the law does not permit us to make festivals at the birth of our children, and thereby afford occasion of drinking to excess (Josephus. Translated by W. Whiston. Against Apion, Book II, Chapter 26. Extracted from Josephus Complete Works, Kregel Publications, Grand Rapids (MI), 14th printing, 1977, p. 632).
​

The early church consisted of all Jews at first. Therefore, it probably wasn't until the church became predominantly non-Jewish that such a tradition began. In came Christmas and eating unclean meat and out went the Sabbath and Feast Days thanks to a non-Jewish church that knew nothing about Torah.

I grew up celebrating it, and had nothing but positive, loving Christmas's. It's more than tradition to me.

I know what you mean because I celebrated and loved Christmas for the first 30 years of my life, but when I read John 4:23-24 and learned more about the history of the holiday, I had to lay it down at the feet of Yeshua. If he wanted me to take it back up again, so be it, but that was not to be. Now our family rejoices in celebrating true holy days (Sabbath/Feasts). The highlight of my children's year is the seven day celebration of Sukkot (Feast of Tabernacles) which is when I believe Yeshua was born.