Is belief enough to be saved?

[Gregory Thompson]

What is most important to understand is that Jesus sacrificed himself freely out of love for us and that alone is our redemption. It is like the brass snake lifted up by Moses in the desert. Look to the cross and be saved. See that the head of the snake has been crushed under his heel, just as prophesied a the time that sin entered into the world.

To say that we are saved through the good that we do is the message of Judaism. It is a false gospel for Christians, for it puts the yoke that the Jews of old could not carry and places it back on us.

Those who look to the cross and see the conquest of sin by the Risen Christ enter into a relationship with Christ who pours his Spirit upon us.

The works of the indwelling Spirit continue in the salvation of the world. The grace of the Spirit is a free gift for all who look to the cross and see.

I agree, but would add one more thing .. don't look to the stick .. look to the snake .. Jesus who had no sin .. who became sin .. so we might be the righteousness of God in Him .

 

[Gregory Thompson]

I used scripture... do you believe that all of the bible is true... ? do you believe that scripture does not contradicts itself...? if so, then you can't ignore parts of it... and you cannot interpret it to contradict other scriptures... you can argue an alternative interpretation... but you do have to deal with the scriptures that contradict your argument... otherwise you're interpretation is wrong.

now you're being manipulative . the bible can say anything you want it to . i don't know why you're thinking you have some god given authority to lord it over me . but you are greatly mistaken . continue on as you are . and i will place you on my ignore list .

 

[Lion King]

no faith is faith love is love and hope is hope. All internal feelings but you can put them to work big difference . Works are works. Giving examples of Christ doing good works does not mean or say you are saved by works.

To be honest, I'm not sure I follow you. Where have I stated that faith is love?

By the way, tell me something: what "works" did Jesus Christ do?

I have testimony weightier than that of John. For the very work that the Father has given me to finish, and which I am doing, testifies that the Father has sent me. John 5:36

Do not believe me unless I do the works of my Father. But if I do them, even though you do not believe me, believe the works, that you may know and understand that the Father is in me, and I in the Father. John 10:37-38


PS. Please do not make the mistake of reducing love, faith and hope to mere internal feelings. They are from God.

 

[Lion King]

To say that we are saved through the good that we do is the message of Judaism. It is a false gospel for Christians, for it puts the yoke that the Jews of old could not even carry and places it right back on us. It is an impossible gospel.
Impossible that is, for all but Jesus.

Can I ask you a simple question: Do we not attain eternal life by loving the LORD and our neighbours?

Yes or No?

 

[Montalban]

Romans 9
30 What then shall we say? That the Gentiles, who did not pursue righteousness, have obtained it, a righteousness that is by FAITH;

So the Gentiles didn't need Jesus?

 

[Lindas Place]

now you're being manipulative . the bible can say anything you want it to . i don't know why you're thinking you have some god given authority to lord it over me . but you are greatly mistaken . continue on as you are . and i will place you on my ignore list .

I'm truly sorry you feel that way... but please don't ignore scriptures that contradict your interpretation... every word of God's word is important... and we can believe it all... God bless you!!!

 

[Lindas Place]

So the Gentiles didn't need Jesus?

by faith in Jesus...

 

[Montalban]

yes it is true we are new creatures. The old man is gone. I never cared about doing anything good until I was saved. Same with millions of drug dealers. Murders rapist prostitutes and etc that accepted Christ once again you did not answer the questions I asked earlier. I will repository then again.

Then why are we called to do what we should already be doing?

 

[Lindas Place]

Can I ask you a simple question: Do we not attain eternal life by loving the LORD and our neighbours?

Yes or No?

NO!

 

[Gregory Thompson]

I'm truly sorry you feel that way... but please don't ignore scriptures that contradict your interpretation... every word of God's word is important... and we can believe it all... God bless you!!!

bless you too, and i already consider the context of scripture when interpreting .. howbeit different from you .

 

[Montalban]

Reposted for you. And you are saying you can earn God's grace? Please come up with Scripture that is in context and you studied to answer each question. If you can't beside some half excuse and 1verse that has been explained already then to me this thread is dead.

No one has said you earn God's grace.

God offers his grace, you accept or reject it. But to properly accept it you need to be a new person. And you need to work at this. Like an athlete who has to train to stay fit. Otherwise you're not really committed.

 

[Montalban]

by faith in Jesus...

In Romans 2 Paul's talking about those who never knew Jesus.

 

[Montalban]

And you also were included in Christ when you heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation. Having believed, you were marked in him with a seal, the promised Holy Spirit, who is a deposit guaranteeing our inheritance until the redemption of those who are God's possession—to the praise of his glory Ephesians 1:13-14

These verses then are at odds with the verses calling us to do good works.

 

[Lindas Place]

These verses then are at odds with the verses calling us to do good works.

no there not... works don't save... that does not mean that our Father cannot command us to do them, and if we don't obey Him, He will discipline us... as the bible say's He disciplines His children ...

because the Lord disciplines those he loves, and he punishes everyone he accepts as a son."Hebrews 12:6

Endure hardship as discipline; God is treating you as sons. For what son is not disciplined by his father? If you are not disciplined (and everyone undergoes discipline), then you are illegitimate children and not true sons. Hebrews 12:7-8

No discipline seems pleasant at the time, but painful. Later on, however, it produces a harvest of righteousness and peace for those who have been trained by it. Hebrews 12:11

Proverbs 3
11 My son, do not despise the LORD's discipline
and do not resent his rebuke,
12 because the LORD disciplines those he loves,
as a father the son he delights in.

 

[Lindas Place]

No one has said you earn God's grace.

God offers his grace, you accept or reject it. But to properly accept it you need to be a new person. And you need to work at this. Like an athlete who has to train to stay fit. Otherwise you're not really committed.

We don't make ourselves a new person... that is the work of God and the gift of God...

John 1:12-14
12 Yet to all who received him, to those who believed in his name, he gave the right to become children of God— 13 children born not of natural descent, nor of human decision or a husband’s will, but born of God.

 

[Montalban]

no there not... works don't save...

I think I've said several times that I don't believe works alone save

 

[Montalban]

We don't make ourselves a new person... that is the work of God and the gift of God...

Even if that were so, it doesn't explain why God's asking you to do something that you would by (changed) nature do

However we do change ourselves, with God's grace. We are active participants in our own salvation.

 

[Rick Otto]

God asking us to do what our changed natures already motivate is affirmation of that motivation & provides to the unbelieving world a witness they can structure their denials of Him & His word around. It is all a part of Him showing His power as He said in His scripture:
Rom9:22 What if God, willing to shew his wrath, and to make his power known, endured with much longsuffering the vessels of wrath fitted to destruction:

Nevertheless, & regardless of their saying self-contradictions from different sides of their mouths, vain men will always attempt to claim a portion of God's glory for themselves.

 

[spartakis]

To be honest, I'm not sure I follow you. Where have I stated that faith is love?

By the way, tell me something: what "works" did Jesus Christ do?

I have testimony weightier than that of John. For the very work that the Father has given me to finish, and which I am doing, testifies that the Father has sent me. John 5:36

Do not believe me unless I do the works of my Father. But if I do them, even though you do not believe me, believe the works, that you may know and understand that the Father is in me, and I in the Father. John 10:37-38


PS. Please do not make the mistake of reducing love, faith and hope to mere internal feelings. They are from God.

They are not a work what's so hard to understand a work would be a physical act. Like me saying I am going to heaven for feeding the poor. Please go back through all my post I have asked you to answer questions and explain your view of the Scripture. So far you have only stated you believe love is a work along with hope and faith. And state you can earn your way to heaven. Faith in Christ is the only way to heaven and its not a work. I be explained this in other post and your only answer to every thing I have said is faith is a work. As far as I can tell we are going nowhere. The Scripture is clear on this matter and I feel this is my stopping point. Go back to my other post with the questions and study it. But telling people their salvatio has to do with their works is leading them astray. We are called to do good works. Not saved by them

 

[Albion]

To be honest, I'm not sure I follow you. Where have I stated that faith is love?

By the way, tell me something: what "works" did Jesus Christ do?

I have testimony weightier than that of John. For the very work that the Father has given me to finish, and which I am doing, testifies that the Father has sent me. John 5:36

Do not believe me unless I do the works of my Father. But if I do them, even though you do not believe me, believe the works, that you may know and understand that the Father is in me, and I in the Father. John 10:37-38

It looks like the mistake you're making is to think that anyone holds that doing works of mercy, etc. is somehow wrong to do. That isn't the point with the works vs. faith debate. The issue is only about what such works accomplish.