Is being a Christian and liking Guns mutually exclusive?

Darkhorse

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That is not even remotely true. In fact that is the exact opposite of truth.

The Bill of Rights, that includes the 2nd Amendment, was written after the war had ended. Washington has dismissed the Continental Army back to their homes. There was no standing army. None, nada.
Many in the congress wanted to keep it that way. The 2nd Amendment provided for a citizen militia to protect the the newly formed government. The language is right there in the Amendment:
A well regulated militia being necessary to the security of a free state, the right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed.

And yes "well regulated" meant trained and organized.

Are you familiar with the Heller decision (2008)?
 
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FenderTL5

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As for the topic:
Is being a Christian and liking Guns mutually exclusive?

No.
No more than liking nice homes and being a Christian are mutually exclusive.
No more than, nice clothing, cars, artwork, a collection of beanie babies.. whatever.

Where you run into a problem would be if you were unwilling to give them up. Then you're edging toward idolatry.
 
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Darkhorse

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Then you know that it says the right of the people to keep and bear arms is an individual right, and does not require any membership in a "militia".
 
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FenderTL5

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Then you know that it says the right of the people to keep and bear arms is an individual right, and does not require any membership in a "militia".
That is indeed true, that is what Heller indicated.
That is not my argument in the previous post. The previous poster said the amendment was included for the purpose of citizens to oppose their government. That is not true. The 2nd Amendment provided for the protection/security of the state (government), not its opposition.
 
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FenderTL5

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But it's not the same thing that I like a car, a house, clothes ...
It can be to some. There are those (probably few) who collect guns as a hobby and only use them for target practice, with no other intent.
Possible to kill with a pen? Sure, but that doesn't make a pen a weapon.
Weapons have only one purpose: to kill.
Agree.
That's not my argument.
 
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Darkhorse

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But it's not the same thing that I like a car, a house, clothes ...
Possible to kill with a pen? Sure, but that doesn't make a pen a weapon.

The same goes for the knife,it's a cutting tool and generally you don't need to register the knife.

Weapons have only one purpose: to kill.

It most certainly does make a pen a weapon, at least in that instance...

I actually have a functional pen which is intended to double as a stabbing weapon.

You seem to think that killing is always wrong; sometimes killing is the only solution to a problem.
 
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Darkhorse

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For example?

I'll give you two; there are countless other examples.
Understand that I live in the country, not a big city.

(1) I'm driving down the road, when a deer jumps out in front of my car. The deer is hit and severely injured (broken back) and cannot move. It can only lie there on the road and struggle.
I could leave it there, exposing it to prolonged agony and exposing other drivers to the danger of a large obstacle in the road, or I could pull my gun out of my pocket, shoot it in the head (instant death), and drag it off the road. Which action do you think is better?

(2) I'm walking along the road in my neighborhood, when a snarling dog runs out of a driveway towards me. No one is in sight. I understand dogs pretty well, and most will not attack you if you face them. This dog grabs my leg and starts pulling it side-to-side. Again, I would pull out my gun and shoot it, but not in the head (an intact brain is necessary for a rabies diagnosis).
What "better" solution can you think of?
 
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JohnDB

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I'll give you two; there are countless other examples.
Understand that I live in the country, not a big city.

(1) I'm driving down the road, when a deer jumps out in front of my car. The deer is hit and severely injured (broken back) and cannot move. It can only lie there on the road and struggle.
I could leave it there, exposing it to prolonged agony and exposing other drivers to the danger of a large obstacle in the road, or I could pull my gun out of my pocket, shoot it in the head (instant death), and drag it off the road. Which action do you think is better?

(2) I'm walking along the road in my neighborhood, when a snarling dog runs out of a driveway towards me. I understand dogs pretty well, and most will not attack you if you face them. This dog grabs my leg and starts pulling it side-to-side. Again, I would pull out my gun and shoot it, but not in the head (an intact brain is necessary for a rabies diagnosis).

Manipulating a cross bow is much more difficult... especially if it's in your pocket.
LOL
And I have seen where people have to put "Cattle guards" on the front of their vehicles because of the deer. It's not a question of "IF" but "WHEN" you hit a deer.
 
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Darkhorse

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And I have seen where people have to put "Cattle guards" on the front of their vehicles because of the deer. It's not a question of "IF" but "WHEN" you hit a deer.

My family and I have lived here 15 years, and have hit deer twice so far...
 
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Aryeh Jay

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Last year my wife hit two deer within two days, both times the hind legs were broken and almost no damage to the car. She dispatched both with her .44 special and bragged that she got both of her deer right after the season opened. But then neither of us are Christians so we have no problems having or using “weapons”.
 
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Darkhorse

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BTW, we can not use firearms for self defense here, we can not "carry" pistols anywhere but our approved ranges; but still, worth it!!

Just as an aside, is any self-defense legal there?
Can you use any non-firearm weapons (knives, swords) for defense?
How about tools (pipe wrench, ax)?
 
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JohnDB

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Just as an aside, is any self-defense legal there?
Can you use any non-firearm weapons (knives, swords) for defense?
How about tools (pipe wrench, ax)?

I heard that they were so difficult on knives that those who are accustomed to using straight razors were having difficulties getting them sent out for honing.
 
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MarkRohfrietsch

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Just as an aside, is any self-defense legal there?
Can you use any non-firearm weapons (knives, swords) for defense?
How about tools (pipe wrench, ax)?

Actually, in the last few years, firearms have been used in self defense, and the court has ruled in favor of the person defending themselves; but only after those persons were charged, and after long and expensive court cases. We are not allowed to use undue force; so one's life has to be in immediate and pending danger. If a guy comes into your store, shoots at you, an employee, or actually shoots someone, you can not chase the criminal out on the street and shoot him as he is running away. A Canadian Jewelry store owner did just that, and has been in jail some years now.

Right or wrong, the incidence of needing to defend one's self up here is still very rare, unless you are already a criminal. Most shootings remain gang related; and are either organized or disorganized crime, drug related. If you live outside of that culture, your chances of needing to defend your life or property are very remote indeed.

Substance abuse remains the game changer, as I am sure it is in the US.

Even if I were allowed to concealed carry here in Canada, I would not. Over sixty years, living various places, and not one instance where I ever felt I might need one.
 
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Darkhorse

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Actually, in the last few years, firearms have been used in self defense, and the court has ruled in favor of the person defending themselves; but only after those persons were charged, and after long and expensive court cases. We are not allowed to use undue force; so one's life has to be in immediate and pending danger. If a guy comes into your store, shoots at you, an employee, or actually shoots someone, you can not chase the criminal out on the street and shoot him as he is running away. A Canadian Jewelry store owner did just that, and has been in jail some years now.

Actually, the bold part is very similar to U.S. laws. That's encouraging.
 
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Hazelelponi

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I once said that I like guns and think of them as a beautiful technical art. I was nearly kicked off of FB and the hate mail was on one reason I left FB. It seems that some people have the impression that if you say that you are a Christian and like guns then you are a hypocrite. Not so. I am also a former machinist and fabricator, a marketing management professional, a 3D CAD artist, and I have built thousands of fixtures for manufacturing engineering of products almost everybody has seen in some form. I do not mean that all guns are beautiful, technical, nor an art. However, I do appreciate those which are made in high or moderate volume manufacturing and have the look and feel of fine craftsmanship. I really appreciate it when I see an older a gun with more tight fitting the parts and which as been around for many years and still shoots accurately and reliably. What about you? Do you think that being a Christian and like guns makes you (me) a hypocrite?

There was a Christ follower who was a Roman soldier in the Bible, and there are Christians in our military today.

Belief in absolute non-violence is not a prerequisite of the Christian faith, there are times we should "sell your cloak and buy a sword"

I have always believed for myself that I have to hold to non-violence, but there are reasons I believe so, that aren't universal to every Christian.

My husband on the other hand enjoys guns, as well as owns a couple himself. Certainly beyond hunting or target practice he hopes there will never come a time he needs to use them, but to pretend there will never be a necessary occasion is to be blind to reality, such that it is.

So I see no harm in appreciating fine craftsmanship, wherever you find it. I myself think swords are cool, and have a couple fine specimens of craftsmanship in this area... I just personally don't believe myself willing to use them - for any reason.

We are who we are.. :) Nothing wrong with it.
 
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MarkRohfrietsch

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There was a Christ follower who was a Roman soldier in the Bible, and there are Christians in our military today.

Belief in absolute non-violence is not a prerequisite of the Christian faith, there are times we should "sell your cloak and buy a sword"

I have always believed for myself that I have to hold to non-violence, but there are reasons I believe so, that aren't universal to every Christian.

My husband on the other hand enjoys guns, as well as owns a couple himself. Certainly beyond hunting or target practice he hopes there will never come a time he needs to use them, but to pretend there will never be a necessary occasion is to be blind to reality, such that it is.

So I see no harm in appreciating fine craftsmanship, wherever you find it. I myself think swords are cool, and have a couple fine specimens of craftsmanship in this area... I just personally don't believe myself willing to use them - for any reason.

We are who we are.. :) Nothing wrong with it.
Our Synods provide Clergy to the Chaplaincy or both the Canadian and US armed forces. The National Bishop of the LCMS is a former US Navy Chaplain.
 
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BNR32FAN

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I once said that I like guns and think of them as a beautiful technical art. I was nearly kicked off of FB and the hate mail was on one reason I left FB. It seems that some people have the impression that if you say that you are a Christian and like guns then you are a hypocrite. Not so. I am also a former machinist and fabricator, a marketing management professional, a 3D CAD artist, and I have built thousands of fixtures for manufacturing engineering of products almost everybody has seen in some form. I do not mean that all guns are beautiful, technical, nor an art. However, I do appreciate those which are made in high or moderate volume manufacturing and have the look and feel of fine craftsmanship. I really appreciate it when I see an older a gun with more tight fitting the parts and which as been around for many years and still shoots accurately and reliably. What about you? Do you think that being a Christian and like guns makes you (me) a hypocrite?

The apostles carried swords while they followed Jesus. Surely God didn’t just miracle that sword into Peter’s hand when cut off the slave’s ear when they came to arrest Jesus. Abraham carried a sword, Jacob carried a sword, David carried a sword, and a sling, Samson; ok well he carried a jaw bone but it was still a weapon. No brother there’s nothing wrong with a Christian who likes guns. They’re fun to shoot. Too many people often associate guns with death. Your kitchen knife can kill someone, your car can kill someone or a screwdriver or a hammer. It’s not the tool that’s guilty of sin but the person who wields it and that all depends on what he does with it. I have a pistol that’s never killed anything except targets at a firing range and God so help me I hope it stays that way until the day I die. There’s absolutely nothing wrong with being a Christian and liking guns...especially if your from Texas ;)
 
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SJP51

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That is not even remotely true. In fact that is the exact opposite of truth.

The Bill of Rights, that includes the 2nd Amendment, was written after the war had ended. Washington has dismissed the Continental Army back to their homes. There was no standing army. None, nada.
Many in the congress wanted to keep it that way. The 2nd Amendment provided for a citizen militia to protect the the newly formed government. The language is right there in the Amendment:
A well regulated militia being necessary to the security of a free state, the right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed.

And yes "well regulated" meant trained and organized.

No sir. It is ENTIRELY true. The British had attempted to take their arms and powder. Having lived through that, they then included the 2A in the Bill of Rights, which was indeed written after we were victorious. They knew that even our new governement could become tyranical (as it has) and the WE THE PEOPLE had to have arms to protect ourselves from it.

Read the Federalist Papers for insights into what the founders thought and why they did what they did.
 
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SJP51

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No,not exactly!
A weapon is a weapon, it has only one purpose, and you know it.
Can you cut bread with a gun?
Can you split a tree with a gun?
So, the weapon is very different from other tools, such as a knife, machete etc.

Firearms have MANY purposes. And you know it. Let's have list:
1. Self defense of my person: Against individuals larger, faster, stronger or with weapons of any kind.
2. Self defense against home invaison: Happening more and more. Read about it all the time.
3. Defense of my familiy:
4. Hunting: putting food on the table.
5. Sport: Target shooting, skeet, trap, sporting clays, Western Challenge, IPSC steel, etc.
6. Defense of my country: Japanese did not invade our mainland after Pearl Habor because our civilians were so well armed and they knew it. Read a little history.

Notice how many times "defense" is a purpose of firearms? That is a purpose that civil, poilite, law abiding folk have, and must have becuase there are so many thugs in the world. And many of those thugs are bigger, younger, faster, meaner, and merciless. Been there with thugs and I prefer to go armed. It's not happening again.
 
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