Illigal Imigration

[tsr]

I agree that we should show compassion for everyone. But as the American government should be firstly concerned with the well being of Americans. Illegal immigrants do jobs that for generations were done by Americans, but for the last generation we've been told that American's "won't do" those jobs. We've been told this so often that we've come to believe it. I have come to see, especially during this time of economic uncertainty that Americans - like illegal immigrants - will do what it takes to survive. With unemployment hovering at 9%+, I really feel that this issue needs to be addressed in order to build a sustainable economy in the future.

Illegal Immigrants are hurting the economy of the United States. Compassion is for everyone granted......but we are (goverment) allowing this to happen to a degree which is wrong and of course against the law. Companys' are using illegals because of one things (Greed!!!) Laws must be adhered to and followed the goverment must clamp down on this issue before its to late.

 

[Randy_R]

I saw Jesus the other day.
I saw Him in the face of the migrant worker who works brutal hours in the hot sun.
I saw Him in the Hispanic American who was given a dirty look because "he's probably one of those illegals...".
I saw Him in the face of janitor working 80 hours a week so her children can have a better life than she has.
I saw Him in the face of the man who has been waiting for years to get in legally and hopes maybe next month.
I saw Him in the face of the mother who never thinks about leaving her country because she's too busy collecting garbage to sell to provide for her children.

As long as we can see Jesus in the face of someone in need, we have to help. Illegal immigration is an issue that has to be dealt with separate from the obligation we have to Jesus to help those in need.

And if you can't see Jesus in the faces of those in need, you need to ask why. And pray.

 

[Aibrean]

So, committing crime is helping Jesus?

 

[Randy_R]

So, committing crime is helping Jesus?

It often is. It usually has been throughout history.

“We must obey God rather than any human authority. (Acts 5:29).

 

[contango]

I wonder if God recognizes the lines we draw in the sand? I wonder if He knows or even cares what an illegal alien is?

When questioned on judgment day, do you think God will accept – “They didn’t deserve help because they were born on the wrong side of the line”?

Without wishing to stray too far into politics, this does create something of a question relating to where the duty to help others lies.

If we take the view that it is the duty of the individual Christian to see a need and meet it the legal status of another person in need is not an issue. Just as the Good Samaritan helped someone who in the day would have been anathema to him, so we may be called to help someone who we might normally want to avoid.

If we take the view that it is the duty of government to centralize aid and dispense that aid as the government sees fit then we fall foul of all sorts of thorny issues, not least relating to how to prioritise those needs real or imagined. Do we provide food for a citizen over housing for an illegal? What about legal immigrants - in many countries legal immigrants are expected to pay taxes but are not entitled to public assistance.

I suspect that on judgment day God will be looking to see what we did, not what we abdicated to government to do on our behalf.

 

[tsr]

I saw Jesus the other day.
I saw Him in the face of the migrant worker who works brutal hours in the hot sun.
I saw Him in the Hispanic American who was given a dirty look because "he's probably one of those illegals...".
I saw Him in the face of janitor working 80 hours a week so her children can have a better life than she has.
I saw Him in the face of the man who has been waiting for years to get in legally and hopes maybe next month.
I saw Him in the face of the mother who never thinks about leaving her country because she's too busy collecting garbage to sell to provide for her children.

As long as we can see Jesus in the face of someone in need, we have to help. Illegal immigration is an issue that has to be dealt with separate from the obligation we have to Jesus to help those in need.

And if you can't see Jesus in the faces of those in need, you need to ask why. And pray.

Sorry Randy I don't agree with you. These people are breaking the law and are criminals. This is not a spiritual issue or moral this is a civil issue by law. I uderstand what your saying however what did Jesus say on this....give unto Cesaer what is Cesaer and give unto God what is for God..... This quote is not exact by the Bible but the meaning is clear. The bottom line these people should be returned to their country.

 

[Randy_R]

Sorry Randy I don't agree with you. These people are breaking the law and are criminals. This is not a spiritual issue or moral this is a civil issue by law. I uderstand what your saying however what did Jesus say on this....give unto Cesaer what is Cesaer and give unto God what is for God..... This quote is not exact by the Bible but the meaning is clear. The bottom line these people should be returned to their country.

You'll have to forgive me then. My Elder Brother was an illegal alien (He never got a visa when He came down from Heaven). And when He did get here, He wound up getting executed as a radical subversive. I've also had brothers and sisters thrown into psychiatric hospitals in China and the USSR for Schizophrenia because as Christians they heard from God. As a matter of fact my family has had more brothers and sisters executed for breaking the law then were killed in the last 1900 years combined.

So you'll have to forgive me, being a radical runs in the Family.

 

[Aibrean]

Does committing crime make us a viable witnesses? Did God not say through Paul in Romans 13 to submit to the government because they have been instituted by him?

Let everyone be subject to the governing authorities, for there is no authority except that which God has established. The authorities that exist have been established by God. 2 Consequently, whoever rebels against the authority is rebelling against what God has instituted, and those who do so will bring judgment on themselves. 3 For rulers hold no terror for those who do right, but for those who do wrong. Do you want to be free from fear of the one in authority? Then do what is right and you will be commended. 4 For the one in authority is God’s servant for your good. But if you do wrong, be afraid, for rulers do not bear the sword for no reason. They are God’s servants, agents of wrath to bring punishment on the wrongdoer. 5 Therefore, it is necessary to submit to the authorities, not only because of possible punishment but also as a matter of conscience.
6 This is also why you pay taxes, for the authorities are God’s servants, who give their full time to governing. 7 Give to everyone what you owe them: If you owe taxes, pay taxes; if revenue, then revenue; if respect, then respect; if honor, then honor.

 

[supersoldier71]

You'll have to forgive me then. My Elder Brother was an illegal alien (He never got a visa when He came down from Heaven). And when He did get here, He wound up getting executed as a radical subversive. I've also had brothers and sisters thrown into psychiatric hospitals in China and the USSR for Schizophrenia because as Christians they heard from God. As a matter of fact my family has had more brothers and sisters executed for breaking the law then were killed in the last 1900 years combined.

So you'll have to forgive me, being a radical runs in the Family.

I'm not trying to pick a fight or anything of the sort, but I don't see the persecution of the Church and the repatriation of illegal aliens as the same thing.

And it is impossible for Lord Jesus to be an illegal anything. Through Him, all that was created, was created, He was both the Root and of the Line of David in the flesh. He was executed unjustly, yes, but it was unjust because He had every right to be here and say what He was going to say.

 

[sea oat]

I'm against it. No doubt.

 

[Randy_R]

Does committing crime make us a viable witnesses? Did God not say through Paul in Romans 13 to submit to the government because they have been instituted by him?

To the degree that we can obey worldly authorities without compromising our faith, we do so. However, the lesser authority can't overrule the higher authority. If God (the Higher Authority) commands us to help those in need, (and He does), the lesser authority (the US government) cannot command us to legally ignore those people in need.

Supersoldier, just as if an officer commands you to commit an illegal act, by law you must respectfully decline, if a human government commands us to commit a crime against God, we must respectfully decline.

31 "But when the Son of Man comes in his glory, and all the angels with him, then he will sit upon his glorious throne. 32 All the nations will be gathered in his presence, and he will separate them as a shepherd separates the sheep from the goats. 33 He will place the sheep at his right hand and the goats at his left. 34 Then the King will say to those on the right, 'Come, you who are blessed by my Father, inherit the Kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world. 35 For I was hungry, and you fed me. I was thirsty, and you gave me a drink. I was a stranger, and you invited me into your home. 36 I was naked, and you gave me clothing. I was sick, and you cared for me. I was in prison, and you visited me.' 37 "Then these righteous ones will reply, 'Lord, when did we ever see you hungry and feed you? Or thirsty and give you something to drink? 38 Or a stranger and show you hospitality? Or naked and give you clothing? 39 When did we ever see you sick or in prison, and visit you?' 40 And the King will tell them, 'I assure you, when you did it to one of the least of these my brothers and sisters, you were doing it to me!' 41 "Then the King will turn to those on the left and say, 'Away with you, you cursed ones, into the eternal fire prepared for the Devil and his demons! 42 For I was hungry, and you didn't feed me. I was thirsty, and you didn't give me anything to drink. 43 I was a stranger, and you didn't invite me into your home. I was naked, and you gave me no clothing. I was sick and in prison, and you didn't visit me.' 44 "Then they will reply, 'Lord, when did we ever see you hungry or thirsty or a stranger or naked or sick or in prison, and not help you?' 45 And he will answer, 'I assure you, when you refused to help the least of these my brothers and sisters, you were refusing to help me.' 46 And they will go away into eternal punishment, but the righteous will go into eternal life." (Mt 25:31-46).

 

[Aibrean]

If you want to apply that section of the Bible...


HELP THE PEOPLE IN THEIR OWN COUNTRY! They come to ours illegally. If you want to help them, go over there and help them so they don't have to commit crimes be illegally crossing the border.

Give to Caesar what is Caesar's.

 

[Randy_R]

If you want to apply that section of the Bible...


HELP THE PEOPLE IN THEIR OWN COUNTRY! They come to ours illegally. If you want to help them, go over there and help them so they don't have to commit crimes be illegally crossing the border.

Give to Caesar what is Caesar's.

I'll serve wherever God sends me - including here.

 

[Aibrean]

There are plenty of people that are LEGAL that need assistance. Helping criminals is condoning their actions in my opinion (besides the fact that it's illegal to help them).

 

[Randy_R]

There are plenty of people that are LEGAL that need assistance. Helping criminals is condoning their actions in my opinion (besides the fact that it's illegal to help them).

Most ministries that help the poor don't ask for a green card. And if you're trying to get a good citizenship award, you're working for the wrong kingdom.

 

[supersoldier71]

Aiding the illegal immigrant harms legal workers. Feeding the hungry and clothing the unclothed and providing shelter are all good things, but by allowing illegals to come and work, that is in fact doing an injustice to the American worker who's been replaced. If you said, hypothetically that a given company can hire 3 illegal aliens for every one American, well that's still somewhere around 3-4 million Americans whose jobs are now given to an illegal alien. And when added to the "outsourcing" of blue collar manufacturing jobs by big corporations, and it's no wonder we're trying to dig out of a recession with no jobs.

There are poor people in the US, and it doesn't require breaking the law to help them.

 

[Randy_R]

Aiding the illegal immigrant harms legal workers. Feeding the hungry and clothing the unclothed and providing shelter are all good things, but by allowing illegals to come and work, that is in fact doing an injustice to the American worker who's been replaced. If you said, hypothetically that a given company can hire 3 illegal aliens for every one American, well that's still somewhere around 3-4 million Americans whose jobs are now given to an illegal alien. And when added to the "outsourcing" of blue collar manufacturing jobs by big corporations, and it's no wonder we're trying to dig out of a recession with no jobs.

There are poor people in the US, and it doesn't require breaking the law to help them.

One of the problems with illegal immigration is that it is overlooked during the good times so that we can have illegals (who have no recourse to to being cheated and mistreated) come in and do the work that we don't want to do, but as soon as the economy goes bad, these same people who were accepted on a don't ask don't tell basis are now hated and demonized for being here when we were the ones who allowed them in by overlooking the issue in the good times. The illegals who are here deserve a chance to get a legitimate way to stay.

Second, if you want to stop illegal immigration, then we as a country have to help their counties become places where they want to stay. Where they can live make a living wage. Then they won't want to come to a country where they have no safety net and where they are looked down on. That requires thinking globally.

Until that happens, if someone is hungry - feed them. If someone is thirsty - given them a drink. If someone is in rags - give them clothes. That's basic. That's Kingdom Living 101 material.

 

[tsr]

Illegal Aliens in a nutshell are breaking the law by crossing over to the USA. They as others have stated don't pay taxes, don't have license to drive and are working for company's illegally taking jobs away from US citizens

 

[Ignatius the Hermit]

My friends--where do we find our primary citizenship; Is it in Heaven, or in this Nation that we are currently residing in? If you're like me, you probably consulted the scrioptures:

"But our citizenship is in heaven. And we eagarly await a Savior from there, the Lord Jesus Christ." (Phil 3:20)

1 Peter 2:9-11 recommends Christians to consider themselves as "foreigners and exiles", that is, as a people without a country since they (that includes us too) are the people of God.

Matthew 25:43 "I was a stranger and you did not invite me in." The greek work for stranger is xeos--where we get the root for xenophobia--a fear of aliens (foreigners, immigrants, and ethinicites). In this passage, according to the Lord Jesus Christ, people were admitted into Heaven because of what they did. Those who went away into eternal punishment because of what they failed to do. Jesus says "Truly I tell you, whatever you did not do for one of the least of these, you did not do for me." (matt 25:45).

Jesus also said that we are "Love our neighbor as ourself. Do this and you will live" (Luke 10:27-28). Jesus was asked who is considered a neighbor--and so the Lord told the story of the Good Samaritan (Luke 10:25-37). The neighbor was the foreigner, and by his actions, love was illustrated. He actually paid for the persons hotel and medical costs!

Now Jesus asked "which of these do you think was a neighbor to the man who fell into the hands of robbers?" The Lawyer replied "The one who had mercy on him". And Jesus commanded him "Go and do likewise. (Luke 10:36-37).

In the Old testament there are many examples of how foreigners live in other lands--take Abraham surviving an ecological and financial depression by staying in Egypt (God blessed him there). Also in in Leviticus 23:22 God states "When you reap the harvest of your land, do not reap the very edges of your field or gather the gleanings of your harvest. Leave them for the poor and the alien (illegal immigrant). I Am the LORD your God."

Exodus 22:21 also has God commanding that "You shall not wrong or oppress a resident alien (illegal immigrant living in your country), for you were aliens in Egypt." Indeed, they were aliens in the land of Midian too and in Canaan.

I think you get the point, God wants us to love everyone. And this is one of the ways we can. Jacob went to Egypt (leaving the land he inherited and was a native of) to survive in Egypt (the United States of its time).

How can we turn the alien away when we are as Peter put it 'foreigners and exiles ourselves'? Jesus commands us to be neighbors, to love the strangers amongst us--because when we do, we have done it unto Him.

 

[Aibrean]

Actually, resident aliens (by definition) have a green card.