If you were not a Christian, what would you be?

[Archaeopteryx]

I believe you, but they don't do that for me; and that's why I said that there's a critical difference between a God-centered universe and merely a complicated collection of physical matter that is stunning--and perplexing--when we view it.

What is that difference precisely?

 

[muichimotsu]

Well, this thread has gone off the rails into what could serve as a separate discussion on its own.


To respond to Albion, I'd say that you're mistakenly conflating a purpose in life with something that has to be teleological in nature. It can be, but I'd say that a meaning given to us from outside without our input is far less meaningful than one we discern through contemplation.

My purpose in life is still not entirely clear, but that doesn't mean my life is without purpose because it's still in a state of flux about the purpose itself. Humans generate purpose by a desire for significance in their behavior, but we're also beings that create meaning where there is none through apophenia.

There has to be a delineating point where we start making up a purpose to life in order to feel better rather than generating a purpose because the search for purpose itself is meaningful for us as experiential beings. Purpose will be subjective, particularly to individuals in relation to themselves, but if you want a purpose of humanity as a whole, it would be to better society as a whole along with bettering oneself. It's both long term and acknowledges that there will be purposes within that which apply to select individuals rather than the human community in its entirety.

A universe without any god or gods doesn't lose purpose except in the particular purpose and meaning granted from that deity to its creation. Without god, purpose is still a concept that has practical meaning because we can still search for it and find it, even if it's imperfect in nature.

 

[Albion]

To respond to Albion, I'd say that you're mistakenly conflating a purpose in life with something that has to be teleological in nature. It can be

Well then, there you go.

but I'd say that a meaning given to us from outside without our input is far less meaningful than one we discern through contemplation.

Thanks for sharing. It's okay with me if we disagree without being disagreeable.

 

[muichimotsu]

One extra qualification: merely contemplating it even if it comes from outside doesn't necessarily make it better by comparison to just accepting it. The quality of the purpose still seems hollow in that it's external in origin to begin with. You can rationalize it, but being contingent on an entity that is generally described as outside time and space seems to undermine its real value to those who live in time and space

 

[Noxot]

lol I would be an extremest nihilist. "death is the answer to all things"

 

[Archaeopteryx]

 

[lupusFati]

In response to the OP...

I'm already not a Christian. Because of Christianity and churches and the fact that no one seems to follow Christ, as that name should imply. Just my two cents, not gonna debate that, not insinuating anything about you people.

If I had to pick something other than "agnostic" or whatever I am... Probably buddhist. Those guys rock.