If you Love Me - KEEP My Commandments

[BobRyan]

That is not what Paul said. Paul said that the Gentiles were excluded from the citizenship of Israel and that the Gentiles were also strangers from the covenants of promise (for the Israelites) and so Gentiles had no expectation of salvation without God in the world. But, now because Jesus Christ (God) has come into the world, we Gentiles have become saved by the blood of Jesus Christ. It states nothing at all about Gentiles becoming Israelites.

not quite true. You have bent and wrenched the text to say more than it does.

John 3:16 "God so loved the WORLD that He gave" --- not "God so loved just-the-Jews that He gave"

Romans 2
11 For there is no partiality with God.
12 For as many as have sinned without law will also perish without law, and as many as have sinned in the law will be judged by the law 13 (for not the hearers of the law are just in the sight of God, but the doers of the law will be justified;
14 for when Gentiles, who do not have the law, by nature do the things in the law, these, although not having the law, are a law to themselves, 15 who show the work of the law written in their hearts, their conscience also bearing witness, and between themselves their thoughts accusing or else excusing them) 16 in the day when God will judge the secrets of men by Jesus Christ, according to my gospel.

26 Therefore, if an uncircumcised man keeps the righteous requirements of the law, will not his uncircumcision be counted as circumcision? 27 And will not the physically uncircumcised, if he fulfills the law, judge you who, even with your written code and circumcision, are a transgressor of the law?
28 For he is not a Jew who is one outwardly, nor is circumcision that which is outward in the flesh; 29 but he is a Jew who is one inwardly; and circumcision is that of the heart, in the Spirit, not in the letter; whose praise is not from men but from God.

Romans 4
For we say that faith was accounted to Abraham for righteousness. 10 How then was it accounted? While he was circumcised, or uncircumcised? Not while circumcised, but while uncircumcised. 11 And he received the sign of circumcision, a seal of the righteousness of the faith which he had while still uncircumcised, that he might be the father of all those who believe, though they are uncircumcised, that righteousness might be imputed to them also,

Isaiah 56
“Keep justice, and do righteousness,
For My salvation is about to come,
And My righteousness to be revealed.
2 Blessed is the man who does this,
And the son of man who lays hold on it;
Who keeps from defiling the Sabbath,
And keeps his hand from doing any evil.”
3 Do not let the son of the foreigner
Who has joined himself to the Lord
Speak, saying,
“The Lord has utterly separated me from His people”;
Nor let the eunuch say,
“Here I am, a dry tree.”
4 For thus says the Lord:
“To the eunuchs who keep My Sabbaths,
And choose what pleases Me,
And hold fast My covenant,
5 Even to them I will give in My house
And within My walls a place and a name
Better than that of sons and daughters;
I will give them an everlasting name
That shall not be cut off.
6 “Also the sons of the foreigner
Who join themselves to the Lord, to serve Him,
And to love the name of the Lord, to be His servants—
Everyone who keeps from defiling the Sabbath,
And holds fast My covenant—
7 Even them I will bring to My holy mountain,
And make them joyful in My house of prayer.
Their burnt offerings and their sacrifices
Will be accepted on My altar;
For My house shall be called a house of prayer for all nations.”

Is 66:23 "from Sabbath to Sabbath shall ALL MANKIND come before Me to worship"

Mark 2:27 "the Sabbath was made for MANKIND"

 

[Jan001]

It said we're citizens of Israel. It can't get much more clear than that.





We are Israelites/Hebrews. We are not natural-born Israelites/Hebrews. We are grafted-in through the Messiah Yahushua. Paul wrote about this in the verses I quoted earlier. Saying "That is not what Paul said" over and over doesn't change the fact that Paul said these things.

​

Something isn't adding up. Just because a commandment was not mentioned in the "New Testament" does not mean it's not valid and applicable to the life of a believer.

Did Yahushua or the apostles specifically speak against beastiality and incest? Last time I checked, it's never mentioned in the "New Testament"



We are a part of the nation of Israel. This was the nation that God promised to Abraham. I've already shown in my previous post that we are a part of Israel. I'm not gonna post the same verses over and over.


Genesis 14:13 NIV


Moses told Pharaoh, "The God of the Hebrews has met us with".

Exodus 5:1-3 NIV



Abraham and the Israelites were all called Hebrews. Abraham was a gentile BEFORE God called him out. He then became a Hebrew, and was called one. Abraham was never referred to as a gentile or anything other than a Hebrew once he believed & was saved

There is no such thing as "commandments" for Christians. All of God's commandments are for Christians and anybody who wants to love and obey God.

If you teach that Christian's shouldn't obey any of the commands, then you are teaching and promoting sin and lawlessness.

There's not 2 sets of commandments for different groups of people. There's 1.

The 10 commandments and any/all other commands in the Torah were only given to Israel, just like everything else that God did through the nation of Israel. But now we are citizens of God's kingdom and part of His nation of People

An Israelite is a genetic descendant of Abraham. We may not be natural descendants, but we become sons of Abraham. Anybody that's a son of Abraham is a Hebrew/Israelite. That is, if you are a son of Abraham according to the promise.

Jesus Christ is the olive tree. The Israelites are the natural branches of the olive tree which is Jesus Christ. The Gentiles are the wild branches of the olive tree which is Jesus Christ. The Gentiles do not become Israelites. The Israelites do not become Gentiles. Both become one body -- the Church of Jesus Christ.

 

[Jan001]

not quite true. You have bent and wrenched the text to say more than it does.

John 3:16 "God so loved the WORLD that He gave" --- not "God so loved just-the-Jews that He gave"

Romans 2
11 For there is no partiality with God.
12 For as many as have sinned without law will also perish without law, and as many as have sinned in the law will be judged by the law 13 (for not the hearers of the law are just in the sight of God, but the doers of the law will be justified;
14 for when Gentiles, who do not have the law, by nature do the things in the law, these, although not having the law, are a law to themselves, 15 who show the work of the law written in their hearts, their conscience also bearing witness, and between themselves their thoughts accusing or else excusing them) 16 in the day when God will judge the secrets of men by Jesus Christ, according to my gospel.

26 Therefore, if an uncircumcised man keeps the righteous requirements of the law, will not his uncircumcision be counted as circumcision? 27 And will not the physically uncircumcised, if he fulfills the law, judge you who, even with your written code and circumcision, are a transgressor of the law?
28 For he is not a Jew who is one outwardly, nor is circumcision that which is outward in the flesh; 29 but he is a Jew who is one inwardly; and circumcision is that of the heart, in the Spirit, not in the letter; whose praise is not from men but from God.

Romans 4
For we say that faith was accounted to Abraham for righteousness. 10 How then was it accounted? While he was circumcised, or uncircumcised? Not while circumcised, but while uncircumcised. 11 And he received the sign of circumcision, a seal of the righteousness of the faith which he had while still uncircumcised, that he might be the father of all those who believe, though they are uncircumcised, that righteousness might be imputed to them also,

Isaiah 56
“Keep justice, and do righteousness,
For My salvation is about to come,
And My righteousness to be revealed.
2 Blessed is the man who does this,
And the son of man who lays hold on it;
Who keeps from defiling the Sabbath,
And keeps his hand from doing any evil.”
3 Do not let the son of the foreigner
Who has joined himself to the Lord
Speak, saying,
“The Lord has utterly separated me from His people”;
Nor let the eunuch say,
“Here I am, a dry tree.”
4 For thus says the Lord:
“To the eunuchs who keep My Sabbaths,
And choose what pleases Me,
And hold fast My covenant,
5 Even to them I will give in My house
And within My walls a place and a name
Better than that of sons and daughters;
I will give them an everlasting name
That shall not be cut off.
6 “Also the sons of the foreigner
Who join themselves to the Lord, to serve Him,
And to love the name of the Lord, to be His servants—
Everyone who keeps from defiling the Sabbath,
And holds fast My covenant—
7 Even them I will bring to My holy mountain,
And make them joyful in My house of prayer.
Their burnt offerings and their sacrifices
Will be accepted on My altar;
For My house shall be called a house of prayer for all nations.”

Is 66:23 "from Sabbath to Sabbath shall ALL MANKIND come before Me to worship"

Mark 2:27 "the Sabbath was made for MANKIND"

The Gentile believers did not keep the Jewish sabbath. Paul commanded the Gentile believers (Colossians) to not listen to the Judaizers (people such as yourself) who demand that the Gentiles keep the law of Moses with its sabbath, festival, and new moon laws. Christians worship on the first day of the week (Sunday).

Colossians 2:16
Therefore let no one (including you, Bob Ryan) pass judgment on you (me, Jan) in questions of food and drink or with regard to a festival or a new moon or a sabbath. rsv

Galatians 3:24-26
So that the law was our custodian until Christ came, that we might be justified by faith. 25 But now that faith has come, we are no longer under a custodian (the law); 26 for in Christ Jesus you are all sons of God, through faith. rsv​

 

[BobRyan]

John 3:16 "God so loved the WORLD that He gave" --- not "God so loved just-the-Jews that He gave"

Romans 2
11 For there is no partiality with God.
12 For as many as have sinned without law will also perish without law, and as many as have sinned in the law will be judged by the law 13 (for not the hearers of the law are just in the sight of God, but the doers of the law will be justified;
14 for when Gentiles, who do not have the law, by nature do the things in the law, these, although not having the law, are a law to themselves, 15 who show the work of the law written in their hearts, their conscience also bearing witness, and between themselves their thoughts accusing or else excusing them) 16 in the day when God will judge the secrets of men by Jesus Christ, according to my gospel.

26 Therefore, if an uncircumcised man keeps the righteous requirements of the law, will not his uncircumcision be counted as circumcision? 27 And will not the physically uncircumcised, if he fulfills the law, judge you who, even with your written code and circumcision, are a transgressor of the law?
28 For he is not a Jew who is one outwardly, nor is circumcision that which is outward in the flesh; 29 but he is a Jew who is one inwardly; and circumcision is that of the heart, in the Spirit, not in the letter; whose praise is not from men but from God.

Romans 4
For we say that faith was accounted to Abraham for righteousness. 10 How then was it accounted? While he was circumcised, or uncircumcised? Not while circumcised, but while uncircumcised. 11 And he received the sign of circumcision, a seal of the righteousness of the faith which he had while still uncircumcised, that he might be the father of all those who believe, though they are uncircumcised, that righteousness might be imputed to them also,

Isaiah 56
“Keep justice, and do righteousness,
For My salvation is about to come,
And My righteousness to be revealed.
2 Blessed is the man who does this,
And the son of man who lays hold on it;
Who keeps from defiling the Sabbath,
And keeps his hand from doing any evil.”
3 Do not let the son of the foreigner
Who has joined himself to the Lord
Speak, saying,
“The Lord has utterly separated me from His people”;
Nor let the eunuch say,
“Here I am, a dry tree.”
4 For thus says the Lord:
“To the eunuchs who keep My Sabbaths,
And choose what pleases Me,
And hold fast My covenant,
5 Even to them I will give in My house
And within My walls a place and a name
Better than that of sons and daughters;
I will give them an everlasting name
That shall not be cut off.
6 “Also the sons of the foreigner
Who join themselves to the Lord, to serve Him,
And to love the name of the Lord, to be His servants—
Everyone who keeps from defiling the Sabbath,
And holds fast My covenant—
7 Even them I will bring to My holy mountain,
And make them joyful in My house of prayer.
Their burnt offerings and their sacrifices
Will be accepted on My altar;
For My house shall be called a house of prayer for all nations.”

Is 66:23 "from Sabbath to Sabbath shall ALL MANKIND come before Me to worship"

Mark 2:27 "the Sabbath was made for MANKIND"

The Gentile believers did not keep the Jewish sabbath.

Until you read the actual Bible.

Acts 13:14-16 GENTILES and JEWS keeping the Sabbath AND hearing Gospel Sermons.
Acts 13:41-44 GENTILES and JEWs keeping the Sabbath AND hearing Gospel Sermons - Sabbath after Sabbath.
Acts 17:1-4 GENTILES and JEWs keeping the Sabbath AND hearing Gospel Sermons - Sabbath after Sabbath after Sabbath..
Acts 18:1-5 GENTILES and JEWs keeping the Sabbath AND hearing Gospel Sermons - "EVERY SABBATH"..

Jesus said "Salvation is of the JEWS" in John 4.

Is that what you mean by the made-up-term "Jewish Sabbath"???

 

[BobRyan]

for those who love man-made-tradition and not the Word of God -- I offer you this --

Matt 19
16 Now behold, one came and said to Him, “Good Teacher, what good thing shall I do that I may have eternal life?”
17 So He said to him, “Why do you call Me good? No one is good but One, that is, God. But if you want to enter into life, keep the commandments.”
18 He said to Him, “Which ones?”
Jesus said,
“‘You shall not murder,’
‘You shall not commit adultery,’
‘You shall not steal,’
‘You shall not bear false witness,’
19 ‘Honor your father and your mother,’ and,
‘You shall love your neighbor as yourself.’ ”


Mark 7

7 Howbeit in vain do they worship me, teaching for doctrines the commandments of men.
8 For laying aside the Commandment of God, ye hold the tradition of men, as the washing of pots and cups: and many other such like things ye do.
9 And he said unto them, Full well ye reject the commandment of God, that ye may keep your own tradition.
10 For Moses said, Honour thy father and thy mother; and, Whoso curseth father or mother, let him die the death:
11 But ye say, If a man shall say to his father or mother, It is Corban, that is to say, a gift, by whatsoever thou mightest be profited by me; he shall be free.
12 And ye suffer him no more to do ought for his father or his mother;
13 Making the Word of God of none effect through your tradition, which ye have delivered: and many such like things do ye.

 

[Jan001]

John 3:16 "God so loved the WORLD that He gave" --- not "God so loved just-the-Jews that He gave"

Romans 2
11 For there is no partiality with God.
12 For as many as have sinned without law will also perish without law, and as many as have sinned in the law will be judged by the law 13 (for not the hearers of the law are just in the sight of God, but the doers of the law will be justified;
14 for when Gentiles, who do not have the law, by nature do the things in the law, these, although not having the law, are a law to themselves, 15 who show the work of the law written in their hearts, their conscience also bearing witness, and between themselves their thoughts accusing or else excusing them) 16 in the day when God will judge the secrets of men by Jesus Christ, according to my gospel.

26 Therefore, if an uncircumcised man keeps the righteous requirements of the law, will not his uncircumcision be counted as circumcision? 27 And will not the physically uncircumcised, if he fulfills the law, judge you who, even with your written code and circumcision, are a transgressor of the law?
28 For he is not a Jew who is one outwardly, nor is circumcision that which is outward in the flesh; 29 but he is a Jew who is one inwardly; and circumcision is that of the heart, in the Spirit, not in the letter; whose praise is not from men but from God.

Romans 4
For we say that faith was accounted to Abraham for righteousness. 10 How then was it accounted? While he was circumcised, or uncircumcised? Not while circumcised, but while uncircumcised. 11 And he received the sign of circumcision, a seal of the righteousness of the faith which he had while still uncircumcised, that he might be the father of all those who believe, though they are uncircumcised, that righteousness might be imputed to them also,

Isaiah 56
“Keep justice, and do righteousness,
For My salvation is about to come,
And My righteousness to be revealed.
2 Blessed is the man who does this,
And the son of man who lays hold on it;
Who keeps from defiling the Sabbath,
And keeps his hand from doing any evil.”
3 Do not let the son of the foreigner
Who has joined himself to the Lord
Speak, saying,
“The Lord has utterly separated me from His people”;
Nor let the eunuch say,
“Here I am, a dry tree.”
4 For thus says the Lord:
“To the eunuchs who keep My Sabbaths,
And choose what pleases Me,
And hold fast My covenant,
5 Even to them I will give in My house
And within My walls a place and a name
Better than that of sons and daughters;
I will give them an everlasting name
That shall not be cut off.
6 “Also the sons of the foreigner
Who join themselves to the Lord, to serve Him,
And to love the name of the Lord, to be His servants—
Everyone who keeps from defiling the Sabbath,
And holds fast My covenant—
7 Even them I will bring to My holy mountain,
And make them joyful in My house of prayer.
Their burnt offerings and their sacrifices
Will be accepted on My altar;
For My house shall be called a house of prayer for all nations.”

Is 66:23 "from Sabbath to Sabbath shall ALL MANKIND come before Me to worship"

Mark 2:27 "the Sabbath was made for MANKIND"




Until you read the actual Bible.

Acts 13:14-16 GENTILES and JEWS keeping the Sabbath AND hearing Gospel Sermons.
Acts 13:41-44 GENTILES and JEWs keeping the Sabbath AND hearing Gospel Sermons - Sabbath after Sabbath.
Acts 17:1-4 GENTILES and JEWs keeping the Sabbath AND hearing Gospel Sermons - Sabbath after Sabbath after Sabbath..
Acts 18:1-5 GENTILES and JEWs keeping the Sabbath AND hearing Gospel Sermons - "EVERY SABBATH"..

Jesus said "Salvation is of the JEWS" in John 4.

Is that what you mean by the made-up-term "Jewish Sabbath"???

Jews did not associate with Gentiles unless the Gentiles had converted to Judaism.

There were no Gentiles in the synagogues who were not devout converts to Judaism. It is only these Gentile converts to Judaism who listened to the Torah in the synagogues every Sabbath. It was only those practicing the Jewish faith who listened to the Torah in the synagogues every Sabbath.

Acts 13:43
And when the meeting of the synagogue broke up, many Jews and devout converts to Judaism followed Paul and Barnabas, who spoke to them and urged them to continue in the grace of God. rsv​

Isaiah 66:23 is apocalyptic literature. Symbolic, not literal.

 

[BobRyan]

John 3:16 "God so loved the WORLD that He gave" --- not "God so loved just-the-Jews that He gave"

Romans 2
11 For there is no partiality with God.
12 For as many as have sinned without law will also perish without law, and as many as have sinned in the law will be judged by the law 13 (for not the hearers of the law are just in the sight of God, but the doers of the law will be justified;
14 for when Gentiles, who do not have the law, by nature do the things in the law, these, although not having the law, are a law to themselves, 15 who show the work of the law written in their hearts, their conscience also bearing witness, and between themselves their thoughts accusing or else excusing them) 16 in the day when God will judge the secrets of men by Jesus Christ, according to my gospel.

26 Therefore, if an uncircumcised man keeps the righteous requirements of the law, will not his uncircumcision be counted as circumcision? 27 And will not the physically uncircumcised, if he fulfills the law, judge you who, even with your written code and circumcision, are a transgressor of the law?
28 For he is not a Jew who is one outwardly, nor is circumcision that which is outward in the flesh; 29 but he is a Jew who is one inwardly; and circumcision is that of the heart, in the Spirit, not in the letter; whose praise is not from men but from God.

Romans 4
For we say that faith was accounted to Abraham for righteousness. 10 How then was it accounted? While he was circumcised, or uncircumcised? Not while circumcised, but while uncircumcised. 11 And he received the sign of circumcision, a seal of the righteousness of the faith which he had while still uncircumcised, that he might be the father of all those who believe, though they are uncircumcised, that righteousness might be imputed to them also,

Isaiah 56
“Keep justice, and do righteousness,
For My salvation is about to come,
And My righteousness to be revealed.
2 Blessed is the man who does this,
And the son of man who lays hold on it;
Who keeps from defiling the Sabbath,
And keeps his hand from doing any evil.”
3 Do not let the son of the foreigner
Who has joined himself to the Lord
Speak, saying,
“The Lord has utterly separated me from His people”;
Nor let the eunuch say,
“Here I am, a dry tree.”
4 For thus says the Lord:
“To the eunuchs who keep My Sabbaths,
And choose what pleases Me,
And hold fast My covenant,
5 Even to them I will give in My house
And within My walls a place and a name
Better than that of sons and daughters;
I will give them an everlasting name
That shall not be cut off.
6 “Also the sons of the foreigner
Who join themselves to the Lord, to serve Him,
And to love the name of the Lord, to be His servants—
Everyone who keeps from defiling the Sabbath,
And holds fast My covenant—
7 Even them I will bring to My holy mountain,
And make them joyful in My house of prayer.
Their burnt offerings and their sacrifices
Will be accepted on My altar;
For My house shall be called a house of prayer for all nations.”

Is 66:23 "from Sabbath to Sabbath shall ALL MANKIND come before Me to worship"

Mark 2:27 "the Sabbath was made for MANKIND"

The Gentile believers did not keep the Jewish sabbath.

Until you read the actual Bible.

Acts 13:14-16 GENTILES and JEWS keeping the Sabbath AND hearing Gospel Sermons.
Acts 13:41-44 GENTILES and JEWs keeping the Sabbath AND hearing Gospel Sermons - Sabbath after Sabbath.
Acts 17:1-4 GENTILES and JEWs keeping the Sabbath AND hearing Gospel Sermons - Sabbath after Sabbath after Sabbath..
Acts 18:1-5 GENTILES and JEWs keeping the Sabbath AND hearing Gospel Sermons - "EVERY SABBATH"..

Jesus said "Salvation is of the JEWS" in John 4.

Is that what you mean by the made-up-term "Jewish Sabbath"???

Jews did not associate with Gentiles unless the Gentiles had converted to Judaism. .

Making more stuff up??

You may wish to get an actual history text book to see what the term "God fearing gentile" means before simply making stuff up.

==================================

. Julius Scott provides the more or less standard definition of a God-Fearer: “an unofficial class of Gentiles who stopped short of becoming full proselytes but were permitted limited participation in Jewish worship” (JETS 34 [1991]: 478). The key word here is “unofficial.”

 

[BobRyan]

Bible-denying... calling Paul a liar... making up history out of thin air...

That is the sort of "basket of solutions" one might expect to be employed by the anti-Bible-Sabbath POV.

 

[Jan001]

Bob Ryan

Romans 4
For we say that faith was accounted to Abraham for righteousness. 10 How then was it accounted? While he was circumcised, or uncircumcised? Not while circumcised, but while uncircumcised. 11 And he received the sign of circumcision, a seal of the righteousness of the faith which he had while still uncircumcised, that he might be the father of all those who believe, though they are uncircumcised, that righteousness might be imputed to them also,

Abraham first received righteousness without circumcision.

Romans 4:11
He received circumcision as a sign or seal of the righteousness which he had by faith while he was still uncircumcised. The purpose was to make him the father of all who believe without being circumcised and who thus have righteousness reckoned to them, rsv


In the OT, Abraham and His biological descendants were commanded to receive circumcision.

Genesis 17:10
This is my covenant, which you shall keep, between me and you and your descendants after you: Every male among you shall be circumcised. rsv

Genesis 17:14
Any uncircumcised male who is not circumcised in the flesh of his foreskin shall be cut off from his people; he has broken my covenant.” rsv
​

Under the first covenant, the Israelites/Jews were required to become circumcised in order to become righteous and they had to keep the law of Moses.

However, both the Gentiles and the male Israelites/Jews can receive righteousness in the New covenant without circumcision so this means that neither Gentile or Jew are considered to be Israelites in the NT.


It is the Jews who changed their religious practices after Jesus came to earth and died for the sins of the world.

1 Corinthians 7:18
Was any one at the time of his call already circumcised? Let him not seek to remove the marks of circumcision. Was any one at the time of his call uncircumcised? Let him not seek circumcision. rsv
​

So Bob, why does Paul in the NT command male Christians who are not circumcised to not become circumcised?

Paul commands them to not become circumcised because the law of Moses is no longer in effect. If the law of Moses was still in effect for NT Christians, he would have commanded all the males under the New Covenant to become circumcised or else they would be cut off from God.

In the NT Paul commands the uncircumcised males to not become circumcised and so therefore the law of Moses with its sabbath requirements is not required for Christians.


What is the law in the following passage? It is the law of Moses.

Galatians 3:24-26
So that the law was our custodian until Christ came, that we might be justified by faith. 25 But now that faith has come, we are no longer under a custodian; 26 for in Christ Jesus you are all sons of God, through faith. rsv​

Christians are not under the law/law of Moses. They are sons of God through faith in Jesus Christ. Male Christians do not receive ritual circumcision.


Regarding the sabbath of the Israelites, please note that the sabbath is required for Israelites

Exodus 31:13
“Say to the people of Israel, ‘You shall keep my sabbaths, for this is a sign between me and you throughout your generations, that you may know that I, the Lord, sanctify you. rsv​

Gentile/Greek Christians do not ever become Israelites/Jews. Gentile Christians are fellow citizens with the saints (the righteous) and therefore they are members of the household of God.

Ephesians 2:19
So then you are no longer strangers and sojourners, but you are fellow citizens with the saints and members of the household of God, rsv

Romans 3:29
Or is God the God of Jews only? Is he not the God of Gentiles also? Yes, of Gentiles also, rsv
​

There can be no distinction between Jews and Greeks in the church of God.

Galatians 3:28
There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither slave nor free, there is neither male nor female; for you are all one in Christ Jesus. rsv


Please note in the following verse that there are Jews who practice Judaism and there are Gentiles who are pagans and there is the one church of God which is comprised of all people who are Christians. There is no distinction between Israelite/Jew and Gentile/Greek in the church, the household of God.

1 Corinthians 10:32
Give no offense to Jews or to Greeks or to the church of God, rsv
​

The law of Moses is no longer in effect.

Hebrews 8:13
In speaking of a new covenant he treats the first as obsolete...rsv




​

 

[Jan001]

Jesus said "Salvation is of the JEWS" in John 4

John 4:22
You worship what you do not know; we worship what we know, for salvation is from the Jews. rsv
​

Salvation is from Jesus Christ who definitely was a descendant of the house of Judah.

 

[Jan001]

Is that what you mean by the made-up-term "Jewish Sabbath"???



Making more stuff up??

You may wish to get an actual history text book to see what the term "God fearing gentile" means before simply making stuff up.

==================================

. Julius Scott provides the more or less standard definition of a God-Fearer: “an unofficial class of Gentiles who stopped short of becoming full proselytes but were permitted limited participation in Jewish worship” (JETS 34 [1991]: 478). The key word here is “unofficial.”

Please note that these god-fearing Gentiles who were listening to the Torah in the synagogues were not Christians!

Gentile Christians were not allowed in Jewish synagogues.

 

[Jan001]

Bible-denying... calling Paul a liar... making up history out of thin air...

That is the sort of "basket of solutions" one might expect to be employed by the anti-Bible-Sabbath POV.

Galatians 3:23-25
Now before faith came, we were confined under the law, kept under restraint until faith should be revealed. 24 So that the law was our custodian until Christ came, that we might be justified by faith. 25 But now that faith has come, we are no longer under a custodian; rsv​

The law of Moses is no longer in effect. That is what Paul said. You do not believe him.

Hebrews 8:13
In speaking of a new covenant he treats the first as obsolete...rsv

 

[BobRyan]

The law of Moses is no longer in effect. That is what Paul said. You do not believe him.

Until you read the actual Bible.

"Do we make VOID the LAW of God by our faith? God forbid!! In fact we ESTABLISH the LAW of God" Rom 3:31

"what matters is KEEPING the COMMANDMENTS of GOD" 1 Cor 7:19

Eph 6:2 "honor your father and mother for this is the first COMMANDMENT with a PROMISE" in that still valid - still binding -- unit of TEN.

Rev 14:12 "the saints KEEP the COMMANDMENTS of GOD and their faith in Jesus"

Matt 19
16 Now behold, one came and said to Him, “Good Teacher, what good thing shall I do that I may have eternal life?”
17 So He said to him, “Why do you call Me good? No one is good but One, that is, God. But if you want to enter into life, keep the commandments.”
18 He said to Him, “Which ones?”
Jesus said,
“‘You shall not murder,’
‘You shall not commit adultery,’
‘You shall not steal,’
‘You shall not bear false witness,’
19 ‘Honor your father and your mother,’ and,
‘You shall love your neighbor as yourself.’ ”


Mark 7
7 Howbeit in vain do they worship me, teaching for doctrines the commandments of men.
8 For laying aside the Commandment of God, ye hold the tradition of men, as the washing of pots and cups: and many other such like things ye do.
9 And he said unto them, Full well ye reject the commandment of God, that ye may keep your own tradition.
10 For Moses said, Honour thy father and thy mother; and, Whoso curseth father or mother, let him die the death:
11 But ye say, If a man shall say to his father or mother, It is Corban, that is to say, a gift, by whatsoever thou mightest be profited by me; he shall be free.
12 And ye suffer him no more to do ought for his father or his mother;
13 Making the Word of God of none effect through your tradition, which ye have delivered: and many such like things do ye.

James 2 points out that the authority is based on the "HE WHO SAID" when speaking of the TEN Commandments.

 

[BobRyan]

Please note that these god-fearing Gentiles who were listening to the Torah in the synagogues were not Christians!

Gentile Christians were not allowed in Jewish synagogues.

making stuff up? again...

Paul was a Christian Pharisee - welcomed into the synagogue in Acts 13:14-16. Read more... make up less stuff.


Acts 13:14-16 GENTILES and JEWS keeping the Sabbath AND hearing Gospel Sermons.
Acts 13:41-44 GENTILES and JEWs keeping the Sabbath AND hearing Gospel Sermons - Sabbath after Sabbath.
Acts 17:1-4 GENTILES and JEWs keeping the Sabbath AND hearing Gospel Sermons - Sabbath after Sabbath after Sabbath..
Acts 18:1-5 GENTILES and JEWs keeping the Sabbath AND hearing Gospel Sermons - "EVERY SABBATH".

 

[Jan001]

making stuff up? again...

Paul was a Christian Pharisee - welcomed into the synagogue in Acts 13:14-16. Read more... make up less stuff.


Acts 13:14-16 GENTILES and JEWS keeping the Sabbath AND hearing Gospel Sermons.
Acts 13:41-44 GENTILES and JEWs keeping the Sabbath AND hearing Gospel Sermons - Sabbath after Sabbath.
Acts 17:1-4 GENTILES and JEWs keeping the Sabbath AND hearing Gospel Sermons - Sabbath after Sabbath after Sabbath..
Acts 18:1-5 GENTILES and JEWs keeping the Sabbath AND hearing Gospel Sermons - "EVERY SABBATH".

You really should stop saying that Acts states that the Christian Gentiles were in the synagogues. Acts does not state that at all. The Gentile Christians were definitely not welcome in Jewish synagogues.

Paul was a Jew by birth, a descendant of the tribe of Benjamin. I repeat: Christian Gentiles were not welcome in Jewish synagogues. Only Gentiles who were devout converts to Judaism and Gentiles desiring to become devout converts to Judaism were allowed in Jewish synagogues.

Paul and crowds of Christian Gentiles did not invade the Jewish synagogues on the Sabbath!

You are interested in the history written by Julius Scott, but you are not interested in reading the history of the early church written by the early Christian fathers. Jesus Christ taught the apostles to worship God on the first day of the week. The law of Christ is different than the law of Moses. Different priesthood, different laws. The Levite priesthood is obsolete and so is the law of Moses.

Justin Martyr -- Weekly Worship of the Christians

And on the day called Sunday, all who live in cities or in the country gather together to one place, and the memoirs of the apostles or the writings of the prophets are read, as long as time permits; then, when the reader has ceased, the president verbally instructs, and exhorts to the imitation of these good things. Then we all rise together and pray, and, as we before said, when our prayer is ended, bread and wine and water are brought, and the president in like manner offers prayers and thanksgivings, according to his ability, and the people assent, saying Amen; and there is a distribution to each, and a participation of that over which thanks have been given, and to those who are absent a portion is sent by the deacons. And they who are well to do, and willing, give what each thinks fit; and what is collected is deposited with the president, who succours the orphans and widows and those who, through sickness or any other cause, are in want, and those who are in bonds and the strangers sojourning among us, and in a word takes care of all who are in need. But Sunday is the day on which we all hold our common assembly, because it is the first day on which God, having wrought a change in the darkness and matter, made the world; and Jesus Christ our Saviour on the same day rose from the dead. For He was crucified on the day before that of Saturn (Saturday); and on the day after that of Saturn, which is the day of the Sun, having appeared to His apostles and disciples, He (Jesus Christ) taught them these things, which we have submitted to you also for your consideration. (First Apology Chapter LXVII.—Weekly worship of the Christians. [A.D. 155]). ​

Hebrews 7:12
For when there is a change in the priesthood, there is necessarily a change in the law as well. rsv

Hebrews 8:13
In speaking of a new covenant he treats the first as obsolete. And what is becoming obsolete and growing old is ready to vanish away. rsv

​

It seems to me that you are unable to comprehend what is obvious to literally over 2 billion Christians -- the law of Moses with its sabbath worship is obsolete, no longer in force. You do not understand the meaning of the Scriptures you keep posting. They do not mean what you want them to mean.

Sunday worship of the Christians:

Acts 20:7
On the first day of the week, when we were gathered together to break bread, Paul talked with them, intending to depart on the morrow; and he prolonged his speech until midnight. rsv​

The law of Jesus Christ with its Sunday worship is here to stay. Praise be to God!

 

[JohnRabbit]

making stuff up? again...

Paul was a Christian Pharisee - welcomed into the synagogue in Acts 13:14-16. Read more... make up less stuff.

a lot of that going around in these forums!

Acts 13:14-16 GENTILES and JEWS keeping the Sabbath AND hearing Gospel Sermons.
Acts 13:41-44 GENTILES and JEWs keeping the Sabbath AND hearing Gospel Sermons - Sabbath after Sabbath.
Acts 17:1-4 GENTILES and JEWs keeping the Sabbath AND hearing Gospel Sermons - Sabbath after Sabbath after Sabbath..
Acts 18:1-5 GENTILES and JEWs keeping the Sabbath AND hearing Gospel Sermons - "EVERY SABBATH".

some act like these verses are not in the bible!

 

[bbbbbbb]

a lot of that going around in these forums!



some act like these verses are not in the bible!

Indeed. That, and a lot of evasion.

 

[bugkiller]

making stuff up? again...

Paul was a Christian Pharisee - welcomed into the synagogue in Acts 13:14-16. Read more... make up less stuff.


Acts 13:14-16 GENTILES and JEWS keeping the Sabbath AND hearing Gospel Sermons.
Acts 13:41-44 GENTILES and JEWs keeping the Sabbath AND hearing Gospel Sermons - Sabbath after Sabbath.
Acts 17:1-4 GENTILES and JEWs keeping the Sabbath AND hearing Gospel Sermons - Sabbath after Sabbath after Sabbath..
Acts 18:1-5 GENTILES and JEWs keeping the Sabbath AND hearing Gospel Sermons - "EVERY SABBATH".

Are you trying to say Paul was a gentile?

bugkiller

 

[Jan001]

a lot of that going around in these forums!



some act like these verses are not in the bible!

The Gentiles in the synagogues who were listening to the law of Moses were not Christian Gentiles. These Gentiles in the synagogues were devout converts to Judaism and also Gentiles who were studying to become devout converts to Judaism. The Gentile Christians were not welcome in Jewish synagogues. Paul and Barnabas were Jews by birth or else they would not have been welcome to speak in the synagogues.

Acts 13:43
And when the meeting of the synagogue broke up, many Jews and devout converts to Judaism followed Paul and Barnabas, who spoke to them and urged them to continue in the grace of God. rsv​

The Christian Gentiles met together for worship on the first day of the week.

Acts 20:7
On the first day of the week, when we were gathered together to break bread, Paul talked with them, intending to depart on the morrow; and he prolonged his speech until midnight. rsv​

 

[JohnRabbit]

The Gentiles in the synagogues who were listening to the law of Moses were not Christian Gentiles. These Gentiles in the synagogues were devout converts to Judaism and also Gentiles who were studying to become devout converts to Judaism. The Gentile Christians were not welcome in Jewish synagogues. Paul and Barnabas were Jews by birth or else they would not have been welcome to speak in the synagogues.

Acts 13:43
And when the meeting of the synagogue broke up, many Jews and devout converts to Judaism followed Paul and Barnabas, who spoke to them and urged them to continue in the grace of God. rsv​

​

yeah, when the gentiles separated from jews, they followed paul and barnabas and the verse said "the Gentiles begged that these words might be preached to them the next Sabbath".

this would have been a great teaching moment for paul to tell the gentiles that they don't meet on the sabbath because it was done away with, and now the christian is to meet on the "first day of the week".

paul didn't say that! in fact, paul told them nothing like what you said, "The Christian Gentiles met together for worship on the first day of the week."

remember paul said to peter, "why do you compel Gentiles to live as Jews?"

if paul stood up to peter, surely he would have told the gentiles what all of the sabbath haters on this forum say about the sabbath!

again, he didn't!

The Christian Gentiles met together for worship on the first day of the week.

Acts 20:7
On the first day of the week, when we were gathered together to break bread, Paul talked with them, intending to depart on the morrow; and he prolonged his speech until midnight. rsv​

they were gathered together to eat a meal. that's what the verse says!

can't make it say something it's not saying!