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If you feel it's OK to cook on Sabbath, why?

Discussion in 'Progressive/Moderate Adventists' started by Sylvester, Aug 22, 2017.

  1. A_Thinker

    A_Thinker Well-Known Member Supporter

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    The goal has changed ... we are no longer striving to live our lives according to a set of requirements.

    We are learning and growing to be more and more like our Father ...

    P.S. Not an Adventist ...
     
  2. Sylvester

    Sylvester Member

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    I take that as a yes.

    You haven't answered my follow up question. Wouldn't it mean that they also encompass things like not worshiping other Gods, not making idols, not taking God's name in vain, not working on Sabbaths?
     
  3. Sylvester

    Sylvester Member

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    We can never earn heaven through our works. Our righteousness is dirt compared to God's righteousness. We can only go to heaven by God's grace. I think we're on the same page regarding that.

    1.
    But are you sure it's correct to say we are no longer striving to live our lives according to a set of requirements? In the verses you quoted Paul urges the Galatians not to take part in the things he mentions in verse 19. If that's not a set of requirements then I don't know what is.

    2
    And Jesus said, "If ye love me, keep my commandments." John 14:15. Jesus says we'd keep His commandments if we love him. So again, I don't see how one can say adherence to law is no longer necessary.

    3
    And what do we do when we grow to be more like our Father? We keep His laws better than before. If a thief finds Christ, he obeys the commandment "Thou Shall not steal".

    Cool.
     
  4. A_Thinker

    A_Thinker Well-Known Member Supporter

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    Because Paul said adherence to the Law is no longer necessary ... (i.e. "we are not UNDER the Law", ... "we are DEAD to the Law", etc.).

    I think that the separation between our opinions lies in our priorities of goals as children of God.

    I say that our primary goal as a child of God is not "meeting a list of requirements", but rather, being a loving, relating, contributing member of God's family.

    Following the OT Law was/is only a START of that journey, primarily designed to show us that we need to STRIVE to achieve God's will for our lives (i.e. that we are NOT YET FIT for His fellowship).

    Having been convinced, by the Law, that we are not yet FIT for God's fellowship, ... we come to CHrist, and are received into His family ... with ALL that that encompasses.

    Surely you can see that the real expectations of God for His children are MUCH DEEPER than what the OT Law requires ... and may be worked out, in our lives, in different ways than it was worked out at previous times.

    For example, in the OT Law, it is described how a man may sell His daughter into indentured servitude (leviticus 21:7-11). Surely this is not the expectation of God for us at this time.

    Fortunately, as believers, we are free to follow the Spirit, who will lead us into truth in all things, ... including the writing upon our hearts such expectations as you see in Galatians 5. And also, those teachings from the Prophets, and the books of Poetry, and finally, the teachings of Jesus and the Apostles.

    If we follow the Spirit, we will meet ALL of God's expections for us as His children. OTOH, if we restrict ourselves to following any particular written code, ... we are apt to MISS much of what God desires for us.
     
    Last edited: Sep 30, 2017
  5. Dave-W

    Dave-W Welcoming grandchild #7, Arturus Waggoner! Supporter

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    A little bit of both, actually. Sometimes what we think was breaking the sabbath because one group said so; was not necessarily correct.
     
  6. Sylvester

    Sylvester Member

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    Paul says that because we cannot earn our salvation by keeping any laws. That’s why he says we are not under the law but under grace. So it’s clear he’s talking about how we get our salvation which is through grace alone. We’re on the same page on that.

    He talks about that in Romans 6:14. In the next verse he mentions it doesn’t mean it’s OK to sin. Obviously that’s true. If you love God then you’ll try your best to live the way He wants you to live. It’ll be fake for me to say I love God but don’t want to follow the rules He’s made. That’s why Jesus says if we love Him we should keep His commandments. (1) Why do you think Jesus said that?

    Actually I don’t think I ever said our primary goal as a child of God is meeting a list of requirements. All I say is that as children of God we should love God and people with our all hearts. And if we love him, naturally we’ll try to live the way he has told us to live. Just like Jesus said.
    It’s not like anyone can ever meet this ‘list of requirements’. If anything it just shows us how sinful we are and how hopeless we would be without His mercy and grace.

    I think you meant to type Exodus.
    Those were civil codes for the country of Israel. That’s different from the Ten Commandments which is a set of moral laws. The civil code is only a subset of the moral law.
    (2) What do you mean by meeting God’s expectation? Isn’t that adhering to the things he told us to do (do not kill, do not be angry with your brother without a cause, do not commit adultery, do not look at a women with lust, etc). If not, what do you mean by it? We should clear that up first.
     
  7. Sylvester

    Sylvester Member

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    Well, my point is that they didn't break the Sabbath to begin with.
     
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  8. A_Thinker

    A_Thinker Well-Known Member Supporter

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    Because following Jesus' commandments is the best way to be a loving, relating, contributing member of God's family.

    We should note, however, that many of Jesus' commandments are NOT FOUND in the Old Testament Law ... the admonition that we ought always pray, for example. So looking to a written code of Law will never be adequate. We must look to the Law written in our hearts by the Spirit.

    I agree ...

    ALL of what you said (i.e. following the Spirit will fulfill our keeping the spirit of the Law), ... but, also, following God in other circumstances, ... for instance, when Philip followed the Spirit's leading to make his way to evangelize the Ethiopian eunuch, or where Paul followed the Spirit's guidance to go to Macedonia to evangelize. There are plenty of Biblical examples (both OT and NT) of God's people following Spiritual guidance which is not found in the any written Law.
     
    Last edited: Oct 28, 2017
  9. woobadooba

    woobadooba Legend

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  10. Dave-W

    Dave-W Welcoming grandchild #7, Arturus Waggoner! Supporter

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    And what do you know of the back story of that incident?
    Why did our Lord use that incident to justify His disciples before that group of Pharisees?

    Galatians says that He was born "under the Law." (4.4)
    That means if He ever broke the Law of Moses in any way He was invalidated as our perfect sacrifice for sins, and we are still lost.
     
  11. Sylvester

    Sylvester Member

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    Absolutely. So do you agree that we can say that obedience to laws is necessary now too? Not because we can ever gain our salvation from it but because keeping God’s laws is obviously the good thing to do. And it also shows if we really do love Him. Jesus himself said it. (1) Are we in agreement on this then?




    I totally agree with that.




    Absolutely. We should always follow the Holy Spirit's leading.
     
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