If there were no school shootings, would you still want gun control? Why or why not?

[FenderTL5]

I would agree that it seems a worthwhile idea. I would also suggest that we look at some of the other factors I think we are seeing this issue. Specifically community building. While I am not religious one of the many benefits of religion is that it fosters a sense of community. I think a big part of why we are seeing a rise in gun violence is we are isolating people which cuts them off from building a sense of empathy.

I would agree, a lot of the issue(s) are associated with a lack of community.
I don't point a finger at any technology as a source and certainly there's not a single culprit but some have definitely not been helpful for us.

 

[Speedwell]

Question; your being raped, would you perfer to have a gun or not?

in Christ, Not me

Do you really think that having an unregistered (as opposed to registered) AR-15 or other long gun would be of any use in that situation?

 

[PreviouslySeeking...]

what would that include? How broad is this law you propose? what is the gun was stolen?

What do you mean? It would require biometric storage for any gun the person wanted to register. Say fingerprint access, only for the person registering.

If the gun was stolen there should be a report on file.

 

[razzelflabben]

What do you mean? It would require biometric storage for any gun the person wanted to register. Say fingerprint access, only for the person registering.

If the gun was stolen there should be a report on file.

okay, two issues...one what would be the required bells and whistles that would be required for biometric storage... who decides what is the least bells and whistles that are acceptable.

Second, if the gun is secured and not checked daily, it could be missing for some time before reported missing.

 

[PreviouslySeeking...]

okay, two issues...one what would be the required bells and whistles that would be required for biometric storage... who decides what is the least bells and whistles that are acceptable.

Second, if the gun is secured and not checked daily, it could be missing for some time before reported missing.

I would made gun regulation a federal issue. The requirements would would be set via a federal law and safes would have to be locally inspected by law enforcement.

That would be on the gun owner. Check regularly or face the penalty.

I grew up with guns & have them now. It isn't that hard to make sure they are where they are supposed to be. Especially if they are stored in safes.

 

[razzelflabben]

I would made gun regulation a federal issue. The requirements would would be set via a federal law and safes would have to be locally inspected by law enforcement.

That would be on the gun owner. Check regularly or face the penalty.

I grew up with guns & have them now. It isn't that hard to make sure they are where they are supposed to be. Especially if they are stored in safes.

okay, but I have some problems with the check thingy...when I was teaching, we had a student (SBH Severely behavior handicap) that was abused (sexually) by his grandfather. Children's services got involved and grandfather was no permitted to stay in the home. So what would happen is that the grandfather would move into the home then when they would schedule a home visit, grandfather would move out for a few days to "prove he wasn't living there" after the home visit, back he would come and live there till the next home visit.

The point is this, requiring safes would not insure they were used and in fact, could be passed around for inspections by family and friends to avoid the cost and hastles. Loopholes if you want to call it that.

As to the other issue, what I am suggesting is that a gun could be stolen and not known to be stolen for sometime as to reporting it stolen...in fact, it could be used for a crime before it was ever known to be stolen.

Furthermore, how would this stop suicides and accidental shootings?

 

[CRAZY_CAT_WOMAN]

Question; your being raped, would you perfer to have a gun or not?

in Christ, Not me

It Wouldn't be an issue for me. Since I would pass all the laws. Except being able to safely fire a gun. Which should be in the requirements to own a gun. Also training into keeping the gun in your hands. Guns really don't promise safety.

 

[RocksInMyHead]

As to the other issue, what I am suggesting is that a gun could be stolen and not known to be stolen for sometime as to reporting it stolen...in fact, it could be used for a crime before it was ever known to be stolen.

If your gun is stored in a safe with a biometric lock (as others have proposed), I would think that it would be rather difficult for someone to steal it without leaving a trace. With a key/code lock, it could be theoretically stolen by a family member, but if your fingerprint is required to unlock it, they'd have to physically break the safe or steal the entire thing.

 

[razzelflabben]

If your gun is stored in a safe with a biometric lock (as others have proposed), I would think that it would be rather difficult for someone to steal it without leaving a trace. With a key/code lock, it could be theoretically stolen by a family member, but if your fingerprint is required to unlock it, they'd have to physically break the safe or steal the entire thing.

which they could do but there are other ways to get finger prints too. Point being, there are people in this world that love that kind of challenge and make it a career.

 

[PreviouslySeeking...]

okay, but I have some problems with the check thingy...when I was teaching, we had a student (SBH Severely behavior handicap) that was abused (sexually) by his grandfather. Children's services got involved and grandfather was no permitted to stay in the home. So what would happen is that the grandfather would move into the home then when they would schedule a home visit, grandfather would move out for a few days to "prove he wasn't living there" after the home visit, back he would come and live there till the next home visit.

The point is this, requiring safes would not insure they were used and in fact, could be passed around for inspections by family and friends to avoid the cost and hastles. Loopholes if you want to call it that.

As to the other issue, what I am suggesting is that a gun could be stolen and not known to be stolen for sometime as to reporting it stolen...in fact, it could be used for a crime before it was ever known to be stolen.

Furthermore, how would this stop suicides and accidental shootings?

1. Serial numbers. 1 number, 1 owner, 1 location - national database.

2. Well if the gun was stolen from a safe, the owner would presumably see that fairly quickly and file a report & have a damaged safe to show for it when he files his stolen gun report.

3. Accidental shootings should drop because anyone not properly storing their weapon would be subject to prison for letting someone else access it

4. As for suicide- people would have less access to household guns that aren't theirs. People wanting to kill themselves would probably not be inclined to jump through the hoops to buy a gun and probably wouldn't pass the psych eval (I mentioned mental fitness earlier).

 

[PreviouslySeeking...]

which they could do but there are other ways to get finger prints too. Point being, there are people in this world that love that kind of challenge and make it a career.

Yeah,but those thieves aren't bothering with the average 3bd 2 ba tract home & the wealthy homes they do break into have things way more valuable than guns.

 

[Not me]

It Wouldn't be an issue for me. Since I would pass all the laws. Except being able to safely fire a gun. Which should be in the requirements to own a gun. Also training into keeping the gun in your hands. Guns really don't promise safety.

Confused;

It wouldn’t be a issue with you if you had a gun or not if you were being raped? It that what you mean?

Also, Nothing can “promise”safety but God alone. Just like clothes can’t “promise” to keep you covered but they sure help.

in Christ, Not me

 

[razzelflabben]

1. Serial numbers. 1 number, 1 owner, 1 location - national database.

fair enough...I still see problems, but you addressed most of them.

2. Well if the gun was stolen from a safe, the owner would presumably see that fairly quickly and file a report & have a damaged safe to show for it when he files his stolen gun report.

what if the safe was in an unused basement or something like that?

3. Accidental shootings should drop because anyone not properly storing their weapon would be subject to prison for letting someone else access it

not all accidents happen when a gun should be stored...we had a principle that was shot while hunting...have a friend who was going hunting when his dog jumped and he shot himself...the first one was fatal the second just an injury...an accident is an accident. it's really that simple.

4. As for suicide- people would have less access to household guns that aren't theirs. People wanting to kill themselves would probably not be inclined to jump through the hoops to buy a gun and probably wouldn't pass the psych eval (I mentioned mental fitness earlier).

and yet they would find someway to kill themselves, so what is gained? Is it really that important to stop gun suicides and not suicides in general?

 

[razzelflabben]

Yeah,but those thieves aren't bothering with the average 3bd 2 ba tract home & the wealthy homes they do break into have things way more valuable than guns.

so now everyone who owns a gun has to live in a "fine" home? what about poor americans especially those that live in the rural areas where hunting and animal control are important?

 

[razzelflabben]

Look, I'm not saying some of these ideas are not going to help in some areas but what I am doubting is that they will help in the areas we are trying to argue protection for....for example, if I am a criminal I will get a gun no matter if yours is locked away or not...you have offered nothing to stop a criminal that is bent on getting a weapon. that is why so many questions...how does this help the situation? Seems to me that we would be better served to save the money that would need to be spent to ensure proper storage and use that money to say educate people, or inforce the existing laws.

 

[PreviouslySeeking...]

fair enough...I still see problems, but you addressed most of them. what if the safe was in an unused basement or something like that? not all accidents happen when a gun should be stored...we had a principle that was shot while hunting...have a friend who was going hunting when his dog jumped and he shot himself...the first one was fatal the second just an injury...an accident is an accident. it's really that simple. and yet they would find someway to kill themselves, so what is gained? Is it really that important to stop gun suicides and not suicides in general?

2 . If you have a lethal weapon on your property, check it often or risk the consequences.

3. The gun "accidents" I want to prevent are primarily minor children accessing guns. Some kids end up injured, some dead. They are preventable.

4. Actually young men tend to attempt suicide more impulsively and more often when they have access to a firearm. It might impact prevention more than you think. Suicide is difficult, if people have to struggle to achieve it - many will give up. We are talking about gun control, I can address the full scope of suicide prevention in another thread.

 

[expos4ever]

I'd guess several of them would?

Gun control's racist past and present

This is a hanging curveball.

 

[razzelflabben]

2 . If you have a lethal weapon on your property, check it often or risk the consequences.

that does not insure that it would be reported missing before it was used in a crime...but I think it is time to move past this idea as this discussion goes.

3. The gun "accidents" I want to prevent are primarily minor children accessing guns. Some kids end up injured, some dead. They are preventable.

4. Actually young men tend to attempt suicide more impulsively and more often when they have access to a firearm. It might impact prevention more than you think. Suicide is difficult, if people have to struggle to achieve it - many will give up. We are talking about gun control, I can address the full scope of suicide prevention in another thread.

as was already talked about in this thread, the stats don't necessarily back this up...thanks for your input I really do appreciate it I'm just not convinced it would have any real impact on the problems we have with guns in our society.