If suicidals only knew

[SteveB28]

It's as is the case with events such as earthquakes Paul. There aren't any more these days, even though it may seem so. We just report them much better......

 

[Desk trauma]

Is that a fact? I find that hard to believe, especially in America.

Here are the numbers for the US.

 

[jimmyjimmy]

http://www.nytimes.com/2016/04/22/health/us-suicide-rate-surges-to-a-30-year-high.html?_r=0

It seems that the popular method of fixing the suicide problem has lead to an increased suite rates. "Therapy" doesn't seem to be working. In fact, it's like pouring gasoline on a fire.

 

[Zoii]

http://www.nytimes.com/2016/04/22/health/us-suicide-rate-surges-to-a-30-year-high.html?_r=0

It seems that the popular method of fixing the suicide problem has lead to an increased suite rates. "Therapy" doesn't seem to be working. In fact, it's like pouring gasoline on a fire.

Again you take some information and then add a totally unsubstaniated remark. Nowhere in the report or referred research links does it say ""Therapy" doesn't seem to be working. In fact, it's like pouring gasoline on a fire".... thats your uninformed view.
Instead what Professor Phillips actually said was comments such as:
there is a "larger emerging pattern of evidence of the links between poverty, hopelessness and health" in the USA
and
“It appears this group isn’t seeking help but rather turning to self-destructive means of dealing with their despair,”

When you make such unsubstantiated comments such as previously suggesting its young silly girls seeking attention [your first post]... or now that counselling is worsening things, youre actually saying things that are totally contrary to any evidence and just blaming the victim and health professionals.

In point of fact the major area of concern is with mature men...As professor Phillips commented [in the article you cited]... "But men still kill themselves at a rate 3.6 times that of women"

 

[Godlovesmetwo]

Are you sure you're just 16 years of age Zoii?

 

[Godlovesmetwo]

When you make such unsubstantiated comments such as previously suggesting its young silly girls seeking attention [your first post]... or now that counselling is worsening things, youre actually saying things that are totally contrary to any evidence and just blaming the victim and health professionals.

Zoii's right again. I'm surprised Jimmyjimmy is not more sensitive about this issue having admitted he felt suicidal at one stage in his life.

 

[Zoii]

Are you sure you're just 16 years of age Zoii?

Yes ty Paul in October

 

[Godlovesmetwo]

I'm speculating but it might be just bravado. People act tough "come on, you gotta Man Up" when deep inside they're hurting just as much as anyone.Maybe they need to show some vulnerability. That takes courage too.

 

[jimmyjimmy]

Zoii's right again. I'm surprised Jimmyjimmy is not more sensitive about this issue having admitted he felt suicidal at one stage in his life.

I live in a society in which "therapy" is given to everyone, and that has been the case for decades. You can follow the trajectory of secular "therapy" and suicide rates. If the world's wisdom worked, why the increase in suicide, Paul?

I am very sensitive about this issue, which is precisely why I took the time to try to help people understand some of the issues that are under the surface of many of the cases.

Joining a person in his pity party won't help, and if we don't help, but harm, what good is our sensitivity?

The purpose in a man’s heart is like deep water, but a man of understanding will draw it out. (Prov. 20:5)

 

[Zoii]

Jimmy the issue I have is that a view of what you think, might not connect with researched fact - I dont call counselling of a woman who has been tortured by her partner for 10 years a pity party.... I dont call psychiatric reviews of a schizophrenic person a pity party nor of a 12yo girl whos been raped repeatedly by her pastor <recent event in Australia>. Counselling isn't the Fix-all ... its just one strategy among many and its not "gasoline on a fire".

If you want to understand why rates have increased the article I provided a link to might help.

 

[Godlovesmetwo]

nor of a 12yo girl whos been raped repeatedly by her pastor <recent event in Australia>.

I know that story. One of the most heinous crimes I have ever read.

 

[SnowyMacie]

I know. That is my point.

No, like they are literally unable to do that. It would be like describing asking a blind person to see the light they are staring right at, they couldn't no matter what you did.

 

[Godlovesmetwo]

So Jimmy Jimmy would say lets cancel all the emergency hotlines for those feeling suicidal. Gasoline on the fire. Counselling is a waste of time.
Those volunteers have helped me in my hour of need. God bless them.

 

[SnowyMacie]

Suicide is definitely sinfulness.
When shallow powerless gods in your life are shattered, then what do you have left to live for.
You will either get new gods, or you will die with them.
Romans 6:10
For the death that He died, He died to sin once for all; but the life that He lives, He lives to God.
Romans 8:5
For those who live according to the flesh set their minds on the things of the flesh, but those who live according to the Spirit, the things of the Spirit.
In Context | Full Chapter | Other Translations
Romans 8:13
For if you live according to the flesh you will die; but if by the Spirit you put to death the deeds of the body, you will live.
In Context | Full Chapter | Other Translations
Romans 10:5
For Moses writes about the righteousness which is of the law, “The man who does those things shall live by them.”
In Context | Full Chapter | Other Translations
Romans 14:7
For none of us lives to himself, and no one dies to himself.
In Context | Full Chapter | Other Translations
Romans 14:8
For if we live, we live to the Lord; and if we die, we die to the Lord. Therefore, whether we live or die, we are the Lord’s.

Suicidal thoughts and the Depression that proceeds them have nothing to do with sin, but psychological illness. Their brains are not working correctly.

 

[Godlovesmetwo]

Suicidal thoughts and the Depression that proceeds them have nothing to do with sin, but psychological illness. Their brains are not working correctly.

Yes I can definitely agree to an extent and feel there is much more room for psychology and counselling for Christians when they feel suicidal. But there is a part of me that understands that wanting to end one's life, which was given to me by God, is highly ungrateful and not my call. God decides when we exit this earth. I don't condemn the sinner, just the sin. Like euthanasia is wrong, strictly speaking.

 

[Lily76_]

i lost my step dad to suicide loseing a loved one like that is heart breaking but i know he was unwell ( he must have been to do that ) we had no warnings no way of saving him before he left my mums house first thing in the morning took a bus to the city and jumped off a bridge near to where i live .
Shock isnt the word for it ...its devastated us all the whole family affected one of my nieces turned to drugs but got clean and now had a one year old his great granddaughter that he will never meet
my nephew also turned to drugs as well another niece is trying to become a nurse she wants to help people but has depression but is still fighting with her own mind my two younger nieces where very young at the time we had to tell them he was gone
they have been effected by this a lot
they later found out that it was suicide no by us but by social work ...my sister blames herself and i blame by self how could we not have forseen this if we only knew maybe we could have stopped him
i have felt suicide myself i know when you feel like this you think everyone will be better off without you please never think that
we are worse off without you you may not think it but your life means the world to someone

 

[Godlovesmetwo]

i know when you feel like this you think everyone will be better off without you please never think that we are worse off without you you may not think it but your life means the world to someone

Beautiful.

 

[jimmyjimmy]

So Jimmy Jimmy would say lets cancel all the emergency hotlines for those feeling suicidal. Gasoline on the fire. Counselling is a waste of time.
Those volunteers have helped me in my hour of need. God bless them.

You have misunderstood me a bit, and put some words in my mouth as well.

I would make a distinction between "counsel", which is good and helpful, but only if it is wise and godly, and "therapy", which is in large part worthless.

The former has the power to prevent catastrophe and also help one correct course if he has drifted or worse, crashed his live upon the rocks, while the latter often takes an already self-centered person, and makes him twice so.

Help can only be found when a true counselor sees through the superficial layers and exposes what's at their root. For example, those who apparently hate themselves don't actually hate themselves. Not one bit. I would attempt to explain that here, but if you haven't understood what I've already posted, you will never understand that.

 

[ToBeLoved]

Someone attempting suicide is not in their right mind. They don't have the capacity to think rationally let alone abstractly. Now before you get to that point, it may be helpful to see things from outer space or from the POV of others, but once you've crossed the line, all that goes out the window. Your only goal is to relieve your suffering.

I agree. The person has probably been close to suicide before also. A mental illness is also many times associated.

 

[ToBeLoved]

Where is the love of Christ in this thread? Are we not to care for all who are in pain and needy?

Christ said I do not come for the well, but the sick.

I would like to see a little more compassion and empathy. It is a sin, but every one of us sins and the person who commits suicide has not had an easy road.