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It is hard to accept that God would ask such random act of violence.
Commiting murder is a sin.
Commiting murder is a sin.
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If God asked you to kill someone from another group, would you?
- Thread starter CrystalDragon
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I could never kill infants or innocent people. I really honestly feel like I had my head chopped off in this forum because someone thought I belonged to another group outside USA. A so called "forbidden" country. It makes me wonder what will happen to them? Do You also get a note that If You are from Pakistan, Russia or what country was it then You have to have contact with customer service? Is this forum hunting down people of foreign origin? Why? Is this a Naziforum? Why? Sure the nazis called themself christians too and In Germany christians had different opinions about Hitler too. But not everyone knew the awful truth so do not let history repeat itself. I come from Finland and perhaps someone had not looked close enough on their map. To answer the question properly about God and killing, there has been a war between Russia and Finland and that was many Years ago and nobody wants war but nobody wants to get killed either. My grandfather who was forced into war and sent home, said girl if you ever have to go outside in wartime keep a small bible in Your breastpocket on the side of your heart. He saw many men with a small half inch thick bible in the breastpocket, If they got shot in th bible it did seldom get through and saved their lives. I don´t hate Russians, nor Americans nor other people but those that learn in school that they should behead all christians I am a bit reserved against, I guess they are forced to learn such things. I live a civiliced life and expect others to do the same. Many countries in the world have both good and bad sides, including my own. I don´t storm someones home to kill someone not even If i believe God or some person or officer says so, but If there is a war going on and some soldier storms into my home and has the habit of killing or raping every woman in their way I don´t know how I would react, probably run and hide. These theological commandments of killing entire cities has made me doubt who really heard from God. Was it God? And Why? What happened to those people after they where dead and no, can I but tremble of such a God. But then we hear of people who get killed before their time and get sent back to this world by Jesus, and then I think maybe they still have things to do here. Then God seems somewhat milder. But that is of course unusual. So If You think about killing someone from another group please go see an older mature psychiatrist and tell them that You have read it in the bible and You are unsure of Your faith. It should not be a faith issue. It could help children from a lot of trauma of getting hunted, abused and killed. Even if You believe God tells you to, you could end up in prison and there You could get killed too. God has also said the one who kills with sword will be killed with a sword and Murderers go to hell, If You do not regret Your sin, and turn away from it, that is where You end up. And to me the christian message is treat Your enemies as You would like to be treated. Now You can believe me or disbeliev, I personnally don´t know what to believe about that experience. If christians starts to kill just like the nazis did before, and like some terroristgroup then there is not much joy in Heaven. It is an utterly defeat, let some sin destroy itself as it usually does or leave it to the police or health care. We do not live on this earth forever so concentrate on the positive how to make life better, take care of the nature and sea God gave us, care for the people, invent good medicine, grow clean food, fair pay and workpossibilities, get rid of the desert, grow trees, rather than killing the weak.
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Gordon Southgate
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My Thoughts
The question should be rephrased from "If God asked you to kill someone from another group, would you?" to "Would God ask someone to kill someone? As the question is not aimed so much towards an individual per se but God. For what is embedded in the question is would God ask someone to kill someone. To answer this question I can only look at scripture. The answer is never a simple yes or no but understandable. For we know that the law says “thou shalt not kill” but is there circumstances today that would say we should.
God Kills
In an attempt to answer this question lets take the commandment thou shalt not kill. The sixth commandment. In the old testament God orders killings. Sodom and Gomorrah, All people in Noah's day wiped out apart from eight (just some of many examples). Even in the new testament we see God's hand in action with the death of Ananias and Sapphira (note God took away their lives no human killed them and this is a fundamental difference between the old and new covenants), from this we can conclude that God will have people put to death. In the old covenant in some cases He asked His people to carry out killings however there is no evidence under the new covenant God would ask someone to kill another human being and there is a reason for this.
We All Deserve to Be Killed Under The Written Law
For under the new covenant the only thing we are asked to put to death is our old nature. God written law has condemned all men to death for all are unrighteous and subject to the laws judgement and that judgement is death, death to us all (that is old and new covenant for the law remains Christ came to fulfil the law not do away with it). If you think you have never murdered someone think again. For Jesus said "the law says though shalt not kill but I say that whosoever is angry with his brother without a cause shall be in danger of the judgement". Jesus was putting the fulfilment of the law in context, we think murder is physical but we murder when we gossip about someone we murder when we slander, we commit adultery by just looking lustfully at another's wife. I could go through the whole ten commandments of us breaking Gods holy law but I think you get the picture. We deserve nothing but punishment for our sin. For we know the payment of sin is death and all have sinned therefore the penalty applies to all mankind all mankind is subject to God's holy law and therefore the law of sin and death applies to all mankind. That is the destiny of all mankind, for all mankind is under the law of sin and death. Therefore God has a right a righteous and just right to kill us all of us. According to the laws of the one who created the heavens and the earth, the laws that hold the universe in place we (mankind) are condemned to death and it is right.
A Different Law
However there is another law created by the same God. The law of the Spirit. For a Christian is under the law (or lets say in) of the Spirit and not subject to the written law of sin and death they are subject to the law of the Spirit who gives life (see Romans 8). An eye for an eye a tooth for a tooth is applied under the written commandment, tit for tat. But the Christian is under grace and there is a difference, light and day, life and death neither can hold the same ground at any one moment, you are either alive or dead, light or dark. We who were once condemned who deserved the same death as all others, have received life and forgiveness instead of the penalty of death from the written law.
The Question Answered
This is where the gospel shines and where the gospel answers your question. Would God ask us (Christians) to kill someone, no no and no. Jesus became the target of death on the cross, He became sin. He died on the cross taking our penalty for our transgression for our breaking of God's holy commandments, we deserve what he got. When we look upon the cross we can say "there but by the grace of God do I". We live because He died. He received no mercy, we receive mercy. He became sin we became righteous. He took all the due righteous anger from God the Father (His Wrath) towards sin upon Himself and we receive abundant love from the same Father. He was nailed to the cross for our sins that we would walk free, that we would be legally and justly be acquitted. It is finished.
He Who is Without Sin Pick Up the First Stone
Tell me then when you look upon the cross in the law of the spirit, the spirit that showed you "a wretch" mercy how does your question fair? Can you lift up a sword at that moment and slay another and call it God's will when you know He died to give life and life in abundance? For if you hear a voice saying kill another then you hear not the voice of the Savior King. If you obey that voice to kill another then id say you know not Christ but are another's son or have forgot whence you came or at best a fool.
The question should be rephrased from "If God asked you to kill someone from another group, would you?" to "Would God ask someone to kill someone? As the question is not aimed so much towards an individual per se but God. For what is embedded in the question is would God ask someone to kill someone. To answer this question I can only look at scripture. The answer is never a simple yes or no but understandable. For we know that the law says “thou shalt not kill” but is there circumstances today that would say we should.
God Kills
In an attempt to answer this question lets take the commandment thou shalt not kill. The sixth commandment. In the old testament God orders killings. Sodom and Gomorrah, All people in Noah's day wiped out apart from eight (just some of many examples). Even in the new testament we see God's hand in action with the death of Ananias and Sapphira (note God took away their lives no human killed them and this is a fundamental difference between the old and new covenants), from this we can conclude that God will have people put to death. In the old covenant in some cases He asked His people to carry out killings however there is no evidence under the new covenant God would ask someone to kill another human being and there is a reason for this.
We All Deserve to Be Killed Under The Written Law
For under the new covenant the only thing we are asked to put to death is our old nature. God written law has condemned all men to death for all are unrighteous and subject to the laws judgement and that judgement is death, death to us all (that is old and new covenant for the law remains Christ came to fulfil the law not do away with it). If you think you have never murdered someone think again. For Jesus said "the law says though shalt not kill but I say that whosoever is angry with his brother without a cause shall be in danger of the judgement". Jesus was putting the fulfilment of the law in context, we think murder is physical but we murder when we gossip about someone we murder when we slander, we commit adultery by just looking lustfully at another's wife. I could go through the whole ten commandments of us breaking Gods holy law but I think you get the picture. We deserve nothing but punishment for our sin. For we know the payment of sin is death and all have sinned therefore the penalty applies to all mankind all mankind is subject to God's holy law and therefore the law of sin and death applies to all mankind. That is the destiny of all mankind, for all mankind is under the law of sin and death. Therefore God has a right a righteous and just right to kill us all of us. According to the laws of the one who created the heavens and the earth, the laws that hold the universe in place we (mankind) are condemned to death and it is right.
A Different Law
However there is another law created by the same God. The law of the Spirit. For a Christian is under the law (or lets say in) of the Spirit and not subject to the written law of sin and death they are subject to the law of the Spirit who gives life (see Romans 8). An eye for an eye a tooth for a tooth is applied under the written commandment, tit for tat. But the Christian is under grace and there is a difference, light and day, life and death neither can hold the same ground at any one moment, you are either alive or dead, light or dark. We who were once condemned who deserved the same death as all others, have received life and forgiveness instead of the penalty of death from the written law.
The Question Answered
This is where the gospel shines and where the gospel answers your question. Would God ask us (Christians) to kill someone, no no and no. Jesus became the target of death on the cross, He became sin. He died on the cross taking our penalty for our transgression for our breaking of God's holy commandments, we deserve what he got. When we look upon the cross we can say "there but by the grace of God do I". We live because He died. He received no mercy, we receive mercy. He became sin we became righteous. He took all the due righteous anger from God the Father (His Wrath) towards sin upon Himself and we receive abundant love from the same Father. He was nailed to the cross for our sins that we would walk free, that we would be legally and justly be acquitted. It is finished.
He Who is Without Sin Pick Up the First Stone
Tell me then when you look upon the cross in the law of the spirit, the spirit that showed you "a wretch" mercy how does your question fair? Can you lift up a sword at that moment and slay another and call it God's will when you know He died to give life and life in abundance? For if you hear a voice saying kill another then you hear not the voice of the Savior King. If you obey that voice to kill another then id say you know not Christ but are another's son or have forgot whence you came or at best a fool.
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And I must conclude that you only want to be argumentative, and don't care to actually discuss this, or else you would start a thread on the subject....
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It's a weird subject. My morality is based on biblical principles. If God came to me and said, "Kill this child for me..." I would have to know that I know that I know that I know that it was God telling me to do this...because, from a New Testament perspective, that isn't something He would command.
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Gordon Southgate
Active Member
Should the question be rephrased from "If God asked you to kill someone from another group, would you?" to "Would God ask someone to kill someone? As the question is not aimed so much towards an individual per se but God. For what is embedded in the question is would God ask someone to kill someone. To answer this question I can only look at scripture. The answer is never a simple yes or no but understandable. For we know that the law says “thou shalt not kill” but is there circumstances today that would say we should.
God Kills Believe It!
In an attempt to answer this question lets take the commandment thou shalt not kill. The sixth commandment. In the old testament God orders killings. Sodom and Gomorrah, All people in Noah's day wiped out apart from eight (just some of many examples). Even in the new testament we see God's hand in action with the death of Ananias and Sapphira (note God took away their lives no human killed them and this is a fundamental difference between the old and new covenants), from this we can conclude that God will have people put to death. In the old covenant in some cases He asked His people to carry out killings however there is no evidence under the new covenant God would ask someone to kill another human being and there is a reason for this.
We All Deserve Killed Under The Written Law
For under the new covenant the only thing we are asked to put to death is our old nature. God written law has condemned all men to death for all are unrighteous and subject to the laws judgement and that judgement is death, death to us all (that is old and new covenant for the law remains Christ came to fulfil the law not do away with it). If you think you have never murdered someone think again. For Jesus said "the law says though shalt not kill but I say that whosoever is angry with his brother without a cause shall be in danger of the judgement". Jesus was putting the fulfilment of the law in context, we think murder is physical but we murder when we gossip about someone we murder when we slander, we commit adultery by just looking lustfully at another's wife. I could go through the whole ten commandments of us breaking Gods holy law but I think you get the picture. We deserve nothing but punishment for our sin. For we know the payment of sin is death and all have sinned therefore the penalty applies to all mankind all mankind is subject to God's holy law and therefore the law of sin and death applies to all mankind. That is the destiny of all mankind, for all mankind is under the law of sin and death. Therefore God has a right a righteous and just right to kill us all of us. According to the laws of the one who created the heavens and the earth, the laws that hold the universe in place we (mankind) are condemned to death and it is right.
A Different Law
However there is another law created by the same God. The law of the Spirit. For a Christian is under the law (or lets say in) of the Spirit and not subject to the written law of sin and death they are subject to the law of the Spirit who gives life (see Romans 8). An eye for an eye a tooth for a tooth is applied under the written commandment, tit for tat. But the Christian is under grace and there is a difference, light and day, life and death neither can hold the same ground at any one moment, you are either alive or dead, light or dark. We who were once condemned who deserved the same death as all others, have received life and forgiveness instead of the penalty of death from the written law.
The Question Answered
This is where the gospel shines and where the gospel answers your question. Would God ask us (Christians) to kill someone, no no and no. Jesus became the target of death on the cross, He became sin. He died on the cross taking our penalty for our transgression for our breaking of God's holy commandments, we deserve what he got. When we look upon the cross we can say "there but by the grace of God go I that should have been me that was my punishment". We live because He died. He received no mercy, we receive mercy. He became sin we became righteous. He took all the due righteous anger from God the Father (His Wrath) towards sin upon Himself and we receive abundant love from the same Father. He was nailed to the cross for our sins that we would walk free, that we would be legally and justly be acquitted. It is finished.
He Who is Without Sin Pick Up the First Stone
Tell me then when you look upon the cross in the law of the spirit, the spirit that showed you that wretch mercy how does your question fair? Can you lift up a sword at that moment and slay another and call it God's will when you know He died to give life and life in abundance? For if you hear a voice saying kill another then you hear not the voice of the Savior King. If you obey that voice to kill another then id say at worse you know not Christ but are another's son and at best forgetting whence you came but more likely in the middle lack of wisdom.
God Kills Believe It!
In an attempt to answer this question lets take the commandment thou shalt not kill. The sixth commandment. In the old testament God orders killings. Sodom and Gomorrah, All people in Noah's day wiped out apart from eight (just some of many examples). Even in the new testament we see God's hand in action with the death of Ananias and Sapphira (note God took away their lives no human killed them and this is a fundamental difference between the old and new covenants), from this we can conclude that God will have people put to death. In the old covenant in some cases He asked His people to carry out killings however there is no evidence under the new covenant God would ask someone to kill another human being and there is a reason for this.
We All Deserve Killed Under The Written Law
For under the new covenant the only thing we are asked to put to death is our old nature. God written law has condemned all men to death for all are unrighteous and subject to the laws judgement and that judgement is death, death to us all (that is old and new covenant for the law remains Christ came to fulfil the law not do away with it). If you think you have never murdered someone think again. For Jesus said "the law says though shalt not kill but I say that whosoever is angry with his brother without a cause shall be in danger of the judgement". Jesus was putting the fulfilment of the law in context, we think murder is physical but we murder when we gossip about someone we murder when we slander, we commit adultery by just looking lustfully at another's wife. I could go through the whole ten commandments of us breaking Gods holy law but I think you get the picture. We deserve nothing but punishment for our sin. For we know the payment of sin is death and all have sinned therefore the penalty applies to all mankind all mankind is subject to God's holy law and therefore the law of sin and death applies to all mankind. That is the destiny of all mankind, for all mankind is under the law of sin and death. Therefore God has a right a righteous and just right to kill us all of us. According to the laws of the one who created the heavens and the earth, the laws that hold the universe in place we (mankind) are condemned to death and it is right.
A Different Law
However there is another law created by the same God. The law of the Spirit. For a Christian is under the law (or lets say in) of the Spirit and not subject to the written law of sin and death they are subject to the law of the Spirit who gives life (see Romans 8). An eye for an eye a tooth for a tooth is applied under the written commandment, tit for tat. But the Christian is under grace and there is a difference, light and day, life and death neither can hold the same ground at any one moment, you are either alive or dead, light or dark. We who were once condemned who deserved the same death as all others, have received life and forgiveness instead of the penalty of death from the written law.
The Question Answered
This is where the gospel shines and where the gospel answers your question. Would God ask us (Christians) to kill someone, no no and no. Jesus became the target of death on the cross, He became sin. He died on the cross taking our penalty for our transgression for our breaking of God's holy commandments, we deserve what he got. When we look upon the cross we can say "there but by the grace of God go I that should have been me that was my punishment". We live because He died. He received no mercy, we receive mercy. He became sin we became righteous. He took all the due righteous anger from God the Father (His Wrath) towards sin upon Himself and we receive abundant love from the same Father. He was nailed to the cross for our sins that we would walk free, that we would be legally and justly be acquitted. It is finished.
He Who is Without Sin Pick Up the First Stone
Tell me then when you look upon the cross in the law of the spirit, the spirit that showed you that wretch mercy how does your question fair? Can you lift up a sword at that moment and slay another and call it God's will when you know He died to give life and life in abundance? For if you hear a voice saying kill another then you hear not the voice of the Savior King. If you obey that voice to kill another then id say at worse you know not Christ but are another's son and at best forgetting whence you came but more likely in the middle lack of wisdom.
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What you asked and what happen in the OT are not even the same.. worlds apart. If you search and you will be hard pressed to find anyone that really digs into this. "women and children" ...is that really what it means? Did they find in those places women and children living there? No. You really believe GOD can go and KILL children? Other places in the word (women and children) it just means "everyone". These were not just reg people going on about their day and then Israel comes in and GIVE US THIS LAND and die!
They had hundreds of years to repent. They did things that demand judgment. And in those days..there were THINGS that were never meant to be in this world. "were like grasshoppers to them". Then the places where Israel did not drive them out.. became a stumbling stone. Look at them today and the places they have problems. Yes.. the ones they never drove out.
We are free..yet SIN.. the wages of sin is death. God hasnt changed. We have. We believe we can still be part of this world and Him. We can read watch say things and still love JESUS! What happens when just one part of a whole gets tainted rotten aka sin? It destroys all. Anyway.. if we again think... no one dies. Jesus aka GOD can not lie "Lazarus is sleeping"...then to help them .. he is dead. All that were born on this world..dead and gone? Yeah from this world but this is not GODS realm. This was never the way GOD wanted it.
So look up things how they were ORG written. If you just read the 1st chapter GEN in the org Hebrew. HAHA.. I give you this.. So did GOD create the sun twice? Let there be light.. read on.. then creates the sun the moon.. wait? Thought He already did the LIGHT? Gee...what could that light be...
To think GOD kills kids.. shows we dont know Him. ASK HIM! Is He dead? Can GOD lie? Well He said by Christ "my sheep KNOW not guess not wonder not never hear but my sheep KNOW my voice". Just BELIEVE
They had hundreds of years to repent. They did things that demand judgment. And in those days..there were THINGS that were never meant to be in this world. "were like grasshoppers to them". Then the places where Israel did not drive them out.. became a stumbling stone. Look at them today and the places they have problems. Yes.. the ones they never drove out.
We are free..yet SIN.. the wages of sin is death. God hasnt changed. We have. We believe we can still be part of this world and Him. We can read watch say things and still love JESUS! What happens when just one part of a whole gets tainted rotten aka sin? It destroys all. Anyway.. if we again think... no one dies. Jesus aka GOD can not lie "Lazarus is sleeping"...then to help them .. he is dead. All that were born on this world..dead and gone? Yeah from this world but this is not GODS realm. This was never the way GOD wanted it.
So look up things how they were ORG written. If you just read the 1st chapter GEN in the org Hebrew. HAHA.. I give you this.. So did GOD create the sun twice? Let there be light.. read on.. then creates the sun the moon.. wait? Thought He already did the LIGHT? Gee...what could that light be...
To think GOD kills kids.. shows we dont know Him. ASK HIM! Is He dead? Can GOD lie? Well He said by Christ "my sheep KNOW not guess not wonder not never hear but my sheep KNOW my voice". Just BELIEVE
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Gordon Southgate
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God commanded the destruction of Cities and killings for a reason. Today it is different.
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This is very much the truth. Unfortunately once you've gotten yourself to that point, and you realize it's as real as they told you it was, there's nothing left to do but survive.
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People worship Satan and think they worship God so I assume Satan could dress up like an angel or God in the sky too and deceive people to think they ought to slaughter innocent people. Just don´t believe any of that junk in case that happens. The big deceiver is Him, that is not God. No murder, not today by His people. Period. If you end up in jail You should work there. That is my opinion.
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SolomonVII
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Abraham was the patriarchal example of a man of faith, a man with so much faith in God that he would unquestioningly, unblinkingly, kill even his own only son, the carrier of his future progeny and his name, without a moment hesitation.
Jacob was a very different sort. He was a scrapper who would do anything to get what he wanted, even wrestle with God himself. He in a lot of ways was the opposite of Abraham. He connived and manipulated to make sure that his favorite son was the one who ended up with it all. Even as he did get wiser as the years went on, and learned from the school of hard knocks which those who rely on their own wits more than their faith all attend, he was of a very different character than Abraham.
God was pleased enough with Abraham with making his choice with Isaac. Even so, the moment that Abraham drew up the sacrificial blade, his story in the Bible was pretty much over. He and Isaac went their separate ways, and there was nothing much more for Abraham to do after that than just die.
In contrast, Jacob fighting the night away against the angel of God started a whole new chapter of the Bible that not only renews himself with the name of Israel, but continues on with God's people taking on his name.
I suppose God himself recognized that having a people who questioned everything and struggled against the legitimacy of any authority, even his Divine authority, was a better fit for his plan than another Abraham whose faith in God's authority was unquestioning and infinite.
My own sense is that God wants something more of his people than faithful automatons who would kill for Him at the drop of a hat.
Jacob was a very different sort. He was a scrapper who would do anything to get what he wanted, even wrestle with God himself. He in a lot of ways was the opposite of Abraham. He connived and manipulated to make sure that his favorite son was the one who ended up with it all. Even as he did get wiser as the years went on, and learned from the school of hard knocks which those who rely on their own wits more than their faith all attend, he was of a very different character than Abraham.
God was pleased enough with Abraham with making his choice with Isaac. Even so, the moment that Abraham drew up the sacrificial blade, his story in the Bible was pretty much over. He and Isaac went their separate ways, and there was nothing much more for Abraham to do after that than just die.
In contrast, Jacob fighting the night away against the angel of God started a whole new chapter of the Bible that not only renews himself with the name of Israel, but continues on with God's people taking on his name.
I suppose God himself recognized that having a people who questioned everything and struggled against the legitimacy of any authority, even his Divine authority, was a better fit for his plan than another Abraham whose faith in God's authority was unquestioning and infinite.
My own sense is that God wants something more of his people than faithful automatons who would kill for Him at the drop of a hat.
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The only one that demands childsacrifices is satan nowadays, certainly not God. That is my opinion. To be deceived is one way to end up deeper into his snares. Don´t get deceived. It is very traumatic for a child to get sacrificed that way.
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