Idolatry

[Jipsah]

Is this not a problem for certain churches who claim to be following apostolic teaching?

I've found that the accusation of idolatry is usually dircted at those whose traditions include icons or statuary. Personally, I've never met anyone who I reckoned worshipped either a picture or a statue. "oh, them Catrholics worship that crucifix." No, not unless they're suffering from a mental afflicton. "those Orthodox are praying to that icon." No, the icon is just a pictture, and no one expects it to answer back, leave the pic to get a drink of water, or hum "Jerusalem".

It's easy to play the "Those people worship them images " game when it makes you feel superior somehow, but I've never known the charge to be true.

 

[Jipsah]

Some people have a custom of kneeling before statues, if that is not worship what it is?

Different customs. Being Korean, I "bow down" (which is how you phrase bowing when you stronly diapprove of it) to all my brethren in the church, and to anyone who bows to me, when I walk past t altar, or when handed the cup during the Eurcharist, etc. Is a sign of respect, and not of worship. (No, I don't worship old man Park, and speaking candidly, neither of us likes the other a bit, but we still bow to each other when we pass in the hall. So no, bowing does not presupose worship.

Even if they are not worshiping, the bible says to not bow before other than God.

How far need we carry that. Is an inclination of the head when meeting someone a forbidden bow? Is the inclination of the head and upper body as a sign of respectful aggreement verboten? Are we now to condemn forms courtest from cultures not our own as idolatrous? I think the idea idea is ridiculous.

 

[RileyG]

Different customs. Being Korean, I "bow down" (which is how you phrase bowing when you stronly diapprove of it) to all my brethren in the church, and to anyone who bows to me, when I walk past t altar, or when handed the cup during the Eurcharist, etc. Is a sign of respect, and not of worship. (No, I don't worship old man Park, and speaking candidly, neither of us likes the other a bit, but we still bow to each other when we pass in the hall. So no, bowing does not presupose worship.


How far need we carry that. Is an inclination of the head when meeting someone a forbidden bow? Is the inclination of the head and upper body as a sign of respectful aggreement verboten? Are we now to condemn forms courtest from cultures not our own as idolatrous? I think the idea idea is ridiculous.

Not to mention, people in the United Kingdom bow (male)or curtsy (female) to the monarch when he passes by. Even in Queen Elizabeth’s funeral, mourners bowed or curtsied to her casket when it passed by.

Context is everything.

 

[Jipsah]

I have plenty of quotes. I will start posting them tomorrow.

We'll all be waiting with bated breath. And not bowing.

 

[Jipsah]

some Anglicans address their clergymen as "Father," use incense, and practice confession to a "priest."

Guilty as charged!

 

[Jipsah]

Yes, I am arguing the affirmative and I will prove not only that idolatry was condemned by the ancient church

Easy argument to win here, since we're all in agreement o that point. But if you enjoy "preaching to the choir", go for it.

but also it is as we see in the second commandment- made things that are venerated.

Like the Cross of Christ?

Now my opponents are going to get desperate

I'm fairly frothing at the mouth even now.

, engage personal attacks

Hmmm... OK, You're literally Hitler.

and perhaps even deliberately tell lies.

I'm 6'3 and classically handsome.

Why? Becuase they are here to defend their church

My church is red hot, your church ain't diddly squat!

. I am here to defend the faith, one true faith.

I 've waiting for you to make that startling revelation.

There has already been a bogus term introduced - “icon”

OK, I admit it - I made that word up myself.

. An icon is an idol.

Well, I reckon if you say so then there's an end of it.

The people who attempt to make a (false) distinction between idol and icon are simply trying to justify their error and sin.

Yep, no question about it. And also in a vicious attempt to discredit a gallant defenddr og the faith (that would be you, of course).

Next witness)

"Your honor, I move that this case be dismissed on the grounds of the Sanity Clause!
Motion denied! Everybody knows there ain't no Sanity Clause!"

Justin martyr. Credited as the first Christian apologist defines idolatry as “set in shrines and called Gods”.

Right. And afaik, no, there are no icons or statuary claiming to be images of God, or any collectively caled "gods:". Do you know of any?

So something that is made and venerated.

That ain't what he saidc, is it? That's just what you happen to believe, worth the price charged.

So you wiffed that one. Any more you'd care to try?