I think mid rapture or pre raptuer will happen why?

[beck12]

I think this mainly because the bible clearly states that no man will know the time or the hour/what time the rapture would happen. there for if it happened after the tribulation everyone would know the time, and also alot of people mistake the rapture for the second coming which i disagree, the rapture clearly states that jesus is in the sky not the ground, which means he never touchs earth, which would imply it is not the second coming.


(Sorry if you can not read this very well, i am not a grammer person!)

 

[n2thelight]

I think this mainly because the bible clearly states that no man will know the time or the hour/what time the rapture would happen. there for if it happened after the tribulation everyone would know the time, and also alot of people mistake the rapture for the second coming which i disagree, the rapture clearly states that jesus is in the sky not the ground, which means he never touchs earth, which would imply it is not the second coming.


(Sorry if you can not read this very well, i am not a grammer person!)

Acts 3:19 "Repent ye therefore, and be converted, that your sins may be blotted out, when the times of refreshing shall come from the presence of the Lord;"

Acts 3:20 "And He shall send Jesus Christ, Which before was preached unto you:"

Acts 3:21 "Whom the heaven must receive unto the times of restitution of all things, which God hath spoken by the mouth of all His holy prophets since the world began."

Christ must remain in heaven until the times of restitution of all things. The "restitution of all things" is "Apokatastasis" in the Greek, and means the re-establishment of all things from a state of ruin.

How does Christ get out of Heaven for this rapture??

 

[Jerico Miles]

Christ must remain in heaven until the times of restitution of all things. The "restitution of all things" is "Apokatastasis" in the Greek, and means the re-establishment of all things from a state of ruin.

How does Christ get out of Heaven for this rapture??

So if you believe Jesus raptures the church at the end of the tribulation, does that mean He'll rapture everyone when He's on earth?

 

[beck12]

Sorry guys, but i can not change my mind on this, because the bible states it clearly, and i have to follow what the bible says.

 

[ViaCrucis]

Nothing in Scripture suggests that at Christ's Parousia Christians go up into heaven. It says we meet the Lord (who is coming down) in the air. Not that we are beamed up into heaven.

The event is Christ's coming, His Parousia--appearing and advent--which is described as Christ descending.

"For the Lord himself will descend from heaven with a cry of command, with the voice of an archangel, and with the sound of the trumpet of God. And the dead in Christ will rise first." (1 Thessalonians 4:16)

It is Christ descending, not our ascending. We meet the descending, returning, coming, adventing Christ in the air, as He descends. That's what the text explicitly says.

The idea that we will get beamed up into heaven is entirely foreign from the teaching of Scripture. It's not there at all.

As such there is no "rapture" as popularly imagined in the pages of the Bible. The only way the "rapture" can make sense is if we understand that we are caught up, ἁρπαγησόμεθα, plucked, snatched to meet, encounter, go out to encounter and welcome--ἀπάντησιν (apantesin)--this One who is descending. What is happening is an apentesis, a meeting. One going out to meet another as they come.

We are the royal entourage going out to meet the King returning, welcoming the triumphant return of Christ the Lord. That is what the language of parousia, harpazo, and apantesis are all pointing to.

-CryptoLutheran

 

[Shocker]

Nothing in Scripture suggests that at Christ's Parousia Christians go up into heaven. It says we meet the Lord (who is coming down) in the air. Not that we are beamed up into heaven.

The event is Christ's coming, His Parousia--appearing and advent--which is described as Christ descending.

"For the Lord himself will descend from heaven with a cry of command, with the voice of an archangel, and with the sound of the trumpet of God. And the dead in Christ will rise first." (1 Thessalonians 4:16)

It is Christ descending, not our ascending. We meet the descending, returning, coming, adventing Christ in the air, as He descends. That's what the text explicitly says.

The idea that we will get beamed up into heaven is entirely foreign from the teaching of Scripture. It's not there at all.

As such there is no "rapture" as popularly imagined in the pages of the Bible. The only way the "rapture" can make sense is if we understand that we are caught up, ἁρπαγησόμεθα, plucked, snatched to meet, encounter, go out to encounter and welcome--ἀπάντησιν (apantesin)--this One who is descending. What is happening is an apentesis, a meeting. One going out to meet another as they come.

We are the royal entourage going out to meet the King returning, welcoming the triumphant return of Christ the Lord. That is what the language of parousia, harpazo, and apantesis are all pointing to.

-CryptoLutheran

Yeah, but then you run into issues with these verses.

Rev 3:10 Because thou hast kept the word of my patience, I also will keep thee from the hour of temptation, which shall come upon all the world, to try them that dwell upon the earth.

Mat 24:22 And except those days should be shortened, there should no flesh be saved: but for the elect's sake those days shall be shortened.

Luk_21:36 Watch ye therefore, and pray always, that ye may be accounted worthy to escape all these things that shall come to pass, and to stand before the Son of man.

Mat 24:40 Then shall two be in the field; the one shall be taken, and the other left.

Mat 24:41 Two women shall be grinding at the mill; the one shall be taken, and the other left.

Luk 17:34 "I tell you, on that night there will be two in one bed; one will be taken and the other will be left.

Luk 17:35 "There will be two women grinding at the same place; one will be taken and the other will be left
.
Luk 17:36 "Two men will be in the field; one will be taken and the other will be left."

Rev 12:5 And she brought forth a man child, who was to rule all nations with a rod of iron: and her child was caught up unto God, and to his throne. (Mal_4:2Gen_17:10;Lev_12:2;Rev_2:25-27;1Th_4:17;Rev_7:9)

 

[ViaCrucis]

Yeah, but then you run into issues with these verses.

Rev 3:10 Because thou hast kept the word of my patience, I also will keep thee from the hour of temptation, which shall come upon all the world, to try them that dwell upon the earth.

Indeed, Christ will keep us safe in Him. As He promised those in Philadelphia here who received this letter.

But, again, no being taken up into heaven.

Mat 24:22 And except those days should be shortened, there should no flesh be saved: but for the elect's sake those days shall be shortened.

Indeed, those days did not last forever. The time of trial that came upon the land of Judea during the Jewish-Roman war which caused so much bloodshed only lasted for a season.

Still no rapture taking anyone up into heaven.

Luk_21:36 Watch ye therefore, and pray always, that ye may be accounted worthy to escape all these things that shall come to pass, and to stand before the Son of man.

Again, that particular time of tribulation came and went within the lifetime of His own apostles to whom He is speaking here. They did not fall away, but kept the faith, endured, and reside in the Lord's rest until that coming day.

Still no rapture taking anyone up into heaven.

Mat 24:40 Then shall two be in the field; the one shall be taken, and the other left.

When Christ comes to judge the world, it will come with suddenness. It will be as in the days of Noah before the flood came that swept away the wicked from the earth; the flood came and they did not expect it and they were destroyed in it. So it will be at Christ's coming on the Last Day, when He comes to judge. Those taken are the wicked, swept up by the fire of God's wrath and judgment.

Still no rapture taking anyone into heaven.

Mat 24:41 Two women shall be grinding at the mill; the one shall be taken, and the other left.

Luk 17:34 "I tell you, on that night there will be two in one bed; one will be taken and the other will be left.

Luk 17:35 "There will be two women grinding at the same place; one will be taken and the other will be left
.
Luk 17:36 "Two men will be in the field; one will be taken and the other will be left."

Same thing as above.

Rev 12:5 And she brought forth a man child, who was to rule all nations with a rod of iron: and her child was caught up unto God, and to his throne. (Mal_4:2Gen_17:10;Lev_12:2;Rev_2:25-27;1Th_4:17;Rev_7:9)

The Child is Christ, Christ alone is He who rules the nations with a rod of iron. When He ascended He took His seat at the right hand of the Father from where He rules now with all authority, over all dominions and powers; there He shall be until He comes again on the Last Day as Judge of the quick and the dead.

Again, still no rapture taking anyone into heaven.

If we are willing, Scripture certainly has much to tell us here. But if we choose not to heed and listen to Scripture, but invent new doctrines and remove Scripture from context, we can certainly concoct any strange theology we so desire.

It's why I abandoned Dispensationalism years ago, and why I continue to reject it now. I simply take the Bible too seriously to be a Dispensationalist.

-CryptoLutheran

 

[Shocker]

Indeed, Christ will keep us safe in Him. As He promised those in Philadelphia here who received this letter.

But, again, no being taken up into heaven.

Indeed, those days did not last forever. The time of trial that came upon the land of Judea during the Jewish-Roman war which caused so much bloodshed only lasted for a season.

Still no rapture taking anyone up into heaven.

Again, that particular time of tribulation came and went within the lifetime of His own apostles to whom He is speaking here. They did not fall away, but kept the faith, endured, and reside in the Lord's rest until that coming day.

Still no rapture taking anyone up into heaven.

When Christ comes to judge the world, it will come with suddenness. It will be as in the days of Noah before the flood came that swept away the wicked from the earth; the flood came and they did not expect it and they were destroyed in it. So it will be at Christ's coming on the Last Day, when He comes to judge. Those taken are the wicked, swept up by the fire of God's wrath and judgment.

Still no rapture taking anyone into heaven.

Same thing as above.

The Child is Christ, Christ alone is He who rules the nations with a rod of iron. When He ascended He took His seat at the right hand of the Father from where He rules now with all authority, over all dominions and powers; there He shall be until He comes again on the Last Day as Judge of the quick and the dead.

Again, still no rapture taking anyone into heaven.

If we are willing, Scripture certainly has much to tell us here. But if we choose not to heed and listen to Scripture, but invent new doctrines and remove Scripture from context, we can certainly concoct any strange theology we so desire.

It's why I abandoned Dispensationalism years ago, and why I continue to reject it now. I simply take the Bible too seriously to be a Dispensationalist.

-CryptoLutheran

Im not a dispensationalist, and Id love to take your reply serious, but you've only given me a human perspective, Id love to have seen you use scripture to parallel with the verses I gave you attributing them directly to the events you feel they match. If this indeed referring to a past event.

 

[ViaCrucis]

Im not a dispensationalist, and Id love to take your reply serious, but you've only given me a human perspective, Id love to have seen you use scripture to parallel with the verses I gave you attributing them directly to the events you feel they match. If this indeed referring to a past event.

Here is what St. Luke records in his version of the Olivet Discourse:

"But when you see Jerusalem surrounded by armies, then know that its desolation has come near. Then let those who are in Judea flee to the mountains, and let those who are inside the city depart, and let not those who are out in the country enter it, for these days of vengeance, to fulfill all that is written. Alas for women who are pregnant and for those who are nursing infants in those days! For there will be great distress upon the earth and wrath against this people. They will fall by the edge of the sword and be led captive among the nations, and Jerusalem will be trampled underfoot by the Gentiles, until the times of the Gentiles are fulfilled." - Luke 21:20-24

Compare with what Josephus has to say concerning the sacking and ruin of the city and the desolation of the Temple:

Primary Sources - Josephus Describes The Romans' Sack Of Jerusalem | From Jesus To Christ | FRONTLINE | PBS

-CryptoLutheran

 

[Shocker]

Here is what St. Luke records in his version of the Olivet Discourse:

"But when you see Jerusalem surrounded by armies, then know that its desolation has come near. Then let those who are in Judea flee to the mountains, and let those who are inside the city depart, and let not those who are out in the country enter it, for these days of vengeance, to fulfill all that is written. Alas for women who are pregnant and for those who are nursing infants in those days! For there will be great distress upon the earth and wrath against this people. They will fall by the edge of the sword and be led captive among the nations, and Jerusalem will be trampled underfoot by the Gentiles, until the times of the Gentiles are fulfilled." - Luke 21:20-24

Compare with what Josephus has to say concerning the sacking and ruin of the city and the desolation of the Temple:

Primary Sources - Josephus Describes The Romans' Sack Of Jerusalem | From Jesus To Christ | FRONTLINE | PBS

-CryptoLutheran

You just lost all credibility with me when you said "Josephus".

A Christ hating Jew, not a prophet of God, and historical works that are not objective in placing a time with the prophecy, nor is there another witness to confirm his claims.


Good day sir.

 

[beck12]

You just lost all credibility with me when you said "Josephus".

A Christ hating Jew, not a prophet of God, and historical works that are not objective in placing a time with the prophecy, nor is there another witness to confirm his claims.


Good day sir.

I was going to reply to him until i saw he mention that,
Anyways the scriptures you said above you forgot to mention one about the 144,000 which could help in this case
The Lamb and the 144,000

14 Then I looked, and behold, a[a] Lamb standing on Mount Zion, and with Him one hundred and forty-four thousand, having[b] His Father’s name written on their foreheads. 2 And I heard a voice from heaven, like the voice of many waters, and like the voice of loud thunder. And I heard the sound of harpists playing their harps. 3 They sang as it were a new song before the throne, before the four living creatures, and the elders; and no one could learn that song except the hundred and forty-four thousand who were redeemed from the earth. 4 These are the ones who were not defiled with women, for they are virgins. These are the ones who follow the Lamb wherever He goes. These were redeemed[c] from among men, being firstfruits to God and to the Lamb. 5 And in their mouth was found no deceit,[d] for they are without fault before the throne of God.[e]

 

[interpreter]

There is no rapture because Jesus never mentioned one.

 

[beck12]

There is no rapture because Jesus never mentioned one.

He clearly does if you read the bible yourself and understand it, I can never deny the rapture, because i know its true.

I am not a good debater nor am i a good informer, but i am a good observer, and a good understander (ha had to say this!)

So do not ask me for a debate, i am not debating, i do not try to change everys beliefs if there not willing to listen.

 

[interpreter]

He clearly does if you read the bible yourself and understand it, I can never deny the rapture, because i know its true.

I am not a good debater nor am i a good informer, but i am a good observer, and a good understander (ha had to say this!)

So do not ask me for a debate, i am not debating, i do not try to change everys beliefs if there not willing to listen.

Where did Jesus mention a rapture?

 

[Shocker]

Where did Jesus mention a rapture?

Well you've read the bible presumably, If you didnt see it, would anything we say make a difference?

 

[beck12]

Well you've read the bible presumably, If you didnt see it, would anything we say make a difference?

Exactly, thats why in my previous post i said i am not debating with anyone who does not want to listen.

 

[ViaCrucis]

You just lost all credibility with me when you said "Josephus".

I wasn't aware that contemporary historians and historical works were somehow incredulous.

A Christ hating Jew,

What a delightfully inflammatory remark. Josephus was certainly a Jew and wrote of Jewish history, but "Christ hating"? Do you presume that all Jews are "Christ haters"? Or just the ones who wrote history books?

not a prophet of God,

Irrelevant. Josephus hasn't been cited as a divinely ordained prophet, but as a first century historian recording the events of the times.

and historical works that are not objective in placing a time with the prophecy,

Josephus shows no indication that he is interested in validating the Lord's predictions concerning the destruction of Jerusalem. He's writing as a Jewish man concerning Jewish history.

nor is there another witness to confirm his claims.

At least have the honesty to come out and say that you have an ideological problem with the recorded history because it contradicts your particular doctrines.

-CryptoLutheran

 

[Shocker]

Josephus shows no indication that he is interested in validating the Lord's predictions concerning the destruction of Jerusalem. He's writing as a Jewish man concerning Jewish history.

That's because he would have recognized them if they did.

He was a Jew, which means he had Daniels prophecy.

But that's neither here nor there.

Hes contributed, literally nothing, to objectively identify the prophecy in Daniel as fulfilled, not that Josephus could prove it anyways, because the 490 years would have consecutively ended in 33ad.

Cyrus decree to rebuild Jerusalem was 457 b.c.


There is a logical fallacy, its actually simple math.

70ad would make daniels prophecy 527 years long in order to fit the time period.

 

[Bible2]

beck12 said in post 1:

I think mid rapture or pre raptuer will happen why?

I think this mainly because the bible clearly states that no man will know the time or the hour/what time the rapture would happen.

Note that Matthew 24:36,42,44 refers to Jesus' 2nd coming (Matthew 24:37,42,44), which Jesus had just finished saying won't happen until immediately after the tribulation (Matthew 24:29-31). So in Matthew 24:42,44, Jesus can mean that only if believers don't watch (stay awake, spiritually) during the tribulation, the 2nd coming will happen at an hour they don't know/think not (cf. the if principle of Revelation 3:3b). In the context of Matthew 24:36,42,44, Jesus suggests that it is possible for believers to know when the 2nd coming will occur and to watch for it (Matthew 24:43-44a; 1 Thessalonians 5:4).

Also, Jesus says "of that day and hour knoweth no man" (Matthew 24:36), he doesn't say "of that day and hour no man will know". So it's possible that at a certain point in our future, some believers will come to know the date (as in the year, month, and day) of the 2nd coming before it happens. Also, if we mistakenly think that Jesus can come today or tomorrow (as is sometimes claimed by the pre-tribulation and symbolicist views), then how can we also claim that he will come when nobody thinks he will (Matthew 24:44)?

Also, compare the following: "of that day and hour knoweth no man" (Matthew 24:36), "the things of God knoweth no man" (1 Corinthians 2:11). If we claim that the 1st verse means no man will ever know the date of the 2nd coming until it happens, then to be consistent we would have to also claim that the 2nd verse means no man, not even believers, can know the things of God until the 2nd coming. But who would say that? For the Holy Spirit can currently reveal to believers the things of God (1 Corinthians 2:12-13). He can currently guide them into all truth and show them what will happen in the future (John 16:13), including the date of the 2nd coming. For, again, Jesus suggests that it is possible for believers to know when the 2nd coming will occur and to watch for it (Matthew 24:43-44a; 1 Thessalonians 5:4). Also, what Amos 3:7 says would include the 2nd coming: Surely God the Father won't send Jesus back without having 1st revealed to some believers the secret of the date of the 2nd coming.

Jesus could return on the 1,335th day after the abomination of desolation (possibly a standing, android image of the Antichrist) is set up in a 3rd Jewish temple (Daniel 12:11-12, Revelation 16:15, Daniel 11:31,36, Matthew 24:15).

beck12 said in post 1:

the rapture clearly states that jesus is in the sky not the ground, which means he never touchs earth, which would imply it is not the second coming.

Note that nothing in 1 Thessalonians 4 says or requires that Jesus won't at that same coming subsequently descend to the earth on a white horse, as in Revelation 19. And there's no explicit descent to the earth, or a white horse, in Matthew 24:30 either, but it's still the same 2nd coming as Revelation 19. And even in Revelation 19, there's no explicit descent to the earth, even though it's the same 2nd coming as Zechariah 14:3-5, which has no explicit white horse.

 

[Bible2]

ViaCrucis said in post 5:

Nothing in Scripture suggests that at Christ's Parousia Christians go up into heaven. It says we meet the Lord (who is coming down) in the air. Not that we are beamed up into heaven.

Great point, if by "heaven" you mean the 3rd heaven (2 Corinthians 12:2b). For indeed no scripture requires that believers will be raptured any higher than the clouds of the sky (the 1st heaven) to hold a meeting in the air with Jesus at his 2nd coming (1 Thessalonians 4:15-17). After that meeting, in which the church will be judged by Jesus (Psalms 50:3-5, cf. Mark 13:27) and the obedient part of the church will be married to Jesus (Revelation 19:7, Matthew 25:1-13), the obedient part of the church will come back down from the sky (the 1st heaven) with Jesus (Revelation 19:15-21) to reign on the earth with him for 1,000 years (Revelation 20:4-6, Revelation 5:10, Revelation 2:26-29). After the 1,000 years and subsequent events (Revelation 20:7-15, Ezekiel chapters 38-39), the obedient part of the church will live on the new earth with God the Father and Jesus in the literal city of New Jerusalem (Revelation chapters 21-22).

*******

ViaCrucis said in post 7:

The Child is Christ, Christ alone is He who rules the nations with a rod of iron.

Actually, in Revelation 12:5, the "man child" isn't Jesus. For Revelation 12:5 isn't about past things, but is part of the "things which must be hereafter" (Revelation 4:1b). Revelation chapters 11-14 show from 4 different angles what will happen right before the start and during the future, literal 3.5 years of the Antichrist's worldwide reign (Revelation 11:2b-3, Revelation 12:6,14, Revelation 13:5-8, Revelation 14:9-13), which will be in the latter half of the future tribulation of Revelation chapters 6 to 18 and Matthew 24.

Regarding Revelation 12:5 saying "who was to rule all nations with a rod of iron": Along with Jesus (Revelation 19:15, Psalms 2:9), the whole obedient church will rule the nations with a rod of iron (Revelation 2:26-29) on the earth (Revelation 5:10) during the future millennium (Revelation 20:4-6). Before the millennium, during the tribulation, at its midpoint, the 144,000 male-virgins part of the church will be caught up bodily to the throne of God in heaven (Revelation 14:1,4,5, Textus Receptus) as the "man child" (Revelation 12:5-6), and as the firstfruits of the church (Revelation 14:4), in the sense of its best part (cf. Numbers 18:12).

*******

ViaCrucis said in post 9:

Here is what St. Luke records in his version of the Olivet Discourse:

"But when you see Jerusalem surrounded by armies, then know that its desolation has come near. Then let those who are in Judea flee to the mountains, and let those who are inside the city depart, and let not those who are out in the country enter it, for these days of vengeance, to fulfill all that is written. Alas for women who are pregnant and for those who are nursing infants in those days! For there will be great distress upon the earth and wrath against this people. They will fall by the edge of the sword and be led captive among the nations, and Jerusalem will be trampled underfoot by the Gentiles, until the times of the Gentiles are fulfilled." - Luke 21:20-24

When Jesus says "ye shall see Jerusalem compassed with armies" (Luke 21:20), he's referring to the 1st part of Daniel 11:31: "And arms shall stand on his part". And when Jesus says "the desolation" in Luke 21:20, he's referring to the "abomination of desolation" part of Daniel 11:31, just as in Matthew 24:15, he's referring to the "abomination of desolation" part of Daniel 11:31.

So Luke 21:20-23 isn't referring to 70 AD nor (as is sometimes claimed) to the pillaging of Jerusalem which will occur at the very end of the future tribulation, right before Jesus' 2nd coming to save Jerusalem (Zechariah 14), but is referring to what will happen mid-tribulation when the Antichrist will antitypically fulfill Daniel 11:31 at the start of his future, literal 3.5-year worldwide reign (Revelation 13:4-18), during which 3.5 years Jerusalem will be trodden down by the Gentiles (Revelation 11:2b), which future treading down is what Luke 21:24 is referring to.

Regarding the "abomination of desolation", Daniel 11:31 was typically fulfilled by the abomination of desolation in 1 Maccabees 1:54, which occurred in the holy place (the inner sanctum) of the 2nd Jewish temple in Jerusalem in the time of Antiochus IV. But per Jesus' statement in Matthew 24:15, the church will see the abomination of desolation in Daniel 11:31 fulfilled (antitypically) in the future, when the church will see the abomination of desolation stand in the holy place (of a 3rd Jewish temple in Jerusalem). This future abomination of desolation could be a standing, android image of the Antichrist (Revelation 13:15) which his followers ("they") will put in the holy place of the temple (Daniel 11:31) to be worshipped (Revelation 13:15), after they've stopped the daily Mosaic animal sacrifices which the ultra-Orthodox Jews will have restarted in front of the temple (Daniel 11:31). This image will pollute the holy place of the temple (Daniel 11:31).

The Antichrist will then fulfill Daniel 11:36 and 2 Thessalonians 2:4 by sitting himself (at least one time) in the temple and proclaiming himself God. By the power of Satan (the dragon, Revelation 12:9), the Antichrist (the individual-man aspect of Revelation's "beast") will then rule and be worshipped by all the nations of the earth for 3.5 literal years (Revelation 13:4-18), and will physically overcome Biblical Christians (not in hiding) in every nation (Revelation 13:7-10, Revelation 14:12-13, Revelation 20:4-6, Matthew 24:9-13).

Also, from the day on which (antitypically) "the daily sacrifice shall be taken away, and the abomination that maketh desolate set up, there shall be 1,290 days. Blessed is he that waiteth, and cometh to the 1,335 days" (Daniel 12:11-12, Revelation 16:15). Also, because the Antichrist will fulfill Daniel 11:31 antitypically (Matthew 24:15) and will fulfill Daniel 11:36 for the first (and only) time, then he will also fulfill all of Daniel 11:21-45 (the 1st part of it antitypically, and the rest for the 1st and only time) when he arises on the world stage, for that passage refers to the career of the same man. And since the Antichrist will fulfill all of Daniel 11:21-45 when he arises on the world stage, then just preceding his arising on the world stage, Daniel 11:13-19 could be fulfilled antitypically by an Iraqi Baathist General completely defeating and occupying Israel and Egypt with a huge Iraqi Army (Daniel 11:15-17; in verse 17 the original Hebrew word translated as "daughter" is "bath").

ViaCrucis said in post 9:

Here is what St. Luke records in his version of the Olivet Discourse:

"But when you see Jerusalem surrounded by armies, then know that its desolation has come near. Then let those who are in Judea flee to the mountains, and let those who are inside the city depart, and let not those who are out in the country enter it, for these days of vengeance, to fulfill all that is written. Alas for women who are pregnant and for those who are nursing infants in those days! For there will be great distress upon the earth and wrath against this people. They will fall by the edge of the sword and be led captive among the nations, and Jerusalem will be trampled underfoot by the Gentiles, until the times of the Gentiles are fulfilled." - Luke 21:20-24

Regarding "Judaea" (Luke 21:21), note that this doesn't have to mean 1st-century-AD Judaea. For there are many churches in Judaea (southern Israel) still today. They contain mostly Gentile believers, not just Jewish believers. The church began and has always been in Judaea: "Then had the churches rest throughout all Judaea" (Acts 9:31); "the churches of Judaea" (Galatians 1:22); "the churches... in Judaea" (1 Thessalonians 2:14). Matthew 24:16 refers to those in the church, both Gentiles and Jews, who will be living in Judaea at the future point in time when the abomination of desolation (possibly a standing, android image of the Antichrist) is set up in the holy place (the inner sanctum) of a 3rd Jewish temple in Jerusalem (Matthew 24:15, Daniel 11:31).

The Antichrist's persecution of the church could begin in Jerusalem and Judaea right after the abomination of desolation is set up and the Antichrist himself sits in the temple (at least one time) and proclaims himself God (2 Thessalonians 2:4, Daniel 11:36). So to avoid this persecution (cf. Matthew 10:23a), those in the church living in Judaea should flee immediately after they see the abomination of desolation set up (Matthew 24:15-16), which event could occur at the midpoint of the future tribulation of Revelation chapters 6 to 18 and Matthew 24, and which event could mark the start of the Antichrist's future, literal 3.5-year worldwide reign (Revelation 13:4-18). Eventually, the Antichrist's persecution of the church will reach every nation of the earth (Revelation 13:7-10, Revelation 14:12-13, Revelation 20:4-6, Matthew 24:9-13), so that the basic principle of Matthew 24:16 of fleeing (the Antichrist's persecution) would apply to believers around the world.

Just as the woman in Revelation 12:6 represents many different people in the church around the world, so the protected wilderness place she flees to represents many different protected wilderness places around the world. When those in the church living in Judaea see the abomination of desolation set up, they should flee into places in the wilderness east of Judaea, the mountains (Matthew 24:16) of Jordan. And those in the church who will be living in places in the world other than Judaea should flee into other wilderness places, mountainous places (Ezekiel 7:16), in the regions of the world where they live.

And they should have prepared beforehand hideouts in these wilderness/mountain places, hideouts already fully stocked with all of the emergency supplies of food, water, warm clothing, etc., that they and their families and fellow Christians will need to survive (1 Timothy 5:8, Matthew 24:45-46, cf. Genesis 41:48,36, Genesis 45:7) until Jesus returns, possibly on the 1,335th day after the abomination of desolation is set up (Daniel 12:11-12, Revelation 16:15). For they shouldn't carry any supplies with them when they flee (Matthew 24:17-18). They should flee as unhindered and quickly as possible, knowing that when the abomination of desolation is set up, that could signal the beginning of the Antichrist's future, literal 3.5-year Luciferian (Satanic) worldwide reign of terror (Revelation 13:4-18, Revelation 12:9), when he will be given power to make war against all those in the church that he can get his hands on, and to physically overcome them and kill them (by beheading) in every nation (Revelation 13:7-10, Revelation 14:12-13, Revelation 20:4-6, Matthew 24:9-13).