I don't understand...

[LastSeven]

Thanks. What does this mean practically? How can we know if someone is spiritually dead or alive?

Since Jesus is the life of this world, anyone in whom Jesus dwells is alive and everyone else is dead. Without Jesus there is no life. And since Jesus is the word of God, it's simply a matter of believing in that word. If you don't believe the word of God, you are dead.

If you do believe in the word of God (aka Jesus) then that word lives in you. That means you have taken part in the first resurrection, as you were spiritually crucified and resurrected with Jesus on the cross. You have been spiritually born again.

As Jesus said, you must be born of water (physical birth) and of the spirit (spiritual birth) to enter into the kingdom of heaven.

 

[chrisstavrous]

Since Jesus is the life of this world, anyone in whom Jesus dwells is alive and everyone else is dead. Without Jesus there is no life. And since Jesus is the word of God, it's simply a matter of believing in that word. If you don't believe the word of God, you are dead.

If you do believe in the word of God (aka Jesus) then that word lives in you. That means you have taken part in the first resurrection, as you were spiritually crucified and resurrected with Jesus on the cross. You have been spiritually born again.

As Jesus said, you must be born of water (physical birth) and of the spirit (spiritual birth) to enter into the kingdom of heaven.

Then every baby that has died was also spiritually dead, no? babies dont go to hell? well if they dont it proves god does not need faith to save someone.

 

[Snake75]

Then every baby that has died was also spiritually dead, no? babies dont go to hell? well if they dont it proves god does not need faith to save someone.

Also add people with severe mental issues. I guess they go to hell too.

 

[chrisstavrous]

Also add people with severe mental issues. I guess they go to hell too.

And the billions of people before jesus and the gospel.

 

[Snake75]

And the billions of people before jesus and the gospel.

Oh thats a good one xD

 

[LastSeven]

And the billions of people before jesus and the gospel.

There was no "before Jesus". Jesus is the word of God through whom all things were created and he was with God in the beginning. Even before the word of God came in the flesh those with faith in Him were saved.

1 Corinthians 10:1-4
For I do not want you to be ignorant of the fact, brothers and sisters, that our ancestors were all under the cloud and that they all passed through the sea. 2 They were all baptized into Moses in the cloud and in the sea. 3 They all ate the same spiritual food 4 and drank the same spiritual drink; for they drank from the spiritual rock that accompanied them, and that rock was Christ.

As for the young ones and mentally handicapped, I honestly don't know how God deals with those people. That is a matter of great debate within the Christian community.

 

[LastSeven]

what proven reliable and accurate historical text are you talking about? Please tell me its not the bible.... No, it makes no sense and no evidence at all the burden of proof is still on you good sir.

It is a word en.wikipedia(remove).org/wiki/Omnibenevolence

So, if God loves us all. Why does he allow diseases and hunger and all these bad things happen to us?

Who said God loves us all? Nevertheless, even those he loves are allowed to suffer. We suffer because we live in a sinful world, but for those he calls his own he is building a world without suffering.

 

[aiki]

Goodness, LastSeven! Take a bath! You're covered in red herrings!

Selah.

 

[chrisstavrous]

There was no "before Jesus". Jesus is the word of God through whom all things were created and he was with God in the beginning. Even before the word of God came in the flesh those with faith in Him were saved.

1 Corinthians 10:1-4
For I do not want you to be ignorant of the fact, brothers and sisters, that our ancestors were all under the cloud and that they all passed through the sea. 2 They were all baptized into Moses in the cloud and in the sea. 3 They all ate the same spiritual food 4 and drank the same spiritual drink; for they drank from the spiritual rock that accompanied them, and that rock was Christ.

As for the young ones and mentally handicapped, I honestly don't know how God deals with those people. That is a matter of great debate within the Christian community.

That bible verse is talking about moses and his people, what of the billions of people in history that was not apart of that special dispensation.

 

[LastSeven]

That bible verse is talking about moses and his people, what of the billions of people in history that was not apart of that special dispensation.

Paul mentions Moses because the people were concerned about the salvation of their ancestors specifically, but since Jesus existed long before Moses, and in fact since before Adam, the same salvation has always been available to everyone.

As I said, Jesus was with God in the beginning and through him all things were created. In other words, through the word of God all things were created. If anyone accepted that word as the truth then they were and are redeemed, no matter when in history they lived. Jesus has always been, and our salvation with him.

 

[LastSeven]

Goodness, LastSeven! Take a bath! You're covered in red herrings!

Selah.

Yes, sigh. It tends to happen that way in these types of threads.

 

[chrisstavrous]

It mentions Moses as an example, but since Jesus existed long before Moses, and in fact since before Adam, the same salvation was available to everyone.

As I said, Jesus was with God in the beginning and through him all things were created. In other words, through the word of God all things were created. If anyone accepted that word as the truth then they were and are redeemed, no matter when in history they lived. Jesus has always been, and our salvation with him.

How? The holy spirit was only given to the gentiles after jesus acended to heaven. How did the gentiles gain salvation without the holy spirit?

 

[LastSeven]

You don't need the holy spirit to be saved. The holy spirit is a guide, not a saviour.

 

[chrisstavrous]

You don't need the holy spirit to be saved. The holy spirit is a guide, not a saviour.

The holy spirit is god not a guide, not having the holy spirit means god does not dwell in your body and you are dead. Its the spirit of god that gives you life without it you are dead. This is why jesus says blasphemy against the holy spirit will never be forgiven, because your rejecting god not a guide.

 

[LastSeven]

You are right when you say the holy spirit is God, and the holy spirit is Jesus. The point is the spirit came to guide us in all understanding, not to bring salvation. It's through Jesus that we receive salvation, and through salvation that we receive the spirit.

Matthew 10:10
I am come that they might have life, and that they might have it more abundantly

John 16:13
But when he, the Spirit of truth, comes, he will guide you into all the truth. He will not speak on his own; he will speak only what he hears, and he will tell you what is yet to come.

Whether or not the ancients received the holy spirit is neither here nor there. If they received the word they were saved.

 

[Beccs]

i didnt realise we had created life in a laboratory when did that happen

Scientist Craig Venter creates life for first time in laboratory sparking debate about 'playing god' - Telegraph

 

[oi_antz]

Since Jesus is the life of this world, anyone in whom Jesus dwells is alive and everyone else is dead. Without Jesus there is no life. And since Jesus is the word of God, it's simply a matter of believing in that word. If you don't believe the word of God, you are dead.

If you do believe in the word of God (aka Jesus) then that word lives in you. That means you have taken part in the first resurrection, as you were spiritually crucified and resurrected with Jesus on the cross. You have been spiritually born again.

As Jesus said, you must be born of water (physical birth) and of the spirit (spiritual birth) to enter into the kingdom of heaven.

How do we recognize this? Are you saying that everyone who believes the words of the bible and preaches them has life? Does everyone who doesn't believe or preach the words in the bible not have life? What is the way that someone such as yourself or the OP for example can recognize this spiritual life?

 

[chrisstavrous]

You are right when you say the holy spirit is God, and the holy spirit is Jesus. The point is the spirit came to guide us in all understanding, not to bring salvation. It's through Jesus that we receive salvation, and through salvation that we receive the spirit.

Matthew 10:10
I am come that they might have life, and that they might have it more abundantly

John 16:13
But when he, the Spirit of truth, comes, he will guide you into all the truth. He will not speak on his own; he will speak only what he hears, and he will tell you what is yet to come.

Whether or not the ancients received the holy spirit is neither here nor there. If they received the word they were saved.

Why do you think I would defend a doctrine knowing that by that doctrine it would mean my own destruction? You seem to defend your doctrine because by not doing so you will have to face that legalistic anomaly in the bible I was talking about.

 

[aiki]

You really like to take science and morph it into something that works for you and your belief.

Science says nothing; scientists do. And scientists interpret what science uncovers according to their philosophical presuppositions. Of course, it is not just scientists who do this. We all of us do the very same thing. Even you.

Selah.

 

[Snake75]

Science says nothing; scientists do. And scientists interpret what science uncovers according to their philosophical presuppositions. Of course, it is not just scientists who do this. We all of us do the very same thing. Even you.

Selah.

But scientist have evidence to back up what they say. While you do not.