I desperately need valid proof of creationism.

Lost4words

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The way i look at creation and believe in it is, God can turn water into wine, bring someone back from the dead, heal the blind.

God is our creator. He spoke and everything came into being! Trust in God. Have faith.
 
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SkyWriting

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Chapter and verse please.

Strong's Hebrew: 6213. עָשָׂה (asah) -- accomplish

Genesis 1:7
HEB: וַיַּ֣עַשׂ אֱלֹהִים֮ אֶת־
NAS: God made the expanse, and separated
KJV: And God made the firmament,
INT: made God the expanse

Genesis 1:11
HEB: עֵ֣ץ פְּרִ֞י עֹ֤שֶׂה פְּרִי֙ לְמִינ֔וֹ
NAS: on the earth bearing fruit
KJV: tree yielding fruit
INT: trees fruit bearing fruit their kind

Genesis 1:12
HEB: לְמִינֵ֔הוּ וְעֵ֧ץ עֹֽשֶׂה־ פְּרִ֛י אֲשֶׁ֥ר
NAS: and trees bearing fruit
KJV: and the tree yielding fruit,
INT: their kind and trees bearing fruit with

Genesis 1:16
HEB: וַיַּ֣עַשׂ אֱלֹהִ֔ים אֶת־
NAS: God made the two great
KJV: and it was so.And God made two great
INT: made God the two

Genesis 1:25
HEB: וַיַּ֣עַשׂ אֱלֹהִים֩ אֶת־
NAS: God made the beasts of the earth
KJV: And God made the beast
INT: made God the beast

Genesis 1:26
HEB: וַיֹּ֣אמֶר אֱלֹהִ֔ים נַֽעֲשֶׂ֥ה אָדָ֛ם בְּצַלְמֵ֖נוּ
NAS: said, Let Us make man
KJV: said, Let us make man
INT: said God make man our image

Genesis 1:31
HEB: כָּל־ אֲשֶׁ֣ר עָשָׂ֔ה וְהִנֵּה־ ט֖וֹב
NAS: all that He had made, and behold,
KJV: every thing that he had made, and, behold, [it was] very
INT: all that had made and behold good

Genesis 2:2
HEB: מְלַאכְתּ֖וֹ אֲשֶׁ֣ר עָשָׂ֑ה וַיִּשְׁבֹּת֙ בַּיּ֣וֹם
NAS: which He had done, and He rested
KJV: his work which he had made; and he rested
INT: his work which had done rested day

Genesis 2:2
HEB: מְלַאכְתּ֖וֹ אֲשֶׁ֥ר עָשָֽׂה׃
NAS: His work which He had done.
KJV: from all his work which he had made.
INT: his work which had done

Genesis 2:3
HEB: בָּרָ֥א אֱלֹהִ֖ים לַעֲשֽׂוֹת׃ פ
NAS: God had created and made.
KJV: which God created and made.
INT: had created God and made

Genesis 2:4
HEB: בְּהִבָּֽרְאָ֑ם בְּי֗וֹם עֲשׂ֛וֹת יְהוָ֥ה אֱלֹהִ֖ים
NAS: God made earth
KJV: God made the earth
INT: were created the day made the LORD God

Genesis 2:18
HEB: הָֽאָדָ֖ם לְבַדּ֑וֹ אֶֽעֱשֶׂהּ־ לּ֥וֹ עֵ֖זֶר
NAS: to be alone; I will make him a helper
KJV: should be alone; I will make him an help meet
INT: the man to be alone will make A helper suitable

Genesis 3:1
HEB: הַשָּׂדֶ֔ה אֲשֶׁ֥ר עָשָׂ֖ה יְהוָ֣ה אֱלֹהִ֑ים
NAS: God had made. And he said
KJV: God had made. And he said
INT: of the field which had made the LORD God

Genesis 3:7
HEB: עֲלֵ֣ה תְאֵנָ֔ה וַיַּעֲשׂ֥וּ לָהֶ֖ם חֲגֹרֹֽת׃
NAS: together and made themselves
KJV: together, and made themselves aprons.
INT: leaves fig and made loin

Genesis 3:13
HEB: מַה־ זֹּ֣את עָשִׂ֑ית וַתֹּ֙אמֶר֙ הָֽאִשָּׁ֔ה
NAS: is this you have done? And the woman
KJV: unto the woman, What [is] this [that] thou hast done? And the woman
INT: What hast done said to the woman

Genesis 3:14
HEB: הַנָּחָשׁ֮ כִּ֣י עָשִׂ֣יתָ זֹּאת֒ אָר֤וּר
NAS: Because you have done this,
KJV: Because thou hast done this, thou [art] cursed
INT: the serpent Because have done likewise Cursed

Genesis 3:21
HEB: וַיַּעַשׂ֩ יְהוָ֨ה אֱלֹהִ֜ים
NAS: The LORD God made garments of skin
KJV: did the LORD God make coats of skins,
INT: made the LORD God

Genesis 4:10
HEB: וַיֹּ֖אמֶר מֶ֣ה עָשִׂ֑יתָ ק֚וֹל דְּמֵ֣י
NAS: What have you done? The voice
KJV: What hast thou done? the voice
INT: said What done the voice blood

Genesis 5:1
HEB: בִּדְמ֥וּת אֱלֹהִ֖ים עָשָׂ֥ה אֹתֽוֹ׃
NAS: man, He made him in the likeness
KJV: in the likeness of God made he him;
INT: the likeness of God made

Genesis 6:6
HEB: יְהוָ֔ה כִּֽי־ עָשָׂ֥ה אֶת־ הָֽאָדָ֖ם
NAS: was sorry that He had made man
KJV: the LORD that he had made man
INT: the LORD for had made man the earth

Genesis 6:7
HEB: נִחַ֖מְתִּי כִּ֥י עֲשִׂיתִֽם׃
NAS: for I am sorry that I have made them.
KJV: for it repenteth me that I have made them.
INT: I am for have made

Genesis 6:14
HEB: עֲשֵׂ֤ה לְךָ֙ תֵּבַ֣ת
NAS: Make for yourself an ark of gopher
KJV: Make thee an ark of gopher
INT: Make an ark wood

Genesis 6:14
HEB: גֹ֔פֶר קִנִּ֖ים תַּֽעֲשֶׂ֣ה אֶת־ הַתֵּבָ֑ה
NAS: wood; you shall make the ark
KJV: rooms shalt thou make in
INT: of gopher rooms shall make in the ark

Genesis 6:15
HEB: וְזֶ֕ה אֲשֶׁ֥ר תַּֽעֲשֶׂ֖ה אֹתָ֑הּ שְׁלֹ֧שׁ
NAS: is how you shall make it: the length
KJV: And this [is the fashion] which thou shalt make it [of]: The length
INT: This is how shall make three hundred

Genesis 6:16
HEB: צֹ֣הַר ׀ תַּעֲשֶׂ֣ה לַתֵּבָ֗ה וְאֶל־
NAS: You shall make a window for the ark,
KJV: A window shalt thou make to the ark,
INT: A window shall make the ark to
 
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SkyWriting

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Strong's Hebrew: 6213. עָשָׂה (asah) -- accomplish

Genesis 1:7
HEB: וַיַּ֣עַשׂ אֱלֹהִים֮ אֶת־
NAS: God made the expanse, and separated
KJV: And God made the firmament,
INT: made God the expanse

Genesis 1:11
HEB: עֵ֣ץ פְּרִ֞י עֹ֤שֶׂה פְּרִי֙ לְמִינ֔וֹ
NAS: on the earth bearing fruit
KJV: tree yielding fruit
INT: trees fruit bearing fruit their kind

Genesis 1:12
HEB: לְמִינֵ֔הוּ וְעֵ֧ץ עֹֽשֶׂה־ פְּרִ֛י אֲשֶׁ֥ר
NAS: and trees bearing fruit
KJV: and the tree yielding fruit,
INT: their kind and trees bearing fruit with

Genesis 1:16
HEB: וַיַּ֣עַשׂ אֱלֹהִ֔ים אֶת־
NAS: God made the two great
KJV: and it was so.And God made two great
INT: made God the two

Genesis 1:25
HEB: וַיַּ֣עַשׂ אֱלֹהִים֩ אֶת־
NAS: God made the beasts of the earth
KJV: And God made the beast
INT: made God the beast

Genesis 1:26
HEB: וַיֹּ֣אמֶר אֱלֹהִ֔ים נַֽעֲשֶׂ֥ה אָדָ֛ם בְּצַלְמֵ֖נוּ
NAS: said, Let Us make man
KJV: said, Let us make man
INT: said God make man our image

Genesis 1:31
HEB: כָּל־ אֲשֶׁ֣ר עָשָׂ֔ה וְהִנֵּה־ ט֖וֹב
NAS: all that He had made, and behold,
KJV: every thing that he had made, and, behold, [it was] very
INT: all that had made and behold good

Genesis 2:2
HEB: מְלַאכְתּ֖וֹ אֲשֶׁ֣ר עָשָׂ֑ה וַיִּשְׁבֹּת֙ בַּיּ֣וֹם
NAS: which He had done, and He rested
KJV: his work which he had made; and he rested
INT: his work which had done rested day

Genesis 2:2
HEB: מְלַאכְתּ֖וֹ אֲשֶׁ֥ר עָשָֽׂה׃
NAS: His work which He had done.
KJV: from all his work which he had made.
INT: his work which had done

Genesis 2:3
HEB: בָּרָ֥א אֱלֹהִ֖ים לַעֲשֽׂוֹת׃ פ
NAS: God had created and made.
KJV: which God created and made.
INT: had created God and made

Genesis 2:4
HEB: בְּהִבָּֽרְאָ֑ם בְּי֗וֹם עֲשׂ֛וֹת יְהוָ֥ה אֱלֹהִ֖ים
NAS: God made earth
KJV: God made the earth
INT: were created the day made the LORD God

Genesis 2:18
HEB: הָֽאָדָ֖ם לְבַדּ֑וֹ אֶֽעֱשֶׂהּ־ לּ֥וֹ עֵ֖זֶר
NAS: to be alone; I will make him a helper
KJV: should be alone; I will make him an help meet
INT: the man to be alone will make A helper suitable

Genesis 3:1
HEB: הַשָּׂדֶ֔ה אֲשֶׁ֥ר עָשָׂ֖ה יְהוָ֣ה אֱלֹהִ֑ים
NAS: God had made. And he said
KJV: God had made. And he said
INT: of the field which had made the LORD God

Genesis 3:7
HEB: עֲלֵ֣ה תְאֵנָ֔ה וַיַּעֲשׂ֥וּ לָהֶ֖ם חֲגֹרֹֽת׃
NAS: together and made themselves
KJV: together, and made themselves aprons.
INT: leaves fig and made loin

Genesis 3:13
HEB: מַה־ זֹּ֣את עָשִׂ֑ית וַתֹּ֙אמֶר֙ הָֽאִשָּׁ֔ה
NAS: is this you have done? And the woman
KJV: unto the woman, What [is] this [that] thou hast done? And the woman
INT: What hast done said to the woman

Genesis 6:15
HEB: וְזֶ֕ה אֲשֶׁ֥ר תַּֽעֲשֶׂ֖ה אֹתָ֑הּ שְׁלֹ֧שׁ
NAS: is how you shall make it: the length
KJV: And this [is the fashion] which thou shalt make it [of]: The length
INT: This is how shall make three hundred

Genesis 6:16
HEB: צֹ֣הַר ׀ תַּעֲשֶׂ֣ה לַתֵּבָ֗ה וְאֶל־
NAS: You shall make a window for the ark,
KJV: A window shalt thou make to the ark,
INT: A window shall make the ark to
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
1254. bara'

Genesis 1:1
HEB: בְּרֵאשִׁ֖ית בָּרָ֣א אֱלֹהִ֑ים אֵ֥ת
NAS: God created the heavens
KJV: God created the heaven
INT: in the beginning created God the heavens

Genesis 1:21
HEB: וַיִּבְרָ֣א אֱלֹהִ֔ים אֶת־
NAS: God created the great sea monsters
KJV: And God created great whales,
INT: created God sea

Genesis 1:27
HEB: וַיִּבְרָ֨א אֱלֹהִ֤ים ׀ אֶת־
NAS: God created man in His own image,
KJV: So God created man in his [own] image,
INT: created God man

Genesis 1:27
HEB: בְּצֶ֥לֶם אֱלֹהִ֖ים בָּרָ֣א אֹת֑וֹ זָכָ֥ר
NAS: of God He created him; male
KJV: of God created he him; male
INT: the image of God created male and female

Genesis 1:27
HEB: זָכָ֥ר וּנְקֵבָ֖ה בָּרָ֥א אֹתָֽם׃
NAS: him; male and female He created them.
KJV: and female created he them.
INT: male and female created

Genesis 2:3
HEB: מְלַאכְתּ֔וֹ אֲשֶׁר־ בָּרָ֥א אֱלֹהִ֖ים לַעֲשֽׂוֹת׃
NAS: which God had created and made.
KJV: which God created and made.
INT: his work which had created God and made

Genesis 2:4
HEB: הַשָּׁמַ֛יִם וְהָאָ֖רֶץ בְּהִבָּֽרְאָ֑ם בְּי֗וֹם עֲשׂ֛וֹת
NAS: and the earth when they were created, in the day
KJV: and of the earth when they were created, in the day
INT: of the heavens and the earth were created the day made

Genesis 5:1
HEB: אָדָ֑ם בְּי֗וֹם בְּרֹ֤א אֱלֹהִים֙ אָדָ֔ם
NAS: when God created man,
KJV: that God created man,
INT: of Adam the day created God man

Genesis 5:2
HEB: זָכָ֥ר וּנְקֵבָ֖ה בְּרָאָ֑ם וַיְבָ֣רֶךְ אֹתָ֗ם
NAS: He created them male and female,
KJV: and female created he them; and blessed
INT: male and female created blessed and called

Genesis 5:2
HEB: אָדָ֔ם בְּי֖וֹם הִבָּֽרְאָֽם׃ ס
NAS: in the day when they were created.
KJV: in the day when they were created.
INT: Man the day were created

Genesis 6:7
HEB: הָאָדָ֤ם אֲשֶׁר־ בָּרָ֙אתִי֙ מֵעַל֙ פְּנֵ֣י
NAS: whom I have created from the face
KJV: man whom I have created from the face
INT: man whom have created from the face

Exodus 34:10
HEB: אֲשֶׁ֛ר לֹֽא־ נִבְרְא֥וּ בְכָל־ הָאָ֖רֶץ
NAS: which have not been produced in all
KJV: marvels, such as have not been done in all the earth,
INT: which nor been produced all the earth

Numbers 16:30
HEB: וְאִם־ בְּרִיאָ֞ה יִבְרָ֣א יְהוָ֗ה וּפָצְתָ֨ה
NAS: the LORD brings about an entirely new thing
KJV: But if the LORD make a new thing,
INT: if an entirely brings the LORD opens

Deuteronomy 4:32
HEB: הַיּוֹם֙ אֲשֶׁר֩ בָּרָ֨א אֱלֹהִ֤ים ׀ אָדָם֙
NAS: that God created man
KJV: that God created man
INT: the day which created God man

Joshua 17:15
HEB: לְךָ֣ הַיַּ֔עְרָה וּבֵרֵאתָ֤ לְךָ֙ שָׁ֔ם
NAS: up to the forest and clear a place for yourself there
KJV: to the wood [country], and cut down for thyself there in the land
INT: go to the forest and clear there the land

Joshua 17:18
HEB: יַ֣עַר ה֔וּא וּבֵ֣רֵאת֔וֹ וְהָיָ֥ה לְךָ֖
NAS: shall be yours. For though it is a forest, you shall clear it, and to its farthest borders
KJV: shall be thine; for it [is] a wood, and thou shalt cut it down: and the outgoings
INT: forest you shall clear become farthest

1 Samuel 2:29
HEB: בָּנֶ֙יךָ֙ מִמֶּ֔נִּי לְהַבְרִֽיאֲכֶ֗ם מֵרֵאשִׁ֛ית כָּל־
NAS: above Me, by making yourselves fat with the choicest
KJV: thy sons above me, to make yourselves fat with the chiefest
INT: your sons above making the choicest of every


You might be able to agree that you wouldn't use the same word for INSTANT
creation as you would for changing something or altering it. I don't know if you can stretch that far though.
 
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PrincetonGuy

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The evolutionary tale is fabricated to remove God from the picture.

This claim is maliciously false. The theory of evolution is supported by massive amounts of data—indeed, such massive amounts of data that the theory has not been challenged in recent years by anyone who is familiar with the theory. However, it is very frequently challenged by persons who lack so much as a high school education in biology, and by persons who have very strong but poorly grounded religious beliefs.

Science and religion are two very different disciplines that do not intersect. Therefore, science could not care less about the teachings of religion. However, individual evolutionists and other scientists may have religious beliefs, and among evolutionists, we find Christians, Jews, Muslims, Buddhists, Hindus, and Taoists, as well as persons with indigenous and ethnic beliefs.

Even in the "theory" of evolution, they totally skip the whole part of where life came from. They ignore this simple and necessary step. Ask them. Where did the first cell get "life". They will tell you that that is not in the theory. They just come in when it's already alive, can replicate, and through some miracle has DNA ( a blue print with enough information to fill volumes of text books. Made up of strands of complex combinations of Proteins. Proteins which are on and of their own, also, complex chemical structures necessary for the building of any living thing. )


Even a single cell simple being has extremely complex DNA and RNA. It would have cytoplasm, mitochondria, ribosomes, a cell membrane that is smart enough to allow things that are good in and waste out. In itself, this single cell being would be a mathematically impossible structure to have formed spontaneously. Darwin had no idea of the complexity of each and every cell, on its own, let alone the immense amount of information stored in DNA and the complexity of DNA.


But... jump over that and dive right in to what happened after this totally impossible event took place.

Anti-evolution teaching is not a mere distraction from the gospel—it has caused tens of millions of our young people to come to the conclusion that Christians are both ignorant and foolish. However, this conclusion is false! See for example the 636-page commentary on the Hebrew text of Genesis 1-11 by Claus Westermann. Additional notable examples are abundant in the writing of Christians in a very wide spectrum of disciplines—including the life and earth sciences. Unfortunately, however, antievolutionists talk so loudly that they tend to drown out the genuine Christian scholars.
 
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PrincetonGuy

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It's not irrelevant as it shows where sin came from and what it caused -death.
If sin caused death then death was not simply a by product of life going on for millions of years of evolution either. It shows death as a foreigner, an enemy that came in due to sin.
It is also reaffirmed by scripture that it was one man that caused it not all of mankind.
Romans 5:12 Therefore, just as sin entered the world through one man, and death through sin, and in this way death came to all people, because all sinned—

So is death just a normal by product of life or is it the direct result of sin? This is an important distinction.

And don't say it simply means spiritual death, Adam and Eve were told they would literally die as well.
17 To Adam he said, “Because you listened to your wife and ate fruit from the tree about which I commanded you, ‘You must not eat from it,’

“Cursed is the ground because of you;
through painful toil you will eat food from it
all the days of your life.
18 It will produce thorns and thistles for you,
and you will eat the plants of the field.
19 By the sweat of your brow
you will eat your food
until you return to the ground,
since from it you were taken;
for dust you are
and to dust you will return.”

This happened because he listen to his wife and was disobedient to God.

This post assumes that the first eleven chapters of Genesis are an accurate account of historic events—an assumption that has been proven incorrect! However, a few notes on Romans 5:12-14 are in order.

5:12. Therefore, just as sin came into the world through one man, and death came through sin, and so death spread to all because all have sinned—
13. sin was indeed in the world before the law, but sin is not reckoned when there is no law.
14. Yet death exercised dominion from Adam to Moses, even over those whose sins were not like the transgression of Adam, who is a type of the one who was to come. (NRSV)

Having written in chapter three that we have all sinned, Paul here deals with the handful of Jews, who like him, were blameless under the law,

Philippians 3:4. even though I, too, have reason for confidence in the flesh.
If anyone else has reason to be confident in the flesh, I have more:
5. circumcised on the eighth day, a member of the people of Israel, of the tribe of Benjamin, a Hebrew born of Hebrews; as to the law, a Pharisee;
6. as to zeal, a persecutor of the church; as to righteousness under the law, blameless.

To these Jews, Paul argues from Genesis that they sinned in Adam—the proof being that “death exercised dominion from Adam to Moses, even over those whose sins were not like the transgression of Adam” even though “sin is not reckoned when there is no law.” However, Paul’s use of Genesis in his argument does in no way prove that the first eleven chapters of Genesis are an accurate account of historic events. Paul, according to his own testimony, was “circumcised on the eighth day, a member of the people of Israel, of the tribe of Benjamin, a Hebrew born of Hebrews; as to the law, a Pharisee. Therefore, he would have mistakenly believed Gen. 1:6-9,

6. And God said, “Let there be a dome in the midst of the waters, and let it separate the waters from the waters.”
7. So God made the dome and separated the waters that were under the dome from the waters that were above the dome. And it was so.
8. God called the dome Sky. And there was evening and there was morning, the second day. NRSV)

6. Then God said, “Let there be a dome in the middle of the waters, to separate one body of water from the other.” And so it happened:
7. God made the dome, and it separated the water above the dome from the water below it.
8. God called the dome “the sky.” Evening came, and morning followed-the second day.(NAB)

6 God said, “Let there be a dome in the middle of the waters to separate the waters from each other.” 7 God made the dome and separated the waters under the dome from the waters above the dome. And it happened in that way. 8 God named the dome Sky.

There was evening and there was morning: the second day. (CEB)

6. dixit quoque Deus fiat firmamentum in medio aquarum et dividat aquas ab aquis
7. et fecit Deus firmamentum divisitque aquas quae erant sub firmamento ab his quae erant super firmamentum et factum est ita
8. vocavitque Deus firmamentum caelum et factum est vespere et mane dies secundus
(Latin Vulgagte)

6 And God seide, The firmament be maad in the myddis of watris, and departe watrisfro watris.
7And God made the firmament, and departide the watristhat weren vndurthe firmament fro these watris that weren on the firmament; and it was don so.
8 And God clepide the firmament, heuene. And the euentid and morwetid was maad, the secounde dai. (Wycliffe Bible)

Gen. 1:6. And God said, Let there be a firmament in the midst of the waters, and let it divide the waters from the waters.
7. And God made the firmament, and divided the waters which were under the firmament from the waters which were above the firmament: and it was so.
8. And God called the firmament Heaven. And the evening and the morning were the second day. (KJV)

This word firmament comes to us from the Latin word firmamentum which literally express the concept “that which strengthens or supports”. In Genesis 1:6-8, the word expresses the concept of the strong, solid dome that supported the water above the dome. Few people today correctly understand the word firmament as it is used in the KJV, but mistakenly believe that it means the “atmosphere.”

The ancient Hebrew people believed that the earth was flat and covered with a solid dome with windows or floodgates in it through which the celestial floodwaters fell. (Gen. 7:11), and that incorrect cultural belief appears in the story of Noah’s Ark.
 
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andreha

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Hello everyone,

I'm assuming that this is the correct subforum in which to post this topic, but if not, forgive me. Basically, I've grown up in a home that believes in 100% biblical inerrancy and that's what I've believed, but recently I've been having a lot of doubts about creationism in particular. There are a few articles and websites that I have read that seem to completely and almost convincingly refute the idea of creationism. I'll link them below.

Ken Ham's 10 facts that prove creationism - Debunked

Evidence against a recent creation - RationalWiki

An Index to Creationist Claims

Falsifiability of creationism - RationalWiki

How am I, as a Christian, supposed to keep my belief in biblical inerrancy when there are all of these rebuttals that seemingly debunk creationism? Why can't creationists come up with good rebuttals to evolutionists' claims and rebuttals? If the creation story and the fall of man aren't true then is there no original sin by Adam? If there wasn't then why did God even have to send Christ to die for us, or did He? Was there even divine intervention in the universe's creation or formation? Is my faith just weak? I don't mean to cause controversy, I just really need some answers. I'm so tired of doubting my whole life. If these can't be answered, I'm afraid I may start to slip away to agnosticism. So, if anyone has answers, please share them.

Thank you!

I would encourage anyone (Including believers) to go check this site out. They have tons of scientific analysis that point to intelligent design. I find it truly fascinating:

http://reasons.org/
 
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JacksBratt

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Strong's Hebrew: 6213. עָשָׂה (asah) -- accomplish

Genesis 1:7
HEB: וַיַּ֣עַשׂ אֱלֹהִים֮ אֶת־
NAS: God made the expanse, and separated
KJV: And God made the firmament,
INT: made God the expanse

Genesis 1:11
HEB: עֵ֣ץ פְּרִ֞י עֹ֤שֶׂה פְּרִי֙ לְמִינ֔וֹ
NAS: on the earth bearing fruit
KJV: tree yielding fruit
INT: trees fruit bearing fruit their kind

Genesis 1:12
HEB: לְמִינֵ֔הוּ וְעֵ֧ץ עֹֽשֶׂה־ פְּרִ֛י אֲשֶׁ֥ר
NAS: and trees bearing fruit
KJV: and the tree yielding fruit,
INT: their kind and trees bearing fruit with

Genesis 1:16
HEB: וַיַּ֣עַשׂ אֱלֹהִ֔ים אֶת־
NAS: God made the two great
KJV: and it was so.And God made two great
INT: made God the two

Genesis 1:25
HEB: וַיַּ֣עַשׂ אֱלֹהִים֩ אֶת־
NAS: God made the beasts of the earth
KJV: And God made the beast
INT: made God the beast

Genesis 1:26
HEB: וַיֹּ֣אמֶר אֱלֹהִ֔ים נַֽעֲשֶׂ֥ה אָדָ֛ם בְּצַלְמֵ֖נוּ
NAS: said, Let Us make man
KJV: said, Let us make man
INT: said God make man our image

Genesis 1:31
HEB: כָּל־ אֲשֶׁ֣ר עָשָׂ֔ה וְהִנֵּה־ ט֖וֹב
NAS: all that He had made, and behold,
KJV: every thing that he had made, and, behold, [it was] very
INT: all that had made and behold good

Genesis 2:2
HEB: מְלַאכְתּ֖וֹ אֲשֶׁ֣ר עָשָׂ֑ה וַיִּשְׁבֹּת֙ בַּיּ֣וֹם
NAS: which He had done, and He rested
KJV: his work which he had made; and he rested
INT: his work which had done rested day

Genesis 2:2
HEB: מְלַאכְתּ֖וֹ אֲשֶׁ֥ר עָשָֽׂה׃
NAS: His work which He had done.
KJV: from all his work which he had made.
INT: his work which had done

Genesis 2:3
HEB: בָּרָ֥א אֱלֹהִ֖ים לַעֲשֽׂוֹת׃ פ
NAS: God had created and made.
KJV: which God created and made.
INT: had created God and made

Genesis 2:4
HEB: בְּהִבָּֽרְאָ֑ם בְּי֗וֹם עֲשׂ֛וֹת יְהוָ֥ה אֱלֹהִ֖ים
NAS: God made earth
KJV: God made the earth
INT: were created the day made the LORD God

Genesis 2:18
HEB: הָֽאָדָ֖ם לְבַדּ֑וֹ אֶֽעֱשֶׂהּ־ לּ֥וֹ עֵ֖זֶר
NAS: to be alone; I will make him a helper
KJV: should be alone; I will make him an help meet
INT: the man to be alone will make A helper suitable

Genesis 3:1
HEB: הַשָּׂדֶ֔ה אֲשֶׁ֥ר עָשָׂ֖ה יְהוָ֣ה אֱלֹהִ֑ים
NAS: God had made. And he said
KJV: God had made. And he said
INT: of the field which had made the LORD God

Genesis 3:7
HEB: עֲלֵ֣ה תְאֵנָ֔ה וַיַּעֲשׂ֥וּ לָהֶ֖ם חֲגֹרֹֽת׃
NAS: together and made themselves
KJV: together, and made themselves aprons.
INT: leaves fig and made loin

Genesis 3:13
HEB: מַה־ זֹּ֣את עָשִׂ֑ית וַתֹּ֙אמֶר֙ הָֽאִשָּׁ֔ה
NAS: is this you have done? And the woman
KJV: unto the woman, What [is] this [that] thou hast done? And the woman
INT: What hast done said to the woman

Genesis 3:14
HEB: הַנָּחָשׁ֮ כִּ֣י עָשִׂ֣יתָ זֹּאת֒ אָר֤וּר
NAS: Because you have done this,
KJV: Because thou hast done this, thou [art] cursed
INT: the serpent Because have done likewise Cursed

Genesis 3:21
HEB: וַיַּעַשׂ֩ יְהוָ֨ה אֱלֹהִ֜ים
NAS: The LORD God made garments of skin
KJV: did the LORD God make coats of skins,
INT: made the LORD God

Genesis 4:10
HEB: וַיֹּ֖אמֶר מֶ֣ה עָשִׂ֑יתָ ק֚וֹל דְּמֵ֣י
NAS: What have you done? The voice
KJV: What hast thou done? the voice
INT: said What done the voice blood

Genesis 5:1
HEB: בִּדְמ֥וּת אֱלֹהִ֖ים עָשָׂ֥ה אֹתֽוֹ׃
NAS: man, He made him in the likeness
KJV: in the likeness of God made he him;
INT: the likeness of God made

Genesis 6:6
HEB: יְהוָ֔ה כִּֽי־ עָשָׂ֥ה אֶת־ הָֽאָדָ֖ם
NAS: was sorry that He had made man
KJV: the LORD that he had made man
INT: the LORD for had made man the earth

Genesis 6:7
HEB: נִחַ֖מְתִּי כִּ֥י עֲשִׂיתִֽם׃
NAS: for I am sorry that I have made them.
KJV: for it repenteth me that I have made them.
INT: I am for have made

Genesis 6:14
HEB: עֲשֵׂ֤ה לְךָ֙ תֵּבַ֣ת
NAS: Make for yourself an ark of gopher
KJV: Make thee an ark of gopher
INT: Make an ark wood

Genesis 6:14
HEB: גֹ֔פֶר קִנִּ֖ים תַּֽעֲשֶׂ֣ה אֶת־ הַתֵּבָ֑ה
NAS: wood; you shall make the ark
KJV: rooms shalt thou make in
INT: of gopher rooms shall make in the ark

Genesis 6:15
HEB: וְזֶ֕ה אֲשֶׁ֥ר תַּֽעֲשֶׂ֖ה אֹתָ֑הּ שְׁלֹ֧שׁ
NAS: is how you shall make it: the length
KJV: And this [is the fashion] which thou shalt make it [of]: The length
INT: This is how shall make three hundred

Genesis 6:16
HEB: צֹ֣הַר ׀ תַּעֲשֶׂ֣ה לַתֵּבָ֗ה וְאֶל־
NAS: You shall make a window for the ark,
KJV: A window shalt thou make to the ark,
INT: A window shall make the ark to
Sorry. Can you show me where it says that "nothing was made instantly"?

All I come up with is:

And God said, and there was.

Seems like there was a lot made in that six day period. All by God "saying" followed by "and it was".

Sure, the ark took 100 years and Abraham's life was long before Issac came along.

However, to state that the bible says that "nothing was made instantly"..... Hard thing to find scripture that states that.
 
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JacksBratt

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This post assumes that the first eleven chapters of Genesis are an accurate account of historic events—an assumption that has been proven incorrect! However, a few notes on Romans 5:12-14 are in order.

5:12. Therefore, just as sin came into the world through one man, and death came through sin, and so death spread to all because all have sinned—
13. sin was indeed in the world before the law, but sin is not reckoned when there is no law.
14. Yet death exercised dominion from Adam to Moses, even over those whose sins were not like the transgression of Adam, who is a type of the one who was to come. (NRSV)

Having written in chapter three that we have all sinned, Paul here deals with the handful of Jews, who like him, were blameless under the law,

Philippians 3:4. even though I, too, have reason for confidence in the flesh.
If anyone else has reason to be confident in the flesh, I have more:
5. circumcised on the eighth day, a member of the people of Israel, of the tribe of Benjamin, a Hebrew born of Hebrews; as to the law, a Pharisee;
6. as to zeal, a persecutor of the church; as to righteousness under the law, blameless.

To these Jews, Paul argues from Genesis that they sinned in Adam—the proof being that “death exercised dominion from Adam to Moses, even over those whose sins were not like the transgression of Adam” even though “sin is not reckoned when there is no law.” However, Paul’s use of Genesis in his argument does in no way prove that the first eleven chapters of Genesis are an accurate account of historic events. Paul, according to his own testimony, was “circumcised on the eighth day, a member of the people of Israel, of the tribe of Benjamin, a Hebrew born of Hebrews; as to the law, a Pharisee. Therefore, he would have mistakenly believed Gen. 1:6-9,

6. And God said, “Let there be a dome in the midst of the waters, and let it separate the waters from the waters.”
7. So God made the dome and separated the waters that were under the dome from the waters that were above the dome. And it was so.
8. God called the dome Sky. And there was evening and there was morning, the second day. NRSV)

6. Then God said, “Let there be a dome in the middle of the waters, to separate one body of water from the other.” And so it happened:
7. God made the dome, and it separated the water above the dome from the water below it.
8. God called the dome “the sky.” Evening came, and morning followed-the second day.(NAB)

6 God said, “Let there be a dome in the middle of the waters to separate the waters from each other.” 7 God made the dome and separated the waters under the dome from the waters above the dome. And it happened in that way. 8 God named the dome Sky.

There was evening and there was morning: the second day. (CEB)

6. dixit quoque Deus fiat firmamentum in medio aquarum et dividat aquas ab aquis
7. et fecit Deus firmamentum divisitque aquas quae erant sub firmamento ab his quae erant super firmamentum et factum est ita
8. vocavitque Deus firmamentum caelum et factum est vespere et mane dies secundus
(Latin Vulgagte)

6 And God seide, The firmament be maad in the myddis of watris, and departe watrisfro watris.
7And God made the firmament, and departide the watristhat weren vndurthe firmament fro these watris that weren on the firmament; and it was don so.
8 And God clepide the firmament, heuene. And the euentid and morwetid was maad, the secounde dai. (Wycliffe Bible)

Gen. 1:6. And God said, Let there be a firmament in the midst of the waters, and let it divide the waters from the waters.
7. And God made the firmament, and divided the waters which were under the firmament from the waters which were above the firmament: and it was so.
8. And God called the firmament Heaven. And the evening and the morning were the second day. (KJV)

This word firmament comes to us from the Latin word firmamentum which literally express the concept “that which strengthens or supports”. In Genesis 1:6-8, the word expresses the concept of the strong, solid dome that supported the water above the dome. Few people today correctly understand the word firmament as it is used in the KJV, but mistakenly believe that it means the “atmosphere.”

The ancient Hebrew people believed that the earth was flat and covered with a solid dome with windows or floodgates in it through which the celestial floodwaters fell. (Gen. 7:11), and that incorrect cultural belief appears in the story of Noah’s Ark.
I have argued many times with "theistic" evolutionists and other atheist folk.

I have come to the conclusion that neither of us is going to change the others mind.

So, no sense wearing out our keyboards as we are both set in our beliefs.
 
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zoidar

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Hello everyone,

I'm assuming that this is the correct subforum in which to post this topic, but if not, forgive me. Basically, I've grown up in a home that believes in 100% biblical inerrancy and that's what I've believed, but recently I've been having a lot of doubts about creationism in particular. There are a few articles and websites that I have read that seem to completely and almost convincingly refute the idea of creationism. I'll link them below.

Ken Ham's 10 facts that prove creationism - Debunked

Evidence against a recent creation - RationalWiki

An Index to Creationist Claims

Falsifiability of creationism - RationalWiki

How am I, as a Christian, supposed to keep my belief in biblical inerrancy when there are all of these rebuttals that seemingly debunk creationism? Why can't creationists come up with good rebuttals to evolutionists' claims and rebuttals? If the creation story and the fall of man aren't true then is there no original sin by Adam? If there wasn't then why did God even have to send Christ to die for us, or did He? Was there even divine intervention in the universe's creation or formation? Is my faith just weak? I don't mean to cause controversy, I just really need some answers. I'm so tired of doubting my whole life. If these can't be answered, I'm afraid I may start to slip away to agnosticism. So, if anyone has answers, please share them.

Thank you!

I like to ask you, if evolution is true, what is it in that that would lead you towards agnosticism? I mean there a plenty of genuine Christians believing in evolution.

Is it that you take every story in the Bible to be 100% historically and literally accurate? And if one thing is not literally correct, everything has to be put to question? Myself for an example am quite confident with seeing the purpose of the story of creation, rather than it has to be historically correct in each detail.

The fall of man absolutely happened. If the story of Adam and Eve has a more spiritual meaning than literal, then it's still true, isn't it?
 
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SkyWriting

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Sorry. Can you show me where it says that "nothing was made instantly"?

I'm not going to poke you in the eye at your demand.

Sorry. Can you show me where it says that "nothing was made instantly"?

All I come up with is:

And God said, and there was.

Seems like there was a lot made in that six day period. All by God "saying" followed by "and it was".

Sure, the ark took 100 years and Abraham's life was long before Issac came along.

However, to state that the bible says that "nothing was made instantly"..... Hard thing to find scripture that states that.


Well it does do that, about 22 times.
SkyWriting said:


And here:
Joshua 17:15
HEB: לְךָ֣ הַיַּ֔עְרָה וּבֵרֵאתָ֤ לְךָ֙ שָׁ֔ם
NAS: up to the forest and clear a place for yourself there
KJV: to the wood [country], and cut down for thyself there in the land
INT: go to the forest and clear there the land

Joshua 17:18
HEB: יַ֣עַר ה֔וּא וּבֵ֣רֵאת֔וֹ וְהָיָ֥ה לְךָ֖
NAS: shall be yours. For though it is a forest, you shall clear it, and to its farthest borders
KJV: shall be thine; for it [is] a wood, and thou shalt cut it down: and the outgoings
INT: forest you shall clear become farthest

1 Samuel 2:29
HEB: בָּנֶ֙יךָ֙ מִמֶּ֔נִּי לְהַבְרִֽיאֲכֶ֗ם מֵרֵאשִׁ֛ית כָּל־
NAS: above Me, by making yourselves fat with the choicest
KJV: thy sons above me, to make yourselves fat with the chiefest
INT: your sons above making the choicest of every


Cut down what exists and Make fat what exists.

These could not be "poof!" by any stretch of the definition.
 
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JacksBratt

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I like to ask you, if evolution is true, what is it in that that would lead you towards agnosticism? I mean there a plenty of genuine Christians believing in evolution.

Is it that you take every story in the Bible to be 100% historically and literally accurate? And if one thing is not literally correct, everything has to be put to question? Myself for an example am quite confident with seeing the purpose of the story of creation, rather than it has to be historically correct in each detail.

The fall of man absolutely happened. If the story of Adam and Eve has a more spiritual meaning than literal, then it's still true, isn't it?
It amazed me, at one time, that people accept that Christ walked on water, turned water to very very good wine in a millisecond, healed a young girl from miles away, gave sight to blind men, healed a man who could not walk, a woman was healed by touching the frills of his robe, put a soldiers ear back on, died and rose again, floated up to heaven in plain sight.... All of which are scientifically impossible and super natural.

Yet, they will deny the fact that this same Jesus spoke the universe into existence in six days.

Until.....

Until I realized that these people MUST believe in the numerous miracles that were done by Christ, most importantly His death and resurrection... Because.... the eternal existence of their mortal soul depends on them. If that was not necessary, these same folks would deny these supernatural events as well.

IMO the bible is to be taken exactly as it is written. All of it is true. Creation, the flood of the entire earth, the burning bush, giants, the plagues of Egypt, the moon and sun standing still, the talking donkey, the floating axe head, the chariot of fire for Elijah, the crossing of the red sea, the three men in the fiery furnace, Daniel in the lions den, the life of Christ and the events that took place after His death.

There are things like "I am the door". Christ is the lamb. And others that are common sense to the reader given the context.

Do I believe that you are not saved if you don't believe the six days of creation? Absolutely not.. I just think that you are caught up in the "wisdom of man". However, God will make these who propose to be wise... out to be fools.
 
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coffee4u

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This post assumes that the first eleven chapters of Genesis are an accurate account of historic events

Yes it is-because God says so.

Exodus 20:11
For in six days the LORD made the heavens and the earth, the sea, and all that is in them, but he rested on the seventh day. Therefore the LORD blessed the Sabbath day and made it holy.


—an assumption that has been proven incorrect! However, a few notes on Romans 5:12-14 are in order.
Who by? By mankind? Mankind declares that God's word is incorrect so it must be?
You are putting a lot of faith into mankind.

5:12. Therefore, just as sin came into the world through one man, and death came through sin, and so death spread to all because all have sinned—
13. sin was indeed in the world before the law, but sin is not reckoned when there is no law.
14. Yet death exercised dominion from Adam to Moses, even over those whose sins were not like the transgression of Adam, who is a type of the one who was to come. (NRSV)

Having written in chapter three that we have all sinned, Paul here deals with the handful of Jews, who like him, were blameless under the law,

Philippians 3:4. even though I, too, have reason for confidence in the flesh.
If anyone else has reason to be confident in the flesh, I have more:
5. circumcised on the eighth day, a member of the people of Israel, of the tribe of Benjamin, a Hebrew born of Hebrews; as to the law, a Pharisee;
6. as to zeal, a persecutor of the church; as to righteousness under the law, blameless.

To these Jews, Paul argues from Genesis that they sinned in Adam—the proof being that “death exercised dominion from Adam to Moses, even over those whose sins were not like the transgression of Adam” even though “sin is not reckoned when there is no law.” However, Paul’s use of Genesis in his argument does in no way prove that the first eleven chapters of Genesis are an accurate account of historic events. Paul, according to his own testimony, was “circumcised on the eighth day, a member of the people of Israel, of the tribe of Benjamin, a Hebrew born of Hebrews; as to the law, a Pharisee. Therefore, he would have mistakenly believed Gen. 1:6-9,

6. And God said, “Let there be a dome in the midst of the waters, and let it separate the waters from the waters.”
7. So God made the dome and separated the waters that were under the dome from the waters that were above the dome. And it was so.
8. God called the dome Sky. And there was evening and there was morning, the second day. NRSV)

6. Then God said, “Let there be a dome in the middle of the waters, to separate one body of water from the other.” And so it happened:
7. God made the dome, and it separated the water above the dome from the water below it.
8. God called the dome “the sky.” Evening came, and morning followed-the second day.(NAB)

6 God said, “Let there be a dome in the middle of the waters to separate the waters from each other.” 7 God made the dome and separated the waters under the dome from the waters above the dome. And it happened in that way. 8 God named the dome Sky.

There was evening and there was morning: the second day. (CEB)

6. dixit quoque Deus fiat firmamentum in medio aquarum et dividat aquas ab aquis
7. et fecit Deus firmamentum divisitque aquas quae erant sub firmamento ab his quae erant super firmamentum et factum est ita
8. vocavitque Deus firmamentum caelum et factum est vespere et mane dies secundus
(Latin Vulgagte)

6 And God seide, The firmament be maad in the myddis of watris, and departe watrisfro watris.
7And God made the firmament, and departide the watristhat weren vndurthe firmament fro these watris that weren on the firmament; and it was don so.
8 And God clepide the firmament, heuene. And the euentid and morwetid was maad, the secounde dai. (Wycliffe Bible)

Gen. 1:6. And God said, Let there be a firmament in the midst of the waters, and let it divide the waters from the waters.
7. And God made the firmament, and divided the waters which were under the firmament from the waters which were above the firmament: and it was so.
8. And God called the firmament Heaven. And the evening and the morning were the second day. (KJV)

This word firmament comes to us from the Latin word firmamentum which literally express the concept “that which strengthens or supports”. In Genesis 1:6-8, the word expresses the concept of the strong, solid dome that supported the water above the dome. Few people today correctly understand the word firmament as it is used in the KJV, but mistakenly believe that it means the “atmosphere.”

The ancient Hebrew people believed that the earth was flat and covered with a solid dome with windows or floodgates in it through which the celestial floodwaters fell. (Gen. 7:11), and that incorrect cultural belief appears in the story of Noah’s Ark.

Unsure what you are trying to prove here.

It doesn't matter what the ancient Hebrews believed, their misunderstanding has nothing to do with God said. They were again simply men with limited understanding. Doesn't matter if the man came from the days of Noah or is a modern noble piece prize scientist-they are only men.
So we are back to God or man's word? Which do we trust?

When God gave the ancients laws to do with hygiene and quarantine, do you think they understood germ theory? Not at all.
Did it matter? No.
Gods word isn't contingent on humans understanding. What was importance was trust and obedience. You can see that again and again all through scripture.

The firmament went all around the earth and is where much of the water at the flood came from. It shielded the ancient earth from radiation and other elements coming in.
Again the Bible does not teach a flat earth nor does it teach a spherical earth. If the ancients understood it to be flat is on them. Again there understanding does not affect God. Neither does our understanding.

Faith in men or faith in God is your choice.
 
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anna ~ grace

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Hello everyone,

I'm assuming that this is the correct subforum in which to post this topic, but if not, forgive me. Basically, I've grown up in a home that believes in 100% biblical inerrancy and that's what I've believed, but recently I've been having a lot of doubts about creationism in particular. There are a few articles and websites that I have read that seem to completely and almost convincingly refute the idea of creationism. I'll link them below.

Ken Ham's 10 facts that prove creationism - Debunked

Evidence against a recent creation - RationalWiki

An Index to Creationist Claims

Falsifiability of creationism - RationalWiki

How am I, as a Christian, supposed to keep my belief in biblical inerrancy when there are all of these rebuttals that seemingly debunk creationism? Why can't creationists come up with good rebuttals to evolutionists' claims and rebuttals? If the creation story and the fall of man aren't true then is there no original sin by Adam? If there wasn't then why did God even have to send Christ to die for us, or did He? Was there even divine intervention in the universe's creation or formation? Is my faith just weak? I don't mean to cause controversy, I just really need some answers. I'm so tired of doubting my whole life. If these can't be answered, I'm afraid I may start to slip away to agnosticism. So, if anyone has answers, please share them.

Thank you!
The created world is proof of Creationism. :clap:
 
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SkyWriting

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Sorry. Can you show me where it says that "nothing was made instantly"?

Very simply. A word that describes some being made instantly would be a far different word from something being refashioned. Yet you insist that the word for cutting down trees could be the same word as Ex Nihilo. The two ideas are light years apart. Therefore Ex Nihilo creation does not exist.

Here is more data to research:
What are the 4 types of miracles Jesus performed?
  • healing miracles. Jesus healed people who were sick or disabled.
  • exorcism. the act of freeing someone of demons.
  • Restoration of Life. there are three occasion in the gospel eyes Jesus raises people from the dead.
  • nature miracles. A miracle in which Jesus shows his power over nature.
The miracles of Jesus - complete list!
 
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SkyWriting

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It amazed me, at one time, that people accept that Christ walked on water, turned water to very very good wine in a millisecond, healed a young girl from miles away, gave sight to blind men, healed a man who could not walk, a woman was healed by touching the frills of his robe, put a soldiers ear back on, died and rose again, floated up to heaven in plain sight.... All of which are scientifically impossible and super natural.

Yet, they will deny the fact that this same Jesus spoke the universe into existence in six days.

No need to deny it. It's not even listed.
The miracles of Jesus - complete list!
THE MIRACLES OF JESUS CHRIST
list of jesus miracles of creation - Google Search

Also not listed: Jesus blinding Paul.
 
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PrincetonGuy

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I would encourage anyone (Including believers) to go check this site out. They have tons of scientific analysis that point to intelligent design. I find it truly fascinating:

http://reasons.org/
The intelligent design movement is flagrantly dishonest in its attempts to sneak, through the back door, religion into science. Moreover, rather than employing scientific analysis, it employs religious analysis and therefore comes to non-scientific conclusions regarding alleged intelligent design vs. evolution. Furthermore, it is obsessed with the theory of evolution to the point that it virtually ignores the Bible! Indeed, it totally ignores the application of critical analysis to understand and interpret the Bible. Therefore, it ignores textual variants in the ancient manuscripts, it ignores the study of the sources of the information in the Bible, it ignores the study of the composition of the Bible, it ignores the genres of literature in which the Bible is written, it ignores conflicting information regarding family relationships among the characters in the Bible, and it ignores conflicting information regarding quantities and amounts of people and materials specified in the Bible—and it ignores what the Bible actually says and substitutes what it wishes the Bible did say.

There is no place for flagrant dishonesty among God’s people, and there is no place for the careless reading and teaching of the Bible among God’s people
 
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andreha

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Ahh, I see. I must admit, the stuff they write about the so called "Shallow carbon cycle and the deep carbon cycle" sounded rather convincing. But I'm no scientist, and my house is built on the rock, and not scientific sand.
 
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PrincetonGuy

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It amazed me, at one time, that people accept that Christ walked on water, turned water to very very good wine in a millisecond, healed a young girl from miles away, gave sight to blind men, healed a man who could not walk, a woman was healed by touching the frills of his robe, put a soldiers ear back on, died and rose again, floated up to heaven in plain sight.... All of which are scientifically impossible and super natural.


Yet, they will deny the fact that this same Jesus spoke the universe into existence in six days.


Until.....


Until I realized that these people MUST believe in the numerous miracles that were done by Christ, most importantly His death and resurrection... Because.... the eternal existence of their mortal soul depends on them. If that was not necessary, these same folks would deny these supernatural events as well.

Long before I read any academic literature on Genesis, I noticed in reading it that the first eleven chapters were written in a distinctly different genre of literature than the rest of Genesis. I then became curious and wondered who else had noticed that very important fact. Jump forward more than two decades, and I now have in my personal library 19 commentaries on Genesis, including the very best scholarly Jewish commentary, the three very best critical commentaries, and the two very best academic but non-critical commentaries.

Note: A critical commentary is a commentary that:
· Is based on the Greek, Hebrew, or Aramaic text.
· Was (preferably) published in the last 40 years or so.
· Has a large bibliography and footnotes.
· Often has a translation of the original text.
· Focuses on narrower areas of the text (such as a book or a few books that can be grouped together, such as the Johannine Epistles).
· Tends to have a significant portion of their text devoted to behind-the-text issues such as the composition of the book, history of interpretation, text-critical issues, etc. These issues can have their own chapter.
https://helpdesk.asburyseminary.edu/portal/en/kb/articles/critical-commentary-definition

The authors of all of these commentaries are very much aware of the change in genre and its significance for interpreting the first eleven chapters of Genesis. Indeed, Claus Westermann wrote a 636 page critical commentary on Genesis 1-11. But—in what genre of literature were these eleven chapters written? They were written in the same genre of literature as epic tales, sagas, myths, and legends, and they need to be interpreted taking this fact into careful and prayerful consideration.

There is nothing, absolutely nothing more important to me than the truth—and I am not too proud to sit at the feet of scholars whom God has blessed with a wealth of wisdom and knowledge to learn more accurately the truth.

Do I believe that you are not saved if you don't believe the six days of creation? Absolutely not.. I just think that you are caught up in the "wisdom of man". However, God will make these who propose to be wise... out to be fools.

Carefully and prayerfully studying the Bible in the languages in which God, in His infinite wisdom, chose to give it to us and humbly learning from others whom God has blessed with a wealth of wisdom and knowledge is NOT being “caught up in the "wisdom of man"—and it is not being caught up in shameful ignorance.
 
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Aussie Pete

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A story doesn't have to be a specific literal event.
It can be a generalized true event.
Like if we say a person is saved, we don't link that to our vision of
Jesus erasing our name in one book and writing it in another physical book.
I had a friend and mentor, now passed away. He was very sin conscious when he was first saved. He confessed his sins often, including those he'd already confessed. He had a vision one morning. God showed him the book of the record of his life. As God turned the pages, there were many blank areas. When my friend asked what it meant, God told him that his sins had been erased. I would not be too sure that there are no books in heaven.
 
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zoidar

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It amazed me, at one time, that people accept that Christ walked on water, turned water to very very good wine in a millisecond, healed a young girl from miles away, gave sight to blind men, healed a man who could not walk, a woman was healed by touching the frills of his robe, put a soldiers ear back on, died and rose again, floated up to heaven in plain sight.... All of which are scientifically impossible and super natural.

Yet, they will deny the fact that this same Jesus spoke the universe into existence in six days.

Until.....

Until I realized that these people MUST believe in the numerous miracles that were done by Christ, most importantly His death and resurrection... Because.... the eternal existence of their mortal soul depends on them. If that was not necessary, these same folks would deny these supernatural events as well.

IMO the bible is to be taken exactly as it is written. All of it is true. Creation, the flood of the entire earth, the burning bush, giants, the plagues of Egypt, the moon and sun standing still, the talking donkey, the floating axe head, the chariot of fire for Elijah, the crossing of the red sea, the three men in the fiery furnace, Daniel in the lions den, the life of Christ and the events that took place after His death.

There are things like "I am the door". Christ is the lamb. And others that are common sense to the reader given the context.

Do I believe that you are not saved if you don't believe the six days of creation? Absolutely not.. I just think that you are caught up in the "wisdom of man". However, God will make these who propose to be wise... out to be fools.

I think there is huge difference between NT which was written by witnesses of Jesus and OT stories where we don't know that much about the authors and how the books came to be. God used people with flaws to write the Bible, to get His message to us. Did Moses have the same knowledge of God and revelation as Paul and Peter? I doubt that.

It would be sad if the OP loses his faith over such a question as the validity of evolution, when he doesn't have to.
 
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