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Humans are unique, not evolved

Jonathan_Gale

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He's a police officer, reminding Congress what a domestic terrorist is. He directly experienced an attack by domestic terrorists.

He didn't say he hated the terrorists. He merely noted what they did, and that it fit the legal definition.

Are you claiming that Trump attacked the Capitol? The indictment merely notes that he encouraged it.
Are you a robot with no independent mind? So far you keep posting these propaganda and misinformations that have nothing to do with the OP. Again, I mentioned nothing about Trump, the Capitol, the indictment or any of those stuffs, why are you so obsessed with it and posting it?
 
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SeventhFisherofMen

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No, it's "missing lynx." And they found it:

As your fellow YE creationist Dr. Kurt Wise writes, the large number of hominid fossils is some of the "very good evidence for macroevolutionary theory." Would you like to see some of that?

Dr. Wise rebutted that belief by citing numerous examples of transitional series.

Evidences for Darwin’s second expectation — of stratomorphic intermediate species —include such species as Baragwanathia27 (between rhyniophytes and lycopods), Pikaia28 (between echinoderms and chordates), Purgatorius29 (between the tree shrews and the primates), and Proconsul30 (between the non-hominoid primates and the hominoids). Darwin’s third expectation — of higher-taxon stratomorphic intermediates — has been confirmed by such examples as the mammal-like reptile groups31 between the reptiles and the mammals, and the phenacodontids32 between the horses and their presumed ancestors. Darwin’s fourth expectation — of stratomorphic series — has been confirmed by such examples as the early bird series,33 the tetrapod series,34,35 the whale series,36 the various mammal series of the Cenozoic37 (for example, the horse series, the camel series, the elephant series, the pig series, the titanothere series, etc.), the Cantius and Plesiadapus primate series,38 and the hominid series.39 Evidence for not just one but for all three of the species level and above types of stratomorphic intermediates expected macroevolutionary theory is surely strong evidence for macroevolutionary theory. Creationists therefore need to accept this fact. It certain CANNOT be said that traditional creation theory expected (predicted) any of these fossil finds.
Dr. Kurt Wise Toward a Creationist Understanding of Transitional Forms

Even more convincing, there are no transitional forms were evolutionary theory does not predict them.



You've confused adaptation with evolution.
  • Your skin getting red in the shower is adaptation, but not evolution.
  • A mutation that happens to do nothing is evolution, but not adaptation.
  • A mutation that allows Tibetans to safely live at high altitudes is adaptation and evolution.
You might want to write this down for future reference.


If you did it would invalidate evolutionary theory. Evolution happens to populations, not individuals.


If there was, it would be peculiar, since humans evolved from other apes, not monkeys.
But there are dozens of transitional hominids between other apes and humans:
Here are some of the more important ones:
Honestly when I hear stories of experts finding missing links to species I can't help but remember the fraudulent account of the Piltdown Man , i mean after such a hoax in 1912 where people truly believed they had found a missing link between apes and men, why should i believe a possibly fraudulent claim that goes against what The Bible teaches as God creating all things.

I mean let's be honest, if i had to choose between what the Bible says and what some so called "expert" wrote online, i'm gonna go with The Bible on that one brosky.
 
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The Barbarian

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Honestly when I hear stories of experts finding missing links to species I can't help but remember the fraudulent account of the Piltdown Man ,
Yes, it caused a good deal of concern when it was found, because it was exactly the opposite of what evolutionary theory predicted. A large cranium with an apelike jaw was not expected. Evolutionary theory predicted a manlike body with a small cranium. So a lot of embarrassed scientists, until one evolutionist was able to show it was a fake. BTW, evolutionary theory correctly predicted the actual nature of hominid fossils. They have relatively manlike postcranial skeletons and small crania.

I mean let's be honest, if i had to choose between what the Bible says
The Bible just says God made living things, but doesn't provide the details. But many creationist organizations now admit that new species and even higher taxa come from other species. Would you like to see that?

If I have to choose between the evidence and something some guy added to the Bible, I'll go with the evidence.
 
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SeventhFisherofMen

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Yes, it caused a good deal of concern when it was found, because it was exactly the opposite of what evolutionary theory predicted. A large cranium with an apelike jaw was not expected. Evolutionary theory predicted a manlike body with a small cranium. So a lot of embarrassed scientists, until one evolutionist was able to show it was a fake. BTW, evolutionary theory correctly predicted the actual nature of hominid fossils. They have relatively manlike postcranial skeletons and small crania.


The Bible just says God made living things, but doesn't provide the details. But many creationist organizations now admit that new species and even higher taxa come from other species. Would you like to see that?

If I have to choose between the evidence and something some guy added to the Bible, I'll go with the evidence.
Genesis 1:25

"God made the wild animals according to their kinds, the livestock according to their kinds, and all the creatures that move along the ground according to their kinds. And God saw that it was good."

Btw he did this in 6 days. It doesn't say "well God didn't think people would know what he meant if He said 7,000,000 years so he just said 6 days."

It also doesn't say "God made this one organism and waited millions of years for it to evolve into Adam and Eve, and then waited millions of more years until the snake was evolved, AND THEN the original sin happened."

It just feels like people are trying to tell God how He made everything instead of let God tell us how He made everything.
 
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The Barbarian

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"God made the wild animals according to their kinds, the livestock according to their kinds, and all the creatures that move along the ground according to their kinds. And God saw that it was good."

Btw he did this in 6 days.
The text of Genesis makes it clear that the "yom" of the creation story are not literal 24-hour days. By definition there can be no literal mornings or evenings before there was a sun to have them.

Yes, God created living things. The point is, YE creationists don't like the way He did it.
 
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The Barbarian

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He's a police officer, reminding Congress what a domestic terrorist is. He directly experienced an attack by domestic terrorists.

He didn't say he hated the terrorists. He merely noted what they did, and that it fit the legal definition.

Are you claiming that Trump attacked the Capitol? The indictment merely notes that he encouraged it.

Are you a robot with no independent mind?
I'm just showing you the evidence. Are you telling me that the police are lying? Is there anyone you think isn't lying? Did you not see all the video taken by the insurgents themselves? Did you not hear their statements that Trump ordered them to attack the Capitol? Are they lying, too?

So far you keep posting all this propaganda and misinformation.

I mentioned nothing about Trump, the Capitol, the indictment or any of those stuffs, why are you so obsessed with it and posting it?
I'm just pointing out one major incident of domestic terrorism. As you see, the police correctly identified it as such. Here's why:

Domestic Terrorism for the FBI’s purposes is referenced in U.S. Code at 18 U.S.C. 2331(5),
and is defined as activities:
• Involving acts dangerous to human life that are a violation of the criminal laws of the United
States or of any State;
• Appearing to be intended to:
o Intimidate or coerce a civilian population;
o Influence the policy of government by intimidation or coercion; or
o Affect the conduct of a government by mass destruction, assassination or kidnapping;
and

• Occurring primarily within the territorial jurisdiction of the United States

There it is. And that's what happened.
 
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Jonathan_Gale

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I'm just showing you the evidence. Are you telling me that the police are lying? Is there anyone you think isn't lying? Did you not see all the video taken by the insurgents themselves? Did you not hear their statements that Trump ordered them to attack the Capitol? Are they lying, too?
I'm not here to watch any video, neither do I care about Trump or the so called insurrection three years ago, I'm here to talk about God, not Trump.

I'm just pointing out one major incident of domestic terrorism. As you see, the police correctly identified it as such. Here's why:
I'm not here to listen to any policeman, neither do I wanna receive any lecture on terrorism. I'm here to talk about God, not terrorism.
 
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SeventhFisherofMen

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The text of Genesis makes it clear that the "yom" of the creation story are not literal 24-hour days.
that's where you lost me. So even though time exists you're telling me there couldn't have been 12 hour time spans of day and night? Also God emits light, according to revelation 21:23

"And the city had no need of the sun, neither of the moon to shine in it; for the glory of God gave it light, and the Lamb is the light thereof."

So we can all agree that in the future there will be no need of the sun, but you're telling me the only reason you can't believe in it being a literal day is because you don't know where the light comes from if there hasn't been a sun made yet? So we made this whole idea of Evolution up so we feel better about understanding the creation story?

We should not lean so heavily on our own understanding when trying to read the Bible. For me if I don't understand something I just say "well I don't know about that, i guess i'll find out when i am in Heaven." I don't rewrite how God did something despite the Bible clearly saying how He did something.

We should lean on what the Bible actually says and not rewrite it to fit our narrative.
 
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The Barbarian

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that's where you lost me. So even though time exists you're telling me there couldn't have been 12 hour time spans of day and night?
I'm pointing out that by definition, "morning" and "evening" require a sun to have them. But the sun didn't exist the first day. So we know it's figurative.
"And the city had no need of the sun, neither of the moon to shine in it; for the glory of God gave it light, and the Lamb is the light thereof."
But no mornings or evenings. By definition.

So we can all agree that in the future there will be no need of the sun, but you're telling me the only reason you can't believe in it being a literal day
Not the only reason, but as early Christians like St. Augustine observed, it is absurd to speak of mornings and evenings without sun to have them.
So we made this whole idea of Evolution up so we feel better about understanding the creation story?
Evolution was just the observation of what happens. The creation story was considered to be figurative as the text itself shows us that it is.
We should not lean so heavily on our own understanding when trying to read the Bible.
Yes. Putting a reinterpretation of those days as literal 24-hour days is adding to scripture. We should lean on what the Bible actually says and not rewrite it to fit our narrative.
 
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SeventhFisherofMen

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I'm pointing out that by definition, "morning" and "evening" require a sun to have them. But the sun didn't exist the first day. So we know it's figurative.

But no mornings or evenings. By definition.


Not the only reason, but as early Christians like St. Augustine observed, it is absurd to speak of mornings and evenings without sun to have them.

Evolution was just the observation of what happens. The creation story was considered to be figurative as the text itself shows us that it is.

Yes. Putting a reinterpretation of those days as literal 24-hour days is adding to scripture. We should lean on what the Bible actually says and not rewrite it to fit our narrative.
it's not adding to scripture, it's just plain reading. What you're doing is adding. As far as early Christians go there were plenty of early Christians that thought the Earth was flat.

Idk man it sounds like you're trying really hard to convince me that evolution is a real thing, but i'll save you the work and let you know i'm not buyin ;)
 
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Jonathan_Gale

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Evolution was just the observation of what happens. The creation story was considered to be figurative as the text itself shows us that it is.
No, what happens in observation is adaptation and variation. Some call it "micro evolution", which is just a play of words, and it cannot be extrapolated to "macro evolution over millions of years". "Macro evolution" is a myth that contradicts modern scientific discoveries of genetics and epigenetics.
 
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SeventhFisherofMen

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No, what happens in observation is adaptation and variation. Some call it "micro evolution", which is just a play of words, and it cannot be extrapolated to "macro evolution over millions of years". "Macro evolution" is a myth that contradicts modern scientific discoveries of genetics and epigenetics.
If there is no narrative to explain away the literal description of the way God created the world, then there is no way people can question other aspects of the Bible as being true. BUT as I'm sure you may already know, if you can question how God created things and put our own narrative, then we can question other aspects of the Bible and other aspects of the Bible and put our own narrative on what it really means.

It's all a part of the constant attack on the validity of scripture. There's always people at work trying to invalidate the Bible, some try in Genesis some try in the Gospels and it's all the same as the first sin: "Did God really say_____?" And if we say "Yes God did say_____" then they respond "What God said will not take place"

Just stand firm in The truth in God's word, this helps to strengthen your faith more than anything else.
 
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Jonathan_Gale

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If there is no narrative to explain away the literal description of the way God created the world, then there is no way people can question other aspects of the Bible as being true. BUT as I'm sure you may already know, if you can question how God created things and put our own narrative, then we can question other aspects of the Bible and other aspects of the Bible and put our own narrative on what it really means.

It's all a part of the constant attack on the validity of scripture. There's always people at work trying to invalidate the Bible, some try in Genesis some try in the Gospels and it's all the same as the first sin: "Did God really say_____?" And if we say "Yes God did say_____" then they respond "What God said will not take place"

Just stand firm in The truth in God's word, this helps to strengthen your faith more than anything else.
This is just fulfillment of this particular portion of the Scripture. In western world the word of God is often rendered as foolishness or superstition, but "the foolishness of God is wiser than men". Contrary to popular belief and conventional wisdom, science is not a god, there's no absolute certainties, usually a "law of physics" is just a known and observable pattern of how things in nature behave, most of them are theories, and any of these theories in the textbook can be seriously challenged by new discoveries and evidence, especially in the fields of biogoly and genetics.

For the message of the cross is foolishness to those who are perishing, but to us who are being saved it is the power of God. For it is written:

“I will destroy the wisdom of the wise,
And bring to nothing the understanding of the prudent.”

Where is the wise? Where is the scribe? Where is the disputer of this age? Has not God made foolish the wisdom of this world? For since, in the wisdom of God, the world through wisdom did not know God, it pleased God through the foolishness of the message preached to save those who believe. For Jews request a sign, and Greeks seek after wisdom; but we preach Christ crucified, to the Jews a stumbling block and to the Greeks foolishness, but to those who are called, both Jews and Greeks, Christ the power of God and the wisdom of God. Because the foolishness of God is wiser than men, and the weakness of God is stronger than men.
(1 Cor. 1:16-25)
 
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SeventhFisherofMen

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This is just fulfillment of this particular portion of the Scripture. In western world the word of God is often rendered as foolishness or superstition, but "the foolishness of God is wiser than men". Contrary to popular belief and conventional wisdom, science is not a god, there's no absolute certainties, usually a "law of physics" is just a known and observable pattern of how things in nature behave, most of them are theories, and any of these theories in the textbook can be seriously challenged by new discoveries and evidence, especially in the fields of biogoly and genetics.

For the message of the cross is foolishness to those who are perishing, but to us who are being saved it is the power of God. For it is written:

“I will destroy the wisdom of the wise,
And bring to nothing the understanding of the prudent.”

Where is the wise? Where is the scribe? Where is the disputer of this age? Has not God made foolish the wisdom of this world? For since, in the wisdom of God, the world through wisdom did not know God, it pleased God through the foolishness of the message preached to save those who believe. For Jews request a sign, and Greeks seek after wisdom; but we preach Christ crucified, to the Jews a stumbling block and to the Greeks foolishness, but to those who are called, both Jews and Greeks, Christ the power of God and the wisdom of God. Because the foolishness of God is wiser than men, and the weakness of God is stronger than men.
(1 Cor. 1:16-25)
Thank you brother for the kind words. They are both strengthening and encouraging.
 
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The Barbarian

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it's not adding to scripture, it's just plain reading.
It's using the word in a new way to avoid the logical consequences.
As far as early Christians go there were plenty of early Christians that thought the Earth was flat.
No, several hundred years before Christ was born, people knew the Earth was round. Eratosthenes of Alexandria even accurately measured the circumference of the Earth. That's just a story people tell. Every educated person in the Roman world was well aware that the Earth is round.

Idk man it sounds like you're trying really hard to convince me that evolution is a real thing
We directly observe it happening. Can't get much more real than that. Perhaps you don't know what biological evolution is. What do you think it is?

but i'll save you the work and let you know i'm not buyin ;)
Doesn't matter. Other people see these discussions and make conclusions. You play an important role in that.
 
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The Barbarian

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Evolution was just the observation of what happens. The creation story was considered to be figurative as the text itself shows us that it is.

No, what happens in observation is adaptation and variation.
You're confusing adaptation and evolution.

Getting a sun tan is adaptation, but not evolution.
Having a neutral mutation is evolution, but not adaptation.
Having a mutation that makes one less likely to be infected with a disease is evolution and adaptation.

Does that help?

Some call it "micro evolution", which is just a play of words, and it cannot be extrapolated to "macro evolution over millions of years".
"Microevolution" is evolution in a population that does not produce a new species. "Macroevolution" is speciation. We see both happening. I think what you are thinking of is common descent of all living things on Earth. As your fellow YE creationist Dr. Kurt Wise admit, there is "very good evidence for macroevolutionary theory." Would you like to learn about some of it?
 
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BNR32FAN

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The life on Earth is so colorful, complex, interconnected and the mechanisms of various plant and animal bodies are so astonishing that its really hard to think its all some mechanistic coincidence. Some realities in nature are not easily explainable with unplanned small steps. Sure, the providence of God is visible in our universe, if one is open to see it.

It does not mean that the evolution as a process of creation is impossible.

We can clearly see that bodies changed significantly over time. There were no cows among dinosaurs. So, "all was created at once" is not scientifically possible. We are left with progressive creationism and theistic evolution. The latter makes more sense IMO.
We don’t see physical changes over time we just see different species, different variations of the same animals. We don’t see any specific animal going thru the process of becoming a different animal. We do see that some animals became extinct. And we can’t say that cows didn’t exist just because we haven’t found any.
 
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BNR32FAN

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Evolution was just the observation of what happens. The creation story was considered to be figurative as the text itself shows us that it is.
Where does the text show us that it is figurative?
 
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BNR32FAN

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Evolution was just the observation of what happens. The creation story was considered to be figurative as the text itself shows us that it is.


You're confusing adaptation and evolution.

Getting a sun tan is adaptation, but not evolution.
Having a neutral mutation is evolution, but not adaptation.
Having a mutation that makes one less likely to be infected with a disease is evolution and adaptation.

Does that help?


"Microevolution" is evolution in a population that does not produce a new species. "Macroevolution" is speciation. We see both happening. I think what you are thinking of is common descent of all living things on Earth. As your fellow YE creationist Dr. Kurt Wise admit, there is "very good evidence for macroevolutionary theory." Would you like to learn about some of it?
What are some examples of evidence supporting macroevolution?
 
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