How some creationists pushed me away from christianity

Non sequitur · Jul 22, 2011

selfinflikted said:
It really bugs me when people say to do this. I tried this for years, but nothing ever came of it.

I can offer the standard response:

You didn't really try* or try the right** way.

* "try" means believe that it was really, really, really real
** "right" means the bestest and most truest way.

David Evarts · Jul 22, 2011

Insane_Duck said:
FULFILLED PROPHECIES OF THE HOLY QURAN

This site says yes. There are many more so called "predictions" made by the bible, Qur'an, and most every holy book. The reason you disbelieve their prophecies is much the same reason why I disbelieve yours.

I've yet to find a "fulfilled" prophecy that can't be interpreted to mean many things and be fufilled by many very different things. I really wouldn't rely on "prophecy" as proof. I would, however note that truly succesful scientific theories have made predictions that could not be made based on other theories and that hsve been tested.

David Evarts · Jul 22, 2011

selfinflikted said:
It really bugs me when people say to do this. I tried this for years, but nothing ever came of it.

I feel you. It bugs me as well when people say things like this. It's like asking you to squint really hard and stare at the candle until it lights on fire.

AV1611VET · Jul 22, 2011

David Evarts said:
I've yet to find a "fulfilled" prophecy that can't be interpreted to mean many things and be fufilled by many very different things.

49

24

248

British Bulldog · Jul 22, 2011

David Evarts said:
I'd be curious about their experience. What questions did you ask?

What is this life business all about then? What's the big idea? Is there a plan? Are you out there somewhere? What are you DOING? Do you even exist? Come on, just give us a clue. Oh, and can I have a new cricket bat for Christmas please?

What answers were unfulfilling?

They weren't so much unfulfilling as non-existent. No answers were forthcoming. Nothing. Total silence. No one at home. And I didn't get a new cricket bat either.

What was the God you were seeking like?

A rational and reasonable adult. Who owns a sporting goods store and is close friends with Father Christmas.

Can you tell me more about your quest?

It failed. Now I'm older I know why it failed for me and I know why it worked for some other kids, and I'm quite pleased that I wasn't one of the unlucky ones. Only other atheists will know what I'm talking about.

Non sequitur · Jul 22, 2011

British Bulldog said:
They weren't so much unfulfilling as non-existent. No answers were forthcoming. Nothing. Total silence. No one at home. And I didn't get a new cricket bat either.

That's because his answer was "no"... or "not yet".

I'm not really sure...

selfinflikted · Jul 22, 2011

David Evarts said:
I feel you. It bugs me as well when people say things like this. It's like asking you to squint really hard and stare at the candle until it lights on fire.

Ha. Exactly.

Cabal · Jul 22, 2011

Non sequitur said:
That's because his answer was "no"... or "not yet".

I'm not really sure...

My milk jug answers all prayers with either "yes" "no" or "not yet".

Praise be etc.

selfinflikted · Jul 22, 2011

David Evarts said:
I'd be curious about their experience. What questions did you ask? What answers were unfulfilling? What was the God you were seeking like? Can you tell me more about your quest?

Best to you.

Well, I've answered these questions already (in this very thread, possibly, I can't remember and am too lazy to skim). But the short answers are:

David Evarts said:
What questions did you ask?

Not questions, per se. I wasn't playing with a Magic 8-Ball, I was supposed to be talking to god. Prayers were more like, "Lord, please fill me with the Holy Spirit and grant me understanding. Show me that you are moving in my life, and help guide me to do your will.." etc etc.

Oh, and also, "God, please make me straight."

David Evarts said:
What answers were unfulfilling?

That's just it - I never got answers, a sign, a feeling. Nothing.

David Evarts said:
What was the God you were seeking like?

I wouldn't know. A god never revealed itself. At. All.

David Evarts said:
Can you tell me more about your quest?

It would be a long and boring affair for everyone else. If you're really that interested, feel free to discuss that through PM.

Non sequitur · Jul 22, 2011

Cabal said:
My milk jug answers all prayers with either "yes" "no" or "not yet".

Praise be etc.

Mine too.

If I can be honest, in a strange way, it's almost like it doesn't really do anything and I could never really know if it did.

But that would be silly of me to say...

Oncedeceived · Jul 22, 2011

Davian said:
What other things do you accept without restrictions? Without using your intellect?

You misunderstand. What I mean is that you can't want to find God and then tell Him just how you will accept Him.

Tinker Grey · Jul 22, 2011

He doesn't know?

Non sequitur · Jul 22, 2011

Oncedeceived said:
You misunderstand. What I mean is that you can't want to find God and then tell Him just how you will accept Him.

I think by default, you have to do so in order to believe something.

Doveaman · Jul 22, 2011

Jazer said:
Actually Hubble showed that the universe is expanding.

No one can show the universe expanding. All they can do is interpret the light spectrum of distant objects. Hubble simply interpreted the light spectrum reaching his now outdated telescope. His interpretation has since been shown to be false by many other reputable scientists who are far more qualified than he was.

The theory goes back to In the 12th century, the exalted Kabbalist, Rabbi Moses Maimonides. Kabbalism is said to be a part of the oral traditions that goes back to Moses in the Bible. Their tradition was the universe started out the size of a mustard seed.

I agree the Big Bang is an oral tradition and not science.

Non sequitur · Jul 22, 2011

Doveaman said:
No one can show the universe expanding. All they can do is interpret the light spectrum of distant objects. Hubble simply interpreted the light spectrum reaching his now outdated telescope. His interpretation has since been shown to be false by many other reputable scientists who are far more qualified than he was.

The universe is expanding, based on the interpretation of the color shift in the spectra of all the galaxies as being the result of the Doppler effect and indicating that all galaxies are moving away from one another.

Doveaman said:
I agree the Big Bang is an oral tradition and not science.

*raises hand*

Oh, oh, oh!

I know what else is an oral tradition!

Pick, me! Pick me!

Split Rock · Jul 22, 2011

Doveaman said:
[/COLOR]I agree the Big Bang is an oral tradition and not science.

I agree that the Bible is an oral tradition and not God's Word.

Seriously... why don't you leave it to scientists to determine what is and is not science?

docpotter · Jul 22, 2011

Don't you put your trust in man when you go to the doctor or drive your vehicle?

Yes , I do , but when it comes to my salvation and the word of God , I do not . Now , there are a handful of bible teachers , and pastors I have found to be spot on over the years that I do trust.

I think their brain made them experience something or they were a nut case.

Now, here I would say you are hoping that is the case . You have maybe heard a scientist say that this is just the brain dying. I also have heard this. But lets remember these are men that fight God and creation tooth and nail, and feel that they have to explain everything from a non - God point of view. I would say to you do your own research on negative near death experiences. Its amazing how similar they are from people of different countries, ages, and walks of life.

Sending people to hell is not very nice

Would you, if you were God, send Adolf Hitler to hell, or let him have everlasting life for billions of years in paradise ?

I wonder why he cares whether or not I deny him because I never see or talk to him.

Paul says in Romans ( I believe , or Corinthians ) that God has shown every man his works in nature and in people, and we basically have no excuse to know he is there . We cannot see God of course, and that, I think, is his plan , how could we seek God, and have free will to chose him, if he appeared to us , and to everyone in the world ? He wants us to seek him. And when you do , you will find him . Its very hard to understand God , without knowing what he wants and doesnt want from us. I cannot stress enough how important it is to know the bible, and I have a long way to go, but I read some every day .

Oncedeceived · Jul 22, 2011

Tinker Grey said:
He doesn't know?

Indeed.

Doveaman · Jul 22, 2011

selfinflikted said:
Then what would you say to someone who pursued god for years and was left empty handed?

If you pursue god you will be left empty handed, but if you pursue God you will find Him.

"From one man He made every nation of men...God did this so that men would seek Him and perhaps reach out for Him and find Him, though He is not far from each one of us." (Acts 17:26-27).

Oncedeceived · Jul 22, 2011

Non sequitur said:
I think by default, you have to do so in order to believe something.

Very true. What we should do concerning God is to not limit ourselves by our own beliefs about God. What God is. What He should be. That sort of thing.

How some creationists pushed me away from christianity

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