How prayers are "answered" (and the effects thereof)

[truthshift]

The banana must die! Long live the banana.

I'm thoroughly confused! o.0

 

[jcook922]

Aye. We are freed from the ways of the old banana by the coming of the new banana, who overturned the old banana law and gave us new life in potassium-rich snack foods.

I am an orthodox Bananian, I reject your god for mine, HE really knew how to get things done. Raining cherries, whipped cream, and hot, scorching chocolate on ancient cities he did not approve of. Thus resulting in what we know as the Bananian Split, our favorite religious dish.

 

[truthshift]

I am an orthodox Bananian, I reject your god for mine, HE really knew how to get things done. Raining cherries, whipped cream, and hot, scorching chocolate on ancient cities he did not approve of. Thus resulting in what we know as the Bananian Split, our favorite religious dish.

As you can see; Banana still performs miracles to this day.

 

[Ryal Kane]

I am an orthodox Bananian, I reject your god for mine, HE really knew how to get things done. Raining cherries, whipped cream, and hot, scorching chocolate on ancient cities he did not approve of. Thus resulting in what we know as the Bananian Split, our favorite religious dish.

You know, in a strange way, that would make something like the destruction of Sodom and Gommorah more credible.
Being drowned in a rain of cherries and chocolate, that would take direct intervention from a deity, not something that can be explained by something natural like a volcano.

 

[truthshift]

You know, in a strange way, that would make something like the destruction of Sodom and Gommorah more credible.
Being drowned in a rain of cherries and chocolate, that would take direct intervention from a deity, not something that can be explained by something natural like a volcano.

Another great point.

 

[Garyzenuf]

...Thus resulting in what we know as the Bananian Split, our favorite religious dish.

Which also regrettably, led directly to the birth of the infamous "Reformed Bananain Church".

Boy, those liberal Bananains really brown my peel!

 

[Verv]

Well, to put it simply:

I do not believe God answers prayers in conventional senses and a lot of modern Christianity has been confused since many sects, especially the modern American sects of Christianity, have no real tradition to go off of and are theologically unsound in many parts.

Prayer is more about a meditation on God than on anything else.

We should also know to never pray for essentially anything that is material or superficial and in our prayers we should already recognize the notion that whatever is happening already is God's will and whatever will happen is His Will.

I think it is hard to understand that God might have a profound view of world events. Heavens forbid, even more profound than the individual atheist's shallow understanding.

 

[truthshift]

Well, to put it simply:

I do not believe God answers prayers in conventional senses and a lot of modern Christianity has been confused since many sects, especially the modern American sects of Christianity, have no real tradition to go off of and are theologically unsound in many parts.

Prayer is more about a meditation on God than on anything else.

We should also know to never pray for essentially anything that is material or superficial and in our prayers we should already recognize the notion that whatever is happening already is God's will and whatever will happen is His Will.

I think it is hard to understand that God might have a profound view of world events. Heavens forbid, even more profound than the individual atheist's shallow understanding.

1. So, of the 33,000 denominations that exist, yours is correct? Explain please

2. Explain how prayer is a meditation on God and how that is of any more benefit than praying specifically for something. I could meditate on Banana just as easily and achieve the same results.

3. If everything that is happening is already happening according to your gods will then you admit that there is no free will because you clearly can make no choice

4. "even more profound than the individual atheist's shallow understanding."

Are you to say that you, as a christian have a better understanding of your god? I was an active and fervent southern baptist for 19 years of my life; 13 counting from the day I confided that I would like to truly accept jesus into my heart. Explain how my understanding can be that much shallower than the likes of, say... yours. Do you claim to know what I know? Or, are you just trying to manipulate wording to discredit me?

 

[jcook922]

Which also regrettably, led directly to the birth of the infamous "Reformed Bananain Church".

Boy, those liberal Bananains really brown my peel!

Man, I think after connecting those dots I laughed so hard I almost snorted coffee onto my desk.

 

[Polycarp_fan]

According to beliefnet.com

God answers prayers in 1 of 5 ways:

1. No, I love you too much.
2. Yes, but wait.
3. Yes, but not how you expected.
4. Yes, and here is more.
5. Yes, I thought you'd never ask.
__________________________________

According to John Piper, in this video:

http://www.godtube.com/view_video.php?viewkey=716b02ec0da35256a998

God does not even answer all prayers.

It would appear that the Christian god has an answer for everything.

- When you pray for a chance to see your grandmother this summer, but you do not manage to raise the money for a plane ticket before school starts; God has clearly answered with "no"

-When you pray for a chance to go on a mission trip in Europe, but do not get the opportunity for 6 months; God has clearly said "yes, but wait."

-When you pray for a chance to witness to millions of poeple and you get into a crippling, near-fatal accident and become a Christian motivational speaker; God has clearly said "yes, but not how you expected"

-When you pray to be able to pay your bills on time and you recieve an inheritance and an alimony check within a week of your bills being due; God has clearly said "Yes, and here is more"

-When you pray for the ability to support your favorite charity/organization and you win the lottery; God has clearly said "yes, I thought you'd never ask."

-When you pray for anything and it does not happen; God has said "no" by not answering...(or "no, I love you too much" )

_____________


Well that's all good and well but look at MY god:

I pray to this banana. This banana answers all of my prayers. Well, sometimes it doesn't. But, that's ok. I am not this banana's master. This banana is MY master.

- When I prayed for a chance to see my grandmother this summer, but I did not manage to raise the money for a plane ticket before school started; Banana clearly answered with "no"

-When I prayed for a chance to go on a vacation trip in Europe, but did not get the opportunity for 6 months; Banana clearly said "yes, but wait."

-When I prayed for a chance to talk to millions of poeple and I got into a crippling, near-fatal accident and became a Banana motivational speaker; Banana clearly said "yes, but not how you expected"

-When I prayed to be able to pay my bills on time and I recieved an inheritance and an child support check within a week of my bills being due; Banana clearly said "Yes, and here is more"

-When I pray for the ability to support my favorite fruit company: Dole and I won the lottery; God clearly said "yes, I thought you'd never ask"

-When I pray for anything and it does not happen; Banana has said "no" by not answering


Surely, you can see my god answers all of my prayers. Why not pray to Banana? At least you can see Banana.

..or am I just insulting your intelligence by asking you to do that? What if I said you will be punished if you don't have faith in Banana? Surely, you can see that this is no joke.
____________________________________

Hmm, now what might be some effects of a society that believes that it's prayers will be answered in one way or another; no matter what?

1. A society that follows a rigid belief system through thick and thin, regardless of all rationality, because it's prayers are being answered 100%

2. A society that will not desire to seek truth because it has "already found it"

3. A society that spends an average of 45 minutes a day, 5.25 hours a week, 21 hours a month, 10.5 days a year unproductively/unrecreationally talking into space (regarding only personal prayer time)

In other words: a society that will do as the bible and it's authoritarians command it to do, because it honestly believes it is getting something in return.

Blahblahblahblahblahblahblah . . .atheism rote . . .blahblahblahblahblah.

How often is prayer answered in the Bible for the people mentioned in it?

 

[truthshift]

Blahblahblahblahblahblahblah . . .atheism rote . . .blahblahblahblahblah.

How often is prayer answered in the Bible for the people mentioned in it?

Plenty of times.

I'm basing my argument purely on what biblical authorities say. If someone brings an argument against you, do you think that it's actually effective or convincing to brush it off with "Blahblahblahblahblahblahblah . . .atheism rote . . .blahblahblahblahblah."

Don't you have some credible defense?

 

[selfinflikted]

PC_F,

I absolutely demand you take that quote of mine OUT of your signature. It's completely out of context, and you know it. If it is not removed, I will report it to the mods.

 

[Polycarp_fan]

Plenty of times.

I'm basing my argument purely on what biblical authorities say.

Who?

If someone brings an argument against you, do you think that it's actually effective or convincing to brush it off with "Blahblahblahblahblahblahblah . . .atheism rote . . .blahblahblahblahblah."

Rather, when I here queries of the atheist persuasion, I usually pass it off like a bad smell in a room full of polite people.

Don't you have some credible defense?

Just keeping my pearls where they'll not be trampled.

I'm not some Christian that sees "miracles" happneing in a world with so much sin and evil. Other than the miracle that a Christian cares about those that are non and anti Christians enough to die for them, I'm not expecting anything but natural reality. I see enough miracles happening there for me to know that God is a fact.

The Israelites (Now known as "Jews") have not had a Prophet in over two-thousand years. And who's to say that Jesus hasn't cured me of disease and afflictions already hundreds of times? A good parent takes care of thier children and never makes it known so many, many times.

I rest my confidence in Christ Jesus as God and the Creator on the evidence that can be seen and felt. Science is no bogey man to the Gospel and Apostolic witness.



-----Atheism just has no new concepts. Oh well. At least their nicer now, than back in the 20th century.

 

[truthshift]

Who?

John Piper and beliefnet.com Did you even read the OP?

Rather, when I here queries of the atheist persuasion, I usually pass it off like a bad smell in a room full of polite people.

That would be why you earn little respect from your peers that you could potentially convert if your arguments were dynamic and you reacted intelligently and rationally to cases made against your beliefs

Just keeping my pearls where they'll not be trampled.

I'm not some Christian that sees "miracles" happneing in a world with so much sin and evil.

So, you chose not to make a defense for fear that there would be a reaction to it? You actually consider your arguments akin to pearls?

What's this got to do with prayer anyhow? I had a thread on miracles a while back, post in that.

Other than the miracle that a Christian cares about those that are non and anti Christians enough to die for them, I'm not expecting anything but natural reality.

I'm sorry, what? ^

I see enough miracles happening there for me to know that God is a fact.

What miracles? If your "miracle" is nature itself, I'll reiterate; how does that prove your god?

The Israelites (Now known as "Jews") have not had a Prophet in over two-thousand years. And who's to say that Jesus hasn't cured me of disease and afflictions already hundreds of times? A good parent takes care of thier children and never makes it known so many, many times.

So, you attribute the existence of your god to the _LACK_ of any happening.

I rest my confidence in Christ Jesus as God and the Creator on the evidence that can be seen and felt. Science is no bogey man to the Gospel and Apostolic witness.

What evidence?

-----Atheism just has no new concepts. Oh well. At least their nicer now, than back in the 20th century.

New concepts in what time frame?

Christianity has changed, despite it's best efforts.

What does any of this have to do with it anyhow?

If the atheistic argument has not changed then, obviously it has not needed to. You'd think that a reasoning full of fallacy would be revised... much like Christianity has done.

 

[Adam007]

Prayers as like horrorscopes. It's all about interpretation. Try not praying and things will just come out the same.

 

[jcook922]

Blahblahblahblahblahblahblah . . .atheism rote . . .blahblahblahblahblah.

How often is prayer answered in the Bible for the people mentioned in it?

How often is it answered for the people not mentioned in it? How often do miraculous things happen the protaganists in MOST books in our society? All the time.

 

[truthshift]

How often is it answered for the people not mentioned in it? How often do miraculous things happen the protaganists in MOST books in our society? All the time.

Makes for a great fairy tale.

 

[keith99]

I rather like this true story of unanswered prayer. Or perhaps careful prayer. I really don't care which.

Long ago when going to a Bowl game really meant something Boston College was on the verge of their first undefeated regular season and a Bowl. All they had to do was beat Holy Cross. They were overwhelming favotites. The one part I can not verify is just what the pregame prayers were. But it is safe to bet at least some of the players asked for victory.

They not only lost they lost badly. No undefeated season. No Bowl. They all felt pretty crappy at that point. They canceled the victory celebration. No one wanted to celebrate anything.

They woke the next morning to find the local headlines were about the Coconut Grove night club fire. Still the worst nightclub disaster in U.S. history. For those of you who are a bit slow, yes that is where their celebration was scheduled.

EDIT: If you trust Wiki this is now easy to verify. It even mentions the Boston College football party.

 

[truthshift]

I rather like this true story of unanswered prayer. Or perhaps careful prayer. I really don't care which.

Long ago when going to a Bowl game really meant something Boston College was on the verge of their first undefeated regular season and a Bowl. All they had to do was beat Holy Cross. They were overwhelming favotites. The one part I can not verify is just what the pregame prayers were. But it is safe to bet at least some of the players asked for victory.

They not only lost they lost badly. No undefeated season. No Bowl. They all felt pretty crappy at that point. They canceled the victory celebration. No one wanted to celebrate anything.

They woke the next morning to find the local headlines were about the Coconut Grove night club fire. Still the worst nightclub disaster in U.S. history. For those of you who are a bit slow, yes that is where their celebration was scheduled.

EDIT: If you trust Wiki this is now easy to verify. It even mentions the Boston College football party.

See, it seems plausible that some intervention was involved when it came to this incident. but...

What about the other team? What about all of the other teams that were not even playing there? What about all of the fans?
What about all of the other clubs in the city? in the state? in the country?

If the team HAD gone to the club, what would have happened at the club differently that may have averted the fire?

It's a very inspiring story, I trust you that it is true, but even so; There is not much to say that it was not coincidence beyond being told from the perspective of the team.

If the team had prayed to Banana.. would it have been any different you think?

 

[Polycarp_fan]

PC_F,

I absolutely demand you take that quote of mine OUT of your signature. It's completely out of context, and you know it. If it is not removed, I will report it to the mods.

It's in context and you know it.

Report away. How is it a violation of any rules here?

Why not apologize or stand by it. It is in context and you know it. You just don't like the spotlight on your belief system? There's some non or anti using a quote of mine and I'm not huffy about it.

I get a kick out of how many times "you guys" report me. You can dish it out but you can't take it. It's so typical.