How narrow is the "narrow way"?

[Bible Highlighter]

"It’s co-operation. God does not force a believer against their free will.
We are told in the Bible to continue in the faith (Acts 14:22), continue in God’s grace (Acts 13:43), and to keep ourselves in the love of God (Jude 1:21). So it’s not all God forcing you to live a sanctified life, and neither is it all yourself, either."

I say what agrees with this actually. God is not willing that any perish. We still need to respond with the repentant faith coming to Christ.

I do not think I disagree with "the Bible’s true teaching on Sanctification", you have not shown that. Notice I speak of those responding with repentant faith coming to Christ. Others do not come to salvation. So, no sanctification. With the biblical faith to come to salvation, responding with repentance coming to Christ, the Bible does not say any doing this would turn away from all that. Why would they? You have not shown how one responds with repentant faith to come to Christ for restoration to God and then turns away from that. Something was not real in that if anything like that happens. And sanctification is work from God with cooperation from the human believer, believers are supposed to grow toward godliness. That is one important thing for which God saves any of us. I don't do some things others do in godliness. But I do a number of godly things others do not. The reality is there are more things in which we are to yet grow, which God would lead us to. And where there is awareness of sin and things that keep us from godliness we need to turn from those and keep those out of our life, which we are to come to see.

God's grace is to turn us from life with sins.

Growth in godliness is important and what we do matters. Those who do not have repentant faith do not show the change with growth with works of the fruit of the Spirit of God. What do you think is meant by 1 John 2:19?

You have a whole lot of misconceptions about believing OSAS. I can't really get to all those things, except to call you on it. You are not really portraying what I say which you respond to.

Fear of God that only you bring up for an issue is not anything I disagree with. We should fear, God has absolute control and can do anything in our lives. God has no limits. It is well for us that God is good, but it is right to fear God.

You have not shown how "one is going to turn God’s grace into a license to sin automatically." Sounds like you do not have understanding or belief in repentance.

Okay. This s really simple. You believe in the OSAS deception which I have already demonstrated as false by the verses I just posted to you already. OSAS is a license to sin even if you claim it is not because if the penalty of sin is removed (future sin is forgiven you) there is no real motivation to do good always in regards to safe guarding your soul against grievous sin damning your soul as the Bible actually teaches. We need to confess and forsake sin in order to have mercy (Proverbs 28:13). Mercy from God is salvation. But I am sure you probably do not see 1 John 1:9, and Proverbs 28:13 as salvific (even though that is the most child like reading of such verses).

Take again 1 Timothy 5:8. How on Earth does that fit with your false belief of OSAS?
You cannot claim 1 Timothy 5:8 is talking about false believers because it is saying that if you (the believer) do not provide for your own, you have denied the faith and are worse than an unbeliever. So If 1 Timothy 5:8 is talking about a fake believer who is actually an unbeliever in reality, then how can this individual who is an unbeliever be worse than an unbeliever? So the conclusion is that this must be referring to the believer and therefore, the believer can fall into spiritual death and damn their soul in that moment in time by not providing for their own. Yes. There is grace (salvation again) for them, but only if they confess and forsake this sin. But if they continue to not provide for their own, and they do not confess and forsake such a sin, they are worse than an unbeliever and denied the faith. Meaning, they will not be saved and not enter God’s Kingdom. They will damned to the Lake of Fire. It’s just that simple.

You are saying future sin is forgiven you (Which is a part of OSAS), and yet Jesus and His followers warned against how sin can destroy or damn our souls in the afterlife (Unless we confess and forsake such sins). I can provide more verses to you that warns against how sin can damn our souls after we are dead. Would you like to see those verses, or is that something you simply you do not want to see because it does sound appealing to you?

 

[FredVB]

Okay. This s really simple. You believe in the OSAS deception which I have already demonstrated as false by the verses I just posted to you already. OSAS is a license to sin even if you claim it is not because if the penalty of sin is removed (future sin is forgiven you) there is no real motivation to do good always in regards to safe guarding your soul against grievous sin damning your soul as the Bible actually teaches. We need to confess and forsake sin in order to have mercy (Proverbs 28:13). Mercy from God is salvation. But I am sure you probably do not see 1 John 1:9, and Proverbs 28:13 as salvific (even though that is the most child like reading of such verses).

Take again 1 Timothy 5:8. How on Earth does that fit with your false belief of OSAS?
You cannot claim 1 Timothy 5:8 is talking about false believers because it is saying that if you (the believer) do not provide for your own, you have denied the faith and are worse than an unbeliever. So If 1 Timothy 5:8 is talking about a fake believer who is actually an unbeliever in reality, then how can this individual who is an unbeliever be worse than an unbeliever? So the conclusion is that this must be referring to the believer and therefore, the believer can fall into spiritual death and damn their soul in that moment in time by not providing for their own. Yes. There is grace (salvation again) for them, but only if they confess and forsake this sin. But if they continue to not provide for their own, and they do not confess and forsake such a sin, they are worse than an unbeliever and denied the faith. Meaning, they will not be saved and not enter God’s Kingdom. They will damned to the Lake of Fire. It’s just that simple.

You are saying future sin is forgiven you (Which is a part of OSAS), and yet Jesus and His followers warned against how sin can destroy or damn our souls in the afterlife (Unless we confess and forsake such sins). I can provide more verses to you that warns against how sin can damn our souls after we are dead. Would you like to see those verses, or is that something you simply you do not want to see because it does sound appealing to you?

You show a misrepresentation of the OSAS position with a caricature, and make strawman arguments with that. I don't know that there are any arguing it is no matter what. I can't believe your position. You don't even mention anything of repentance.

1 John 1:8, If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us. If we confess our sins, He is faithful and just to forgive us of our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.

1 John 2:19, They went out from us, but they were not of us; for if they had been of us, they would have continued with us; but they went out that they might be made manifest, that none of them were of us.

1 John 5:11, God has given us eternal life, and this life is in His Son.

Romans 8:35-39, who shall separate us from the love of Christ? Shall tribulation, or distress, or persecution, or famine, or nakedness, or peril, or sword? As it is written:

“For Your sake we are killed all day long;
We are accounted as sheep for the slaughter.”
Yet in all these things we are more than conquerors through Him who loved us. For I am persuaded that neither death nor life, nor angels nor principalities nor powers, nor things present nor things to come, nor height nor depth, nor any other created thing, shall be able to separate us from the love of God which is in Christ Jesus our Lord.

 

[FredVB]

The penalty of sin is not removed. Christ bore penalty of sin for those of us who repented from life of sin turned to Christ with grace of God given to us, the penalty was not gone. We are not happy about what Christ bore for us, we do not want to sin more, for what Christ bore. Repentance is real. If any of us depart from Christ, those ones were not of us though among us, their salvation is not real because any 'repentance' was not real! Turning to depart from Christ proves that! You would refer to them to prove salvation was lost, so salvation can be lost. But they did not have that, or they would have everlasting life. But they are not in Christ and never were. It was not real repentant faith after all. If you think your salvation can be lost, figure out if you are a repentant believer, or not. If not, confess being a sinner and repent. Really being in Christ involves that. It is not about losing faith, but about if you even have real faith. There is no license to sin! Thinking so is not compatible with repentance!

 

[Bible Highlighter]

You show a misrepresentation of the OSAS position with a caricature, and make strawman arguments with that.

Not true. I am not new to discussing OSAS (Once Saved Always Saved). I have been discussing it since 2011 approximately. The more I learn about it, the more I realize how it is a false teaching that the Bible warns against in tons of places.

There are many ways to demolish OSAS (Once Saved Always saved), Eternal Security, and or Preservance of the Saints (POTS). Here are 4 Lists or Categories That Refutes OSAS:

1. Fall Away List of Verses.
2. Serious Sin can Separate Us From God Verses.
3. Verses on Sanctification Being a Part of Salvation.
4. Obeying God’s Commands as a Part of Eternal Life Verses.

Bonus:
Bonus Point Verses.

I don't know that there are any arguing it is no matter what. I can't believe your position. You don't even mention anything of repentance.

Repentance means different things to many Christians today.
Jesus basically said, repent or perish (See: Luke 13:3).
Some Christians think that just a belief alone on Jesus as one’s Savior is repentance (And this is a part of having a changed mind).
Others believe repentance is forsaking sin.
I believe the word “repent” and its variations has different meanings in the Bible based on the context.
When the word “repent” and its variations (like repentance) is used in context of God telling man to repent, this is about us seeking forgiveness with the Lord Jesus Christ by way of prayer. The fruits of repentance then should follow (Which are good works). John the Baptist said bring forth fruits worthy of repentance. John the Baptist had people confessing their sins as they were being baptized. They were not confessing their sins to John, but to the Lord.

Check out the…

CF - Thread: A Biblical Case for Repentance.

1 John 1:8, If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us. If we confess our sins, He is faithful and just to forgive us of our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.

As for 1 John 1:8:

What is helpful in understanding 1 John 1:8 is looking at its immediate context. 1 John 1:10 says if we say we have not sinned. 1 John 1:10 switches gears from 1 John 1:8 in regards to time; John talks about the declaration on committing sin in verse 8 (which is present tense) to a declaration on committing sin being a past declaration (with verse 10). Verse 10 is saying there are people who said they have not sinned (past tense). This is clearly a gnostic belief. Why? Well, most believers today hold to the idea that they have sinned as a part of their old life before coming to Christ (Regardless of whether they are “OSAS,” a “Sin and still be saved” type believer, or a “Conditional Salvationist”). So this clearly is a “gnostic belief” that John was warning the brethren about (See 1 John 2:26). 1 John 1:8 is a present declaration of sin. It is saying if we say we have no sin when we do sin (present tense). This has to be the interpretative understanding of this verse because 1 John 2:4 says if we say we know Him and do not keep His commandments we are a liar and the truth is not in us. The OSAS's interpretation on 1 John 1:8 does not work because it conflicts with a normal reading on 1 John 2:3-4. You cannot always be in sin (breaking God's commands) as a part of 1 John 1:8 and yet also fulfill 1 John 2:3 that says we can have an assurance of knowing Him if we keep His commandments. Especially when 1 John 2:4 says we are a liar and the truth is not in us if we break his commandments. In other words, if the OSAS interpretation on 1 John 1:8 was true, then I would be damned if I do by obeying God's commands (1 John 1:8) and yet I would be damned if I don't by not obeying God's commands (1 John 2:4).

In fact, the New English Translation says this for 1 John 1:8,

"If we say we do not bear the guilt of sin, we are deceiving ourselves and the truth is not in us." (1 John 1:8 NET).​

In other words, this verse is saying that if a person sins and says they do not bear the guilt of sin (in the sense that they will not have to face any wrath or Judgment from God over their sin) then they would be deceiving themselves and the truth would not be in them. This is exactly what the Eternal Security proposes. They are saying that they do not bear the guilt of any sin (destruction of their soul and body in hell fire) if they do sin because they believe their future sins are paid for by Jesus. They are saying, they do not bear the guilt or the punishment of sin at the final Judgment because of their belief on Jesus. In short, 1 John 1:8 is a denial of the existence of sin on some level. “If we say we have no sin (in the sense that it does not exist) we deceive ourselves and the truth is not in us.” (1 John 1:8). Christian Scientists think sin is an illusion and does not exist at all. So this verse would apply to them. Eternal Security Proponents and those who deny that “Sin Can Separate a Believer from God” deny the existence of sin partially. They believe sin exists physically but they do not believe sin exists for them on a spiritual level because Jesus has forgiven them of all their sin by their belief on Jesus. In fact, to see just how silly your argument actually is for 1 John 1:8, you would have to believe that you are sinning right now at this very moment in order for such a verse to be true because 1 John 1:8 is speaking in the present tense.

John prescribes that we do not think that sin is an illusion, and we are automatically saved, but John is telling us to "sin not" and go to our advocate Jesus Christ (1 John 2:1), and confess our sins so as to be forgiven of sin and to be cleansed of all unrighteousness (1 John 1:9). How can you confess and be forgiven of sin if all your future sin is paid for? It makes no sense.

You can say that John is talking about a break of fellowship by one's sins and not a loss of salvation, but that would not be consistent with Scripture. 1 John 5:12 says he that has the Son has life, and he that does not have the Son does not have life.

1 John 2:19, They went out from us, but they were not of us; for if they had been of us, they would have continued with us; but they went out that they might be made manifest, that none of them were of us.

Yes, there are verses that talk about how there are false professing believers who never knew the Lord. Matthew 7:23 is another such example. But there are other verses that talk about how there are believers did once know the Lord and they later became unsaved. 1 Timothy 5:8, the Parable of the Prodigal Son in Luke 15:11-32, James 5:19-20, Jude 1:12, 2 Peter 2:20-22. Just see my list of verses on how a believer can fall away.

1 John 5:11, God has given us eternal life, and this life is in His Son.

Notice it says this life is IN HIS SON.
Meaning, Jesus is the source of eternal life.
In fact, 1 Timothy 6:16 declares Jesus alone has immortality.
So the way we have eternal life is by abiding in the Son, Jesus Christ.
How can you have an assurance that you know the Lord Jesus?
By keeping His commandments (See: 1 John 2:3).
The person who says they know the Lord and they do not keep His commandments is a liar and the truth is not in them (1 John 2:4).

Romans 8:35-39, who shall separate us from the love of Christ? Shall tribulation, or distress, or persecution, or famine, or nakedness, or peril, or sword? As it is written:

“For Your sake we are killed all day long;
We are accounted as sheep for the slaughter.”
Yet in all these things we are more than conquerors through Him who loved us. For I am persuaded that neither death nor life, nor angels nor principalities nor powers, nor things present nor things to come, nor height nor depth, nor any other created thing, shall be able to separate us from the love of God which is in Christ Jesus our Lord.

Please notice. There are two things that are not on this list of things that cannot separate you from the love of God.

#1. You.
#2. Your sin.

All the things listed on this list are external things and not internal choices by you.
Jesus warns that even looking upon a woman in lust can cause your whole body to be cast into hellfire (Matthew 5:28-30).
Paul says if any man does not agree with the words of Jesus Christ and the doctrine according to godliness, he is proud and he knows nothing (1 Timothy 6:3-4). James 4:6 says God resists the proud and gives grace to the humble.

Also, Romans 8:1 says,
“There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.”

So you have to be walking after the Spirit and not after the flesh in order to not be under the Condemnation.

Also, see Romans 8:13, and Galatians 6:8-9.

 

[FredVB]

Not true. I am not new to discussing OSAS (Once Saved Always Saved). I have been discussing it since 2011 approximately. The more I learn about it, the more I realize how it is a false teaching that the Bible warns against in tons of places.

There are many ways to demolish OSAS (Once Saved Always saved), Eternal Security, and or Preservance of the Saints (POTS). Here are 4 Lists or Categories That Refutes OSAS:

1. Fall Away List of Verses.
2. Serious Sin can Separate Us From God Verses.
3. Verses on Sanctification Being a Part of Salvation.
4. Obeying God’s Commands as a Part of Eternal Life Verses.

Bonus:
Bonus Point Verses.



Repentance means different things to many Christians today.
Jesus basically said, repent or perish (See: Luke 13:3).
Some Christians think that just a belief alone on Jesus as one’s Savior is repentance (And this is a part of having a changed mind).
Others believe repentance is forsaking sin.
I believe the word “repent” and its variations has different meanings in the Bible based on the context.
When the word “repent” and its variations (like repentance) is used in context of God telling man to repent, this is about us seeking forgiveness with the Lord Jesus Christ by way of prayer. The fruits of repentance then should follow (Which are good works). John the Baptist said bring forth fruits worthy of repentance. John the Baptist had people confessing their sins as they were being baptized. They were not confessing their sins to John, but to the Lord.

Check out the…

CF - Thread: A Biblical Case for Repentance.



As for 1 John 1:8:

What is helpful in understanding 1 John 1:8 is looking at its immediate context. 1 John 1:10 says if we say we have not sinned. 1 John 1:10 switches gears from 1 John 1:8 in regards to time; John talks about the declaration on committing sin in verse 8 (which is present tense) to a declaration on committing sin being a past declaration (with verse 10). Verse 10 is saying there are people who said they have not sinned (past tense). This is clearly a gnostic belief. Why? Well, most believers today hold to the idea that they have sinned as a part of their old life before coming to Christ (Regardless of whether they are “OSAS,” a “Sin and still be saved” type believer, or a “Conditional Salvationist”). So this clearly is a “gnostic belief” that John was warning the brethren about (See 1 John 2:26). 1 John 1:8 is a present declaration of sin. It is saying if we say we have no sin when we do sin (present tense). This has to be the interpretative understanding of this verse because 1 John 2:4 says if we say we know Him and do not keep His commandments we are a liar and the truth is not in us. The OSAS's interpretation on 1 John 1:8 does not work because it conflicts with a normal reading on 1 John 2:3-4. You cannot always be in sin (breaking God's commands) as a part of 1 John 1:8 and yet also fulfill 1 John 2:3 that says we can have an assurance of knowing Him if we keep His commandments. Especially when 1 John 2:4 says we are a liar and the truth is not in us if we break his commandments. In other words, if the OSAS interpretation on 1 John 1:8 was true, then I would be damned if I do by obeying God's commands (1 John 1:8) and yet I would be damned if I don't by not obeying God's commands (1 John 2:4).

In fact, the New English Translation says this for 1 John 1:8,

"If we say we do not bear the guilt of sin, we are deceiving ourselves and the truth is not in us." (1 John 1:8 NET).​

In other words, this verse is saying that if a person sins and says they do not bear the guilt of sin (in the sense that they will not have to face any wrath or Judgment from God over their sin) then they would be deceiving themselves and the truth would not be in them. This is exactly what the Eternal Security proposes. They are saying that they do not bear the guilt of any sin (destruction of their soul and body in hell fire) if they do sin because they believe their future sins are paid for by Jesus. They are saying, they do not bear the guilt or the punishment of sin at the final Judgment because of their belief on Jesus. In short, 1 John 1:8 is a denial of the existence of sin on some level. “If we say we have no sin (in the sense that it does not exist) we deceive ourselves and the truth is not in us.” (1 John 1:8). Christian Scientists think sin is an illusion and does not exist at all. So this verse would apply to them. Eternal Security Proponents and those who deny that “Sin Can Separate a Believer from God” deny the existence of sin partially. They believe sin exists physically but they do not believe sin exists for them on a spiritual level because Jesus has forgiven them of all their sin by their belief on Jesus. In fact, to see just how silly your argument actually is for 1 John 1:8, you would have to believe that you are sinning right now at this very moment in order for such a verse to be true because 1 John 1:8 is speaking in the present tense.

John prescribes that we do not think that sin is an illusion, and we are automatically saved, but John is telling us to "sin not" and go to our advocate Jesus Christ (1 John 2:1), and confess our sins so as to be forgiven of sin and to be cleansed of all unrighteousness (1 John 1:9). How can you confess and be forgiven of sin if all your future sin is paid for? It makes no sense.

You can say that John is talking about a break of fellowship by one's sins and not a loss of salvation, but that would not be consistent with Scripture. 1 John 5:12 says he that has the Son has life, and he that does not have the Son does not have life.



Yes, there are verses that talk about how there are false professing believers who never knew the Lord. Matthew 7:23 is another such example. But there are other verses that talk about how there are believers did once know the Lord and they later became unsaved. 1 Timothy 5:8, the Parable of the Prodigal Son in Luke 15:11-32, James 5:19-20, Jude 1:12, 2 Peter 2:20-22. Just see my list of verses on how a believer can fall away.



Notice it says this life is IN HIS SON.
Meaning, Jesus is the source of eternal life.
In fact, 1 Timothy 6:16 declares Jesus alone has immortality.
So the way we have eternal life is by abiding in the Son, Jesus Christ.
How can you have an assurance that you know the Lord Jesus?
By keeping His commandments (See: 1 John 2:3).
The person who says they know the Lord and they do not keep His commandments is a liar and the truth is not in them (1 John 2:4).



Please notice. There are two things that are not on this list of things that cannot separate you from the love of God.

#1. You.
#2. Your sin.

All the things listed on this list are external things and not internal choices by you.
Jesus warns that even looking upon a woman in lust can cause your whole body to be cast into hellfire (Matthew 5:28-30).
Paul says if any man does not agree with the words of Jesus Christ and the doctrine according to godliness, he is proud and he knows nothing (1 Timothy 6:3-4). James 4:6 says God resists the proud and gives grace to the humble.

Also, Romans 8:1 says,
“There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.”

So you have to be walking after the Spirit and not after the flesh in order to not be under the Condemnation.

Also, see Romans 8:13, and Galatians 6:8-9.

You were doing so. I can tell you are giving a generic answer written before at length, that instead of dealing with what I say, makes assumptions of a position to address that is not at all my position. I am not interested in talking about those things you address, why not carefully consider what I do say and address those things with what you think is wrong with them, without any other assumptions, because so far those were wrong.

Notice I do speak of real repentance. No one is saved without that.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

You were doing so. I can tell you are giving a generic answer written before at length, that instead of dealing with what I say, makes assumptions of a position to address that is not at all my position. I am not interested in talking about those things you address, why not carefully consider what I do say and address those things with what you think is wrong with them, without any other assumptions, because so far those were wrong.

Notice I do speak of real repentance. No one is saved without that.

I posted plenty of verses so far that you did not deal with. I also explained your misunderstanding on the verses you posted. I also explained repentance. But repentance does not mean anything, if a person believes future sin is forgiven them when the Bible teaches the exact opposite of that. If one denies the Bible’s teaching that a believer can fall into spiritual death by sin no amount of repentance teaching will help. I am sorry, you just do not get it. Jesus said if one looks upon a woman in lust, they are in danger of being cast bodily into hellfire (See: Matthew 5:28-30). If one is once saved always saved is true, then Matthew 5:28-30 would be a lie in Scripture.

I provided verses, the choice is yours if you want to deal with them.

Also, you have not defined what your view of repentance is.
There are many views on repentance as I pointed out already.
Perhaps you missed what I wrote.

 

[returntosender]

I believe I am a born again Christian. I came to a point in my life where The Holy Spirit moved upon me, I recognized it, I acknowledged it, I was convicted of my sin BY the Holy Spirit, I was sorry, I desired to get to know this being - this person - this Holy Spirit, He accepted me, and I was born again. I went to bed that night full of fire and having a heart for God I never thought would come into my life in my dizziest daydreams. I felt so cool the next day at school because I personally had met the one true GOD almighty! I wondered who else around me possibly had this rebirth, and I had a yearning for everyone I knew to come to this same knowledge, to experience God personally in that way which would change their lives forever.

Regardless of my own testimony, how many Christians are actually going to find the narrow way? I wonder myself, "Am I walking along the path that Jesus himself calls the 'narrow way that leads into eternal life'?"

What about lukewarmness? Jesus said, I would rather you be hot or cold, for if you are lukewarm, I will spit you out of my mouth.

What about intentional sin? If I step on your toe and then apologize, and you say it's okay, but then I do it again, and you forgive me again, and I continue to do it because I know I can get away with it, what of the "narrow way" then?

1 Corinthians 6

(NLT) 9Don’t you realize that those who do wrong will not inherit the Kingdom of God? Don’t fool yourselves. Those who indulge in sexual sin, or who worship idols, or commit adultery, or are male prostitutes, or practice homosexuality, 10or are thieves, or greedy people, or drunkards, or are abusive, or cheat people—none of these will inherit the Kingdom of God. 11Some of you were once like that. But you were cleansed; you were made holy; you were made right with God by calling on the name of the Lord Jesus Christ and by the Spirit of our God.

What about born again Christians who continue to walk in some of these ways? Obviously the actions listed above are not in accordance to the "narrow way". I will be honest. I am guilty of at least one of these wrong doings. I know I ought to repent of it, maybe I struggle with it and maybe I have not yet been corrected of it. But when I do it, I know I am committing a wrong doing that is not in line with the "narrow way" which has led me to start this thread to seek out how all of this comes together.

1 Corinthians 3 Paul writes...

(NLT) 10Because of God’s grace to me, I have laid the foundation like an expert builder. Now others are building on it. But whoever is building on this foundation must be very careful. 11For no one can lay any foundation other than the one we already have—Jesus Christ.

12Anyone who builds on that foundation may use a variety of materials—gold, silver, jewels, wood, hay, or straw. 13But on the judgment day, fire will reveal what kind of work each builder has done. The fire will show if a person’s work has any value. 14If the work survives, that builder will receive a reward. 15But if the work is burned up, the builder will suffer great loss. The builder will be saved, but like someone barely escaping through a wall of flames.

16Don’t you realize that all of you together are the temple of God and that the Spirit of God lives in you? 17God will destroy anyone who destroys this temple. For God’s temple is holy, and you are that temple.

In verse 15 above, it says we will saved, but we will be like someone escaping through the flames. Could this be the consequence to our sin even after we have been born again? Is the "narrow way" simply BEING born again? Or is the narrow way being born again AND building with a "material" that survives the fire so that we are rewarded, like in verses 13 and 14 above?

I really like your testimony. I believe we all sin but if we practice sin there is the problem. Ask forgiveness and don't keep doing it and you will ok. What brought the holy spirit on you? I would like that. I think you are very special. I believe the narrow way is very narrow and we should never be complacent.about it. Strive always for the narrow way.
God bless you and keep going in the direction you are in. Some of us should be so blessed.

 

[anetazo]

Ephesians chapter 3:9. Mystery of God is hidden from most people.
Colossians 1;26 mystery of God revealed to the saints.
The saints are the set aside ones = Gods Elect.

Ecclesiastes 3:11. Man can't find out.

Why??

Because they need holy spirit. Those who are carnal minded can't understand spirtual things. So the mystery of God is like story to them. Because of their spirtual blindness.

Matthew 6:22. Eyes are the window into your body. Only Jesus can give spirtual sight. God gives people spirit of stupor for reason.

Why can't many people get through narrow gate??

Because you need the holy spirit to guide you.

First Corinthians chapter 2. Carnal minded people can't understand spirtual things. Because it's spirtualty Discerned. Get the picture.

You need holy spirit help you to get into kingdom of God.
First Corinthians 9:24. Run in such a way to get the prize.
Discipline is factor for training to run race. Many people are disqualified.

Biblically illiterate to start. These are carnal minded people. They didn't finish the race. Some where, they stumbled or got side tracked.

Lot of people end up in sheol. Its holding place for the spirtualty dead.

Those in paradise had the holy spirit. It's no accident that they made it. They made it to finish line.

Those who have holy spirit are predestined, chosen before foundation of the world.

We're talking about the Election. The prize is kingdom of God. Holy spirit was the deciding factor for finishing the race. Get the picture.

I hope this helps you.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

Ephesians chapter 3:9. Mystery of God is hidden from most people.
Colossians 1;26 mystery of God revealed to the saints.
The saints are the set aside ones = Gods Elect.

Ecclesiastes 3:11. Man can't find out.

Why??

Because they need holy spirit. Those who are carnal minded can't understand spirtual things. So the mystery of God is like story to them. Because of their spirtual blindness.

Matthew 6:22. Eyes are the window into your body. Only Jesus can give spirtual sight. God gives people spirit of stupor for reason.

Why can't many people get through narrow gate??

Because you need the holy spirit to guide you.

First Corinthians chapter 2. Carnal minded people can't understand spirtual things. Because it's spirtualty Discerned. Get the picture.

You need holy spirit help you to get into kingdom of God.
First Corinthians 9:24. Run in such a way to get the prize.
Discipline is factor for training to run race. Many people are disqualified.

Biblically illiterate to start. These are carnal minded people. They didn't finish the race. Some where, they stumbled or got side tracked.

Lot of people end up in sheol. Its holding place for the spirtualty dead.

Those in paradise had the holy spirit. It's no accident that they made it. They made it to finish line.

Those who have holy spirit are predestined, chosen before foundation of the world.

We're talking about the Election. The prize is kingdom of God. Holy spirit was the deciding factor for finishing the race. Get the picture.

I hope this helps you.

Election is not some kind of forced thing upon a person.

Colossians 3:12 says,

“Put on therefore, as the elect of God, holy and beloved,​

bowels of mercies, kindness, humbleness of mind,​

meekness, longsuffering;”​

We are only elect according to the foreknowledge of God the Father.

1 Peter 1:1-2

1 ”Peter, an apostle of Jesus Christ, to the strangers scattered throughout Pontus, Galatia, Cappadocia, Asia, and Bithynia,​

2 Elect according to the foreknowledge of God the Father,…”​

Meaning, God the Father has future foreknowledge of what we are going to do and He elects us based on our positive response.
John 6:44 is generally twisted out of context. Those who are drawn are those who have learned of the Father come unto Jesus (John 6:45).

Yes, in one sense we cannot come to the faith without God providing His Word to us by His divine working of preservation through time with the Bible (Psalms 12:6-7). The Holy Spirit needed to convict us of sin (John 16:8-9). Also, the inspiration of of the Almighty needs to be given man in order for Him to understand His Word (Job 32:8). God knows the day we were going to accept Him as our Savior, and I believe He can prepare the heart for that very event. So indeed, this is the work of God In order to believe (John 6:29). But that does not mean we do not have a free will choice to either accept the Lord Jesus Christ or reject Him, once the truth of our Lord and salvation in Him by the gospel (1 Corinthians 15:1-4) is presented to us. I say this because Jonah preached to the Ninevites that Judgment was coming for them in 40 days. But the Ninevites were able to change their situation by seeking forgiveness with the Lord and forsaking their evil way. When God had seen that they forsaken their wickedness, that is when God turned back on bringing wrath or judgment upon them (See: Jonah 3). 2 Thessalonians 2:10 basically says that the reason why the wicked perish is because they received not the love of the truth that they MIGHT be saved.

Also, after we have made a decision to accept Christ, we also must endure to the end to be saved.

We are told:

“...We are made partakers of Christ, if we hold the beginning of our confidence stedfast unto the end.” (Hebrews 3:13-14).​

"Keep yourselves in the love of God, looking for the mercy of our Lord Jesus Christ unto eternal life." (Jude 1:21).​

"...be thou faithful unto death, and I will give thee a crown of life." (Revelation 2:10).​

We are told to:

1. Continue in the grace of God (Acts 13:43).
2. Continue in the faith (Acts 14:22) (Colossians 1:23).
3. Continue in his goodness, otherwise we can be cut off (just like the Jews were cut off) (Romans 11:21-22).

The true narrow way is a daily choice we make. Did we truly accept His grace initially with a humble heart and become transformed by the Spirit? Do we love the things of this world more than the Lord? Do we love sin more than God? As a Christian, we must confess any known sin, and forsake them or we will not have mercy (Proverbs 28:13). Meaning, after we are initially saved by God’s grace through faith (which is a process of salvation without works), we need to continue in God’s way of escape and enter the secondary aspect of salvation with the Sanctification of the Holy Spirit in putting away sin and live holy (2 Thessalonians 2:13) (Romans 8:13) (Galatians 6:8-9). For without holiness, no man shall see the Lord (Hebrews 12:14). Unless a person accepts Christ on their deathbed, or they died as a baby, most believers will not be saved if they do not repent and bring forth fruits worthy of repentance. The Parable of the Talents says the unprofitable servant will be cast into outer darkness. Those who do not do good works and instead justify sin with the thinking that just a belief on Jesus will save them are not going to make it Into the Kingdom. The narrow way Is about seeing how sin can destroy us spiritually and lead us to hell. Most believe you can sin and still be saved. Then folks need to see that they do need to do good works after they are saved by God’s grace. No fruitfulness or good works means one will not be saved. Paul actually teaches salvation by works after being saved by God’s grace without works initially. This is demonstrated in 1 Timothy 5:8. If any believer does not provide for his own they have denied the faith and are worse than an infidel (unbeliever). This cannot be talking about false fake believers because only a believer can be worse than an unbeliever. An unbeliever (a fake believer) cannot be worse than an unbeliever. So one has to do the good work of providing for your own. If one does not provide, they will abide in spiritual death and go to hell unless they repent (seek forgiveness with the Lord Jesus and forsake that sin of not providing for their own).

Side Note:

Those who say that a Christian will not practice sin and yet also doublespeak and say they will sin again do not realize that they are justifying sin under God’s grace by that very statement. Jesus never condoned our sin. Jesus warned us against sin and how it would destroy us spiritually and lead us to hell. If we do not overcome in this life and we love sin more than God, we are not on the narrow path. Saying we must always sin again even though we do not practice sin is still an excuse to sin and to say that one really loves it more than God. If one truly loves God, they will forsake and battle against sin to put it out of their life. If it takes them 10 months or 10 years. They must fight against sin to put it away. If not, they are justifying sin under God’s grace. Jude 1:4 warns against turning God’s grace into a license for immorality. Future sin is not forgiven a person. That is a lie from the pits of hell itself. We must confess sin to Jesus in order to be forgiven of that sin (1 John 1:9). We must walk in the light (love your brother) in order to have the blood of Jesus cleanse us from all sin (See 1 John 1:7 and compare with 1 John 2:9-11).

 

[Matt5]

Ephesians chapter 3:9. Mystery of God is hidden from most people.
Colossians 1;26 mystery of God revealed to the saints.
The saints are the set aside ones = Gods Elect.

Ecclesiastes 3:11. Man can't find out.

Why??

Why can't many people get through narrow gate??

Because you need the holy spirit to guide you.

I like the explanation in Matthew 13. Basically, if you knew the truth you wouldn't respond anyway. So as punishment, the truth has been withheld. For example, that explains why Revelation is mostly incomprehensible.

Why can't many people get through the narrow gate?

Because they won't respond. Shortly before Jesus comes, the harvests come. Get out of the way of the harvests (narrow gate), or do nothing and be killed (wide gate). The harvests are nuclear wars, and they're near.

This corresponds to the parable of the talents. Notice the 1-talent guy is lazy and is killed for it. He won't get out of the way of the harvest of the weeds.

 

[Danthemailman]

Either we by faith are trusting 100% in Jesus Christ as the ALL-sufficient means of our salvation or else we are 100% lost. (John 1:12; 3:15,16,18; 6:40,47; 11:25,26; 10:9; 14:6; Acts 10:43; 16:31; 26:18; Romans 1:16; 3:24-28; 4:5-6; Galatians 3:26; Ephesians 2:8,9; Philippians 3:9; 2 Timothy 3:15; 1 John 5:11-13 etc..). That's how narrow the narrow way is.

 

[returntosender]

I like the explanation in Matthew 13. Basically, if you knew the truth you wouldn't respond anyway. So as punishment, the truth has been withheld. For example, that explains why Revelation is mostly incomprehensible.

Why can't many people get through the narrow gate?

Because they won't respond. Shortly before Jesus comes, the harvests come. Get out of the way of the harvests (narrow gate), or do nothing and be killed (wide gate). The harvests are nuclear wars, and they're near.

This corresponds to the parable of the talents. Notice the 1-talent guy is lazy and is killed for it. He won't get out of the way of the harvest of the weeds.

Clear as mud

 

[Matt5]

Clear as mud

That's what happens when someone gives it to you "short and sweet."

Matthew 24:37 As it was in the days of Noah, so it will be at the coming of the Son of Man.

Do nothing is the wide gate. Walking up the ramp to the Ark is the narrow gate.

 

[returntosender]

I don't give anyone credit here anymore because no two people believe the same it seems.

 

[Matt5]

I don't give anyone credit here anymore because no two people believe the same it seems.

Yep, I get it. My posts are pretty much a nightmare, so I don't actually expect anyone to agree. Although, occasionally I'm surprised. I do collect news articles that kind of back up the things I'm talking about. But they just make everything worse. In the end, I'm ignored or rejected 99% of the time.

 

[AlightSeeker]

The narrow path I see

Come out of her my people.

I'm just a humbled man, humbled by God, I believe. I'm not a teacher or prophet. I know nothing but what God shows me in scripture, but I dont know everything, so we need each other. I would like to share what I see. I see a church not following God. They follow politicians who lead them astray...

www.christianforums.com

 

[Matt5]

The narrow path I see

Come out of her my people.

I'm just a humbled man, humbled by God, I believe. I'm not a teacher or prophet. I know nothing but what God shows me in scripture, but I dont know everything, so we need each other. I would like to share what I see. I see a church not following God. They follow politicians who lead them astray...

www.christianforums.com

Unfortunately, your initial paragraph is very long and difficult to go through. I copied it to a text editor and reformatted it, so I could read it. A couple of things stand out:

------------------------------------------
Come out of her my people.

- I see a church not following God. They follow politicians who lead them astray.
- Money and the world have become our help, not God.
- Psalms says that all those who make or trust in idols will become like them.
- We must be holy, separated from the world as Israel was.
- We, too, must come out of the gentile nations and be separate.
- The kings of the earth fornicate with the great harlot of Babylon.
-
Do you want to follow them?

Do you want to drink the cup of her adulteries and the cup of God's wrath?
Or do you want to turn back to God and let him heal our blindness?
------------------------------------------

What does it mean, "come out of her?"

It sounds like you just mean, "turn back to God." Or do I need to start packing my bags?

 

[AlightSeeker]

Unfortunately, your initial paragraph is very long and difficult to go through. I copied it to a text editor and reformatted it, so I could read it. A couple of things stand out:

------------------------------------------
Come out of her my people.

- I see a church not following God. They follow politicians who lead them astray.
- Money and the world have become our help, not God.
- Psalms says that all those who make or trust in idols will become like them.
- We must be holy, separated from the world as Israel was.
- We, too, must come out of the gentile nations and be separate.
- The kings of the earth fornicate with the great harlot of Babylon.
-
Do you want to follow them?

Do you want to drink the cup of her adulteries and the cup of God's wrath?
Or do you want to turn back to God and let him heal our blindness?
------------------------------------------

What does it mean, "come out of her?"

It sounds like you just mean, "turn back to God." Or do I need to start packing my bags?

It's God himself who says come out of the world, both in 2 Corinthians 6:17 and revelation 18:4. He himself call us out. It doesn't just mean turning to God. That's like saying you believe by your faith doesn't show it. We cast off the works of darkness when we come out of the world. We become holy by obeying God and not following the world.

 

[AlightSeeker]

Unfortunately, your initial paragraph is very long and difficult to go through. I copied it to a text editor and reformatted it, so I could read it. A couple of things stand out:

------------------------------------------
Come out of her my people.

- I see a church not following God. They follow politicians who lead them astray.
- Money and the world have become our help, not God.
- Psalms says that all those who make or trust in idols will become like them.
- We must be holy, separated from the world as Israel was.
- We, too, must come out of the gentile nations and be separate.
- The kings of the earth fornicate with the great harlot of Babylon.
-
Do you want to follow them?

Do you want to drink the cup of her adulteries and the cup of God's wrath?
Or do you want to turn back to God and let him heal our blindness?
------------------------------------------

What does it mean, "come out of her?"

It sounds like you just mean, "turn back to God." Or do I need to start packing my bags?

Also, my apologies for my writing style. It's my hope to be clear with what I see in God's word.

 

[FredVB]

I posted plenty of verses so far that you did not deal with. I also explained your misunderstanding on the verses you posted. I also explained repentance. But repentance does not mean anything, if a person believes future sin is forgiven them when the Bible teaches the exact opposite of that. If one denies the Bible’s teaching that a believer can fall into spiritual death by sin no amount of repentance teaching will help. I am sorry, you just do not get it. Jesus said if one looks upon a woman in lust, they are in danger of being cast bodily into hellfire (See: Matthew 5:28-30). If one is once saved always saved is true, then Matthew 5:28-30 would be a lie in Scripture.

I provided verses, the choice is yours if you want to deal with them.

Also, you have not defined what your view of repentance is.
There are many views on repentance as I pointed out already.
Perhaps you missed what I wrote.

How would you say you post things that are not dealt with, when you post a straw man argument which is against things in which I am not disagreeing with you? I don't need to deal with those points, I already agree. Rather, it was a generic, and long and certainly pre-written, post that did not deal with what I did post.

As far as repentance I can define it as much as the Bible does. The Bible, and Jesus speaking about it, assume you know what repentance is. Too bad many in this generation are making it confusing. Recognize you are doing wrong. Seek God's forgiveness and what God's will for you is, seeking to turn from the wrong things you know about and doing right things. This shouldn't be hard. God would have it made known to you, you must come to Christ and come to God through Christ. And God is not willing that any perish, but they must come to repentance.

Those you know of, whoever they are (you did not name any), were not doing that.