How much prayer is required

[LunarPlexus]

Then how do you account for people who were once gay but aren't anymore because they came to Christ, got saved and minister against homsexuality??

Are you going to tell me they're somehow wrong or confused? That they should have been proud of who they were beforehand simply because God is love and that they are His creations??

Then if they were actually able to change, and if they are now totally content in themselves, we should all be happy for them.

Doesn't mean everyone else will...and I doubt that ALL 'ex-gays' are content.

 

[suzieqtc69]

I am just wondering if the homosexual people who are just born that way and should not have to change, have the same respect for child molesters, murderers, rapists and also adulterers who have affairs with others wives & husbands and even murderers. If you are all born that way and simply cannot change, then it seems a waste of time that we have any punishment for them or that we should try to re-habilitate them so they can live a reformed life or stop hurting others. This makes it seem that our laws of society demand more of someones behaviour than God does, and that just makes no sense.

 

[BAFRIEND]

I am just wondering if the homosexual people who are just born that way and should not have to change, have the same respect for child molesters, murderers, rapists and also adulterers who have affairs with others wives & husbands and even murderers. If you are all born that way and simply cannot change, then it seems a waste of time that we have any punishment for them or that we should try to re-habilitate them so they can live a reformed life or stop hurting others. This makes it seem that our laws of society demand more of someones behaviour than God does, and that just makes no sense.

You are new here so this is old ground- because they are born that way- they say God approves but really cannot answer why it would be any different than, say a baby being born without legs. Did God do that or is God approving of other birth defects ?

There is nothing indicating that Jesus would approve of homosexuality. He speaks of marriage only in terms of a man and woman as does the OT and he also speaks specifically about divorce, pointing to the legality of marriage and not the relativeness of it. Jesus says to follow the narrow road and yet people here keep claiming that anything goes.

 

[eastcoast_bsc]

You are new here so this is old ground- because they are born that way- they say God approves but really cannot answer why it would be any different than, say a baby being born without legs. Did God do that or is God approving of other birth defects ?

There is nothing indicating that Jesus would approve of homosexuality. He speaks of marriage only in terms of a man and woman as does the OT and he also speaks specifically about divorce, pointing to the legality of marriage and not the relativeness of it. Jesus says to follow the narrow road and yet people here keep claiming that anything goes.

Hey your back to being 40 again. It must be a miracle

 

[Brieuse]

Better to ask to be healed but to also pray to accept the things thay you cannot change and for God's will. Remember that just because you have a homosexual orientation- that does not mean that you must lead a sinful lifestyle. There is more to being a human than just an orientation.

So you say it wasn't God's Will?

 

[LunarPlexus]

I am just wondering if the homosexual people who are just born that way and should not have to change, have the same respect for child molesters, murderers, rapists and also adulterers who have affairs with others wives & husbands and even murderers. If you are all born that way and simply cannot change, then it seems a waste of time that we have any punishment for them or that we should try to re-habilitate them so they can live a reformed life or stop hurting others. This makes it seem that our laws of society demand more of someones behaviour than God does, and that just makes no sense.

Two cosenting homosexuals have very nothing in common with child molesters, rapists, or murderers...all of whom are violating other people's rights and liberty.

Chronic adulterers are violating someone through lies and deciet.

To equate a homosexual to any of these is offensive in the extreme.

 

[Ohioprof]

Then how do you account for people who were once gay but aren't anymore because they came to Christ, got saved and minister against homsexuality??

Are you going to tell me they're somehow wrong or confused? That they should have been proud of who they were beforehand simply because God is love and that they are His creations??

How do YOU account for all the people who tried to be heterosexual and got married, and then realized they are actually gay and left the marriage for a same-sex spouse? I can point to a lot more people who have done that than people who say they have turned "ex-gay." Aside from a few people who have posted in here, I have never met anyone who claims to be "ex-gay."

If people say they have, then good for them. People need to do what makes them happy, and if someone is happy because they say they have stopped being gay and have become heterosexual, then fine for them. I can't account for or judge other people's sexual orientation. Each person is different, and each person has to live his or her life in the way that best suits that person.

I don't have a problem with someone saying they have stopped being gay for whatever reason. I do have a problem with some people insisting that all gay people can become "ex-gay," because it's simply not true. There is way too much testimony, including testimony from gay people in these forums, of people who tried to stop being gay, and it was futile and extremely painful. There is also the testimony of the former founders of Exodus, the "ex-gay" ministry. They now say they did not become "ex-gay," and neither did the other people who came to them to try to become "ex-gay." They say they are still gay, and they have apologized for saying their ministry could turn people "ex-gay."

Check out this website for their testimony: http://www.beyondexgay.com

I have never tried to become "ex-gay," because I have never thought there was anything wrong with being how God made me, which is gay. I have no desire to be "ex-gay." I am happy being gay, and I could not become "ex-gay" even if I wanted to, which I don't.

 

[Brieuse]

Then how do you account for people who were once gay but aren't anymore because they came to Christ, got saved and minister against homsexuality??

Are you going to tell me they're somehow wrong or confused? That they should have been proud of who they were beforehand simply because God is love and that they are His creations??

Show me these plenty that were "healed".

I know of plenty following peer pressure yes, not healed, but now chaste.

 

[Brieuse]

I am just wondering if the homosexual people who are just born that way and should not have to change, have the same respect for child molesters, murderers, rapists and also adulterers who have affairs with others wives & husbands and even murderers. If you are all born that way and simply cannot change, then it seems a waste of time that we have any punishment for them or that we should try to re-habilitate them so they can live a reformed life or stop hurting others. This makes it seem that our laws of society demand more of someones behaviour than God does, and that just makes no sense.

I personally have very little respect for the people in that list you brought up.

 

[Brieuse]

You are new here so this is old ground- because they are born that way- they say God approves but really cannot answer why it would be any different than, say a baby being born without legs. Did God do that or is God approving of other birth defects ?

There is nothing indicating that Jesus would approve of homosexuality. He speaks of marriage only in terms of a man and woman as does the OT and he also speaks specifically about divorce, pointing to the legality of marriage and not the relativeness of it. Jesus says to follow the narrow road and yet people here keep claiming that anything goes.

Does a child born without legs pray for them to grow back?

Is that child judged and condemned for not being like everybody else by the religious community? Was it God's Will he has no legs?

Should he pretend to have legs so he can be accepted?

 

[Brieuse]

You are new here so this is old ground- because they are born that way- they say God approves but really cannot answer why it would be any different than, say a baby being born without legs. Did God do that or is God approving of other birth defects ?

There is nothing indicating that Jesus would approve of homosexuality. He speaks of marriage only in terms of a man and woman as does the OT and he also speaks specifically about divorce, pointing to the legality of marriage and not the relativeness of it. Jesus says to follow the narrow road and yet people here keep claiming that anything goes.

I hold you and "Christians" like you personally responsible for the large number of teen suicides due to homosexuality insecurities.

 

[Jet_A_Jockey]

Does a child born without legs pray for them to grow back?

Is that child judged and condemned for not being like everybody else by the religious community? Was it God's Will he has no legs?

Should he pretend to have legs so he can be accepted?

comparing a sexual orientation to a handicap seems inappropriate, but I'll comment on it. One is a physical issue, while the other is not seen (mental). In this statement you seem to be implying that homosexuality is a condition that is given at/before birth and irreparable (sp?) or not able to be influenced henceforth.

 

[Jet_A_Jockey]

I hold you and "Christians" like you personally responsible for the large number of teen suicides due to homosexuality insecurities.

Am I personally responsible too because of my standing on this issue? It's unfair how children are treated, especially around their peers as the pressure to conform is great. How that links someone's biblical belief to their own unfortunate choices I am not sure.

And +rep for this thread, thats right i have rep now

 

[Jet_A_Jockey]

blah i gave out too much already, you are first on my list though I wont forget!

 

[BAFRIEND]

I hold you and "Christians" like you personally responsible for the large number of teen suicides due to homosexuality insecurities.

Then you do not mind if I hold you and the rest of the homosexual community responsible for the AIDS crises ?

 

[Floatingaxe]

In answer to the OP:

You can pray for 20 years, and unless you plan on being obedient to God's Word, those prayers will never be answered. God doesn't free us from our bondages unless we renounce them first.

You lay them on the shoulders of the one who is bearing your sin. Then He will take them away. You need to just stop. As you obey, He will change your mind, and your desires will correct, because the Holy Spirit will be in control, and not you. Ask the Holy Spirit to take control right now.

 

[Brieuse]

In answer to the OP:

You can rpay for 20 years, and unless you plan on beojg obedient to God's Word, those prayers will never be ansered. God doesn't free us from our bondages unless we renounce them first.

You lay them on the shoulders of the one who is bearing your sin. Then He will take them away. You need to just stop. As you obey, He will change your mind, and your desires will correct, becasue the Holy Spirit will be in control, and not you. Ask the Holy Spirit to take control right now.

tried that. Any other ideas?

 

[Ohioprof]

I am just wondering if the homosexual people who are just born that way and should not have to change, have the same respect for child molesters, murderers, rapists and also adulterers who have affairs with others wives & husbands and even murderers. If you are all born that way and simply cannot change, then it seems a waste of time that we have any punishment for them or that we should try to re-habilitate them so they can live a reformed life or stop hurting others. This makes it seem that our laws of society demand more of someones behaviour than God does, and that just makes no sense.

It's wrong to compare being gay, which is positive and entirely benign, with being a child molester or a murderer or an adulterer. Gay people do not harm anyone. Molesting a child does harm to a child. Murder does obvious harm. Adultery does harm to the deceived spouse and probably to the whole family. I would never say that I am born gay to apologize for it. It's not an affliction or a disease or a negative condition. It's just a characteristic, like being left-handed.

It makes no sense anyway to say that a murderer is born to murder, or that a rapist is born to rape, or an adulterer is born to commit adultery. It may be true that some people are predisposed to desire sex with children. This is a serious problem, and right now we have no solution for this problem. It's a problem because a sexual attraction for children is not a benign or positive characteristic; it's a characteristic that tends to lead people to harm children. And it appears that therapy does not change this. Some may argue that giving oneself to Jesus can or will change this, but I have seen no evidence of that. The approach we have settled on, for now, is to convict people of molesting children and send them to jail, and then put their names on a list and bar them from living near or going near children. But this is not an effective solution, and it also appears to deny people basic civil liberties after they have already paid their dues for commiting a crime.

A predisposition toward child molestation may be inborn, and there is no good solution to the problem at this point. The difference between this and being gay is that child molestation does harm; having a same-sex relationship with a consenting adult does no harm. Child molestation is a crime; having a same-sex relationship with a consenting adult is not a crime; it's protected under the right to privacy. Being gay is a positive and benign characteristic; having a sexual attraction to children is likely to lead to harm to children. Being gay is not a social problem, or any kind of problem, unless a gay person thinks it is a problem for him or her. Being born with an attraction for children is a social and an individual problem, because it is likely to lead to harm and to criminal activity.

 

[Ohioprof]

tried that. Any other ideas?

Here's an idea. You can accept yourself as you are, as God made you, and just enjoy your life as a gay person and a Christian.

Just a thought.

 

[Brieuse]

Here's an idea. You can accept yourself as you are, as God made you, and just enjoy your life as a gay person and a Christian.

Just a thought.

Thanks, seems like I was asking the wrong person before.