How many people would go for this if they could?

[dingdong]

It's an improvement, although the term "some" might have served you better. We're talking about at LEAST two major religions with billions of adherents, after all.

Will I ever get this right?

 

[Wicked Willow]

Will I ever get this right?

You already did. Relax!

 

[SithDoughnut]

Ah, but you will.

I'm planning an being a ghost for a while (because it sounds more fun), so do you think I can reserve a place?

 

[Gardenia]

But I don't believe in anything spiritual so it would seem I can not discuss anything here

I didn't say that... You don't have to be spiritual yourself to have discussions here. There are, after all, several other atheists around here who do it successfully.

thinking about it how can anyone discuss anything here when all they have is their opinions? nothing substantial just opinions, I have an opinion so I can discuss things.

I'm not sure if you've misunderstood me, or if I am misunderstanding you... I am not saying opinions and beliefs can't be discussed. Of course they can, it happens all the time. Though as always, if you're going to put your opinion out there, you'd best be ready to see people commenting on it. That's just how it goes.

 

[Mobiosity]

I'm planning an being a ghost for a while (because it sounds more fun), so do you think I can reserve a place?

You should probably call ahead, especially if you want a spot by the window.

 

[Mobiosity]

So they'll be burnt alive? Well, that's okay then.


eudaimonia,

Mark

Hardly, they're already dead.

 

[Mobiosity]

When you think about it most religions are not very nice are they?
They seem to be designed for mean and selfish people who are happy to pat each other on the back for being lucky enough to be blessed with the one true religion, the rest of the worlds religious people can all die in pain.
Not for me thank you very much.

Thanks for that option, but I think I'll pass.

 

[Mobiosity]

You are absolutely right I should not try to mix spirituality with history, one is based on evidence and facts while the other is based on speculation.

But I don't believe in anything spiritual so it would seem I can not discuss anything here, thinking about it how can anyone discuss anything here when all they have is their opinions? nothing substantial just opinions, I have an opinion so I can discuss things.

You can mix spirituality with history all you like. Just remember that opinions are like noses, everyone has one and they all have holes in them.

 

[Eudaimonist]

Hardly, they're already dead.

Now face the issue head on. They may be "dead", but they have bodies and are conscious.


eudaimonia,

Mark

 

[Mobiosity]

Now face the issue head on. They may be "dead", but they have bodies and are conscious.


eudaimonia,

Mark

Do they have bodies? I don't think so. They've been dead for hundreds, thousands of years. Only those in Heaven will have new, glorified, whole, healthy bodies. Consciousness is a given.

 

[yaqovzadeek]

For a small fee I will take all of your sins to Hell with me when I die, and I will even let you decide how much you pay me for each sin, what do you think? let me take the wrap, after all what have you got to lose?

But is deliverance from hell yours to offere for sale though.I mean i would prefer paradise anytime but to take others sins on my back.i meanthis is like blaming jesus for sins of all the world and he ends up getting punished while all the sinners walk off scott free.
Can you imagine a second or minute in hell, now you want to take the sins of everyone else which can land you in hell eternally you don't pass go and you don't collect 200. Think that would be a damn bad idea. The money of this world finish, you can blow it overnight but sins will land you in hell for ever can you imagine that.
Peace
Yaqovzadeek
aKa james the just

 

[Eudaimonist]

Do they have bodies? I don't think so. They've been dead for hundreds, thousands of years. Only those in Heaven will have new, glorified, whole, healthy bodies. Consciousness is a given.

Now face the issue head on. They are conscious, and are thrown into the pit of fire, which is apparently painful, even if only briefly. It would be like being burned alive, or at least that is the implication. All that "wailing and gnashing of teeth".

"They will throw them into the fiery furnace, where there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth."
Matthew 13:42


eudaimonia,

Mark

 

[Mobiosity]

Now face the issue head on. They are conscious, and are thrown into the pit of fire, which is apparently painful, even if only briefly. It would be like being burned alive, or at least that is the implication. All that "wailing and gnashing of teeth".

"They will throw them into the fiery furnace, where there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth."
Matthew 13:42


eudaimonia,

Mark

Revelation 20: 11-15

The Dead Are Judged

11Then I saw a great white throne and him who was seated on it. Earth and sky fled from his presence, and there was no place for them. 12And I saw the dead, great and small, standing before the throne, and books were opened. Another book was opened, which is the book of life. The dead were judged according to what they had done as recorded in the books. 13The sea gave up the dead that were in it, and death and Hades gave up the dead that were in them, and each person was judged according to what he had done. 14Then death and Hades were thrown into the lake of fire. The lake of fire is the second death. 15 If anyone's name was not found written in the book of life, he was thrown into the lake of fire.



You do realize that Matthew 13 is a series of parables and explanations of them, correct? And not to be taken literally unless we are all to become fish as in the following parable.

 

[jpcedotal]

And you still wonder why people consider your particular brand of Christianity to be somewhat... extreme?
Imagining that you have no problem whatsoever with seeing the vast majority of mankind in eternal torment (unless they join your faith) hurts my feelings - sort of.
Nah, that's the wrong phrase. It's more that I consider it shocking that otherwise decent persons seem to feel no cognitive dissonance whatsoever at the notion of sentient beings conscripted to unending suffering by the very God who's supposed to be the epitome of Goodness and Justice (note the capital letters). I find such people to be more than a little creepy, to be completely honest.

u misunderstand. I do not want ANYBODY to go to hell and burn forever and ever. I have a big problem with a single person going to hell.

But

1. God has made it very clear that there are only two sides and the only way to Heaven and to Him is through the Blood of Jesus Christ
2. Everyone has free will that allows him/her to decide for themselves how important salvation is. I can state what I believe and act accordingly (which is very hard most of the time) and hope I plant the seed of curiosity in a non-believer but it is up to the individual to open his/her eyes and see Christ standing in front of them. If he/she does not and dies...it is just brutal honest fact I am stating, not some secret enjoyment of saying "I told you so."

I am not here to argue, though I do a lot. I am here to point toward Jesus Christ every chance I get.

 

[jpcedotal]

Revelation 20: 11-15

The Dead Are Judged

11Then I saw a great white throne and him who was seated on it. Earth and sky fled from his presence, and there was no place for them. 12And I saw the dead, great and small, standing before the throne, and books were opened. Another book was opened, which is the book of life. The dead were judged according to what they had done as recorded in the books. 13The sea gave up the dead that were in it, and death and Hades gave up the dead that were in them, and each person was judged according to what he had done. 14Then death and Hades were thrown into the lake of fire. The lake of fire is the second death. 15 If anyone's name was not found written in the book of life, he was thrown into the lake of fire.



You do realize that Matthew 13 is a series of parables and explanations of them, correct? And not to be taken literally unless we are all to become fish as in the following parable.

So are you picking and choosing what is to be taken literally or are you letting the Bible (not some secret whisper in your soul) tell you what is literal and what is not?

You are correct that there are a lot of parables in Matthew, but that doesn't apply to the verse he quoted.

 

[dingdong]

error

 

[dingdong]

Only those in Heaven will have new, glorified, whole, healthy bodies. Consciousness is a given.

It must be wonderful to live in your little world I envy you,
no I don't just kidding.

 

[Mobiosity]

So are you picking and choosing what is to be taken literally or are you letting the Bible (not some secret whisper in your soul) tell you what is literal and what is not.

You are correct that there are a lot of parables in Matthew, but that doesn't apply to the verse he quoted.

Why are you picking a verse out of a chapter of parables and explanations and saying that verse is neither?

 

[Mobiosity]

It must be wonderful to live in your little world I envy you,
no I don't just kidding.

Naw it sucks to live in my world, but I have hope. It'd suck to live in your world and not have any hope.

 

[Eudaimonist]

You do realize that Matthew 13 is a series of parables and explanations of them, correct? And not to be taken literally unless we are all to become fish as in the following parable.

I'm unaware that the quote I mentioned is from a parable. It could, of course, be a parable. If it is just a parable in your judgment, what do you believe actually happens to people after death who don't (figuratively or literally) have their names written in the book of life? Are the dead brought back to conscious awareness for judgment? Or are they left dead and only restored to life if God chooses to do so?


eudaimonia,

Mark