How do I "stimulate", my Evolution? I can be stimulated to embrace the theory, but what next?

[AV1611VET]

There were several human species ...

Only on paper.

 

[Hans Blaster]

No, it's not and that's why what the bible means by using that word is of paramount importance when determining if something like evolution is compatible with the bible in any sense.
If you define a "kind" as a synonym for "species" then each species is individually created leaving 0 room for an evolutionary process. Hence you come to a complete impasse between science and the bible.

But if "kind" refers to an taxonomic family rather than species, there IS room for evolution.
and hybridization of closely related animals points to this being the case.

I didn't make a specific claim about what "kind" is taxinomically, because it means nothing scientifically. It is not consistent, but that is not concerning since the Torah is not a scientific text and shouldn't be taken as such.

"Hence you come to a complete impasse between science and the bible." Yep. And that's why I don't use the Bible for scientific topics like biology.

 

[Subduction Zone]

In this thread somebody is explaining that God doesn't exist
based on my crooked foot being poorly designed. So nobody has to lie about that.

No. It is merely pointing out that life is not evidence for God. That does not mean that God has been refuted.

 

[Subduction Zone]

I'm not talking about "Original Sin" doctrine where we're all guilty of Adam's sin, you're right, that's absurd.
But Adam sinning changed our entire nature, in that we now ALL sin, on our own.
You're not guilty of Adam's sin you're guilty of your sins, just as I'm guilty of my sins as well.
The difference is, I recognize my need for a savior and found it in Jesus Christ, my sins are forgiven. You don't seem to recognize the need for a savior.

At best that is a morality tale. It is not history. People 'sin' just because people are not perfect.

 

[Freodin]

To fulfill the requirements for us to be saved, yes. 1 man sinned, and so we all sin and we die. In order to fix that, 1 man had to live in perfect obedience, which is impossible for any person to do, and die in our place.
The only way to do this was for God to incarnate Himself in a human body, so that He could Himself fulfill the law, and die in our place.
Without God incarnating as a human, in a human body, we have no hope of redemption from sin.

What a great and wonderful example for my point.
Yes, I understand that.
No, it doesn't make any sense.

What is the reason for all this? The cause? The mechanism? The rationality?

Why would we "all" sin, because one man did? Why would one man not sinning help? Why is that a "law"?

I understand that this is what you (claim to) believe. But for someone who doesn't believe it, it makes as much sense as... well... as any other religious system that you do not believe in.

...
And regarding the "This is a Christian board" stuff: I know that. I don't think most atheists here have a real interest in converting you. I personally don't.

But exactly because this is a Christian board, it should be in the real interest of Christians to learn and understand how to interact with people who do not share their beliefs.

 

[AV1611VET]

Why would we "all" sin, because one man did?

By making [first] Adam the federal head of the human race, God was able to make Jesus Christ (last Adam) the federal Head of the spiritual race.

By doing it that way, Christ only had to die "once for all".

Else He would have to come back and die each and every time someone sinned.

 

[Subduction Zone]

By making [first] Adam the federal head of the human race, God was able to make Jesus Christ (last Adam) the federal Head of the sinful race.

By doing it that way, Christ only had to die "once for all".

Else He would have to come back and die each and every time someone sinned.

This is really not the place to discuss substitutionary atonement and how it fails.

 

[AV1611VET]

This is really not the place to discuss substitutionary atonement ...

Do you want us to ignore Freodin's questions then?

Hans gave them a LIKE.

 

[Subduction Zone]

Do you want us to ignore Freodin's questions then?

Hans gave them a LIKE.

The questions were of a rhetorical nature. Your nonexplanation did not help your side.

 

[AV1611VET]

The questions were of a rhetorical nature.

I don't believe that.

And are you the only one allowed to ask questions?

(See post 111.)

 

[FrumiousBandersnatch]

Kind = Genus

Whatever; tell him that.

 

[FrumiousBandersnatch]

To fulfill the requirements for us to be saved, yes. 1 man sinned, and so we all sin and we die. In order to fix that, 1 man had to live in perfect obedience, which is impossible for any person to do, and die in our place.
The only way to do this was for God to incarnate Himself in a human body, so that He could Himself fulfill the law, and die in our place.
Without God incarnating as a human, in a human body, we have no hope of redemption from sin.

Unless an omnipotent, omnibenevolent God were to skip all that palaver and simply forgive.

 

[FrumiousBandersnatch]

In this thread somebody is explaining that God doesn't exist
based on my crooked foot being poorly designed.

I hope that's not a reference to my post, where I said nothing about the existence or otherwise of God.

 

[FrumiousBandersnatch]

I don't expect you to understand that it works fine and without pain.

I understand that for your purposes it 'works fine'. That doesn't make 'wonky' good design.

 

[Jamdoc]

Unless an omnipotent, omnibenevolent God were to skip all that palaver and simply forgive.

He'd be an unjust God then. Sin has to be punished, or there is no justice.

 

[Subduction Zone]

He'd be an unjust God then. Sin has to be punished, or there is no justice.

Sorry, but "justice" is merely an excuse for revenge. If God is all powerful there is nothing that people could do that would hurt or harm God. He could easily forgive without punishment.

 

[Freodin]

He'd be an unjust God then. Sin has to be punished, or there is no justice.

Another of these ideas that make no sense.

This idea of "justice" is based on the human view and experience that violations of law cannot be rectified at all, and that retribution - that is: "equal" violations that are simply deemed "lawful" - somehow makes up for it.
It's a very human idea, and there is absolutely no reason why it should apply to an eternal omnipotent God.

 

[Jamdoc]

Another of these ideas that make no sense.

This idea of "justice" is based on the human view and experience that violations of law cannot be rectified at all, and that retribution - that is: "equal" violations that are simply deemed "lawful" - somehow makes up for it.
It's a very human idea, and there is absolutely no reason why it should apply to an eternal omnipotent God.

You have it backwards.
God is the objective source of morals and laws.
not humans
note that when humans reject God they reject objective morality and morality all becomes relative.

 

[klutedavid]

Evolution cannot be stimulated because it is not something that a being has control over. Evolution happens regardless of whether a person or being wants it to happen or not.

You can directly control evolution.

I can breed rats with certain evolutionary attributes and keep breeding them. To reinforce those attributes.

 

[AV1611VET]

It's a very human idea, and there is absolutely no reason why it should apply to an eternal omnipotent God.

God requires justice; a higher kind of justice than we can afford ourselves.

And since we can't meet that measure of justice, God meets it for us.

Romans 3:24 Being justified freely by his grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus:
25 Whom God hath set forth to be a propitiation through faith in his blood, to declare his righteousness for the remission of sins that are past, through the forbearance of God;
26 To declare, I say, at this time his righteousness: that he might be just, and the justifier of him which believeth in Jesus.

It's like a judge assessing a trillion dollar fine on someone, or they'll spend all eternity in jail; then that judge paying the fine himself.

Our own attempts at justification doesn't cut it.

For the record, there are three types of judgement that God meets out:

1. Justice = getting what we deserve = Hell
   
2. Mercy = not getting what we deserve
3. Grace = getting what we don't deserve = Heaven

And guess which one God offers?

Ephesians 2:8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: