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John Baptized because the Holy Spirit wants to share the pattern of his life and the perfection he attained. That was to make a way to the Lord.
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Yes. All the examples that people have given are analogies, comparing something or other that's initiatory to sacramental Baptism, which is the initiation sacrament by which a person becomes a part of Christ's church.Baptism has many meanings beyond water immersion. I think there might be something lost in the translation to English, that makes so many people today think it can only refer to being dunked in water.
It's not sacramental baptism.How is Holy Spirit baptism an analogy?
So important that it's a question you didn't address.How can baptism be required for salvation?" is one of the most important questions I've seen on this forum.
Ah, I see, you would rather turn it into a rant.highlights the unbridgeable gulf that exists between Scripture teaching and man-made church tradition.
Baptism through water is the norm for the sacrament of Baptism, but not the only way to receive the sacrament.
John 3:5 Jesus answered, “Truly, truly, I say to you, unless one is born of water and the Spirit, he cannot enter the kingdom of God. RSVCE
Such shame Matthew 7:22-23 is omitted. 22 On that day many will say to me, ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name, and cast out demons in your name, and do many mighty works in your name?’ 23 And then will I declare to them, ‘I never knew you; depart from me, you workers of lawlessness.’
Many Christians claim that the most important thing is to know Jesus. No, the most important is whether Jesus knows you.
Correct, if you wish the word "Baptism" look elsewhere in the Bible:I don't see the word "baptize" in that verse.
That is certainly questionable, considering that there are almost NO churches that teach that baptism is required for salvation."How can baptism be required for salvation?" is one of the most important questions I've seen on this forum.
Well, that's also true of churches which only accept people into membership upon their testimony about having "genuinely placed their faith in Christ."It highlights the unbridgeable gulf that exists between Scripture teaching and man-made church tradition. Tradition's Sacrament of Baptism accepts people into church memberhip who have never genuinely placed their faith in Christ.
I agree but that doesn't mean holy spirit baptism is a symbol for believers baptism. Just the opposite actually. It's not called baptism because it's comparing the two. They are both different forms of submersion.It's not sacramental baptism.
It's another experience that is called a 'baptism' by comparision. When Jesus said to go into the world, preach the Gospel, and baptize the new members, he was quite obviously not speaking there of what is called the Baptism of the Holy Spirit.
That's true. HS Baptism is not a different way of referring to sacramental Baptism. Really, though, there is a limit to how many words can be used in a fanciful, figurative sense, before almost everything can be made to mean something other than what it is.I agree but that doesn't mean holy spirit baptism is a symbol for believers baptism. Just the opposite actually. It's not called baptism because it's comparing the two. They are both different forms of submersion.
You have put your finger on the point I was trying to make. John's baptism of Jesus in the River Jordan is not described in Scripture as having been done by submerging Christ under the waters, but some churches insist that it was done that way.What is known now as the one Baptism began to take place when Jesus was Baptized by John. Jesus was immersed in John's pattern of life and his righteousness.
I think Jesus demonstrated how a Baptism works. He had to be driven into the desert by the HS. That wasn't what he ever would do Himself. He was eating and drinking John was fasting.You have put your finger on the point I was trying to make. John's baptism of Jesus in the River Jordan is not described in Scripture as having been done by submerging Christ under the waters, but some churches insist that it was done that way.
And then to add to that speculation made into a doctrine they sometimes do what you did here and use a word that doesn't appear at all in that Bible passage, then treat it in a non-literal sense to produce support for their doctrine. Thus, the guess about immersion in the River Jordan's waters becomes immersion in John's pattern of life. See the red lettering above.
If we are free to do that, we can make up an endless series of unScriptural doctrines and claim that they are actually Scriptural. The famous joke about what automobile Jesus wants us to drive comes to mind. It's a Honda, of course, because we have the Bible's word on it where believers are instructed to be in or with "one ACCORD." (Acts 5:12 and many others)
Are you saying Jesus was not Baptized or just not with water?And then to add to that speculation made into a doctrine they sometimes do what you did here and use a word that doesn't appear at all in that Bible passage, then treat it in a non-literal sense to produce support for their doctrine. Thus, the guess about immersion in the River Jordan's waters becomes immersion in John's pattern of life. See the red lettering above
Your rebuttal doesn't address the theology it nit pics the translation.That's not related to what we're discussing.