How are you saved?

[Danthemailman]

No one knows they are saved until after they die, when Christ grants them eternal on Judgement Day. That's why salvation is described as a "hope" (ie, not a certainty) in more than twenty NT verses.

The "seal" of the Holy Spirit is conditional - it can be broken by loss of faith or serious sin. It is not an irrevocable ticket to Heaven.

1 John 5:13 - These things I have written to you who believe in the name of the Son of God, so that you may know that you have eternal life. (before we die)

In regards to salvation being described as a “hope,” this hope is not some uncertain cross your fingers kind of hope. Unlike the english word "hope," the N.T. word contains no uncertainty; it speaks of something that is certain. - Strong's #1680 elpís (from elpō, "to anticipate, welcome") – properly, expectation of what is sure (certain); hope. If we have saving faith in Christ then we have this hope. Faith is the assurance of things hoped for.. (Hebrews 11:1) So that being justified by His grace we would be made heirs according to the hope of eternal life. (Titus 3:7)

Nowhere does the Bible say that the seal of the Holy Spirit can be broken and it’s conditional on believing the gospel.

Ephesians 1:13 - In Him you also trusted, after you heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation; in whom also, having believed, you were sealed with the Holy Spirit of promise, 14 who is the guarantee of our inheritance until the redemption of the purchased possession, to the praise of His glory.

2 Corinthians 1:21 - Now He who establishes us with you in Christ and has anointed us is God, 22 who also has sealed us and given us the Spirit in our hearts as a guarantee.

Ephesians 4:30 - And do not grieve the Holy Spirit of God, by whom you were sealed unto/for the day of redemption.

 

[Danthemailman]

Born again Christians know they are saved already. You can examine yourself and know whether you walk in the Holy Spirit or not. Especially in persecution, millions were martyred, yet even when they were tortured, and they children were tortured, they did not deny Christ, but prayed for their enemies. Such fruit of the Spirit cannot be produced by unsaved.

Now, it is true that even the fake Christians think they are saved as they are blinded by their own sin.

Now do you want to explain where in the Bible you read that salvation can be lost? It is a false teaching, please study this carefully.

Amen! There are genuine Christians and there are “nominal/pseudo” Christians. There are genuine believers and there are make believers and it’s not uncommon to find them mixed together in various churches and on various Christian forum sites.

 

[SabbathBlessings]

When one believes in Jesus - is that all encompassing - believing in His teachings or does it mean to “just believe in Jesus” but I can do whatever I want. The devil believes, so I don’t think its the latter.

When a mother tells their child “don’t touch the hot stove because you will get burned” does the child show belief when they stay away from the stove or touch it anyway?

 

[Buzzard3]

Born again Christians know they are saved already

They can think what they like, but it won't help them come Judgement Day ... they will all be judged by Christ and he won't give a cracker about what they think.

It's interesting that, unlike the born-again Christians you mention, the writers of the NT didn't know they were "saved already", because they describe salvation as a "HOPE" in at least twenty verses. Funny that.

Born again Christians know they are saved already

Did Jesus send you a ticket to Heaven when you got saved? If so, please post a photo of it online.

How do you know you won't lose your faith one day? Do you have a crystal ball?

Especially in persecution, millions were martyred, yet even when they were tortured, and they children were tortured, they did not deny Christ, but prayed for their enemies. Such fruit of the Spirit cannot be produced by unsaved.

Fair point, but that is an exceptional, end-of-life circumstance.
How do you know you won't deny Christ under torture and threat of death?

Now do you want to explain where in the Bible you read that salvation can be lost?

I didn't say "salvation can be lost" ... on the contrary, I believe salvation cannot be lost. A believer gains salvation only after being judged worthy of it by Christ on Judgement Day ... once gained on that day, it cannot be lost.

But on the other hand, a believer can lose his hope of salvation in this life thru loss of faith or serious sin.

 

[Buzzard3]

This is of benefit, because Christians who are utterly confident in their sanctity and election may be tempted by pride and may be more easily lured into immoral conduct based on spiritual delusion based on a false sense of security. This makes OSAS a dangerous doctrine, because it does nothing to promote good works, which most believers in Sola Fide consider to be the fruits of a living faith.

Very well said.

I think there's a lot of pride, delusion (and worse) going on in "born-again" Christianity. The "vibe" I get from those so-called churches is not exactly uplifting and reassuring.

 

[d taylor]

Nice try, but no cigar.

"will not inherit" in that verse means "will not enter".

In other words, Paul is preaching salvation thru faith and works.

And the word dog actually mean cat, etc....

It is interesting how people will redefine words and verses just to simply say i am right your are wrong.

When it comes to keeping their beloved theology going, have at then buddy, smoke them cigars.

 

[Buzzard3]

In regards to James 2:24, James is not using the word "justified" here to mean "accounted as righteous" but is shown to be righteous. James is discussing the evidence of faith (says-claims to have faith but has no works/I will show you my faith by my works - James 2:14-18) and not the initial act of being accounted as righteous with God. (Romans 4:2-3)

In the Strong's Exhaustive Concordance of the Bible, the Greek word for justified "dikaioo" #1344 is:

1. to render righteous or such he ought to be
2. to show, exhibit, evince, one to be righteous,such as he is and wishes himself to be considered
3. to declare, pronounce, one to be just, righteous, or such as he ought to be

In Matthew 12:37, we read - "For by your words you will be justified, and by your words you will be condemned." This is because our words (and our works) reveal the condition of our hearts. Words/works are evidences for, or against a man being in a state of righteousness.

God is said to have been justified by those who were baptized by John the Baptist (Luke 7:29). This act pronounced or declared God to be righteous. It did not make him righteous. The basis or ground for the pronouncement was the fact that God IS righteous. Notice that the NIV reads, "acknowledged that God's way was right.." The ESV reads, "they declared God just.." That is the "sense" in which God was "justified." He was shown to be righteous.

Matthew 11:19 "The Son of Man came eating and drinking, and they say, 'Behold, a gluttonous man and a drunkard, a friend of tax-gatherers and sinners!' Yet wisdom is justified/vindicated/shown to be right by her deeds."

So man is saved through faith and not by works (Ephesians 2:8,9; Titus 3:5; 2 Timothy 1:9); yet genuine faith is substantiated, evidenced by works. (James 2:14-24)

Christ saves us through faith based on the merits of His finished work of redemption "alone" and not based on the merits of our works.

It is through faith "in Christ alone" (and not based on the merits of our works) that we are justified on account of Christ (Romans 3:24; 5:1; 5:9); yet faith that justifies does not remain alone (unfruitful, barren) if it is genuine. (James 2:14-24) *Perfect Harmony*

The unrighteous practice sin (1 Corinthians 6:9-10; Galatians 5:19-21); not the righteous, who are born of God. (1 Corinthians 6:11; 1 John 3:9)

Galatians 5:21 - ..those who practice such things will not inherit the kingdom of God.

1 John 3:9 - No one who is born of God practices sin, because His seed abides in him; and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.

1 Corinthians 6:9 clearly states that it’s the unrighteous (unbelievers) who will not inherit the kingdom of God.

1 Corinthians 6:11 - Such were some of you; but you were washed, but you were sanctified, but you were justified in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ and in the Spirit of our God.

Paul clearly states in Romans 3:23 that all have sinned and come short of the glory of God. (Unbelievers and believers alike). In Romans 6:23 we see that the wages of sin is death, but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord. *Only believers will receive eternal life through Jesus Christ.

Whatever, bro. All I need to know is that Scripture says sin can mean the difference between a believer making it to Heaven and ending up in hell.

In Gal 5 and 1Cor 6, Paul warns believers that their sins can result in them not inheriting "the kingdom of heaven".

In Romans 6, Paul says "What then? Are we to sin because we are not under law but under grace? By no means!", then warns believers that "the wages of sin is death".

1John 2:3-5 says a beliver who disobeys God's commandments is "a liar, and the truth is not in him".

In Matt 7:21-23, Jesus denies salvation to certain believers due to their "lawlessness".

"There is sin which is deadly" (1John 5:16).

In Rev 3:4, Jesus declares certain believers "worthy" of eternal life based on their works. And when Jesus judges the seven churches in Rev 2 and 3, "works" are mentioned ten times.

 

[Danthemailman]

Whatever, bro. All I need to know is that Scripture says sin can mean the difference between a believer making it to Heaven and ending up in hell.

In Gal 5 and 1Cor 6, Paul warns believers that their sins can result in them not inheriting "the kingdom of heaven".

In Romans 6, Paul says "What then? Are we to sin because we are not under law but under grace? By no means!", then warns believers that "the wages of sin is death".

1John 2:3-5 says a beliver who disobeys God's commandments is "a liar, and the truth is not in him".

In Matt 7:21-23, Jesus denies salvation to certain believers due to their "lawlessness".

"All wrongdoing is sin, but there is sin that is not deadly" (1John 5:17) ... which implies that there is sin that is "deadly".

In Rev 3:4, Jesus declares certain believers "worthy" of eternal life based on their works. And when Jesus judges the seven churches in Rev 2 and 3, "works" are mentioned ten times.

You seem to be confusing ‘descriptive’ passages of scripture with ‘prescriptive’ passages of scripture and the end result is salvation by works. Also, in Matthew 7:21-23, we discover that Jesus never knew these ‘workers of lawlessness,’ which is not descriptive of genuine believers. (1 John 3:9-10)

Matthew 7:21 - Not everyone who says to me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter the kingdom of heaven, but only the one who does the will of my Father who is in heaven.

John 6:40 - For my Father’s will is that everyone who looks to the Son and believes in him shall have eternal life, and I will raise them up at the last day.

 

[Buzzard3]

1 John 5:13 - These things I have written to you who believe in the name of the Son of God, so that you may know that you have eternal life. (before we die).

That verse is of course directed at all believers, so in effect, you're saying it means all believers will gain eternal life. But not all believers will, therefore it can't mean what you think it means.

Here's what it could mean:
In 1John 1:2 and 3:5, John uses the term "eternal life" as another name for Christ. So, "you may know that you have eternal life" in 1John 5:13 could well mean, "you may know that you have Christ, who is the means of obtaining eternal life".
Knowing you have the means of obtaining eternal life is not the same as knowing you have already gained eternal life.

In regards to salvation being described as a “hope,” this hope is not some uncertain cross your fingers kind of hope. Unlike the english word "hope," the N.T. word contains no uncertainty; it speaks of something that is certain. - Strong's #1680 elpís (from elpō, "to anticipate, welcome") – properly, expectation of what is sure (certain); hope.

Oh, so "hope" means "certainty". Well, silly me ... I've misunderstood what "hope" means my whole life! I "hope" I win the lottery means I'm "certain" to win the lottery.

Our hope is certain because we have full confidence in God's promise, but God's promise is conditional, so the possibility exists that not all believers will remain within the conditions. Besides that, it is Christ who decides our eternal fate - not us - so we hope he will judge in our favour.

If we have saving faith in Christ then we have this hope.

In which Bible verse did you find the term "saving faith"? What does it mean?

If we have saving faith in Christ then we have this hope.

If a believer loses his faith, he loses his hope of salvation. That is one reason salvation is described as a hope and not a certainty.

Nowhere does the Bible say that the seal of the Holy Spirit can be broken and it’s conditional on believing the gospel.

When does a believer get the seal of the Holy Spirit?

 

[Buzzard3]

When one believes in Jesus - is that all encompassing - believing in His teachings or does it mean to “just believe in Jesus” but I can do whatever I want. The devil believes, so I don’t think its the latter.

It's not the latter, but it's disturbing how many Christians believe it is.

 

[Buzzard3]

You seem to be confusing ‘descriptive’ passages of scripture with ‘prescriptive’ passages of scripture and the end result is salvation by works.

Please explain.

Also, in Matthew 7:21-23, we discover that Jesus never knew these ‘workers of lawlessness,’

How did they get the power to prophesy, cast out demons and perform miracles in Jesus' name if Jesus "never knew" them?

Do you think "I never knew you" might be a figure-of-speech which means something like, "I disown you, therefore it's as if I never knew you"?

which is not descriptive of genuine believers. (1 John 3:9-10)

Please explain.

John 6:40 - For my Father’s will is that everyone who looks to the Son and believes in him shall have eternal life, and I will raise them up at the last day.

It is also the "Father's will" that we OBEY his Son and keep his commandments:

"If you love me, you will KEEP MY COMMANDMENTS" (John 14:15).

In fact, if a believer doesn't keep his commandments, he is "a liar, and the truth is in him" (1 John 2:3-5) ... which means he is not in Christ ... we means he has no hope of salvation.

And here's the Father identifies his "offspring" ...
"those who KEEP THE COMMANDMENTS OF GOD and bear testimony to Jesus." (Rev 12:17).

And just in case you missed it the first time, here's how the Father identifies his "saints" ...
"those who KEEP THE COMMANDMENTS OF GOD and the faith of Jesus. (Rev 14:12)

 

[Buzzard3]

And the word dog actually mean cat, etc....

It is interesting how people will redefine words and verses just to simply say i am right your are wrong.

When it comes to keeping their beloved theology going, have at then buddy, smoke them cigars.

That's the thing about rubbish doctrines ... they beget more rubbish in order to make them "fit" Scripture ... such as twisting and inventing idiotic interpretations of words.

However I will admit that such rubbish can be quite entertaining. For example, claiming that "inheriting the kingdom of God" and "entering the kingdom of God" are two different things ... now that's pretty funny!
Got any more like that?

 

[Danthemailman]

That verse is of course directed at all believers, so in effect, you're saying it means all believers will gain eternal life. But not all believers will, therefore it can't mean what you think it means.

All believers will gain eternal life. (John 2:12; 3:18; Acts 13:39; 16:31; 1 John 5:13 etc..).

Here's what it could mean:
In 1John 1:2 and 3:5, John uses the term "eternal life" as another name for Christ. So, "you may know that you have eternal life" in 1John 5:13 could well mean, "you may know that you have Christ, who is the means of obtaining eternal life".

What it “could” mean? Really? Are you grasping for straws?

Knowing you have the means of obtaining eternal life is not the same as knowing you have already gained eternal life.

John 5:24 - Most assuredly, I say to you, he who hears My word and believes in Him who sent Me has everlasting life, and shall not come into judgment, but has passed from death into life. I believe John.

Oh, so "hope" means "certainty". Well, silly me ... I've misunderstood what "hope" means my whole life! I "hope" I win the lottery means I'm "certain" to win the lottery.

I already gave you the Biblical definition of hope from the Greek.

Our hope is certain because we have full confidence in God's promise, but God's promise is conditional, so the possibility exists that not all believers will remain within the conditions. Besides that, it is Christ who decides our eternal fate - not us - so we hope he will judge in our favour.

Your theology is full of too many conditions and too much uncertainty.

In which Bible verse did you find the term "saving faith"? What does it mean?

Simple descriptive term for faith that saves. In contrast with an empty profession of faith/dead faith that cannot save. (James 2:14)

If a believer loses his faith, he loses his hope of salvation. That is one reason salvation is described as a hope and not a certainty.

Show me the words, “loses faith/loses salvation” in scripture.

When does a believer get the seal of the Holy Spirit?

When they believe the gospel. (Ephesians 1:13)

 

[Buzzard3]

All believers will gain eternal life.

... except those believers who lose their faith (Luke 8:13, Heb 6) or are disowned by Christ on Judgement Day due to their sins (Matt 7:21-23).

What it “could” mean? Really? Are you grasping for straws?

I knew that perspective would be a bit too much for you. It's not my idea, actually ... I got it from Scott Hahn, a Professor of Theology.

John 5:24 - Most assuredly, I say to you, he who hears My word and believes in Him who sent Me has everlasting life, and shall not come into judgment, but has passed from death into life. I believe John.

Conditional ... on abiding in Christ, by keeping his commandments ... so says John, whom you claim to believe:

"And by this we may be sure that we KNOW HIM, if we keep his commandments. He who says “I know him” but DISOBEYS HIS COMMANDMENTS is a LIAR, and the TRUTH IS NOT IN HIM; but whoever keeps his word, in him truly love for God is perfected. By this we may be sure that we are IN HIM: he who says he abides in him ought to walk in the same way in which he walked." (1John 2:3-6)

Simple descriptive term for faith that saves. In contrast with an empty profession of faith/dead faith that cannot save. (James 2:14)

Oh, I think get it ... James preaches salvation thru faith and works, so "saving faith" is just another way of saying "salvation thru faith and works".

I already gave you the Biblical definition of hope from the Greek.

To claim that "hope" means "certain" is to be intellectually dishonest.

Show me the words, “loses faith/loses salvation” in scripture.

Luke 8:16 - Jesus said some "believe for a while", then "fall away". Sounds like "loses faith" to me.
Heb 6 - "partakers of the Holy Spirit" fall away into "apostasy". Sounds like "loses faith" to me.

As for "loses salvation", I never said that.

When they believe the gospel. (Ephesians 1:13)

So what about all those who believed the gospel but are now atheists? Are they still sealed by the Holy Spirit? If not, that means the seal can be broken, does it not?

 

[Danthemailman]

Please explain.

An example of a ‘descriptive’ passage of scripture would be 1 John 2:3-4. By this we know that we have come to know Him, (already know Him/already saved/demonstrative evidence) if we “keep” (Greek word “tereo” - guard, observe, watch over) His commandments. 4 The one who says, “I have come to know Him,” and does not keep His commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him. So the former is descriptive of believers and the latter is descriptive of unbelievers. You use the word “believer” too loosely.

How did they get the power to prophesy, cast out demons and perform miracles in Jesus' name if Jesus "never knew" them?

There are false prophets who prophecy in the name of Jesus and even make false prophecies. Also, Satan may grant the power to one of his agents to cast out demons from another of his agents in order to gain attention and loyalty from an audience for his evil agenda. In Matthew 10:1, we also see that Jesus gave His 12 disciples power over unclean spirits, to cast them out, and to heal all kinds of sickness and all kinds of disease. This would include Judas Iscariot, yet Jesus referred to Judas Iscariot as an unbelieving, unclean devil who would betray Him! (John 6:64-71; 13:10-11). Apparently, Judas believed that Jesus' name has the power to cast out demons but did not truly believe in His name (John 1:12) and become a child of God, but instead was the son of perdition. (John 17:12)

Do you think "I never knew you" might be a figure-of-speech which means something like, "I disown you, therefore it's as if I never knew you"?

No. Jesus did not say I once knew you but don’t know you anymore. The Greek word “never” is oudepote. This is a very strong Greek word meaning “not ever, not even ever.”

Please explain.

You really need an explanation for 1 John 3:9-10? - No one who is born of God practices sin, because His seed abides in him; and he cannot sin, because he is born of God. 10 By this the children of God and the children of the devil are obvious: anyone who does not practice righteousness is not of God, nor the one who does not love his brother. Can you not see the contrast here between children of God and children of the devil?

It is also the "Father's will" that we OBEY his Son and keep his commandments:

"If you love me, you will KEEP MY COMMANDMENTS" (John 14:15).

Yes, AFTER we have been saved. Yet people who Jesus NEVER knew were NEVER saved so these many people in Matthew 7:21-23 failed to do the Father’s will of believing in Jesus unto salvation. (John 6:40) It’s also not the Father’s will for us to keep the commandments as a legalistic prescription for salvation. We are not saved by works or law keeping. (Romans 4:2-6; 10:1-4; Ephesians 2:8,9; Galatians 2:16; Titus 3:5; 2 Timothy 1:9 etc..).

Now there is a difference between doing God's will IN ORDER TO BECOME SAVED:

John 6:40 - For my Father’s will is that everyone who looks to the Son and believes in him shall have eternal life, and I will raise them up at the last day.

AND doing God's will AFTER WE HAVE BEEN SAVED:

1 Thessalonians 5:14 - Now we exhort you, brethren, warn those who are unruly, comfort the fainthearted, uphold the weak, be patient with all. 15 See that no one renders evil for evil to anyone, but always pursue what is good both for yourselves and for all. 16 Rejoice always, 17 pray without ceasing, 18 in everything give thanks; for this is the will of God in Christ Jesus for you.

In fact, if a believer doesn't keep his commandments, he is "a liar, and the truth is in him" (1 John 2:3-5) ... which means he is not in Christ ... we means he has no hope of salvation.

Here you go again using the word “believer” too loosely and confusing descriptive with prescriptive.

And here's the Father identifies his "offspring" ...
"those who KEEP THE COMMANDMENTS OF GOD and bear testimony to Jesus." (Rev 12:17).

Identifies. Descriptive. Demonstrative evidence.

And just in case you missed it the first time, here's how the Father identifies his "saints" ...
"those who KEEP THE COMMANDMENTS OF GOD and the faith of Jesus. (Rev 14:12)

I did not miss it and I understand the difference between genuine believers and make believers. BTW please explain to me WHICH commandments that you believe are in view here and also what it means to KEEP them. Are the 10 commandments under the old covenant of law in view here? Does “keep” mean flawlessly obey them? Have you flawlessly obeyed them 100% of the time?

 

[Danthemailman]

... except those believers who lose their faith (Luke 8:13, Heb 6) or are disowned by Christ on Judgement Day due to their sins (Matt 7:21-23).

In regards to Luke 8:13, unlike saving belief, temporary, shallow belief is not rooted in a regenerate heart. How can no depth of earth, no root, no moisture, no fruit, represent saving belief? It doesn't. Also the same Greek word for believe "pisteuo" is used in James 2:19, in which we read that the demons believe "mental assent" that "there is one God," but they are not saved.

Not all belief is the same. Even though this shallow ground hearer in Luke 8:13 is said to have "believed," yet he is never said to have been "saved." How do we know that the shallow ground hearer was never actually "saved"? I will explain the reasons.

First, his heart condition is contrasted with that of the "good ground" hearer in the 4th soil, who's heart was "good" and "honest." Thus, his heart was not "good," being like the soil to which it corresponds, being "shallow" or "rocky," lacking sufficient depth. Such soil represents a sinner not properly prepared in heart. People who "believe" and "rejoice" at the preaching of the gospel without a prepared heart, and without a good and honest heart, and without having "root" in themselves, do not experience real salvation.

IN CONTRAST TO - Mark 4:8 - But other seed fell on good ground and yielded a crop that sprang up, increased and produced: some thirtyfold, some sixty, and some a hundred. Luke 8:15 says, But the ones that fell on the good ground are those who, having heard the word with a noble and good heart, keep it and bear fruit with patience. So the rocky soil represents a person not properly prepared in heart and the seed planted ends up with a lack of "root" (lack of being firmly planted, or established) and good soil represents a person properly prepared in heart who having heard the word with a noble and good heart, keeps it and bears fruit with patience.

In regards to Hebrews 6, see post #330 from the link below:

CAN YOU LOSE YOUR SALVATION AND ETERNAL LIFE?

I knew that perspective would be a bit too much for you. It's not my idea, actually ... I got it from Scott Hahn, a Professor of Theology.

Conditional ... on abiding in Christ, by keeping his commandments ... so says John, whom you claim to believe:

You are misinterpreting John. He is not teaching “type 2 works salvation” by commandment keeping. Genuine believers abide in Christ. Make believers (like Judas Iscariot) do not.

"And by this we may be sure that we KNOW HIM, if we keep his commandments. He who says “I know him” but DISOBEYS HIS COMMANDMENTS is a LIAR, and the TRUTH IS NOT IN HIM; but whoever keeps his word, in him truly love for God is perfected. By this we may be sure that we are IN HIM: he who says he abides in him ought to walk in the same way in which he walked." (1John 2:3-6)

These descriptive passages of scripture do not support works salvation.

Oh, I think get it ... James preaches salvation thru faith and works, so "saving faith" is just another way of saying "salvation thru faith and works".

You obviously don’t get it and James teaches that works are the evidence of faith and not that we are saved by works as you teach.

To claim that "hope" means "certain" is to be intellectually dishonest.

I quoted the Greek word and definition, but you seem to prefer the non-biblical cross your fingers definition.

Luke 8:16 - Jesus said some "believe for a while", then "fall away". Sounds like "loses faith" to me.
Heb 6 - "partakers of the Holy Spirit" fall away into "apostasy". Sounds like "loses faith" to me.

Already previously explained.

As for "loses salvation", I never said that.

Those specific words are found nowhere in scripture.

So what about all those who believed the gospel but are now atheists? Are they still sealed by the Holy Spirit? If not, that means the seal can be broken, does it not?

Those who once claimed to have believed the gospel, but are now atheists, demonstrate that their belief was never firmly rooted and established from the start. Such people believed in vain - without cause or purpose, to no effect. (1 Corinthians 15:1-4)

 

[Buzzard3]

Those who once claimed to have believed the gospel, but are now atheists, demonstrate that their belief was never firmly rooted and established from the start. Such people believed in vain - without cause or purpose, to no effect. (1 Corinthians 15:1-4)

You didn't answer my question. Upon believing the gospel, a believer receives the seal of the Holy Spirit ... if that person loses their faith, are they still sealed by the HS?

 

[Danthemailman]

You didn't answer my question. Upon believing the gospel, a believer receives the seal of the Holy Spirit ... if that person loses their faith, are they still sealed by the HS?

I did answer your question.

 

[Buzzard3]

I did answer your question.

I asked you about the seal, but your answer didn't say anything at all about the seal.

 

[Danthemailman]

I asked you about the seal, but your answer didn't say anything at all about the seal.

Believers are sealed until the redemption of the purchased possession/unto/for the day of redemption. (Ephesians 1:13-14; 4:30)