Holiness

[Frogster]

Debating helped me learn, so i can't be against it, but i really think the way we have done it it causes contention that undermines the work of the holy Spirit in us. I don't know something just doesn't fit.

well yeah, debating, sparring, it is after all a thelogy section, theology has been deabted forever, it is fun, we learn, and it is like full contact karate, only no contact needed.

 

[Frogster]

Man's righteousness must come from God. All righteousness comes from God. By disobeying God, Adam & Eve began to operate according to their own righteousness, determining good and evil for themselves. Through the Cross, mans "righteousness" is exposed for the evil it is-filthy rags worn in place of the genuine thing, the true perfection or righteousness God created for man to wear. He wants us to wear it again-adorned with the innocence He always intended.

Good morning.

 

[fhansen]

Good morning.

Morning Frogster-how goes it? Whaddaya think-should we be contentious today?

 

[Frogster]

Morning Frogster-how goes it? Whaddaya think-should we be contentious today?

Not bad, nice talking with ya last night, have a good one...

 

[fhansen]

Not bad, nice talking with ya last night, have a good one...

Yes, I enjoyed it. And I don't think people need to worry so much about the contention. We're all pilgrims on a journey. Jesus actually told us His truth would cause division and if we're all sincere in seeking truth then some conflict and struggle is necessary and leads to growth-that's sort of the way life is. We can do it in love, as many have said, knowing God alone has the truth down perfectly.

 

[from scratch]

Here's how i look at holiness and the law. We all know that just thinking something makes us guilty of it, but Gods gives us his grace, we cannot be perfected in the flesh only the spirit, but the flesh wars against the spirit so we must forsake works of the flesh if we want to walk in the spirit and bear Good fruit. We must choose to limit what our eyes see if we want to limit what we think about. We will never be free of evil thoughts 100% maybe, but if we want to think good things we must not look at bad things. Even though we are forgiven for every sin we confess to God, we can't bear good fruit if our minds our corrupted by works of the flesh. Its not necessarily that we sinned in those evil thoughts, even though we did, its mostly about bearing good fruit that is pleasing to God and those thoughts war against that good fruit. Its most likely impossible to always have good thoughts because things enter our mind that we don't want there, even so we must choose to cast down these evil thoughts and we can only do it through effort on our part through prayer and censoring what we see and hear to only good things. Only then will we be able to walk in the spirit and bear good fruit for God. Sin wars against the Spirit and if we choose to indulge in sinful thoughts we will bear bad fruit. But if we cast those thoughts down by not indulging in them and also limit what we see to only good things, over time we will begin to think more good and less bad, and in the process we will begin to bear good fruit of the spirit. Sinful thoughts are violence, lust, the love of money and power, hate, revenge, and anything that glorifies sin. TV is just plain evil. We must sensor what we watch, this doesn't mean we can't watch an action flick every once in a while necessarily, but we need to identify what bad fruit we bear and stay away from those things as much as possible. Children get brainwashed by TV and music so its no wonder they are so disrespectful and sinful in todays world.


So the law is not bad, its designed to help us. If we think something is sin then for us its sin and we shouldn't do it because it makes us enemies to God. However it goes deeper than that, we cant get close to God by sinning, and also if we use the law to think we are righteous then we abuse the law because its designed so that we can get closer to God and love Him and each other. I think maybe its about loving God through obedience, loving each other and bearing Good fruit of the Spirit..

It isn't that thoughts in our mind that are sin. They become sin only when we take possion of them as our own and dwell on them. This is the begining of the physical act.

 

[Frogster]

Yes, I enjoyed it. And I don't think people need to worry so much about the contention. We're all pilgrims on a journey. Jesus actually told us His truth would cause division and if we're all sincere in seeking truth then some conflict and struggle is necessary and leads to growth-that's sort of the way life is. We can do it in love, as many have said, knowing God alone has the truth down perfectly.

I like Father Groschele..spelled it wrong though.

 

[from scratch]

But with the holy Spirit guiding us by using the whole bible, we can't be lead astray even by a simple mistranslation of a word, as long as we are open minded seeking truth and walk by faith and not sight, God teaches us Himself. We don't need to know everything, just trust God and pray for His help to understand and obey, if we do that Gods grace is sufficient for us. I love Jesus and know i belong to Him, only the Holy Spirit can tell us this. The closer we get to God in prayer and obedience, the closer He gets to us and the more we see how awesome and loving He really is.

I agree about using the whole Bible. Now tell me why Jer 31:31-34 is dismissed in this mix. And tell me why the very word so Jesus are dismissed as found in the Gospels.

 

[from scratch]

I heard someone say one time that the word perfect is actually mistranslated. They said the word was hard to translate from the original language for some reason that i now forget. They claimed the word would be better translated to mean mature instead of perfect. I don't now if this is true or not. Just sharing it.

Now that I would agree to.

 

[from scratch]

"Be ye perfect ..." is in the future tense, ie be becoming perfect.

As God "is perfect", thus be becoming conformed to the image and likeness of God toward completion.

Points coming your way.

 

[from scratch]

Yep, that's why i don't like restaurants.

I'm not afraid of Jesus, just afraid of not following Him. I love Jesus.

That rhelm of operation is so sad.

 

[from scratch]

dang this thread has moved fast!

The fearsome twosome are in the top 4

from scratch 49

11822 39

JRSut1000 22

Frogster 22

Now outta date. Thisngs can happen fast here. What is the new score? But thanks for the kudos.

 

[brinny]

Heeeeey, is this a race, mon?

 

[from scratch]

James said "cleanse ye hands ye sinners, and humble yourselves before God".

Wow did this thing ever move on out with speed. I'm amazed at how much I missed while playing in the dirt (garden work) yesterday.

 

[LittleLambofJesus]

Originally Posted by LittleLambofJesus dang this thread has moved fast!
The fearsome twosome are in the top 4

Now outta date. Thisngs can happen fast here. What is the new score? But thanks for the kudos.

You can see that for yerself by clicking on the # under "replies"

11822 93
from scratch 81
Frogster 57

Other than that, I am giving this a "rest"

http://www.christianforums.com/t7576552/#post58539660
The Rest in Jesus

 

[from scratch]

"Be ye perfect ..." is in the future tense, ie be becoming perfect.

As God "is perfect", thus be becoming conformed to the image and likeness of God toward completion.

How is be ye perfect future?

 

[Thekla]

How is be ye perfect future?

In the Greek text, it's in the future tense.

 

[LittleLambofJesus]

Originally Posted by Thekla
"Be ye perfect ..." is in the future tense, ie be becoming perfect.

As God "is perfect", thus be becoming conformed to the image and likeness of God toward completion.

Originally Posted by from scratch How is be ye perfect future?

In the Greek text, it's in the future tense.

Which verse are we talking about?

 

[from scratch]

And there is a "we have to", can't avoid that one! Being a Christian DOES have responsibilities and part of that IS obeying whatever He commands whether it's in His Word, or whether it's personal (prophetic) direction He gives us.

And what does Who command for the Christian. So yes I would agree that part of the holiness equasion is obedeince. But that obedience is or must be to the right thing(s).

I've tried to get the pro law camp to identify those things a few times to no avail. Seems like they try to find the answers in the wrong covenant.

 

[from scratch]

You kept changing number . You went from "we" to "a Christian" to "us" .
There is no "*we* have to" unless *we* will all be judged by any singular one of us not doing the "have to" . If we are not punished all together , we don't have a "have to" together .

Gotta be fluid to support one's ideas these days. Nothing is stable.