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Help me understand...

Discussion in 'Eschatology - Endtimes & Prophecy Forum' started by Josiah, Jan 27, 2002.

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  1. Josiah

    Josiah Super suction ears away!

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    ...why so many people believe the rapture will be a silent event when 1 Thess. 4:16 says:
    For the Lord himself will come down from heaven, with a loud command, with the voice of the archangel and with the trumpet call of God, and the dead in Christ will rise first.

    ...just curious... :)

    Even so come, Lord Jesus!
     
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  2. Christsoldier

    Christsoldier So, I'm an apologetic!

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    I believe believers(those who have accepted Christ)will hear the shout and the trump, but non believers will not. Making it possible for the Antichrist to deceive them with whatever story he chooses to allay their questions.

    Hope this helps. I had better add this is my own personal opinion. :D
     
  3. rollinTHUNDER

    rollinTHUNDER Veteran

    +8
    United States
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    Hello Josiah,
    I have never run across this in the scriptures. So unless I just missed it, what you are asking for is opinions here. I'll give it my best shot.

    The loud command from the voice of the Archangel, and the trumpet call of God will only be heard in heaven. He will come like a thief in the night, and thiefs try not to make noise. I believe the command is for the angels to go get the believers. They will then gather the elect from the earth, and bring them to stand before the Son of Man, in the clouds. What an awesome day that will be!
     
  4. Josiah

    Josiah Super suction ears away!

    312
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    Amen to that! Whether it is heard or not it will DEFINITELY be a GREAT DAY!!
    I don't know...It just seems like there are a lot of people determining specifically how things will happen when we don't really have all the specifics...at least it seems that way to me. I WILL say that it may be due to my misunderstanding or lack of GREATER in-depth study (or lack of vision while studying).

    Anyway...I look forward to meeting you all! (HOPEFULLY SOON!!!)
     
  5. rollinTHUNDER

    rollinTHUNDER Veteran

    +8
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    Hey Josiah,
    I wouldn't start putting myself down if I were you. You are learning, just like everyone else is. I'm still learning too. When we get to the point that we know it all, we won't be on this earth anymore. Yes, it's true that some know more than do others, but hey. That goes with everything. The more you put into something, the more you're gonna get out of it. This is a great place to come and get your knowledge increased. Hang in there Dude, and never stop seeking, there is always more treasure to be found. See Ya!!
     
  6. camaro540

    camaro540 Regular Member

    318
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    Messianic
    First off, there is no "rapture"..... The word is not even
    in the word of God.

    The trumps, are events that take place. So, if you have eye's
    to see, and ears to hear, then in that sense, you will hear
    them, and realize what is happening.

    Our Father, Christ, does not return untill the 7th trump.
    Anti-christ comes before our Father, in the 6th trump.

    "Here is wisdom. Let him that hath understanding count the number of the beast: for it is the number of a man; and his number [is] Six hundred threescore [and] six"

    Anti-christ, the dragon, satan, whatever name you chose to use,
    will be here at the;

    6th trump
    6th seal
    6th vial

    666..... Pretty easy to understand if you want to.....

    satan will be here claiming to be Christ, but he is the false christ.
    And those who chose to believe his "babel" (meaning confusion),
    will recieve his mark. Those who chose to follow Jesus, will recieve
    God's (YHVH) mark.

    If you want to "fly away" with satan, then thats your choice, our
    Creator has given all of us free will to choise if we want to love
    Him (YHVH), or follow satan.....
     
  7. Josiah

    Josiah Super suction ears away!

    312
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    You're right. but did you also know the word "Bible" is not in the Word of God? That's a moot point. It's just a term used to describe the "catching away" of the saints.

    From what I understand from the Word of God, there will be a rapture (let's say, catching away) of the church before God's wrath is poured out. Scripture supports this. But I know you have your views so I'm not trying to dissuade you or say "I'm right, you're wrong, la la la la la la"...It's not a point for argument. If you love Jesus and He is your savior, you're my brother and I'll see ya in the New Jerusalem!

    (I'll just be there 7 years earlier! :D :D )
     
  8. Mandy

    Mandy Well-Known Member

    +7


    What do you mean by "Our Father, Christ"?
     
  9. TheBear

    TheBear Free Agent

    +1,662
    Atheist
    Private
    Touche! Josiah,

    As a matter of fact, the word 'Trinity' is not used in the Bible, either. :D
     
  10. camaro540

    camaro540 Regular Member

    318
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    Messianic
    Okay, lets see here. Lets start I guess with
    John 1:1-14 I will not type this all out, grab
    your Bible and read if you like.

    As you can read there, Jesus, Yashua, The Christ is God.
    Jesus is the living word. If thats not as cut and dry as it
    get's, I don't know what is....

    Okay, on to the so called "Rapture" doctrine.

    Read Ezekiel, chapter 13, verse 20. After that, I suggest you
    read all of chapter 13. God is dealing with, and will deal with
    all of these so called preachers. God and His people run from
    nothing. Why? Well, there is nothing to run from.

    Also, read Matthew chapter 24 again, only this time stick with
    the subject, and don't run off in your head where ever it wants
    to go. If you need help, the subject is: Verse 6.
    The one taken in the field is taken by the false christ. Read
    verse 46. Blessed is that servant, whom his lord when he cometh
    shall find so doing.

    Also, read Mark 13. God has told us all things, time to get crackin.
     
  11. rollinTHUNDER

    rollinTHUNDER Veteran

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    Notice very carefully that one will be taken, and the other left. This is not about some boogie man Anti-christ coming to sneak up on and snatch out one of every two. The one out of two means half. Half of the church will be ready when the bridegroom comes for them. The other half will be tried by fire, or purified. Go to the next chapter of the book, Matt. 25:, and see this truth, the parable of the ten virgins. Only half are true believers, they are watching and waiting, they are ready. These were the five wise virgins.

    But the other half were not ready, they were foolish, and they will get left behind. For these five, Gods gift is no longer free. They will have to shed their own blood now, not to buy their way into heaven, but they will be overcome by the Anti-christ. He will be given power to overcome the saints, but not the church. These foolish ones will have to refuse the mark of the beast to live in heaven.

    The bride will have made herself ready, or pure, or a true believer. She will be prepared when Jesus calls for her to join Him. Only half of the body will go.

    She (the bride) will be taken out of the body, just like Eve was taken out of Adams body. The rest of the body- some have accepted Jesus as their savior, but weren't ready, - or have let the cares of this world or false doctrine mis-lead them. They will go through the first 3 1/2 years of the tribulation, so they can be purified by fire. See Rev. 3:14-19....
     
  12. M.O.G.

    M.O.G. New Member

    47
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    OK, time for the M.O.G. to get involved!

    The Rude Dude will handle this! :)
    <<-------say's it right there :)

    camaro540


    John 1:1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.

    What does that say!!! WITH That word would not be there if you my friend made sence.

    You see God, Jesus & the Holy Spirit were all there from the beginning.

    John 1:1 just talks about the 2, Jesus & God and how they are One (the H.S. also) and from the beginning.

    So what this is I dont have a clue! your weird dialect

    >>>>Our Father, Christ, does not return untill the 7th trump.
    Anti-christ comes before our Father, in the 6th trump.



    Is that a biblo-englo language? Are you a "Jesus only" member??

    Your junk>>>Okay, on to the so called "Rapture" doctrine.

    Read Ezekiel, chapter 13, verse 20. After that, I suggest you
    read all of chapter 13. God is dealing with, and will deal with
    all of these so called preachers. God and His people run from
    nothing. Why? Well, there is nothing to run from.


    This does not even pertain to the Rapture!


    This does!
    1Th 4:17-18 Then we which are alive [and] remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord. 18 Wherefore comfort one another with these words.


    As in the greek word "Harpazo" which means "snatch up" or to "lift". "Rapture" is the Latin word for the same.

    Example: Act 8:39 And when they were come up out of the water, the Spirit of the Lord caught away Philip, that the eunuch saw him no more: and he went on his way rejoicing.


    This is jiberish by you >>>> God is dealing with, and will deal with all of these so called preachers. God and His people run from nothing. Why? Well, there is nothing to run from.


    And this shows me you dont have a clue as to the teaching on the subject of the rapture or the tribulation.

    Your junk >>>>Also, read Matthew chapter 24 again, only this time stick with
    the subject, and don't run off in your head where ever it wants
    to go. If you need help, the subject is: Verse 6.
    The one taken in the field is taken by the false christ. Read
    verse 46. Blessed is that servant, whom his lord when he cometh
    shall find so doing.


    THIS IS PURE POOP FRIEND >>>>your junk >>>6th trump

    6th seal
    6th vial

    666..... Pretty easy to understand if you want to..... OH PLEASE

    satan will be here claiming to be Christ, but he is the false christ.
    And those who chose to believe his "babel" (meaning confusion),
    will recieve his mark. Those who chose to follow Jesus, will recieve
    God's (YHVH) mark .

    If you want to "fly away" with satan, then thats your choice, our
    Creator has given all of us free will to choise if we want to love
    Him (YHVH), or follow satan.....


    Show me some of that from the real Bible
    You my friend dont appear to know squat about the Word of God!


    M.O.G.
     
  13. rollinTHUNDER

    rollinTHUNDER Veteran

    +8
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    Married
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    WOE - NELLY!!

    I sure can feel the temperture risin' now. Time to take a dip, and maybe someone will also need a drink, to cool that tongue down.
    No doubt ! ! ! ! Time to split >>>>>>>>>>>>>>
     
  14. M.O.G.

    M.O.G. New Member

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    Sorry rollin! I just cant bare that gargage matched up with that attitude. So I got blunt! :)
     
  15. Josiah

    Josiah Super suction ears away!

    312
    +1
    Yes, Christ is God, BUT He is not the Father. The Father is separate from The Son as is The Spirit...

    Anyway, I'll respond to the other half later...
     
  16. Josiah

    Josiah Super suction ears away!

    312
    +1
    M.O.G., Brother, go a little easy!

    Colossians 4:6
    Let your conversation be always full of grace, seasoned with salt, so that you may know how to answer everyone.

    Blunt isn't necessarily always good! :) :)

    (I know when I let myself get that way and respond that way, it makes me feel pretty crappy when I come to my senses. Jesus' way is always best.) :)
     
  17. M.O.G.

    M.O.G. New Member

    47
    +0

    Hey Dude, :)


    >>>Blunt isn't necessarily always good!


    But in some cases a good thing. Paul rebuked peter "to his face", the "heat" got pretty heavy between Paul & Barnabus over John mark (Mark). And Jesus did get pretty upset with those pharisees.

    Truthfully though bro, I'm not hot about it at all. People will or will not listen, and I see he's one that wont. I basiclly gave him what he gave us because there's to many sunday face's at this forum. I'm a pretty forward person some times that's all. I dont put on a face, and at the same time I dont "go off" just because I'm offended. I gave hime some of his own medicne :)


    We Love all bro, doesn't mean we have to like them. :D

    God bless Bro! :)


    M.O.G.
     
  18. Josiah

    Josiah Super suction ears away!

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    God bless, M.O.G.

    :)
     
  19. rkbo

    rkbo Member

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    I hear ya MOG. If we all had the same personality it'd be a boring world.

    Camaro you sound like a oneness penticostle to me. You my friend are not letting God speak to you in his Word. Slow down and take another look. I fear you may be letting others lead you astray. I will ask you this one thing: What must you do to be saved?
     
  20. Apologist

    Apologist 2 Tim. 2:24-26

    +10
    Christian
    Also consider the verse under my forum name: 2 Tim 2:24-26:

    "And &#65279;a servant of the Lord must not quarrel but be gentle to all, &#65279;able to teach, &#65279;&#65279;patient, &#65279;25&#65279; &#65279;&#65279;in humility correcting those who are in opposition, &#65279;&#65279;if God perhaps will grant them repentance, &#65279;&#65279;so that they may know the truth, &#65279;26&#65279; and that they may come to their senses and &#65279;escape the snare of the devil, having been taken captive by him to do his will."

    God Bless my friends :)
     
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