Anti-Christ European Have I found the framework for the Seven Year Covenant?(Agreement)

David Kent

Continuing Historicist
Aug 24, 2017
2,173
663
86
Ashford Kent
✟116,777.00
Country
United Kingdom
Faith
Baptist
Marital Status
Married
Politics
UK-Conservative
Yes he does, but I wouldn't expect you to see it because from all your other posts I can see you do not understand prophecy or are not called to understanding prophecy, not everybody is. You can call a chicken a cat, but that don't make it a cat.
#

I don't think most of you have any understanding of prophecy. You disagree with all the church from the reformation till about 1825. You disagree with the pre-reformers like the Hussites and Valensians and also the early church writers.
 
Upvote 0

Revealing Times

Well-Known Member
Jun 15, 2016
2,845
420
59
Clanton Alabama
✟108,106.00
Faith
Protestant
Marital Status
Married
No, I have not. The two witnesses will be killed on day 1260. The 7th vial takes place at the very end of the 7 years.

You getting what iamlamad is saying confused as being me saying those things.
I wont get into semantics, but you were telling me that the 2nd Woe and the 3rd Woe was all basically the same time frame. Now allow me to show you the 1260th Day in REAL TIME.

Rev. 6:1 And I saw when the Lamb opened one of the seals, and I heard, as it were the noise of thunder, one of the four beasts saying, Come and see. 2 And I saw, and behold a white horse: and he that sat on him had a bow; and a crown was given unto him: and he went forth conquering, and to conquer. {The Anti-Christ goes forth to Conquer at the Midway Point (Dan. 9:27) and yet you have to Two-Witnesses dying at this point in time, even though there is 6 more Seals to be opened and 6 Trumpet have to be sounded before they die. Now there is only 21 Judgments in Revelation, and 13 Judgments pass before the Two-witnesses die, yet you would have us believe they die on the VERY FIRST DAY when the Anti-Christ comes forth to Conquer even though we know they die at the 6th Trumpet or 2nd Woe. The 3.5 year period of Gods Wrath is the Seals, Trumpets and Vials and thus there is a perfect symmetry to this time period. The FIRST SEAL is not where the Two-Witnesses die, your time-frame is warped/off-center brother.

And no, you saying the Two Witnesses die at the 1260 is what is truly confusing brother.

What you are not getting is that there has to be a day on the timeline that causes terror to the wicked men of the earth that Jesus is about to execute Judgement on them.

Otherwise they would not gather their armies as Armageddon to make war on Jesus.
The Day of the Lord starts that timeline. The Two-Witnesses show up LIKE SCRIPTURES SAY (Malachi 4:5-5) BEFORE the Great and Dreadful Day of the Lord. Thus the 1260 mark is the Day of the Lord, he opens the FIRST SEAL (Lambs/Gods Wrath) and everything springs forth from there.

The men of earth only understand at the 6th Seal that they are in the Day of the Lord, but they have been in it since the First Seal. God is protecting Israel fr 1260 Days and bringing Plagues against the World (Babylon) for 1260 Days, the Two-Witnesses bring forth many of these Plagues it seems via PRAYER, they do not die at the FIRST SEAL.

They know they are in the Day of the Lord, they understand they have received the Mark of the beast, so they have NO HOPE, they must fight against God, they are damned.


The 1290 days from the day when the AOD is setup, day 1185, is the day, day 2475 on the timeline, that Jesus appears in heaven, drawing this reaction....

15 And the kings of the earth, and the great men, and the rich men, and the chief captains, and the mighty men, and every bondman, and every free man, hid themselves in the dens and in the rocks of the mountains; 16 And said to the mountains and rocks, Fall on us, and hide us from the face of him that sitteth on the throne, and from the wrath of the Lamb: 17 For the great day of his wrath is come; and who shall be able to stand?

The above is the 6th Seal, not day 2475. You are trying to say all the Earthquakes are the same I guess, they are not !! Again, you have the 6th Seal night at the end, when the first Seal is opened at the MIDWAY POINT, then you have the Two-Witnesses dying before the 6TH Seal at day 1260, even thought they die WAY LATER at the Second Woe.

THIS JUST IN !!

Seal 1
Seal 2
Seal 3
Seal 4
Seal 5
Seal 6

Seal 7 which is ALL 7 TRUMPETS........
Trumpet 1
Trumpet 2
Trumpet 3
Trumpet 4
Trumpet 5 = 1st Woe
Trumpet 6 = 2nd Woe......Two- Witnesses DIE HERE....Not at the 6th Seal !!!!!

Trumpet 7 = 3rd Woe or ALL SEVEN VIALS........
Vial 1
Vial 2
Vual 3
Vial 4
Vial 5
Vial 6 = Armageddon
Vial 7 = Jesus Second Coming
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Your time-line is just weird brother, it matches noting in the book of Revelation.
 
Upvote 0

Douggg

anytime rapture, non-dispensationalist, futurist
May 28, 2009
28,777
3,419
Non-dispensationalist
✟359,569.00
Country
United States
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Private
I wont get into semantics, but you were telling me that the 2nd Woe and the 3rd Woe was all basically the same time frame.
A woe is not a timeframe. A woe is something bad that happens.
 
Upvote 0

Revealing Times

Well-Known Member
Jun 15, 2016
2,845
420
59
Clanton Alabama
✟108,106.00
Faith
Protestant
Marital Status
Married
What Revelation 12 shows is that there are 1260 days before the war in heaven. And a time, times, half times after the war in heaven.

The time, times, half times in Daniel 12:7 matches the time, times, half times in Revelation 12 following the war in heaven.
It does no such thing brother. This whole chapter is about the Woman FLEEING. The first 6 verses is just setting up a code for us to understand the passage. It shows the LAST HALF of the 70th Week thus it mentions 1260 days.

You guys spend so much time arguing with me because it flies right by you at Mach 2 that (1) the timeframes are expressed differently for a reason, and that (2) the like timeframe expressions go together.
No, your math doesn't add up. Which made me wonder if you made F's in math.

The 42 months in Revelation 11:2 and Revelation 13:5 go together.

Neither chapter is a REAL TIME EVENT. Unless you meant Dan.12 But I think you meant Rev.

The 42 months in Revelation 11:2 and Revelation 13:5 go together.
SAME HERE..........Neither is a REAL TIME EVENT.

The time, times, half times in Daniel 7:25, Daniel 12:7 and Revelation 12:14 go together
Well yea, but you still get the TIME-LINE all wrong.

That's how you can start to piece together the events on a timeline. The worse thing a person can do is start equating the different time expressions as exact equivalents of each other, such as equating the 42 months as being the 1260 days.
42 Months is 1260 days.........as is a time, times, and half time as is the Middle of the Week.
 
Upvote 0

Revealing Times

Well-Known Member
Jun 15, 2016
2,845
420
59
Clanton Alabama
✟108,106.00
Faith
Protestant
Marital Status
Married
#

I don't think most of you have any understanding of prophecy. You disagree with all the church from the reformation till about 1825. You disagree with the pre-reformers like the Hussites and Valensians and also the early church writers.
I can see what you believe, its the same stuff I discounted 30 years ago. And you got it from OTHER MEN, not God.
 
Upvote 0

BABerean2

Newbie
Site Supporter
May 21, 2014
20,614
7,484
North Carolina
✟893,665.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
It shows the LAST HALF of the 70th Week thus it mentions 1260 days.


Daniel Chapter 9: Dr. Kelly Varner

Based on Matthew 10:5-7, and Galatians 1:14-18, the 70th week of Daniel was the time period the Gospel of the New Covenant was taken "first" to Daniel's people during the first century.


.
 
  • Agree
Reactions: David Kent
Upvote 0

iamlamad

Lamad
Jun 8, 2013
9,616
744
78
Home in Tulsa
✟101,763.00
Country
United States
Faith
Word of Faith
Marital Status
Married
Yes he does, but I wouldn't expect you to see it because from all your other posts I can see you do not understand prophecy or are not called to understanding prophecy, not everybody is. You can call a chicken a cat, but that don't make it a cat.


No he doesn't, its the Angel or Jesus offering up that nugget in verse 6.

Dan. 12:6 And one said to the man clothed in linen (Not Daniel), which was upon the waters of the river, How long shall it be to the end of these wonders?

7 And I heard the man clothed in linen, which was upon the waters of the river, when he held up his right hand and his left hand unto heaven, and sware by him that liveth for ever that it shall be for a time, times, and an half; and when he shall have accomplished to scatter the power of the holy people, all these things shall be finished.

If you can't understand the KJV you might to to switch to the ESV:

Dan. 12:5 Then I, Daniel, looked, and behold, two others stood, one on this bank of the stream and one on that bank of the stream. 6 And someone said to the man clothed in linen, who was above the waters of the stream, “How long shall it be till the end of these wonders?”

7 And I heard the man clothed in linen, who was above the waters of the stream; he raised his right hand and his left hand toward heaven and swore by him who lives forever that it would be for a time, times, and half a time (1260 Days), and that when the shattering of the power of the holy people comes to an end all these things would be finished.

If you can't get the writing of the KJV, like many seemingly can't, you need to switch to another version, this is CLEARLY saying that there will be 1260 days after the holy people are scattered or Israel FLEES JUDEA until all these things are finished.

Hasn't it hit you yet that hes says for a time, times and half time and then John tells us in Revelation chapter 12 that the Woman is protected for a time, times and half a time.

Rev. 12:14 And to the woman were given two wings of a great eagle(God gonna protect her), that she might fly into the wilderness, into her place, where she is nourished for a time, and times, and half a time (1260 Days), from the face of the serpent.

The Anti-Christ comes forth in the Middle of the Week, at the 1260 day mark and Conquers Jerusalem, thus hes the Beast for 42 Months or 1260 Days, thus the Woman Israel is protected in the Wilderness for a time, times and half time of 1260 days. Its tells you when these Wonders will be up right there in a multi-faceted way.

Again, ANYONE with common sense understand the 1290 can't come after the 1260. Its IMPOSSIBLE.




Except 1290 can not be the Midway point of 2520 days now can it? That is my point, it can not be on the other side of the MIDWAY POINT which is 1260 days else the holy people/Israel would have fled before the AOD was set up. And that can not be. I use simple logic, you guys seems to try to create a big picture first.



That is no in the bible, that's just coming from you right?

The Bible in verse 6 says the Holy People are scattered for 1260 days, but it says the Abomination is set up 30 days before they are scattered at 1290. It has to be before because if 1290 is AFTER the 1260 how could the Abomination of Desolation make them FLEE when they have already FLED? Its simple logic. We know Israel is protected for 1260 days, so how are they going to FLEE before the Abomination is set up, which tells us the 1290 is before the 1260.

And there is no SACRIFICE Mentioned in the Hebrew text, its the DAILY...There is no mention of the word Sacrifice, it was added by the English translators. So its the Daily Oblation/Tribute to Jesus or God that is taken away because God sends Elijah back BEFORE the Great and Dreadful Day of the Lord to turn Israel back to God. (Malachi 4:5-6)



That is not what it says at all.

Dan. 12:8 I heard, but I did not understand. Then I said, “O my lord, what shall be the outcome of these things?” 9 He said, “Go your way, Daniel, for the words are shut up and sealed until the time of the end. 10 Many shall purify themselves and make themselves white and be refined, but the wicked shall act wickedly. And none of the wicked shall understand, but those who are wise shall understand.

11 And from the time that the regular burnt offering (DAILY is all the Hebrew Says) is taken away and the abomination that makes desolate is set up, there shall be 1,290 days. 12 Blessed is he who waits and arrives at the 1,335 days. 13 But go your way till the end. And you shall rest and shall stand in your allotted place at the end of the days.”

From the time the DAILY (OBLATION) is taken away, AND the Abomination of Desolation is set up (these two are CONJOINED)........There SHALL BE 1290 Days !!

Its pretty obvious I am right here when you look at the ESV instead of the KJV which you guys have a trouble seeing as it is of course wrote in an OLD FASHIONED WEIRD WAY !!

When you understand that each number of Days is a set number of days from an EVENT until the Second Coming or the END OF THESE WONDERS, it might come to you.

The 1335 has to be before the 1290 because the 1290 has to be before the 1260.

As per how I get the Oblation........look at Daniel 9:21.

Dan. 9:21 Yea, whiles I was speaking in prayer, even the man Gabriel, whom I had seen in the vision at the beginning, being caused to fly swiftly, touched me about the time of the evening oblation.

There is an EVENING and a MORNING Oblation. ts a TRIBUTE unto God, the 23000 is not 2300 DAYS but 2300 EVENINGS & MORNINGS Meaning 1150 Days.

It doesn't have to be a Sacrifice of an Animal.
My mistake: it was an angel asking for Daniel. Daniel heard it.
And you are still missing the intent of the author. You are close.

OF COURSE it will be 1260 days from the abomination to the end. John has told us this three different ways. The woman begins to flee at the midpoint, and she will be protected for the 3 1/2 years. But whether John tells us 1260 days, or 42 months, of gives it in years, IT IS THE SAME LAST HALF OF THE WEEK.

But the 1290 is just another 30 days ADDED to the 1260. If you read in Revelation you see that Jesus does not come in chapter 16 at the 7th vial that ends the week. No, He comes LATER as shown in chapter 19. I suspect it will be 30 days later.

And you don't understand the 1335 either! It is SO SIMPLE: just add another 45 days to the 1290 days. This means 75 days added AFTER the end of the week. I guess you just don't understand, the 1260 days is the FIRST PART of the 1290. IT is simple arithmetic: the 1260 days count will end before the 1290 day count by 30 days.
 
Upvote 0

iamlamad

Lamad
Jun 8, 2013
9,616
744
78
Home in Tulsa
✟101,763.00
Country
United States
Faith
Word of Faith
Marital Status
Married
What Revelation 12 shows is that there are 1260 days before the war in heaven. And a time, times, half times after the war in heaven.

The time, times, half times in Daniel 12:7 matches the time, times, half times in Revelation 12 following the war in heaven.

You guys spend so much time arguing with me because it flies right by you at Mach 2 that (1) the timeframes are expressed differently for a reason, and that (2) the like timeframe expressions go together.

The 1260 days in Revelation 11:3 and 12:6 go together.

The 42 months in Revelation 11:2 and Revelation 13:5 go together.

The time, times, half times in Daniel 7:25, Daniel 12:7 and Revelation 12:14 go together

That's how you can start to piece together the events on a timeline. The worse thing a person can do is start equating the different time expressions as exact equivalents of each other, such as equating the 42 months as being the 1260 days.
This is how you have been confused. Go together? In a way, they do, but they are about different events that cover the same period of time.

While the city is being trampled, the Beast will have his authority.
While the two witnesses are testifying, those in Judea will flee.
 
Upvote 0

iamlamad

Lamad
Jun 8, 2013
9,616
744
78
Home in Tulsa
✟101,763.00
Country
United States
Faith
Word of Faith
Marital Status
Married
What you are not getting is that there has to be a day on the timeline that causes terror to the wicked men of the earth that Jesus is about to execute Judgement on them.

Otherwise they would not gather their armies as Armageddon to make war on Jesus.

19 And I saw the beast, and the kings of the earth, and their armies, gathered together to make war against him that sat on the horse, and against his army.

The 1290 days from the day when the AOD is setup, day 1185, is the day, day 2475 on the timeline, that Jesus appears in heaven, drawing this reaction....

15 And the kings of the earth, and the great men, and the rich men, and the chief captains, and the mighty men, and every bondman, and every free man, hid themselves in the dens and in the rocks of the mountains; 16 And said to the mountains and rocks, Fall on us, and hide us from the face of him that sitteth on the throne, and from the wrath of the Lamb: 17 For the great day of his wrath is come; and who shall be able to stand?
When anyone mixes chapter 6 events with later events, making believe they are the same, we know that confusion reigns.

By the time the midpoint of the week arrives, the events of the 6th seal will be over and done with by 3.5 years. Believe it for it is truth.
 
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

jgr

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
Feb 25, 2008
9,692
5,007
✟784,067.00
Country
Canada
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Married
I can see what you believe, its the same stuff I discounted 30 years ago. And you got it from OTHER MEN, not God.
Sounds much like what LDS, JW, and other cults declare; sole possession of truth, and repudiation of prophetic history, and those OTHER MEN within it whose faith and sacrifice purchased the spiritual liberties used to disparage them today.

It's time for another Reformation.
 
Upvote 0

Revealing Times

Well-Known Member
Jun 15, 2016
2,845
420
59
Clanton Alabama
✟108,106.00
Faith
Protestant
Marital Status
Married
My mistake: it was an angel asking for Daniel. Daniel heard it.
And you are still missing the intent of the author. You are close.

OF COURSE it will be 1260 days from the abomination to the end. John has told us this three different ways. The woman begins to flee at the midpoint, and she will be protected for the 3 1/2 years. But whether John tells us 1260 days, or 42 months, of gives it in years, IT IS THE SAME LAST HALF OF THE WEEK.
Let me reverse it then, you are close......:tonguewink:

But the 1290 is just another 30 days ADDED to the 1260. If you read in Revelation you see that Jesus does not come in chapter 16 at the 7th vial that ends the week. No, He comes LATER as shown in chapter 19. I suspect it will be 30 days later.

Here you went off the rails a wee bit because you confuse the book of Revelation. Its not in chronological order. Revelation 19 is a Vision all on its on just like Rev. 11 has the 2nd Woe (Rev.9) and the 3rd Woe (All Seven Vials which are in Rev. 16). So its duplicitous in many aspects.

Rev. ch. 13 starts at the Midway point, as does Rev. ch. 12. So both start at the First Seal or in Rev. ch. 6. Rev. chapter 16 says IT IS DONE and shows Jesus returning to the Mt. of Olives, defeating the Armies of Armageddon and destroying Babylon (the Worlds Governments).

Rev. chapters 4, 5 and 7 is the Raptured Church in Heaven at various times. I see Rev. 19 as the Churches whole Seven Year Period in Heaven or close to a full seven year period. The Church Marries the Lamb, then Returns with the Lamb to destroy the Armies at Armageddon, which has already happened in Rev. ch. 16.

So both Rev. ch. 16 and 19 (Last part of 19) is the EXACT SAME EVENT. As is the WINE-PRESS of Rev. ch. 14, also Rev. ch. 18 is Babylon (World Governments) getting pelted with all 21 Judgments, the Seals, Trumpets and Vials.

So the 30 days you are adding on is being added to a NON EXISTENT EVENT. That is why you can't get the 1290 right, you actually think there is 1290 days after the AOD, until the end and on into the 1000 year reign I guess. BUT NO, its all about the Second Coming. And its 1260 days until the END OF THOSE WONDERS. Thus the 1290 must also end at the Second Coming and the 1335 must end at the Second Coming also. The abomination (1290) has to happen before the 1260, and when we understand that each NUMBERED EVENT must count from the NUMBERED EVENT until the Second Coming, then and only then can we understand this in full.

And you don't understand the 1335 either! It is SO SIMPLE: just add another 45 days to the 1290 days. This means 75 days added AFTER the end of the week. I guess you just don't understand, the 1260 days is the FIRST PART of the 1290. IT is simple arithmetic: the 1260 days count will end before the 1290 day count by 30 days.

This amuses me, not being a smarty pants, but when people get a thought process in their heads it takes a mule to move them off that thought pattern sometimes, I guess its just human nature.

The first point by the Angel/Jesus was until the END OF THESE WONDERS, meaning until Jesus Returns, meaning until these Troubles were over, meaning until the END OF THE AGE. So none of the three NUMBERS go past the Second Coming, they are all speaking of the SAME EVENT via the End Times, the Second Coming !!

Why would anyone assume that we/you/they would be blessed for getting 75 Days past the Second Coming but not be Blessed for the Previous 75 days? LOL. Whoever gets to the Second Coming will be BLESSED FROM THAT POINT ON........EUREKA !! Light switch comes on !!

There is a huge KEY in Dan. ch. 12 and everyone is BRAIN LOCKED because of old thinking. The 1290 is the Abomination of Desolation. Daniel says that 12:11

11 And from the time that the daily sacrifice shall be taken away, and the abomination that maketh desolate set up, there shall be a thousand two hundred and ninety days..........(Till the Second Coming)

So the 1335 event is also from a point in time, until the Second Coming.

They Key is understanding that the Abomination of Desolation has to be set up before the Conquering begins. We always thought the Anti-Christ Conquered then came into the Temple. But lets look at the facts brother. I think I can convince you the Abomination of Desolation is set up before the Anti-Christ Conquers Jerusalem.

1.) If the Beast had Conquered Jerusalem would he not control all the people and thus kill them at that very moment? But in Matthew 24 Jesus says when you SEE the AOD Flee, so they are free to flee (Not Conquered yet), so the 1290 is set up 30 days before the Anti-Christ Conquers Jerusalem.

2.) Who sets up the Image? BOOM !! The Religious Beast !! (False Prophet)

Rev. 13:11 And I beheld another beast coming up out of the earth; and he had two horns like a lamb, and he spake as a dragon. 12 And he exerciseth all the power of the first beast before him, and causeth the earth and them which dwell therein to worship the first beast, whose deadly wound was healed. 13 And he doeth great wonders, so that he maketh fire come down from heaven on the earth in the sight of men,

14 And deceiveth them that dwell on the earth by the means of those miracles which he had power to do in the sight of the beast; saying to them that dwell on the earth, that they should make an image to the beast, which had the wound by a sword, and did live. 15 And he had power to give life unto the image of the beast, that the image of the beast should both speak, and cause that as many as would not worship the image of the beast should be killed.

Why is it this man (False Prophet) rises up Second but interacts with Israel before the First Beast? Because the other Beast has SEVEN HEADS, its been around for eons, it will be officially revived when it Conquers Jerusalem in 30 days. The Man/Anti-Christ is already president of the E.U., but he will only become the BEAST once he conquers Jerusalem. That will happen 30 Days after the Abomination of Desolation is set up, hence the 1290 comes before the 1260. I don't know why God choose me to give me these secrets, but he also told me in a vision in 1986 that the "Man of Sin is Here" so he is in the world now. He does as He wills, I am just following the Spirit.

Dan. 9:27 shows this Abomination is an IMAGE when you look at all the root words. Let me see of I can find it on the web. FOUND IT:

Dan. 9:27 And he shall confirm the covenant with many for one week: and in the midst of the week he shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease, and for the overspreading of abominations he shall make it desolate, even until the consummation, and that determined shall be poured upon the desolate.

1.) Confirm = gabar 1396 (Hebrew Word) meaning to be strong, to prevail or to act insolently.
2.) Oblation = minchah 4503 (Hebrew) A tribute or an offering
3.) Overspreading = kanaph 3671 (Hebrew) An edge, a Wing or Quarter (of a building) a pinnacle. 4.) Abominations = shiqquwts 8251 (Hebrew) Meaning, Disgusting, Filthy, Idolatrous or AN IDOL !
5.) Desolate = shamem 8074 (Hebrew) Meaning to Stun, Grown Numb, to Stupefy, or to Devastate!

So looking at these original Hebrew word translations, what is this verse (Daniel 9:27) really telling us ? Does it match up with other end time events ? Lets delve into it !! Basically this is what I get from verse 27.

Daniel 9:27 The Anti-Christ will FORCE and Agreement (Covenant means agreement) on Israel and others, probably the Muslims. He does so Insolently, his agenda Prevails, he forces this deal. Then after 3 1/2 years he stops allowing the Oblation or Tribute, (I think to Jesus, who Israel accepts as their Messiah before the Day of the Lord as it says in Malachi 4:5-6) by Israel unto their God, the False Prophet places an IDOL in a Wing or a pinnacle of the TEMPLE and demands all people to worship this IDOL or else they must die. THIS STUNS/SHOCKS OR DEVASTATES Israel, then they heed Jesus' words, they Flee unto the Wilderness where they are protected by God for 1260 Days, because Elijah turned them back to the Messiah (Zechariah 12:10) before the Day of the Lord.

Daniel 9:27 shorter version........The Anti-Christ will force a Peace Deal on Israel, in the Middle of this deal he will renege on is deal, and order the False Prophet to place an Image of the Beast (IDOL) in the Temple, and demand all mankind to worship this Image. This Stuns Israel, devastates them.

Do further scriptures agree with this account ?

Revelation 13:14 And deceiveth them that dwell on the earth by the means of those miracles which he had power to do in the sight of the beast; saying to them that dwell on the earth, that they should make an image to the beast, which had the wound by a sword, and did live.

15 And he had power to give life unto the image of the beast, that the image of the beast should both speak, and cause that as many as would not worship the image of the beast should be killed.

Matches up pretty well. Seems like the False Prophet Places an IMAGE OF THE BEAST in the Temple and it eventually comes alive, but this happens 30 days before the Anti-Christ is allowed to go forth an Conquer Jerusalem.














 
Last edited:
Upvote 0

David Kent

Continuing Historicist
Aug 24, 2017
2,173
663
86
Ashford Kent
✟116,777.00
Country
United Kingdom
Faith
Baptist
Marital Status
Married
Politics
UK-Conservative
Sounds much like what LDS, JW, and other cults declare; sole possession of truth, and repudiation of prophetic history, and those OTHER MEN within it whose faith and sacrifice purchased the spiritual liberties used to disparage them today.

It's time for another Reformation.

True. It would be useful if they knew the history of apocalyptic interpretation and who started the Jesuit futurist teaching.

Although futurists general deny Jesuit input, Dispesantionalist Clarence Larkin in his book, Dispensational Truth said

"The "Futurist School" interprets the language of the Apocalypse "literally, " except such symbols as are named as such, and holds that the whole of the Book, from the end of the third chapter, is yet "future" and unfulfilled, and that the greater part of the Book, from the beginning of chapter six to the end of chapter nineteen, describes what shall come to pass during the last week of "Daniel's Seventy Weeks." This view, while it dates in modern times only from the close of the Sixteenth Century, is really the most ancient of the three. It was held in many of its prominent features by the primitive Fathers of the Church, and is one of the early interpretations of scripture truth that sunk into oblivion with the growth of Papacy, and that has been restored to the Church in these last times. In its present form it may be said to have originated at the end of the Sixteenth Century, with the Jesuit Ribera, who, actuated by the same motive as the Jesuit Alcazar, sought to rid the Papacy of the stigma of being called the "Antichrist, " and so referred the prophecies of the Apocalypse to the distant future. This view was accepted by the Roman Catholic Church and was for a long time confined to it, but, strange to say, it has wonderfully revived since the beginning of the Nineteenth Century, and that among Protestants. It is the most largely accepted of the three views., It has been charged with ignoring the Papal and Mohammedan systems, but this is far from the truth, for it looks upon them as foreshadowed in the scriptures, and sees in them the "Type" of those great "Anti-Types" yet future, the "-Beast" and the "False Prophet." The "Futurist" interpretation of scripture is the one employed in this book."


The great error of Larkin in his outline of history, is that the early church taught no such thing. They taught that the let and hindrance in 2 Thess 2 was the Emperor and the Empire and also that the Temple in Revelation referred to the church and the 144,000 were christian martyrs. All directly opposed to futurism, but in line with historicism.

 
Upvote 0

Davy

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
Nov 25, 2017
4,861
1,022
USA
✟267,597.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Private
Hi Davy,

I don`t see where God says Babylon = Jerusalem. I see Sodom and Egypt = Jerusalem.

Maybe you don`t realise but the US and the UN are rebuilding Babylon. You can see it on utube. The world is waiting for the fighting to subside and then there will be a tourist rush to see the oldest civilization in the world. A great money making venture. You will see it rise and become very popular.

regards, Marilyn.

YouTube has a lot of make-believe junk on it. The old city of Babylon still lays barren and a waste, just like God said it would. Those who try to rebuild it will no doubt suffer a similar end like Sadam who tried to rebuild it. Didn't they find Sadam like a wild animal in a hole? Nebuchadnezzar, king of Babylon, was made to live like a wild beast when he tried to play God also (Dan.4).

Rev 18:24
24 And in her was found the blood of prophets, and of saints, and of all that were slain upon the earth.
KJV

Rev 18:20
20 Rejoice over her, thou heaven, and ye holy apostles and prophets; for God hath avenged you on her.
KJV


That's more than enough to show that Revelation is pointing directly to Jerusalem as the Babylon harlot for the end.


Matt 23:37
37 O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, thou that killest the prophets, and stonest them which are sent unto thee, how often would I have gathered thy children together, even as a hen gathereth her chickens under her wings, and ye would not!
KJV
 
Upvote 0

BABerean2

Newbie
Site Supporter
May 21, 2014
20,614
7,484
North Carolina
✟893,665.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
When anyone mixes chapter 6 events with later events, making believe they are the same, we know that confusion reigns.

By the time the midpoint of the week arrives, the events of the 6th seal will be over and done with by 3.5 years. Believe it for it is truth.

Mat 24:29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:

Mat 24:30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.

Mat 24:31 And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.



Rev 6:12 And I beheld when he had opened the sixth seal, and, lo, there was a great earthquake; and the sun became black as sackcloth of hair, and the moon became as blood; (The moon does not give its normal bright light during a blood moon.)

Rev 6:13 And the stars of heaven fell unto the earth, even as a fig tree casteth her untimely figs, when she is shaken of a mighty wind.

Rev 6:14 And the heaven departed as a scroll when it is rolled together; and every mountain and island were moved out of their places.

Rev 6:15 And the kings of the earth, and the great men, and the rich men, and the chief captains, and the mighty men, and every bondman, and every free man, hid themselves in the dens and in the rocks of the mountains;

Rev 6:16 And said to the mountains and rocks, Fall on us, and hide us from the face of him that sitteth on the throne, and from the wrath of the Lamb:

Rev 6:17 For the great day of his wrath is come; and who shall be able to stand?


They would not be hiding from the Lamb at the end of chapter 6, unless the Lamb is present at this point in time. We also find some of the same characters in chapter 19. (mighty men, captains, free, and bond)

We have a four point match between the description in the Olivet Discourse and Revelation chapter 6. This rules out mere coincidence.

The Book of Revelation is not in chronological order, because we have Christ returning in Revelation 16:15-16 and also in chapter 19.
Nobody can honestly deny this fact.

Instead, it is a series of overlapping visions.

The confusion is produced by those who attempt to force the book into a perfect chronology.

The confusion also comes from those who attempt to ignore the New Covenant promised to Israel and Judah in Jeremiah 31:31-34, which is found fulfilled by Christ during the first century in Hebrews 8:6-13, and is specifically applied to the Church in Hebrews 12:22-24, and 2 Corinthians 3:6-8.

An understanding of the New Covenant of Christ destroys the Two Peoples of God doctrine, and its pretrib removal of the Church.


The New Covenant: Bob George


.


 
Last edited:
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

iamlamad

Lamad
Jun 8, 2013
9,616
744
78
Home in Tulsa
✟101,763.00
Country
United States
Faith
Word of Faith
Marital Status
Married
Mat 24:29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:

Mat 24:30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.

Mat 24:31 And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.



Rev 6:12 And I beheld when he had opened the sixth seal, and, lo, there was a great earthquake; and the sun became black as sackcloth of hair, and the moon became as blood; (The moon does not give its normal bright light during a blood moon.)

Rev 6:13 And the stars of heaven fell unto the earth, even as a fig tree casteth her untimely figs, when she is shaken of a mighty wind.

Rev 6:14 And the heaven departed as a scroll when it is rolled together; and every mountain and island were moved out of their places.

Rev 6:15 And the kings of the earth, and the great men, and the rich men, and the chief captains, and the mighty men, and every bondman, and every free man, hid themselves in the dens and in the rocks of the mountains;

Rev 6:16 And said to the mountains and rocks, Fall on us, and hide us from the face of him that sitteth on the throne, and from the wrath of the Lamb:

Rev 6:17 For the great day of his wrath is come; and who shall be able to stand?


They would not be hiding from the Lamb at the end of chapter 6, unless the Lamb is present at this point in time. We also find some of the same characters in chapter 19. (mighty men, captains, free, and bond)

We have a four point match between the description in the Olivet Discourse and Revelation chapter 6. This rules out mere coincidence.

The Book of Revelation is not in chronological order, because we have Christ returning in Revelation 16:15-16 and also in chapter 19.
Nobody can honestly deny this fact.

Instead, it is a series of overlapping visions.

The confusion is produced by those who attempt to force the book into a perfect chronology.

The confusion also comes from those who attempt to ignore the New Covenant promised to Israel and Judah in Jeremiah 31:31-34, which is found fulfilled by Christ during the first century in Hebrews 8:6-13, and is specifically applied to the Church in Hebrews 12:22-24, and 2 Corinthians 3:6-8.

An understanding of the New Covenant of Christ destroys the Two Peoples of God doctrine, and its pretrib removal of the Church.
.
You expect us to believe that a moon that does not give her light, can be seen as blood red! Its balderdash!

These are TWO SEPARATE SIGNS FOR TWO SEPARATE TIMES FOR TWO SEPARATE PURPOSES.

NO ONE can see a moon if it is not reflecting any light.
A blood red moon CAN be seen.
 
  • Agree
Reactions: Riberra
Upvote 0

iamlamad

Lamad
Jun 8, 2013
9,616
744
78
Home in Tulsa
✟101,763.00
Country
United States
Faith
Word of Faith
Marital Status
Married
True. It would be useful if they knew the history of apocalyptic interpretation and who started the Jesuit futurist teaching.

Although futurists general deny Jesuit input, Dispesantionalist Clarence Larkin in his book, Dispensational Truth said

"The "Futurist School" interprets the language of the Apocalypse "literally, " except such symbols as are named as such, and holds that the whole of the Book, from the end of the third chapter, is yet "future" and unfulfilled, and that the greater part of the Book, from the beginning of chapter six to the end of chapter nineteen, describes what shall come to pass during the last week of "Daniel's Seventy Weeks." This view, while it dates in modern times only from the close of the Sixteenth Century, is really the most ancient of the three. It was held in many of its prominent features by the primitive Fathers of the Church, and is one of the early interpretations of scripture truth that sunk into oblivion with the growth of Papacy, and that has been restored to the Church in these last times. In its present form it may be said to have originated at the end of the Sixteenth Century, with the Jesuit Ribera, who, actuated by the same motive as the Jesuit Alcazar, sought to rid the Papacy of the stigma of being called the "Antichrist, " and so referred the prophecies of the Apocalypse to the distant future. This view was accepted by the Roman Catholic Church and was for a long time confined to it, but, strange to say, it has wonderfully revived since the beginning of the Nineteenth Century, and that among Protestants. It is the most largely accepted of the three views., It has been charged with ignoring the Papal and Mohammedan systems, but this is far from the truth, for it looks upon them as foreshadowed in the scriptures, and sees in them the "Type" of those great "Anti-Types" yet future, the "-Beast" and the "False Prophet." The "Futurist" interpretation of scripture is the one employed in this book."


The great error of Larkin in his outline of history, is that the early church taught no such thing. They taught that the let and hindrance in 2 Thess 2 was the Emperor and the Empire and also that the Temple in Revelation referred to the church and the 144,000 were christian martyrs. All directly opposed to futurism, but in line with historicism.
How much of the gospel was known and understood by laymen in the days of Martin Luther?

Ever heard of "the dark ages?"
 
Upvote 0

Douggg

anytime rapture, non-dispensationalist, futurist
May 28, 2009
28,777
3,419
Non-dispensationalist
✟359,569.00
Country
United States
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Private
Everything is a TIME-FRAME, we live on earth where the space time continuum exists. Every Judgment is IN ORDER Brother.
Why don't you try looking up the definition of "woe" on the internet and see if it says "timeframe".
 
Upvote 0

Douggg

anytime rapture, non-dispensationalist, futurist
May 28, 2009
28,777
3,419
Non-dispensationalist
✟359,569.00
Country
United States
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Private
Daniel Chapter 9: Dr. Kelly Varner

Based on Matthew 10:5-7, and Galatians 1:14-18, the 70th week of Daniel was the time period the Gospel of the New Covenant was taken "first" to Daniel's people during the first century.
.
BAB2, I tried looking up Dr. Kelly Varner on the internet to see if I could find any of his view on the end times like in Revelation. I could not find anything.
 
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

BABerean2

Newbie
Site Supporter
May 21, 2014
20,614
7,484
North Carolina
✟893,665.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
You expect us to believe that a moon that does not give her light, can be seen as blood red! Its balderdash!

I taught astronomy at one time and was a member of a local astronomy club.
I have actually gone out and watched a very bright moon turn to a dim red moon during the time span of a few hours.
This occurs because the earth gets in between the sun and the moon and blocks out almost all of the sun's light, which normally hits the moon during the full moon phase.

So the answer is.. Yes.

How many lunar eclipses have you observed by going outside and looking up at the moon with a telescope?


See the link below for the Blood Moon that occurs tonight.

NASA Scientist's Tips to See the Super Blue Blood Moon Lunar Eclipse


.
 
Last edited:
Upvote 0