GUILTY

[BPPLEE]

I did. Trump was more confident but said nothing of value, lied almost every breath and was barely coherent.

And Biden got Trump and Putin mixed up, said he defeated Medicaid and lied including the lie that no troops died under his presidency and that the border patrol endorsed him. He seemed confused and incoherent

 

[BPPLEE]

Well, show me the figures about foreign born workers. Let's see what affect that has on the economy. Where'd you get that info? And I'm not interested in what some people feel when they are polled. Or what some dude says on Youtube about his Wal-Mart bill. Talking about the economy means talking about facts and figures. From reputable sources.

I'll wait here while you find some.

Why don’t you start a thread on that, this one has been derailed enough.

 

[Vylo]

And Biden got Trump and Putin mixed up,

I can understand that confusion.

 

[stevevw]

That may be...but it doesn't change the fact that republicans drive the deficit up when they're in office, and complain about how high it is when they're not. They don't do a thing to bring it down.

Well all we have right now is that Biden is residing over massive debt and not doing a thing to bring it down. In fact the massive debt he brought in is what has caused the inflation and costs of live to triple in the last couple of years making many unable to afford housing, food and energy costs.

That is the only thing people right now remember and will vote on.

Democrats, at the very least, don't drive it up as high as the GOP does.

But high enough that its causing many to turn against Biden. Thats the only poll that counts right now.

So, seems to me, if the debt is the number one issue, then that voter really shouldn't be voting republican.

The debt is felt by voters today and not 10, 20 or 30 years ago. They cannot afford to live right now and thats all that counts and that has been under a Biden adminstration. They don't see it geting better and in fact percieve Trump as the way out of the mess.

I can't speak for most western nations, but it certainly hasn't been the case here in the US. Not with the GOP anyway.

OK fair enough, I don't know the dynamics of the US economy. All I know is right now people trust Trump more than Biden with the economy. They feel the pinch of his policies and they believe things will only get worse.

But a bigger point is it doesn't really matter in the past as the debt was much smaller though it increased. Its the fact that now it is so massive its more vital for it to be addressed than ever and Biden is not doing that.

So in some ways its an even bigger denial as the problem is so obvious that it cannot be denied which makes the present government more culpable. Especially considering they are ttacking Trump on economics while ignoring the elephant in the room.

The exact opposite happens here. The only president who was able to get the economy to a budget surplus was Clinton. The president who drove the deficit the highest was Reagan.

Fair enough. Well Reagan was a Hollywoord actor and they like spending lol. But from memory hee did get the economy pumping as well to counter that.

The GOP hasn't been the so-called "party of fiscal responsibility" for a while now, long before covid. Since Reagan, really.

According the analists it seems the Right has been overall the more economically responsible party. We have to understand deficits in the context of the times. Under Reagan it rose due high inflation that he inherited. They also gave big tax cuts which increased the deficit due to lower tax reciepts. But then this brought strong growth that was unmatched in previous years. So the cuts were like an investment that paid off.

Is a Democratic or Republican president better for the economy?
In the 32 years that Republican presidents have held office since 1969, the average economic growth was 8.4 percent and average inflation was 4.75 percent. Under the 23 years of Democratic administrations, the economy grew on average 7.5 percent and inflation averaged 8 percent.

There’s no argument that the huge GDP growth we saw in the 1970s and 1980s had a lot to do with inflation, both under Republican and Democratic administrations. But even during the Reagan/Bush growth period at 115 percent, GDP was at 26.7 times inflation, which was still better than Clinton’s 21.5.

Spending was generally higher under Democratic administrations. Using just GDP and inflation as factors, you can conclude that a Republican president would be better overall for the economy.

Is a Democratic or Republican president better for the economy?

(This column originally appeared in The Hill) It’s the economy, stupid! With presidential elections looming, the question is, who has been historically better for the economy — Republicans or Democrats? For that answer, let’s take a look at Gross Domestic Product and inflation. We’ll use government

www.linkedin.com

But they still pretend they are. At least, when on the campaign trail. Not so much when it comes to actual governing.

They can claim they are because overall they are the better managers. The simple fact that the Left hate business and want to get their money to pay massive welfare budgets is evidence of that. The Right up until covid invested more and supported more business that the Left. Its in their DNA and to claim otherwise is unreal.

-- A2SG, then it's tax cuts for the rich....and that's it....

You literally have just supported my point that the Left penalised business, make it hard for them to flourish with much bigger tax burdens and other restrictions, creating a hostile environment for business and investment. How is that good economic management when that actually scared investors away and reduces business investment. Considering that business creates 60% of jobs and revenue.

 

[stevevw]

Then let's examine what he's going to do to fix an economy as described here: https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2024/06/us-economy-excellent/678630/

I am not sure thats an accurate reading of the economy. Notice the time period 2019 to 2024. Covid caused the greatest recession since the great depression and the economy virtually came to a stand still. Then we had the stimulous packages to kick start it. So of course we are going to see a big increase in growth from an all time low.

If we factor in pre Covid figures then its not so great in comparison. Much of the growth has come from the economy bouncing back and its too early to tell if there is real sustainable growth.

In fact if Biden implements these massive tax hikes on businesses and other restrictions we will definitely see a decrease in growth as business is the major backbone of the economy. We are also not out of the woods with inflation as its yet to factor in future wage increases and the much higher deficit interest burden and is going to put pressure on inflation which will then stall the economy.

The tipping point will be the next debt ceiling increase.

 

[Bradskii]

Why don’t you start a thread on that, this one has been derailed enough.

You don't have any figures. All you have are bumper sticker political claims. Immigrants do jobs that are poorly paid that Americans don't want. But hey, Trump is going to get rid of them all. So who is going to do that work at those wages? No-one. So wages will have to rise. So costs increase. So prices go up. And who pays the extra?

So your immigration claim is one that actually keeps prices down. Would you like to try something else that you think Trump will do to improve things? Dropping taxes for high earners? Tariffs?

 

[Bradskii]

...costs of live to triple in the last couple of years...

No, you don't get to do that. No way. If you want to make a nonsensical claim at the very begining of a post then the rest can be discounted. This gish gallop form of posting is not on. You need to back up your claims as you go, so on what do you base this risible claim?

 

[Servus]

Fools and their money are soon parted.

That's what I think every time Biden pops up asking for money while I'm scrolling through youtube clips.

 

[Servus]

No, you don't get to do that. No way. If you want to make a nonsensical claim at the very begining of a post then the rest can be discounted. This gish gallop form of posting is not on. You need to back up your claims as you go, so on what do you base this risible claim?

I see you've put yourself in charge of others again.

 

[BPPLEE]

You don't have any figures. All you have are bumper sticker political claims. Immigrants do jobs that are poorly paid that Americans don't want. But hey, Trump is going to get rid of them all. So who is going to do that work at those wages? No-one. So wages will have to rise. So costs increase. So prices go up. And who pays the extra?

So your immigration claim is one that actually keeps prices down. Would you like to try something else that you think Trump will do to improve things? Dropping taxes for high earners? Tariffs?

I will wait and see what he actually does.
It’s probably a wash

Is a Democratic or Republican president better for the economy?

(This column originally appeared in The Hill) It’s the economy, stupid! With presidential elections looming, the question is, who has been historically better for the economy — Republicans or Democrats? For that answer, let’s take a look at Gross Domestic Product and inflation. We’ll use government

www.linkedin.com

 

[stevevw]

Too bad the number 1 issue for the political parties is other people's genitals. The Republicans even showed us pictures of Hunter Biden's genitals on live prime time TV.

Ok that seems a strange thing to get all worked up over. Didn't the Dems evidently claim Hunters laptop was all a Russian conspiracy. Is that right.

 

[BPPLEE]

You don't have any figures. All you have are bumper sticker political claims. Immigrants do jobs that are poorly paid that Americans don't want. But hey, Trump is going to get rid of them all. So who is going to do that work at those wages? No-one. So wages will have to rise. So costs increase. So prices go up. And who pays the extra?

So your immigration claim is one that actually keeps prices down. Would you like to try something else that you think Trump will do to improve things? Dropping taxes for high earners? Tariffs?

You think keeping prices down by paying poor immigrants subpar wages is a good thing?
But you care about these people doing jobs “that no one else will do “?
It doesn’t sound like it
These people are taken advantage of and in my area pay outrageous prices for housing and work at catfish farms, tree farms and in construction then 20 of them live in a 2 bedroom house that they pay enough rent on that each one could have their own house if they were legal.
You think this is a good thing?

 

[Servus]

You don't have any figures. All you have are bumper sticker political claims. Immigrants do jobs that are poorly paid that Americans don't want. But hey, Trump is going to get rid of them all. So who is going to do that work at those wages? No-one. So wages will have to rise. So costs increase. So prices go up. And who pays the extra?

So your immigration claim is one that actually keeps prices down. Would you like to try something else that you think Trump will do to improve things? Dropping taxes for high earners? Tariffs?

What you just posted is a bumper sticker political claim. Tell me what jobs there are in Los Angeles County that only quasi-slave illegals will do? There's always been plenty of documented migrants to work agriculture. But all the illegals who swarm into places like Van Nuys aren't there to pick crops. Bill Clinton used to give about as strong anti illegal alien speeches as Trump. But somewhere along the line the Democrat party decided to exploit minorities to get their votes.

 

[essentialsaltes]

What you just posted is a bumper sticker political claim. Tell me what jobs there are in Los Angeles County that only quasi-slave illegals will do?

INSIDE THE FIGHT TO END LABOR EXPLOITATION IN L.A. GARMENT FACTORIES (2020)​

Garment workers are working to change a long history of wage theft and sweatshop-like conditions in Los Angeles.

With an average hourly rate of $6, [i.e. below the federal minimum wage, much less California] Los Angeles' fashion district is predicated on a vulnerable workforce of largely undocumented immigrants. Workers of this underground economy are often subjected to wage theft, intimidation and poor health and safety conditions.

WHAT FUELS EXPLOITATION?​

Unfortunately, ongoing exploitation means that the GWC [a garment worker rights group] is as relevant as ever. A Department of Labor investigation in 2016 found that contractors received only 73% of what they need to be able to pay workers minimum wage. The result is that retailers have their garments made cheaply, increasing their profits, while workers receive below minimum wage.

--

UNFIT WAGES: US DEPARTMENT OF LABOR SURVEY FINDS WIDESPREAD VIOLATIONS BY SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA GARMENT INDUSTRY CONTRACTORS, MANUFACTURERS (2023)​

Leading retailers, customers benefit as workers struggle with wage theft

Based on data from more than 50 contractors and manufacturers, the 2022 Southern California Garment Survey released today by the department’s Wage and Hour Division found violations of the Fair Labor Standards Act in 80 percent of its investigations. More than 50 percent of the time, the division found employers illegally paying workers part or all their wages off the books, with payroll records either deliberately forged or not provided.

The fiscal year 2022 survey also found 32 percent of contractors paying garment workers piece-rate wages, a practice prohibited by the State of California on Jan. 1, 2022.

In a particularly egregious case, division investigators learned a contractor paid garment workers as little as $1.58 per hour.

 

[stevevw]

That is not exactly what you were talking about. What I showed was someone on the Right demonstrating some sort of perverse pride in Trump's felony convictions.

These are not official campaign items, but clearly these are MAGA products for MAGA people.

View attachment 350863

I love the mean look, he should have been an actor. I think this will actually work in his favor lol. I don't think the Dems realise this. Like they say any advertisement is good advertisement.

I can see a counter reaction to these images and memes with Biden ones of him mumbling and looking confused. Its going to get ugly.

 

[stevevw]

I wouldn’t mind if the people involved, on the prosecution’s side, would have a bias that the person that they’ve brought an indictment against is “guilty”.

I feel at least uncomfortable that Trumps case involved so many people in positions of influence with Left leanings. Ceratinly there was a majority involved in his cases. Certainly he has been treated like no other person for the same crimes. Even if the system would go to such lengths for someone other than Trump, an average person or better still someone who was on the Left.

Maybe there was no bias but the law not only has to be applied fairly and equally but has to be seen to be applied fairly and equally as well and it doesn't look that way to many.

 

[Servus]

INSIDE THE FIGHT TO END LABOR EXPLOITATION IN L.A. GARMENT FACTORIES (2020)​

Garment workers are working to change a long history of wage theft and sweatshop-like conditions in Los Angeles.

With an average hourly rate of $6, [i.e. below the federal minimum wage, much less California] Los Angeles' fashion district is predicated on a vulnerable workforce of largely undocumented immigrants. Workers of this underground economy are often subjected to wage theft, intimidation and poor health and safety conditions.

WHAT FUELS EXPLOITATION?​

Unfortunately, ongoing exploitation means that the GWC [a garment worker rights group] is as relevant as ever. A Department of Labor investigation in 2016 found that contractors received only 73% of what they need to be able to pay workers minimum wage. The result is that retailers have their garments made cheaply, increasing their profits, while workers receive below minimum wage.

--

UNFIT WAGES: US DEPARTMENT OF LABOR SURVEY FINDS WIDESPREAD VIOLATIONS BY SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA GARMENT INDUSTRY CONTRACTORS, MANUFACTURERS (2023)​

Leading retailers, customers benefit as workers struggle with wage theft

Based on data from more than 50 contractors and manufacturers, the 2022 Southern California Garment Survey released today by the department’s Wage and Hour Division found violations of the Fair Labor Standards Act in 80 percent of its investigations. More than 50 percent of the time, the division found employers illegally paying workers part or all their wages off the books, with payroll records either deliberately forged or not provided.

The fiscal year 2022 survey also found 32 percent of contractors paying garment workers piece-rate wages, a practice prohibited by the State of California on Jan. 1, 2022.

In a particularly egregious case, division investigators learned a contractor paid garment workers as little as $1.58 per hour.

And what percentage of garments sold in the US are made in LA? I used to work in a huge garment distribution facility for a high volume national brand, and most if not all of the product was manufactured outside of the US. A lot of it came in from Central and South America. Remember not having the slaves is supposed to raise costs for the US consumer significantly, so there has to be a significant amount of garments made in LA and sold in the US for that to happen.

 

[essentialsaltes]

And what percentage of garments sold in the US are made in LA? I used to work in a huge garment distribution facility for Levi Strauss & Co and most if not all of the product was manufactured outside of the US. A lot of it came in from Central and South America. Remember not having the slaves is supposed to raise costs for the US consumer significantly, so there has to be a significant amount of garments made in LA and sold in the US for that to happen.

Los Angeles is the center of US garment manufacturing. I don't know how it compares to imports, but nearly half of the garment workers in the entire United States are in the Los Angeles area, some 45,000 people.

'Gillibrand’s FABRIC Act would protect nearly 100,000 American garment workers'

Levi's closed its last two US production sites in 2004.

 

[Servus]

Los Angeles is the center of US garment manufacturing. I don't know how it compares to imports, but nearly half of the garment workers in the entire United States are in the Los Angeles area, some 45,000 people.

'Gillibrand’s FABRIC Act would protect nearly 100,000 American garment workers'

Levi's closed its last two US production sites in 2004.

But aren't they in the process of eliminating slave wages?

Also:

What percentage of clothing is made in the US?
Currently, more than 97 percent of apparel sold here is made in other countries, according to the American Apparel and Footwear Association.

Made in the USA

Apparel makers & retailers should consider that 61% of Americans say they're likely to buy items/products that are designated as being "made in America."

lifestylemonitor.cottoninc.com

 

[BCP1928]

Ok that seems a strange thing to get all worked up over.

No, I thought it was funny, especially considering how horrified conservatives are that children should learn anything real about human sexuality, then they show enlarged pictures of Hunter Biden on TV (during family viewing hours) having sex with a prostitute. I suppose they wouldn't have done it if Hunter had been having sex with a homosexual prostitute, .Oh, the horrors that a child might see a man's penis in a woman's locker room. But on TV? No prob.

Didn't the Dems evidently claim Hunters laptop was all a Russian conspiracy. Is that right.

No, they did not. When it was first brought forward many suspected it might be, given the shady manner in which it was acquired.