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Gog and Magog (Part I)

Barraco

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With Iran’s threat to attack Israel and Turkey’s support for Iran’s proxies, the first battle of Gog and Magog appears to be very imminent (Ezekiel 38-39, Joel 2, Zechariah 12, Isaiah 34, Revelation 6:12-17).

Jesus said the events encapsulated in the first four seals of Revelation 6’s sealed scroll would be like birth pangs, which get more intense and closer together as the time approaches. Think about Al Aqsa Flood for a minute. Since October 7th, 2023, we have seen the following:

1. Conquest of Palestine by Israel
2. Attacks from Hezbollah, Hamas, and Houthi.
3. Hyperinflation and stagflation in the market
4. Monkeypox Pandemic in Africa

Now Islamist immigrants flood into European nations governed predominantly by Christians and they are trying to change the laws to sharia law. This, IMO, will no doubt result in martyrdom and persecution of Christians. If I’m correct about this, Trump will not win the 2024 elections.

But all is in God’s hands and nothing happens without His permission.

Finally, the sixth seal quotes so many end-time prophecies about the destruction of nations surrounding and attacking Israel. Notice the patterns in the following passages:

1) Joel 2 talks about an army from the north coming and urges Israel to fast and repent. Then the sun is turned dark and moon to blood. Then the Holy Spirit is poured out on Israel. Then Joel 3 speaks of the destruction of the surrounding nations and the restoration of Israel.

2) Isaiah 33-34 talks about stars falling from the sky and heaven wrapping up like a scroll as signs of the destruction of surrounding nations and Edom (who hated his brother and wanted his blessings). Isaiah 35 follows that talking about the blessings of Israel.

3) Ezekiel 38-39 talks about a massive earthquake that removes mountains and causes everything on earth to hide. It is preceded by the restoration of Israel and followed by the attacking nations getting destroyed by God. Then Israel experiences prosperity, even burning the fuel from the armies for seven years (no coincidence to Daniel 9:27).

4) Zechariah 12 talks about Jerusalem being surrounded by armies and defeating them, then God gathering all nations against Jerusalem to execute judgment on them. Then the Holy Spirit is poured out on Israel and they receive Jesus. Blessings follow afterward and Israel experiences revival.

I would argue that the fifth seal is imminent and the sixth is right after that. We’ll have to watch and see. God is in control, not me or my interpretations.

Thoughts?
 

Ivan Hlavanda

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I would argue that the fifth seal is imminent and the sixth is right after that. We’ll have to watch and see. God is in control, not me or my interpretations.
I agree with most that you wrote. War from Ezekiel 38 is imminent.

Only thing I disagree on is where we are in revelation. We are still in age of the Church which is covered in chapter 2 & 3. Then beginning of chapter 4 describes the rapture, and then until chapter 19 we have the 7 years of tribulation.

The things Jesus warned us about in Matthew 24 are happening right now.
 
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SavedByGrace3

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But all is in God’s hands and nothing happens without His permission.
I might reword this thought to:
"God is sovereign, and everything can happen unless He intervenes."
 
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Dustoff

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I would say it is on the horizon. Not imminent. It happens in a time of peace though. Which is obviously not today. Also for whatever reason America has to be off the scene. Whether by some action or choice. I gave my thoughts on it here a while ago.
The Time we live in: Gog and Magog

I
have a few thoughts here on the times we are living in. Where I am coming from is that
we are living in the end times which started in 1948 with the return of the Jews to their land. Ezek. 37, Is. 11/ 10-16, Rom. 11 and many other passages. The countdown started in 1967 with the restoration of Jerusalem. Luke 21/24 The generation that saw that happen won't pass from the earth.

We are living in the end times and I think things are being held back right now.
It seems to me that so many years have passed without anything really significant happening. I think things have happened and are happening but not to the extent Jesus spoke of. Where do we see in any significant way the Matt 24 & Luke 21 etc. end-time events happening? The call to prepare went out in the 60's & 70's. Yet to my mind it doesn't seem to have done much since then.

I think there is a very good reason.
Matt. 25 parable of the 10 virgins. Vs 5 the bridegroom tarried. It clearly says (context end times) the bridegroom will delay his coming. I think we are in the time the bridegroom has delayed his coming. That time began in 1982 with the holding back of the war of Gog and Magog. Ezek 38-39. That time will end with the going forth of that war and serious end time events will move forward again.

The Holding back of the war of Gog and Magog
In 1982 Israel invaded Lebanon mainly to root out the PLO. When they did they found mountains of Soviet military equipment stored there. Which came as a complete surprise to them. For an army of any size to travel any distance all their equipment has to be moved into place. It's a huge logistical problem. Moving the men into place is the easy part. The Russians did this without anyone in the west or Israel knowing about it.

The Ministry of Foreign Affairs for the State of Israel reports

"During the operation `Peace for Galilee,` as the Israeli forces advanced through Lebanon in July 1982, they made an amazing discovery. Around the village of Saida, the largest secret military base in the world was uncovered. It consisted of miles of steel reinforced bunkers tunneled out of the hillside. Inside was crammed massive quantities of Soviet made arms & ammunition. It exceeded by far the highest previous intelligence estimates. I.D.F. units gathered 4170 tons (some 1,500 truckloads) of ammunition; hundreds of combat-vehicles; tanks & armored carriers; thousands of weapons, artillery & rocket launchers, plus other sophisticated devices.
These arms & stores were far in excess of P.L.O. requirements. Secret documents, & maps found in the Command Post clearly revealed that the Soviets planned invasion of the Middle East on the 4th August 1982. The I.D.F. averted this Soviet invasion by just a few weeks."


I believe we are in the time "that the bridegroom has tarried and delayed his coming". It began with the holding back of this war (Gog and Magog) and this time will end with this war going forward. The Gog war has to occur prior to the trib as there are 7 yrs of cleanup following it. Ezek. 39/9 While I don't believe that time (Gog war) is here yet I do believe it is on the horizon.

There are several reasons for the Ezek 38-39 war of Gog and Magog

1. To show the world that he is God he is there and that he is Israel's God
Ezek. 38/23 39/6-7

2. To destroy Russian military power. Russia has to be removed as a military power. Turkey and Iran (both regional powers involved in the war) as well. The Antichrist is going to arise into a place prepared for him. That is not entirely supernatural. Russia (along with others) have to be removed. In light of this war it's interesting in the last few yrs to see the breakdown of the good relations between Turkey and Israel. Russia building its forces and influence up again in the region and of course Iran's absolute hatred for Israel.

3. To punish Russia for its treatment of the Jews in particular and the multitudes of minorities in general. God is the judge of all the earth and he does judge the nations. One issue for judgment (among many) was the deliberate starvation by Stalin and Russia of millions of Ukrainians in 1932-33

4. The ancient God of the Hebrews is going to show himself to the entire world by supernaturally destroying the invading army. There are several reasons for that.

a. To turn Israel's attention back to their ancient God. Not savingly of course. That comes later. (Zech. 13/1) But the entire nation is going to see the supernatural hand of God on their behalf. Even the most hardened atheist will have to admit the God who called Abraham out of Babylon and spoke out of the burning bush and delivered Israel out of Egypt has shown himself. Following this war, he will have their full attention. Ezek. 39/7, 22

b. So Israel can build their third temple and re-institute the sacrifices. The world and the Muslim nations seeing the ancient God of Israel showing himself will back off and Israel will rebuild their temple. Can you imagine the uproar if they tried to do that today?

c. To clearly remind Israel (and the world) why Israel was taken out of their land /fallen by the sword and given into the hand of their enemies. It was because of their sin and uncleanness.
Ezek. 39/21-29
Vs. 24 According to their uncleanness and according to their transgressions have I done to them and hid my face from them.

d. To prepare the world for the anti-christ by turning it toward a more supernatural worldview. The entire world is going to see this supernatural judgment. Ezek.39/21-29 There are tidal waves of the occult coming especially to the western world. This war will start to prepare them for that.
Off topic but . . .I also think evolution is going to be replaced with something ancient. (pre flood) Something partly science and partly mystical.

It is this war that finishes the time of the bridegroom delaying his coming and opens the door for end-time events to begin to move forward again. Moving forward will start with the persecution Jesus spoke of in Luke 21 Mark 13, Matt. 24. Followed by the beginning of sorrows wars nuclear wars rumors of wars pestilence signs in the heavens famines earthquakes riots lawlessness on every hand sin abounding fear everywhere. That of course is just the secular world. The same issues will be in the religious world. Jesus said all this was just the beginning of sorrows. This is followed by even greater and increasing sorrows then the tribulation and the great tribulation (second half)

Following this war and rebuilding of the temple an unreasoning resentment toward Jews and Christians will begin. Eventually culminating in an implacable hatred.
The persecution of the Jews is for the purpose of moving his ancient people back into their land. Without some sort of impetus, most Jews simply won't move. The reason for this of course is that one of the major end-time purposes of God is to bring his ancient people into salvation. Zech. 13/1 Rom. 11

The persecution of Christians will be so God can cleanse his church. He is going to have a church without spot or wrinkle. Before he deals with the world he has to deal with his own house. God is going to cleanse his church of sin & worldliness and set things in their proper order.
Somewhat off topic but the mainstream view that the rapture will occur and we will all be caught up and safe in heaven is shallow, to say the least. No one (including me) is going to get raptured who isn't walking a consecrated life like Enoch and faithful like Elijah. Those men are in the bible for a reason. My opinion? Thanks for asking! I believe there are several raptures and those ready will go. (pre-trib Rev. 3/10) Those not ready get to keep working on it. So there you go. I'm both pretrib and mid trib. :)

Ezek 37 has already happened ie: Israel restored. The Ezek. 38-39 war of Gog and Magog isn't here yet but it is coming. Its on the horizon and following it end-time events will begin to move forward again.

After the Gog war and before the start of the trib several things have to happen.

1. the anti-Christ has to arise into his power base over a reunified Europe. He has to be in power prior to the trib as it starts with the signing of the peace treaty with Israel. For him to arise from there to worldwide power a number of things have to happen.

2. America has to be removed as a military, economic and diplomatic power prior to the trib or it will stand in the way of the Antichrist. There have been men of God in times past who have seen America destroyed. Valdez and AA Allen for eg.

3. China has to be removed as a economic and military power or like America it will just stand in the way of the anti-Christ. Again the rise of the anti-Christ is not entirely supernatural, I think this will happen as a result of a nuclear war between India and China.

So to the question that just begs to be answered "Where is America" during the Gog war?
One of America's closest allies is under attack by a Russian Arab confederacy. America has stood behind Israel all of its existence. For America to stand back as one of its biggest enemies (Russia) attacks one of its closest allies is unthinkable. So why wouldn't they help?

Here is a related question. Aside from the supernatural element of God putting a hook into Gog's mouth, (Ezek. 38/4) why would Gog even try? America has been behind every war Israel has fought but it has always been on the diplomatic & supply side. They were all regional wars so no reason for America to get involved.

The Gog war in contrast is an existential war. In other words, they are going in to wipe them out. Israel's existence is at stake here. America not getting involved in a serious way is unthinkable. With the kind of serious firepower America has at the ready in Europe and the Mediterranean Gog would just attack?

The answer to the question is that something has to happen to hold America back from helping Israel. America is the economic military diplomatic cultural leader of the world. To see it just sit back and watch is simply unthinkable. Also, Russia talks big but militarily is not even close to a match for America. Even with their Arab confederacy.

God sometimes just simply acts supernaturally and lets the pcs fall where they will but not often. Generally, when he moves in the world it's to a place prepared for it. For Russia to act against Israel with America still militarily ascendant is to my mind highly unlikely and bordering on the ludicrous.

So why would America hold back? I will list what I see as the possibilities

1. Economic judgment.
Where America simply doesn't have the money to maintain its economic and military clout. This is already happening to some extent. Many have referred to this.
2. A Judicial Malaise
God allows or sends a Spirit of Stupor over the entire nation. The nation and its leaders just don't care or can't stir themselves to care. This has happened to other nations in history. The Aztecs for eg.
3. A Judicial Hardening
Like the Pharaoh of the exodus God hardens the heart of America in preparation for its own judgment.

4. A Deep Wound
I think part of the reason America won't reach out to help Israel is that it is going to experience a deep wound in its heart. In the emotional spiritual mental cultural economic heart of America. Not the physical heartland but the inner patriotic pride and makeup of America. More than just its pride but a deep wound. Many times people who experience deep inner wounds just withdraw into themselves. Lie down and curl up into a ball. 9/11 was an example of that. Many visions by men of God about that going back many yrs.
David Wilkerson for one.

5. Francis Schaefer in his book “How Should We Then Live” examined all the various streams of life and thought that influenced modern America from the Reformation and Renaissance He looked at philosophy science art etc. His conclusion was that a dictator (right or left) would arise and take over the America. In my opinion, we saw the beginning of that in the last administration and accelerating now in the present one.

6. The nation consumed with civil war and riots and unrest and simply unable to look beyond its own borders. Actually, we're seeing the beginning of that now.
7. Catastrophic nuclear war.
As I have said that will happen but I can't see it happening prior to the Gog war.

I think it will be a combination of a number of these things. The reason political America has always stood with Israel is that there is a solid wall of support for Israel throughout America It cuts across all economic, demographic and political classes. Something the American political leadership on all sides is well aware of. Whatever is to happen it has to be something bad enough for America to be unable or unwilling to help.

Its on the horizon brothers and sisters. The time to draw close to the Lord is before the storm hits. We need to always remember that God never forsakes his people even in the midst of disaster. He never leaves anything to chance even little things and his people are not little things.
Is. 65/20 Come, my people, enter thou into thy chambers, and shut thy doors about thee: hide thyself as it were for a little moment, until the indignation be overpast.
The day we live in is “The day of the Lord” Its not the day of the devil. God is going to deal with his church, his ancient people Israel and the world. One of the tools in his hand is the devil.
 
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Ivan Hlavanda

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Gog and Magog happen at the end of the 1000 year millennium.
Gog and Magog in Ezekiel 38 and Revelation 20 are different.

First of all, Ezekiel 38:15 states that Gog will only come from “the remote parts of the north”. In Revelation 20, John writes that Gog and Magog will come from “the four corners of the earth”

Secondly, in Ezekiel 38 we only have few nations where as in Revelation 20 we have multitude of people from all over the Earth.

Thirdly, Gog in Ezekiel 38 will die by sword on mountains of Jerusalem, where as in Rev 20, Gog will be destoroyed by fire from Heaven.

All of this makes me and many other believe that Gog is some spiritual being who will control different men. One before the millenium, and one after.
 
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d taylor

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Gog and Magog in Ezekiel 38 and Revelation 20 are different.

First of all, Ezekiel 38:15 states that Gog will only come from “the remote parts of the north”. In Revelation 20, John writes that Gog and Magog will come from “the four corners of the earth”

Secondly, in Ezekiel 38 we only have few nations where as in Revelation 20 we have multitude of people from all over the Earth.

Thirdly, Gog in Ezekiel 38 will die by sword on mountains of Jerusalem, where as in Rev 20, Gog will be destoroyed by fire from Heaven.

All of this makes me and many other believe that Gog is some spiritual being who will control different men. One before the millenium, and one after.
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No this is how The Bible works an event is mention in one part of The Bible and then in another part the same event is mention, but giving more information. Just like Genesis chapters 1 and 2

In Ezekiel Israel is said to be dwelling safely that is only Israel in the Messianic 1000 year rule.
 
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Ivan Hlavanda

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No this is how The Bible works an event is mention in one part of The Bible and then in another part the same event is mention, but giving more information. Just like Genesis chapters 1 and 2

In Ezekiel Israel is said to be dwelling safely that is only Israel in the Messianic 1000 year rule.
Post some Biblical verses that show Ezekiel 38 and Revelation 20 are the same battle. I have shown why they they are not, yet you haven't posted anything that proves otherwise.

In Ezekiel 38 Gog will be killed by the sword and will fall on the mountains of Israel, their bodies will be eaten by birds and animals, and it will take seven months to bury them there. On the other hand, Gog in Rev 20 and those rebels with him a thousand years later will be destroyed, on the spot, by fire coming down out of heaven, there is no burrier site. So if Ez 38 says Gog will be killed by the sword on the mountains of Jerusalem, and Rev 20 says he will be killed by the fire from heaven on the spot. Then these are not the same event.

Also, the armies of the first Gog will be only from a select number of nations in a localized region as we see in Ezekiel 38:2-6. But the second Gog will gather a gigantic multitude of people from all over the earth to make his attack (Revelation 20:8). Again we see these are 2 different events.

At the return to earth of God/Jesus, when He destroys the first leader Gog and his hordes, He will gather the descendants of Jacob (that is, Israelites dispersed among the nations of the world) back to Israel (Ezekiel 39:25), and at that time the people will know that He is their Lord and God (39:28)
At the end of the Millennium, though, Jesus will have been ruling and reigning for 1,000 years, and Israel will have known Him as Lord that entire time.

The Bible clearly teaches that these are 2 different events.
 
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d taylor

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Post some Biblical verses that show Ezekiel 38 and Revelation 20 are the same battle. I have shown why they they are not, yet you haven't posted anything that proves otherwise.

In Ezekiel 38 Gog will be killed by the sword and will fall on the mountains of Israel, their bodies will be eaten by birds and animals, and it will take seven months to bury them there. On the other hand, Gog in Rev 20 and those rebels with him a thousand years later will be destroyed, on the spot, by fire coming down out of heaven, there is no burrier site. So if Ez 38 says Gog will be killed by the sword on the mountains of Jerusalem, and Rev 20 says he will be killed by the fire from heaven on the spot. Then these are not the same event.

Also, the armies of the first Gog will be only from a select number of nations in a localized region as we see in Ezekiel 38:2-6. But the second Gog will gather a gigantic multitude of people from all over the earth to make his attack (Revelation 20:8). Again we see these are 2 different events.

At the return to earth of God/Jesus, when He destroys the first leader Gog and his hordes, He will gather the descendants of Jacob (that is, Israelites dispersed among the nations of the world) back to Israel (Ezekiel 39:25), and at that time the people will know that He is their Lord and God (39:28)
At the end of the Millennium, though, Jesus will have been ruling and reigning for 1,000 years, and Israel will have known Him as Lord that entire time.

The Bible clearly teaches that these are 2 different events.
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Here is your fire

And I will bring him to judgment with pestilence and bloodshed; I will rain down on him, on his troops, and on the many peoples who are with him, flooding rain, great hailstones, fire, and brimstone.

Israel is brought out of the nations and are all together in Israel, no Jewish person lives outside of The nation of Israel. Israel dwells safely and without walls

After many days you will be visited. In the latter years you will come into the land of those brought back from the sword and gathered from many people on the mountains of Israel, which had long been desolate; they were brought out of the nations, and now all of them dwell safely

You will say, ‘I will go up against a land of unwalled villages; I will go to a peaceful people, who dwell safely, all of them dwelling without walls, and having neither bars nor gates’—

Therefore, son of man, prophesy and say to Gog, ‘Thus says the Lord God: “On that day when My people Israel dwell safely, will you not know it?
 
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Ivan Hlavanda

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Here is your fire

And I will bring him to judgment with pestilence and bloodshed; I will rain down on him, on his troops, and on the many peoples who are with him, flooding rain, great hailstones, fire, and brimstone.

Israel is brought out of the nations and are all together in Israel, no Jewish person lives outside of The nation of Israel. Israel dwells safely and without walls

After many days you will be visited. In the latter years you will come into the land of those brought back from the sword and gathered from many people on the mountains of Israel, which had long been desolate; they were brought out of the nations, and now all of them dwell safely

You will say, ‘I will go up against a land of unwalled villages; I will go to a peaceful people, who dwell safely, all of them dwelling without walls, and having neither bars nor gates’—

Therefore, son of man, prophesy and say to Gog, ‘Thus says the Lord God: “On that day when My people Israel dwell safely, will you not know it?
Differences between Ezekiel 38 and Rev 20 include:

The Ezekiel invasion is from the north, the rebellion in Revelation 20 is from the entire earth.
The Ezekiel invasion requires seven years to dispose of weapons, whereas the Great White Throne judgment immediately follows the rebellion in Revelation 20.
The Ezekiel invasion occurs before the establishment of the kingdom, whereas the event in Revelation 20 occurs afterwards.
The Ezekiel invasion is destroyed on the mountains of Israel, whereas the Revelation 20 force is destroyed around Jerusalem.
“In Ezekiel Gog was the leader and Magog his land, while in Revelation both represent nations.”

I don't know why you keep insisting Ez 38 and Rev 20 are the same when they are clearly different.
 
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Barraco

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I agree with most that you wrote. War from Ezekiel 38 is imminent.

Only thing I disagree on is where we are in revelation. We are still in age of the Church which is covered in chapter 2 & 3. Then beginning of chapter 4 describes the rapture, and then until chapter 19 we have the 7 years of tribulation.

The things Jesus warned us about in Matthew 24 are happening right now.

I disagree about the church age thing, well sorta. The parable of the wedding feast shows that, after Jerusalem was destroyed, the Lord's servants went out to invite people to the wedding feast (the kingdom of God). That is what the seven churches represent. That had been going on from 70 AD to 1917. After World War I, Satan lost possession of Palestine, Jerusalem, and the Jews. Satan then persecuted the Jews by means of antisemitism, pogroms, and the Holocaust. After World War II, Britain turned over the mandate of Palestine to create the nation of Israel. The focus has been more and more swinging to the affairs of Israel.

The sealed scroll is the deed to the promises of God, which only Jesus is qualified to bring about. Seals 1-4 establish the rise of the nation of Israel while the surrounding nations decline. Seal 5 has to do with the persecution to come against Christians for their support of Israel. Seal 6 has to do with the destruction of the Islamist regimes that hate Israel with the hatred of Esau (Turkey, IRGC, Syria, Hezbollah, Hamas, Houthi, ISIS). Like Sennacherib's Assyrian army, these armies are forming up and using ceasefire talks as an opportunity to wage further destruction against Israel. And like Hezekiah prayed for God to deliver them from the Assyrians, God will deliver Israel and the Church from these oppressors.

And I agree, we are thick in the middle of Matthew 24. Everything before the abomination of desolation is happening right now as we discuss this.
 
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d taylor

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Differences between Ezekiel 38 and Rev 20 include:

The Ezekiel invasion is from the north, the rebellion in Revelation 20 is from the entire earth.
The Ezekiel invasion requires seven years to dispose of weapons, whereas the Great White Throne judgment immediately follows the rebellion in Revelation 20.
The Ezekiel invasion occurs before the establishment of the kingdom, whereas the event in Revelation 20 occurs afterwards.
The Ezekiel invasion is destroyed on the mountains of Israel, whereas the Revelation 20 force is destroyed around Jerusalem.
“In Ezekiel Gog was the leader and Magog his land, while in Revelation both represent nations.”

I don't know why you keep insisting Ez 38 and Rev 20 are the same when they are clearly different.
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You want to prove your belief. Simply show from The Bible another (future) time period besides the 1000 year millennium.

That Israel lives in - a land of unwalled villages; I will go to a peaceful people, who dwell safely, all of them dwelling without walls, and having neither bars nor gates’ and they were brought out of the nations, and now all of them dwell safely
 
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tranquil

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You want to prove your belief. Simply show from The Bible another (future) time period besides the 1000 year millennium.

That Israel lives in - a land of unwalled villages; I will go to a peaceful people, who dwell safely, all of them dwelling without walls, and having neither bars nor gates’ and they were brought out of the nations, and now all of them dwell safely
You are correct that nation state Israel does not fit the Gog war description currently. I agree that the next item is not the Gog war for Israel.

The Gog war takes place during the millennium. In a manner of speaking, the millennium is currently in effect for Christians as they should be getting the Deuteronomy blessings for faithfulness (I guess I am both amillennial and premillennial).

As such, I think that Babylon is attacked by Gog next. The Gog war is for (Israel) Babylon (which is to say probably the US) (probably Oct 17th, like I have said for over 2 years now, minus the time where I realized that it could technically have started last year).

As to the Gog war in Israel, that is at the 7th Trumpet and is the Rev 13 material. The mighty angel in Rev 10 is confirming the Dan 9:27 covenant which is what is bringing Israel into a state of peace and security. The mighty angel is the False Prophet who is confirming the covenant after the great tribulation has already started (the 6th Trumpet material from Rev 9:13-21).

To sum up, the abomination of desolation occurs at the start of the Trumpets (middle of the 7 - middle of the 7th month, 15 Tishri). Israel (Babylon) sins and is punished with locusts (Gog).

At the 6th Trumpet 5 months later (15 Adar/ March 15, 2025) is the winter, sabbath great tribulation whereby the abomination has moved to Jerusalem and cuts off the daily (Joel 1:9) starting the 1290 days of Dan 12:11. The 4 angels of the Euphrates (Rev 9:14) are the 4 beasts of Daniel 7 attacking Jerusalem (and affecting the whole world). The Daniel 7 little horn (who is Isa 14's Lucifer and the False Prophet and the 'mighty angel' of Rev 10) defeats these beasts and confirms the Dan 9:27 covenant (Ezek 34:25). After the four beasts are defeated they split into 7 heads (1 Lion, 1 Bear, 4 Leopard, and 1 fourth Beast head, the little horn) fulfilling Deuteronomy 28:7.

This 30 day timeframe of Rev 9:13-21 scatters Jerusalem and Israel. They are gathered by the king of Babylon (Lucifer, the false prophet).

The false prophet has 2 horns because he has gathered the 2 sticks of Judah and Joseph (Ephraim). After 1260 days (the middle of the 7 years) (same 1260 days of the 2 witnesses) the false prophet breaks the covenant at the 7th Trumpet, worships the mortally head wounded antichrist, and anoints him as king of Israel as he will probably defeat the enemies of Israel. This is the attack of Gog upon Israel during the millennium. The 7 bowls of wrath are poured out on Feast of Tabernacles around this time.
 
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Douggg

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I would say it is on the horizon. Not imminent. It happens in a time of peace though. Which is obviously not today. Also for whatever reason America has to be off the scene. Whether by some action or choice. I gave my thoughts on it here a while ago.
I will agree. Not imminent. but on the horizon.

Being at peace, you may be right, a change to the current situation. On the other hand, being at peace may be relative to what Jews were experiencing in WWII.

We will just have to keep an eye on things.

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One of the things that has not been mentioned is that before the Gog/Magog event takes place, the little horn person (who will be perceived by the Jews following Gog/Magog as their long-awaited messiah) whoever that is must come to light before Gog/Magog.

What I am thinking is Zelensky, a Jew, who is battling the Russians, and is also seeking EU membership for Ukraine, may be that person. (I could be totally wrong about my Zelensky notion.)

Should he become head over a ten EU leaders panel - that would be big.

In Ezekiel 38:4, God says He will put hooks in Gog's jaws and turn him back - to drag him into the Gog/Magog event. So if Russia disengages Ukraine and starts bringing its military back to Russia - that could be when the Muslim/Israel conflict escalates into the Gog/Magog event.
 
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Douggg

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You are correct that nation state Israel does not fit the Gog war description currently. I agree that the next item is not the Gog war for Israel.

The Gog war takes place during the millennium. In a manner of speaking, the millennium is currently in effect for Christians as they should be getting the Deuteronomy blessings for faithfulness (I guess I am both amillennial and premillennial).

As such, I think that Babylon is attacked by Gog next. The Gog war is for (Israel) Babylon (which is to say probably the US) (probably Oct 17th, like I have said for over 2 years now, minus the time where I realized that it could technically have started last year).

As to the Gog war in Israel, that is at the 7th Trumpet and is the Rev 13 material. The mighty angel in Rev 10 is confirming the Dan 9:27 covenant which is what is bringing Israel into a state of peace and security. The mighty angel is the False Prophet who is confirming the covenant after the great tribulation has already started (the 6th Trumpet material from Rev 9:13-21).

To sum up, the abomination of desolation occurs at the start of the Trumpets (middle of the 7 - middle of the 7th month, 15 Tishri). Israel (Babylon) sins and is punished with locusts (Gog).

At the 6th Trumpet 5 months later (15 Adar/ March 15, 2025) is the winter, sabbath great tribulation whereby the abomination has moved to Jerusalem and cuts off the daily (Joel 1:9) starting the 1290 days of Dan 12:11. The 4 angels of the Euphrates (Rev 9:14) are the 4 beasts of Daniel 7 attacking Jerusalem (and affecting the whole world). The Daniel 7 little horn (who is Isa 14's Lucifer and the False Prophet and the 'mighty angel' of Rev 10) defeats these beasts and confirms the Dan 9:27 covenant (Ezek 34:25). After the four beasts are defeated they split into 7 heads (1 Lion, 1 Bear, 4 Leopard, and 1 fourth Beast head, the little horn) fulfilling Deuteronomy 28:7.

This 30 day timeframe of Rev 9:13-21 scatters Jerusalem and Israel. They are gathered by the king of Babylon (Lucifer, the false prophet).

The false prophet has 2 horns because he has gathered the 2 sticks of Judah and Joseph (Ephraim). After 1260 days (the middle of the 7 years) (same 1260 days of the 2 witnesses) the false prophet breaks the covenant at the 7th Trumpet, worships the mortally head wounded antichrist, and anoints him as king of Israel as he will probably defeat the enemies of Israel. This is the attack of Gog upon Israel during the millennium. The 7 bowls of wrath are poured out on Feast of Tabernacles around this time.
Gog/Magog of Ezekiel 38-39 will take place right before the 7 years begin.

The trumpets of Revelation take place in second half of that 7 years following Gog/Magog.
 
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Barraco

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Gog/Magog of Ezekiel 38-39 will take place right before the 7 years begin.

The trumpets of Revelation take place in second half of that 7 years following Gog/Magog.
Agreed! Ezekiel 39 says that it will take seven years to burn Magog's weapons. Interestingly, Daniel 9:27 sees a period of seven years where a covenant is confirmed.

Perhaps what happens is that Islamist forces led by Turkey and Iran invade Jerusalem due to the temple services recommencing. That's what kicked off the Al Aqsa Flood, after all. Israel had secured the red heifers and were working on resuming temple services while also securing a normalization deal with Saudi Arabia.

(Edited due to internet freezing up).
 
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Douggg

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Agreed! Ezekiel 39 says that it will take seven years to burn Magog's weapons. Interestingly, Daniel 9:27 sees a period of seven years where a covenant is confirmed.

Perhaps what happens is that Islamist forces led by Turkey and Iran invade Jerusalem due to the temple services recommencing. That's what kicked off the Al Aqsa Flood, after all. Israel had secured the red heifers and were working on resuming temple services while also securing a normalization deal with Saudi Arabia.

(Edited due to internet freezing up).
Some tension ( I don't know how much) is building up within Muslims ranks as Jews are working on the red heifer developments.

Historically, the red heifers, I think were sacrificed beyond the temple mount, so the Jews really would not need access to the temple mount to conduct the sacrifice and collect the ashes.
 
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Ivan Hlavanda

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You want to prove your belief. Simply show from The Bible another (future) time period besides the 1000 year millennium.

That Israel lives in - a land of unwalled villages; I will go to a peaceful people, who dwell safely, all of them dwelling without walls, and having neither bars nor gates’ and they were brought out of the nations, and now all of them dwell safely
I already proved from the text in Ez 38 and Rev 20 that these 2 wars are different but you keep ignoring that.

Where in the Bible you see that Israel will live in peace only during the millenium? As I understand it, Israel will live in peace during the first half of the 7 year tribulation, because they signed the false peacy treaty with the false messiah.
 
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Ivan Hlavanda

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The Gog war takes place during the millennium. In a manner of speaking, the millennium is currently in effect for Christians as they should be getting the Deuteronomy blessings for faithfulness (I guess I am both amillennial and premillennial).
No war will take place during the millenium as satan will be bound for 1000 years, and he wilp be put in a bottomless pit that will be shut and sealed against him, so he cannot deceive any nations (Rev 20:1-3).

At the end of it, satan will be released for a little while and he will gather nations and he will match against Jerusalem.

During the milpenium it will be so peaceful that a child will play next to a deadly snake and yet the snake will not harm it. Isaiah 11 6 The wolf shall dwell with the lamb and the leopard shall lie down with the young goat, and the calf and the lion and the fattened calf together; and a little child shall lead them. 7 The cow and the bear shall graze; their young shall lie down together; and the lion shall eat straw like the ox. 8 The nursing child shall play over the hole of the cobra, and the weaned child shall put his hand on the adder's den. 9 They shall not hurt or destroy in all my holy mountain; for the earth shall be full of the knowledge of the Lord as the waters cover the sea.

According to Isaiah 65, when spmeone dies as a 100 years old during the millenium, he will be considered young
Verse 20 No more shall there be in it an infant who lives but a few days, or an old man who does not fill out his days, for the young man shall die a hundred years old, and the sinner a hundred years old shall be accursed.

There will be no wars in millenium because Christ will be here on Earth.
 
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Barraco

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Some tension ( I don't know how much) is building up within Muslims ranks as Jews are working on the red heifer developments.

Historically, the red heifers, I think were sacrificed beyond the temple mount, so the Jews really would not need access to the temple mount to conduct the sacrifice and collect the ashes.
Rumor has it that it's been done in secret. We'll see I suppose. I really feel like this is all going down soon. I've thought for the longest time that Israel was our sign of the Lord's imminent return, but I couldn't see how until Yom Kippur last year.
 
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