God does not love everyone and the Bible says so (Change My Mind)

[Hammster]

okay...if you don't want to answer, I will...
If a natural man could not believe with the heart then he could NOT be saved in the first place. That belief is as I tried to previously talk about and you wanted to talk about something else, a working of God in his life, but he is the one that must decided whether or not to believe with his heart.

You are right. He couldn’t be saved in the first place. The natural man has thr heart of stone that scripture speaks of. He needs the heart of flesh. He needs to be born again.

 

[Hammster]

How can I make "God is love" mean anything other than what it says?
John has already said that we know we love God when we love our brothers, and gives us a definition of love - God sending Jesus to die for us. He then says that anyone who does not love does not know God because God is love.
How does that mean anything other than what it says?

How do you know that it's not you who's misunderstanding the word "hate"?

I don’t understand your question. I never said that you misunderstood the word.

 

[Strong in Him]

I don’t understand your question. I never said that you misunderstood the word.

You said;

The fact is, God also hates. So you must be misunderstanding that verse and trying to make it say something it doesn’t.

I simply asked how I was doing that.

 

[Strong in Him]

That’s not giving clear scripture. That’s asking questions based upon your presuppositions.

I wasn't making any presuppositions.
Jesus preached repentance - I gave references.
John the Baptist preached repentance and his baptism was for the forgiveness of sins - I gave references.
Peter proclaimed "repent and be baptised" - I gave references.

My question was why would people need to preach repentance if forgiveness without repentance, or even asking for it, is possible? I happened to ask the question first and gave Scriptures afterwards, but it's the same thing.

 

[Strong in Him]

I didn't know that you wanted anyone to answer...

Sorry, I was addressing that to the OP, who seems to have left the thread, and to anyone else who believes that God does NOT love everyone.

John says that God is love. Not, "has/shows a limited amount of love"; he IS love.
I was wondering how some people believe that God does not love, when John is clear that God IS love?

Paul says that God cannot deny himself, 2 Timothy 2:13.
The verse wasn't talking about love, but the principle of God not denying, or being untrue to, himself, still stands. Elsewhere Scripture says that God is not a man that he should lie - he cannot lie because he is truth. He cannot deny who he is, and he IS love, 1 John 4:8.
So how can he not be/show love?
Jesus also said that people who only love those who love them, are no better than the pagans, and that we are to be perfect as God is perfect.

The OP claimed the Bible teaches that God doesn't love everyone - I wondered what he/she thought about those verses?

 

[Chinchilla]

Can you love somebody and hate him at the same time? What is love ?

2 I have loved you, saith the LORD. Yet ye say, Wherein hast thou loved us? Was not Esau Jacob's brother? saith the LORD: yet I loved Jacob,

3 And I hated Esau, and laid his mountains and his heritage waste for the dragons of the wilderness.

 

[LoveofTruth]

To all,

This should end this discussion and show some clarity

Luke 6:35
27 But I say unto you which hear, Love your enemies, do good to them which hate you, 28 Bless them that curse you, and pray for them which despitefully use you. 29 And unto him that smiteth thee on the one cheek offer also the other; and him that taketh away thy cloak forbid not to take thy coat also. 30 Give to every man that asketh of thee; and of him that taketh away thy goods ask them not again. 31 And as ye would that men should do to you, do ye also to them likewise. 32 For if ye love them which love you, what thank have ye? for sinners also love those that love them. 33 And if ye do good to them which do good to you, what thank have ye? for sinners also do even the same. 34 And if ye lend to them of whom ye hope to receive, what thank have ye? for sinners also lend to sinners, to receive as much again.35 But love ye your enemies, and do good, and lend, hoping for nothing again; and your reward shall be great, and ye shall be the children of the Highest: for he is kind unto the unthankful and to the evil.36 Be ye therefore merciful, as your Father also is merciful."

1 Thessalonians 3:12
And the Lord make you to increase and abound in love one toward another, and toward all men, even as we do toward you:

Romans 5:8
But God commendeth his love toward us, in that, while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us."

Titus 3:4
But after that the kindness and love of God our Saviour toward man appeared,"

 

[Hammster]

I wasn't making any presuppositions.
Jesus preached repentance - I gave references.
John the Baptist preached repentance and his baptism was for the forgiveness of sins - I gave references.
Peter proclaimed "repent and be baptised" - I gave references.

My question was why would people need to preach repentance if forgiveness without repentance, or even asking for it, is possible? I happened to ask the question first and gave Scriptures afterwards, but it's the same thing.

You are still making vague references. The links to actual verses did talk about repentance, but not about repentance before forgiveness. How about just posting one, and we will discuss it.

 

[Neogaia777]

Could someone PM me and tell me why @Grip Docility got banned please...? But, in a PM though please, not on here please...

God Bless!

 

[Neogaia777]

And, why are you guys arguing over whether or not God loves everyone or not...? He clearly does, but it doesn't mean some cannot be "lost" though...

Did not Jesus love Judas...? Did not Jesus love everyone...?

God Bless!

 

[Neogaia777]

It seems you guys are discussing now if there are any prerequisites, or and requirements on our part, or of our will, to be forgiven or saved...?

Do I have that right...? Or not...?

God Bless!

 

[Neogaia777]

It seems you guys are discussing now if there are any prerequisites, or and requirements on our part, or of our will, to be forgiven or saved...?

Do I have that right...? Or not...?

God Bless!

Cause that is a difficult subject...? We would have to have some measure of free will, first off...

Then, would not be earning or be doing something "deserving" of our salvation or forgiveness or "whatever", first, if that were the case...?

And whatever we would have to do first, would not be "gift", or wasn't predetermined or predestined by God for us to have and do (first)... And would we not have to be kind of like "our own God" in that respect, if that were the case, in a way...?

I don't know...? It's a difficult, complex, and involved subject to broach or discuss in detail or in length on here...?

God Bless!

 

[corinth77777]

yes and no to glorifying because remember it depends on the definition we are going with but yes a non believer cannot bring glory to God through His life choices.

As to cleansing, yes but we do some of the cleansing so to speak...2 Corinthians 7:1; I John 3:3; James 4:8; and more....we cannot do what Christ did....Christ's righteousness is imputed to us...amen but we are also responsible for remaining clean.

Personally I like to think about it as per the scriptures about the bride and the Bridegroom. The bride of Christ is given a wedding gown, that is righteousness by Christ....it is however her responsibility to maintain it's "cleanliness" that is to say that it remains without spot of blemish until the Bridegroom comes to take her to the marriage celebration. We wear the righteousness of Christ but we are responsible for keeping it cleansed, pure by our efforts, our confessions, our repentance, etc. btw, none of that is in our power alone...just to be clear.

Hi, can You post the scripture where it says Christ's righteousness is imputed to us...tks

 

[corinth77777]

Those who believe are saved. But that’s just part.

Belief doesn’t save. It’s just part of salvation.

When Abraham believed GOD......was it a credit towards righteousness?

 

[corinth77777]

So what have I gained....ummm
Well The wind blows where it wishes you hear the sound of it but do not know where it is coming or going....

It sounds as one is saying not everyone is quickened to life in order to believe.

And the other is saying you quicken yourself

 

[Strong in Him]

You are still making vague references. The links to actual verses did talk about repentance, but not about repentance before forgiveness.

I wrote;

John the Baptist preached repentance; his baptism was for the forgiveness of sins, Mark 1:4, Luke 1:17, Acts of the apostles 19:4.
Peter urged people to repent and be baptised for the forgiveness of their sins, Acts of the Apostles 2:38, Acts of the Apostles 3:19.

How about just posting one, and we will discuss it.

Personally I feel that trying to understand God, the Bible or a topic by examining one verse in minute detail is rather like a blind man trying to describe an elephant by only feeling the trunk.

But if you insist:
Mark 1:4

I'll refrain from asking questions, since you said last time that I was posting from my pre-suppositions.

 

[Strong in Him]

To all,

This should end this discussion and show some clarity

Luke 6:35
27 But I say unto you which hear, Love your enemies, do good to them which hate you, 28 Bless them that curse you, and pray for them which despitefully use you. 29 And unto him that smiteth thee on the one cheek offer also the other; and him that taketh away thy cloak forbid not to take thy coat also. 30 Give to every man that asketh of thee; and of him that taketh away thy goods ask them not again. 31 And as ye would that men should do to you, do ye also to them likewise. 32 For if ye love them which love you, what thank have ye? for sinners also love those that love them. 33 And if ye do good to them which do good to you, what thank have ye? for sinners also do even the same. 34 And if ye lend to them of whom ye hope to receive, what thank have ye? for sinners also lend to sinners, to receive as much again.35 But love ye your enemies, and do good, and lend, hoping for nothing again; and your reward shall be great, and ye shall be the children of the Highest: for he is kind unto the unthankful and to the evil.36 Be ye therefore merciful, as your Father also is merciful."

Thank you.
But I wouldn't hold your breath about it ending the discussion. I posted the same verses from Matthew and they have been ignored - and the OP doesn't seem to have posted for ages.

 

[razzelflabben]

You are right. He couldn’t be saved in the first place. The natural man has thr heart of stone that scripture speaks of. He needs the heart of flesh. He needs to be born again.

that is why the natural man's life cannot please God but that he can do something that pleases God and nothing pleases Him more than a humble and contrite heart.

 

[Hammster]

When Abraham believed GOD......was it a credit towards righteousness?

Credit AS righteousness.

 

[razzelflabben]

Sorry, I was addressing that to the OP, who seems to have left the thread, and to anyone else who believes that God does NOT love everyone.

John says that God is love. Not, "has/shows a limited amount of love"; he IS love.
I was wondering how some people believe that God does not love, when John is clear that God IS love?

Paul says that God cannot deny himself, 2 Timothy 2:13.
The verse wasn't talking about love, but the principle of God not denying, or being untrue to, himself, still stands. Elsewhere Scripture says that God is not a man that he should lie - he cannot lie because he is truth. He cannot deny who he is, and he IS love, 1 John 4:8.
So how can he not be/show love?
Jesus also said that people who only love those who love them, are no better than the pagans, and that we are to be perfect as God is perfect.

The OP claimed the Bible teaches that God doesn't love everyone - I wondered what he/she thought about those verses?

we are good...some 12 + years ago God called me to study Biblical Love full time. I'm still going strong hahahahaha....it's amazing how many people just assume to know what Biblical Love is when God tells us that it is too big a topic for us to consume in this lifetime.