God changed the Sabbath

[Citizen of the Kingdom]

You might as well say the litergy too just to cover all the bases which is what I see many fundamentalists doing. Laodocea can only come to those who started off as overcomers.

 

[1John2:4]

Then the same day at evening, being the first day of the week, when the doors were shut where the disciples were assembled for fear of the Jews, came Jesus and stood in the midst, and saith unto them, Peace be unto you. - John 20:19

The beginning of the day is at sundown, so they must have been gathered already on the Sabbath until sundown.

 

[dqhall]

John 5:16 And for this cause the Jews persecuted Jesus, because he did these things on the sabbath. 17 But Jesus answered them, My Father worketh even until now, and I work. 18 For this cause therefore the Jews sought the more to kill him, because he not only brake the sabbath, but also called God his own Father, making himself equal with God.

Mark 2:27 And he said unto them, The sabbath was made for man, and not man for the sabbath:

The Sabbath or Shabaht was from sundown on Friday until sundown on Saturday. In Israel the Jews do not open their shops after sundown Saturday, but they wait until the next morning.

In America there is a two day weekend, but people may work or rest whenever they like.

 

[bugkiller]

You wouldn't have a verse for your assumption, didn't think so

One of the better Promise of the Brit Chadashah is that YHWH would write His Torah upon hearts of Flesh Hebrews 8:10 & Jeremiah 31:33 Psalms 119:142 by the Spirit of Truth

The Torah will be Taught to many during the Millennium Isaiah 2:3-5

Since it will be taught then, why has christendom rejected the New Covenant now?

*****

The Appointed Times ARE a shadow, not were a shadow (past tense) Colossians 2:16-17

Let no one Judge you on what you eat or drink on those days, according to the traditions of men

The Passover will be Kept during the Millennium Ezekiel 45:21 In Remembrance of Him

The Feast of Booths (Sukkot) will be Kept during the Millennium Zechariah 14:16-18

The Sabbath and New Moons will be Kept during the Millennium Isaiah 66:23

every Appointed time of YAH, Will be Done on Earth

and More Zechariah 8:19 Romans 14:6 fasting and not fasting

*****

When you abolish the Torah, you abolish

Justice Mercy and Faith

Matthew 23:23

Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye pay tithe of mint and anise and cummin, and have omitted the weightier matters of the Torah, Judgment, Mercy, and Faith: these ought ye to have done, and not to leave the other undone.

Biblical definition of a judaizer, someone that makes void the commandments by traditions

like christmas, easter, halloween etc

christianity, the mystery of iniquity

Well I'm not going quote a bunch of verses you'll only argue with. "Day of the Lord" is always in reference to some event other than the Sabbath or Sunday. Its a well known fact that Lord's day is a reference to the first day of the week. Check out the historical record for yourself, because you'll only accuse me of bias. These things have been quoted by me and others over the years only to be told they're rewritten lies. Each to their own.

bugkiller

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

Its a well known fact that Lord's day is a reference to the first day of the week.

Yes, well known tradition of man , trying to and succeeding for many in changing the truth to something it is not.

 

[bugkiller]

You wouldn't have a verse for your assumption, didn't think so

One of the better Promise of the Brit Chadashah is that YHWH would write His Torah upon hearts of Flesh Hebrews 8:10 & Jeremiah 31:33 Psalms 119:142 by the Spirit of Truth

Only if you wish to take part of a sentence to establish your false truth. Verse 33 is the last third of a sentence. That sentence says "new" as in cut a new stone. It not a remodel or movement job as you contend with your out of context statement. That sentence also says "Not according to..." while you contend its exactly like but only moved. You also don't understand the word "but" or "for" as it appears in some translations. Both words show a difference from something already on the table so-to-speak.

The Torah will be Taught to many during the Millennium Isaiah 2:3-5

Since it will be taught then, why has christendom rejected the New Covenant now?

*****

The Appointed Times ARE a shadow, not were a shadow (past tense) Colossians 2:16-17

Doesn't really make a difference. You want the shadow when you can have the real thing. Shadows always come and go with the movement of the earth as it spins.

Let no one Judge you on what you eat or drink on those days, according to the traditions of men

Sorry but that isn't what the verse says or implies.

The Passover will be Kept during the Millennium Ezekiel 45:21 In Remembrance of Him

The Feast of Booths (Sukkot) will be Kept during the Millennium Zechariah 14:16-18

The Sabbath and New Moons will be Kept during the Millennium Isaiah 66:23

I'm only dealing with this particular passage. The passage says nothing about "on." The passage clearly says "from ... to" which is the way time was spoken of when Isaiah wrote the passage.

every Appointed time of YAH, Will be Done on Earth

and More Zechariah 8:19 Romans 14:6 fasting and not fasting

*****

When you abolish the Torah, you abolish

Justice Mercy and Faith

So you want justice. Really? No criminal begs for the law. They always beg for mercy which grace administers. And yes Grace administering mercy cancels the law. Its not permission to sin. Sin was before the law and therefore not always a violation of the law. Rom 5:13; I JN 3:4.

Matthew 23:23

Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye pay tithe of mint and anise and cummin, and have omitted the weightier matters of the Torah, Judgment, Mercy, and Faith: these ought ye to have done, and not to leave the other undone.

Biblical definition of a judaizer, someone that makes void the commandments by traditions

No a Judaizer is someone who demands the law be kept for salvation. That means salvation would be wages and not a gift. Wages are paid with death. Rom 6:23.

like christmas, easter, halloween etc

christianity, the mystery of iniquity

You're talking about religion opposed to a relationship with God.

bugkiller

 

[bugkiller]

Yes, well known tradition of man , trying to and succeeding for many in changing the truth to something it is not.

No. You can't support your argument with anything. I can support my argument with Scripture and written history. Besides you're disregarding the OP.

bugkiller

 

[bugkiller]

So much for sound doctrine. Hebrews 4 is (supposedly) talking about Sunday.

Heb 4 doesn't talk about observing a day.

bugkiller

 

[bugkiller]

The beginning of the day is at sundown, so they must have been gathered already on the Sabbath until sundown.

So....

bugkiller

 

[bugkiller]

John 5:16 And for this cause the Jews persecuted Jesus, because he did these things on the sabbath. 17 But Jesus answered them, My Father worketh even until now, and I work. 18 For this cause therefore the Jews sought the more to kill him, because he not only brake the sabbath, but also called God his own Father, making himself equal with God.

Mark 2:27 And he said unto them, The sabbath was made for man, and not man for the sabbath:

The Sabbath or Shabaht was from sundown on Friday until sundown on Saturday. In Israel the Jews do not open their shops after sundown Saturday, but they wait until the next morning.

In America there is a two day weekend, but people may work or rest whenever they like.

Nothing but an out of context verse and remark. If what you say is true then Moses is a liar and unreliable witness. Jesus is talking specifically to Jews and the comment MK2:27 is limited to them. Proof of this is in your last sentence.

bugkiller

 

[lstnag2016]

Only if you wish to take part of a sentence to establish your false truth. Verse 33 is the last third of a sentence. That sentence says "new" as in cut a new stone. It not a remodel or movement job as you contend with your out of context statement. That sentence also says "Not according to..." while you contend its exactly like but only moved. You also don't understand the word "but" or "for" as it appears in some translations. Both words show a difference from something already on the table so-to-speak.Doesn't really make a difference. You want the shadow when you can have the real thing. Shadows always come and go with the movement of the earth as it spins.Sorry but that isn't what the verse says or implies.I'm only dealing with this particular passage. The passage says nothing about "on." The passage clearly says "from ... to" which is the way time was spoken of when Isaiah wrote the passage.So you want justice. Really? No criminal begs for the law. They always beg for mercy which grace administers. And yes Grace administering mercy cancels the law. Its not permission to sin. Sin was before the law and therefore not always a violation of the law. Rom 5:13; I JN 3:4.No a Judaizer is someone who demands the law be kept for salvation. That means salvation would be wages and not a gift. Wages are paid with death. Rom 6:23.You're talking about religion opposed to a relationship with God.

bugkiller

Like unto the first

Exo 34:4 And he hewed two tables of stone like unto the first; and Moses rose up early in the morning, and went up unto mount Sinai, as YAHUWAH had commanded him, and took in his hand the two tables of stone

The Pattern, The First Covenant was Broken, the Re-Newed Covenant like unto the first

Moses was told to speak to the Rock, but he struck it twice, because of that he was not able to enter the promise land

He messed up the pattern

The Torah is a Parable Psalms 78:1-2

Written upon stone, written upon Hearts of Flesh

The Total People saved by keeping the Torah from Genesis until Today 0

and a Judaizer is one who makes void the commandments for traditions

Noah found Grace, Abraham found Grace, David, all who called upon Him

The Exodus from Egypt by Grace

The blood on the doorposts, Saved

Then brought to Mt Sinai and given the Torah/Instructions on how to live as a Redeemed People

Same today, but now He writes the Torah upon the believers mind and heart

believe it on not, that's the way it is

 

[bugkiller]

It sounds like you are sitting on the fence. You want to disagree with MJ and SDA, but you agree with Orthodox sunday worship. I don't understand your position at all. Its confusing.

I guess all I can say is the Bible is written to some and nothing but gibberish to others.

bugkiller

 

[bugkiller]

Like unto the first

Exo 34:4 And he hewed two tables of stone like unto the first; and Moses rose up early in the morning, and went up unto mount Sinai, as YAHUWAH had commanded him, and took in his hand the two tables of stone

The Pattern, The First Covenant was Broken, the Re-Newed Covenant like unto the first

This isn't a "renewed" covenant in Ex 34. As such Ex 34 has nothing to do with the NC spoken of in Jeremiah 31.

Because Moses was told to speak to the Rock, but struck it twice, He was not able to enter the promise land

He messed up the pattern

The Torah is a Parable Psalms 78:1-2

Written upon stone, written upon Hearts of Flesh

The Total People saved by keeping the Torah from Genesis until Today 0

There's no salvation (redemption-eternal life) found in the law.

and a Judaizer is one who makes void the commandments for traditions

Nope!!! A Judaizer is one who requires he law be kept for salvation. See Acts 15.

Noah found Grace, Abraham found Grace, David

Both Noah and Abraham were before the law. Therefore the law had nothing to do with them.

The Exodus from Egypt by Grace

The blood on the doorposts, Saved

That had nothing to do with eternal life.

Then brought to Mt Sinai and given the Torah/Instructions on how to live as a Redeemed People

Those people weren't redeemed from sin or even the law which hadn't been given before Mt Sinai.

Same today, but not He writes it in the believers mind and heart

The covenant issued at Mt Sinai isn't what's written on the heart according to Jer 31:31-33 a single sentence.

believe it on not, that's the way it is

Nope!!!

bugkiller

 

[bugkiller]

Worshipping isnoteven thepoint. When Godchanged the Sabbath go the Lord's day He signified a change in heritage from the bond to the free

Really? Where have you been cloistered?

bugkiller

 

[bugkiller]

I believe you are only hurting your own stand against legalism. You cant agree that Sunday is the Lords day and still agree with Romans 14. If anything you would need to acknoewledge that Romans 14 destroys the nescesity of any holy day whatsoever. Sure paul was saying that peace is better than judging and despising each other, but that is exactly what you seem to be doing. You seem to despise SDA and MJ, while loving those who worship on Sunday. I don't see how you are promoting Pauls doctrine at all, but rather misusing it to war against your opposition.

Sorry you think so. I'm not arguing for either day. I don't keep a day as you think. I don't apply the regulations of the 7th day Sabbath to Sunday.

bugkiller

 

[bugkiller]

For those who turn to Yhwh, as Jesus said to do,
who get born again, as only the Father in heaven by His Will can do,
who get a new and right spirit, which no one deserves or can earn in any way,
who receive (as IT IS WRITTEN) the MIND OF CHRIST,
it is no trouble, no burden, no grief,
to keep all of His Commands, as Jesus always says to do.
"My commandments are not burdensome" (read Psalm 119 to see how WONDERFUL TORAH IS).
"In keeping them there is great reward."
and continuing -
who receive Yhwh's Torah WRITTEN UPON THEIR HEART,
who receive "circumcision of HEART" ,

they (we ekklesia born again by the Father's Will, not our own)
REJOICE in willing and whole hearted obedience to the Father
and following the Shepherd Yeshua (whose VOICE WE HEAR, no doubts, no fears (He takes all of them away) ) .

Heart? Whole Heart ? When there is no other god.
No flesh to follow. Not one of man's traditions to follow. (they HAVE NO GRIP ON US).
No sin has power over us.
The world hates us, but so what !? The world has nothing in us, no power over us.

We may not know how ,
we don't have to.
JESUS KNOWS HOW. He told His disciples "I KNOW YOU DON'T KNOW HOW. Relax, I will show(train) you."

JESUS IS FAITHFUL and TRUE and PERFECT and COMPLETE and TEACHES US.

You're mixing or blending things quite a bit.

bugkiller

 

[bugkiller]

To me it looks like no one (no one else) wants to be a slave of Righteousness nor a slave of Jesus every day. Just a remnant - just a few of us.
It is written frequently in Scripture that we are either slaves of sin OR slaves of Righteousness (slaves of Jesus);
BUT most people don't care and aren't "willing", even if Jesus tells them Himself.
So,
for those, all of those, "not willing", they are like those the tower of siloam fell upon -
if they do not repent(turn to Yhwh) , they perish the same .
Same as Jerusalem Jesus said He would gather their children under His wings (there is NO SAFER PLACE ANYWHERE IN THE UNIVERSE !!!!!!)
BUT
they "would not" --- they were not willing (to give up everything and seek the Father Only)

For all those who are turning or retuning to the law void salvation (make Jesus in effective) according to Gal 5.

bugkiller

 

[bugkiller]

The Sabbath wasnt an issue or a need as command to follow for them, because it was already being observed for 2000+yrs, so they already knew about the day, as it was obvious to them as it would be obvious to us as not having to be told to stop at a stop sign because we already know that we need to.

Where did it say they were commanded to gather on Sunday?

There was no command to. It became a more common practice in the 1st century when Christianity and Judaism were clashed and Christianity separated itself from Judaism and decided to do its own thing. So both sides were probably guilty of wrong doing, but its human nature to move away from drama if you keep experiencing it

Oh come on, please. Christians were kicked out of the synagogue.

bugkiller

 

[bugkiller]

You have to read Acts 15 and Col 2 out of context, like most do in order to come to your conclusion.

All of Gods commands were to Israel. The New Covenant was to Israel and that is why you are grafted in when you are saved and not the other way around.

Christians aren't graft into Israel. Both believers in Jesus are graft into the Root which is Jesus. See Rom 11. Even if Christians were, they're still not obligated to the OC issued at Mt Sinai.

If a Gentile converts to Christianity was under no obligation to observe Torah, that would make them lawless and hypocrite because Torah is all they had back then.

No because Christianity isn't Judaism nor part of the OT/OC in anyway.

You believe in the Trinity and say Jesus is God, so since Jesus came to do the will of the father and Jesus is God, to keep his commands you can go to the OT and see where it say to hold a holy convocation on the 7th day.

No because of passages like JN 1:17 and 15:10.

So since Jesus is God and God said to remember the Sabbath and keep it holy and to hold a holy convocation on that day, that is enough proof.

You just conflated the Trinity meaning Jesus is the Father. No deal.

bugkiller

 

[bugkiller]

Is bugkiller promoting a holy day?

No!

bugkiller