George Pell sentenced

[Heavenhome]

George Pell is sentenced to six years with non parole period of 3 years 8months.
His age, health,etc had to be taken into account.

 

[archer75]

3 years 8 months!

Man, he didn't take his victims' age into account....

 

[Paidiske]

I was wondering, this morning, while I waited for the sentence to be given, if there was any possibility that he could be rehabilitated.

I honestly don't know that there is. Perhaps if he lost all his power and prestige... I would like to see the church laicise him.

 

[CRAZY_CAT_WOMAN]

I don't see a link. Maybe because I on a phone. What did he do?

 

[Paidiske]

Sexual abuse of children.

 

[Zoii]

I suspect, as with so many of these historical sexual assault cases, he will upon appeal be released on the grounds of insufficient evidence to secure a conviction. It's so very difficult for the prosecution who, because of the passage of time, do not have at their disposal, medical or DNA evidence. So many victims suffer the angst of seeing their predator walk free. We saw it with Rolf Harris, Michael Jackson, and we may see it with Pell.

 

[HTacianas]

George Pell is sentenced to six years with non parole period of 3 years 8months.
His age, health,etc had to be taken into account.

This is quite the conundrum. Child sexual predators don't tend to fair well in prison.

Should we pray for his safety?

 

[Paidiske]

He'll be in "protection," I'm sure, which is effectively solitary confinement.

 

[Heavenhome]

From what I have heard from legal fraternity he can only appeal on the grounds of something done in the carrying out of the trial that had a hole in it. His guilt is unquestioned. That is why the prosecution let a Ballarat case go (very reluctantly), that was going to be brought along with this case, so this one could go ahead and get the conviction.
The sentencing judge allowed some concessions so that the defendant's barrister would not be able to come back and get an even lesser sentence.
Some of the charges are served concurrently hence the 6 years.
With all the loopholes in this sort of thing I think the judge did his very best to make sure the sentence would stick.
I heard this all given over the radio (about an hour long), it was done admirably.

 

[Heavenhome]

I pray for his victims ALL of them.

This is quite the conundrum. Child sexual predators don't tend to fair well in prison.

Should we pray for his safety?

He'll be in "protection," I'm sure, which is effectively solitary confinement.

Yes, I pray for his victims, ALL of them.
For anyone who can get it, the ABC TV put out an excellent Four Corners episode last Monday which detailed what the prosecution worked on that brought about the case.
I was hesitant to watch it but glad I did because it made it all so clear.

 

[klutedavid]

From what I have heard from legal fraternity he can only appeal on the grounds of something done in the carrying out of the trial that had a hole in it. His guilt is unquestioned. That is why the prosecution let a Ballarat case go (very reluctantly), that was going to be brought along with this case, so this one could go ahead and get the conviction.
The sentencing judge allowed some concessions so that the defendant's barrister would not be able to come back and get an even lesser sentence.
Some of the charges are served concurrently hence the 6 years.
With all the loopholes in this sort of thing I think the judge did his very best to make sure the sentence would stick.
I heard this all given over the radio (about an hour long), it was done admirably.

I heard the experts running the appeal are very confident that Pell will walk.

 

[Zoii]

I pray for his victims ALL of them.




Yes, I pray for his victims, ALL of them.
For anyone who can get it, the ABC TV put out an excellent Four Corners episode last Monday which detailed what the prosecution worked on that brought about the case.
I was hesitant to watch it but glad I did because it made it all so clear.

According to the ABC report that I too listened to, the strongest grounds of appeal will be based on the notion that the jury arrived at incorrect conclusions.

For now though, due process has determined his guilt. It may bring some level of justice to the victims - and not just the ones who were sexually assaulted by Pell - the victims and families that were prey to other priests and subsequently met with Pell as a bishop [directly or indirectly] and gained little justice through that process.

 

[Tomm]

Sexual abuse of children.

He might be wrongly convicted.
___________________________________________________________________________

Andrew Bolt says Cardinal Pell was Falsely Convicted
Bolt, who says has met Pell about five times, but is not a Catholic or Christian, raised “10 problems” with the evidence that saw a jury unanimously find Pell guilty.

One of these was the fact Pell’s second abuse victim, now dead after a heroin overdose, denied being abused by a priest when asked by his mother. Bolt also said the other victim who gave evidence in court did not speak about the incident for many years. He said he also doubted the attack could have taken place after Mass, when Pell is known to have traditionally spoken to worshippers leaving the ceremony.

“This attack allegedly happened in the cathedral sacristy, which is normally a very busy room, where Pell would have known people were almost certain to walk in,” he said. Click to read full article



The Pell Affair: AUSTRALIA is now on trial
Has it occurred to anyone else debating the perverse verdict rendered against Cardinal George Pell, which convicted him of “historic sexual abuse,” that the cardinal did not have to return to his native Australia to face trial?

As a member of the College of Cardinals of the Holy Roman Church and a Vatican official, Pell holds a Vatican diplomatic passport and citizenship of Vatican City State. Were he guilty, he could have stayed put in the extraterritorial safety of the Vatican enclave, untouchable by the Australian authorities. But because Cardinal Pell knows he is innocent, he was determined to go home to defend his honor—and, in a broader sense, to defend his decades of work rebuilding the Catholic Church in Australia, the living parts of which owe a great deal to his leadership and courage. Click to read full article

 

[archer75]

I was wondering, this morning, while I waited for the sentence to be given, if there was any possibility that he could be rehabilitated.

I honestly don't know that there is. Perhaps if he lost all his power and prestige... I would like to see the church laicise him.

(I am assuming here that the verdict is correct, that Pell is factually guilty.)

Is anything actually done in such cases, apart from the hard-to-verify claim that someone has been ordered to a life of prayer and repentance? Aren't all Christians already called to a life of prayer and repentance? It seems to me that sexually assaulting minors is significantly worse than pilfering change from the collection plate to buy a candy bar during Lent. Where are the extreme obediences that make public how much these people have injured the Body of Christ and the human race? Okay, laicization, obviously, yes. But what else? Nothing? Just another round of "he's suffered enough"? Whatever happened to the notion of penance? Or maybe that's just for us laypeople nowadays?

 

[Tanj]

I heard the experts running the appeal are very confident that Pell will walk.

Ever heard experts running an appeal say anything else, ever?

"I'm running the appeal, but I don't hold out much hope, because my client is actually guilty"

 

[Paidiske]

(I am assuming here that the verdict is correct, that Pell is factually guilty.)

Is anything actually done in such cases, apart from the hard-to-verify claim that someone has been ordered to a life of prayer and repentance? Aren't all Christians already called to a life of prayer and repentance? It seems to me that sexually assaulting minors is significantly worse than pilfering change from the collection plate to buy a candy bar during Lent. Where are the extreme obediences that make public how much these people have injured the Body of Christ and the human race? Okay, laicization, obviously, yes. But what else? Nothing? Just another round of "he's suffered enough"? Whatever happened to the notion of penance? Or maybe that's just for us laypeople nowadays?

To be honest, I don't know what might be possible within Catholicism. From my observation, public penance for these sorts of things has fallen into disuse in the western church in general. I have, over time and involvement in communities broken by such things, formed the view that this lack of public penance is not a good thing.

 

[Sketcher]

I don't know enough about the case to decide whether he is guilty or not.

If he is guilty, he should be laicized, and put in gen pop.

 

[klutedavid]

Ever heard experts running an appeal say anything else, ever?

"I'm running the appeal, but I don't hold out much hope, because my client is actually guilty"

True and politicians boast and make promises also. Yet you still have to vote for some one.

The case is built apparently on one person's testimony from what I can gather.

He may indeed get to walk free.

The guilty verdict was given by a panel of Jurors. The appeal is overseen by three magistrates which is a different kettle of fish.

I believe Pell is in fact guilty but it is the evidence that matters. The magistrates will examine the evidence and nothing else.

 

[Paidiske]

The breakdown of the charges and sentences can be viewed here: https://www.theage.com.au/national/...-crimes-set-a-punishment-20190313-p513u1.html

Edited to add: full sentencing here. Be warned, it goes for an hour and a half:

https://www.facebook.com/video.php?v=2070939156331312

 

[Zoness]

Damn, awful short sentence. He practically got away with it.