Freemason

[dreamingflower]

Do you believe in the freemason, illuminati, and nwo? I am scared after reading all of it.

Please lelt's talk like grown adults and not be foul to eachother. thank you

 

[Wootsy]

I've read alot on the topic as well, and it does offer an interesting explanation on how
the anti-christ comes on the scene.

 

[gracechick]

Yeah have to say I do. The devil has to use humans who will let him to get a certain amount of his plans carried out on earth. But one does have to be careful not to focus on evil instead of the Lord

 

[Sabbathiel]

All of the anti-Masonic material you read on the net and most of the documentaries you see on the TV are usually lies, propaganda, and/or from misinformed individuals.

The Truth is in History.

Some Christians believe it Masonry is Devil Worship. But where did Satanism really evolve in history? It evolved from the Satanic Bible written by an Atheist named Anton LaVey. The Church of Satan is no more than a church of Atheists. See the Church of Satan website to see for yourself...

"No Atheist can be a Mason. You must believe in God."
"Masonry is not a religion but a Fraternity founded upon religion dating back to the building of King Solomon's Temple."

Masonry is about men striving to be better men, following the teachings of the Bible. you may ask, "Why not just go to church?" Masons do. Masonry, by its own law, demands that nothing stand in the way or interfere of a man's faith, family, or job. It's been this way since it was founded. The exact date you can find from the first Grand Lodge - Grand Lodge of England - web site: ugle.org.uk

Masons do good deeds without recognition. There are very, very, little secrets in Masonry. It's as if the good done by Masons past and present are secret and nothing but lies and false accusations are spread instead...

If you knew all of the charities such as those going toward free health care and hospital for those children who need it, Shriners Hospital, free dental going toward those children who are disabled, Grotto, scholarships toward students, and eye care... This is just the beginning of a never ending list of good deeds.

Satanism is all about selfishness... Nothing about giving... In the Church of Satan, it's all about "Survival of the fittest."

In a Masonic Lodge you will always find a KJV Bible in the middle. It's there symbolically to remind Masons to always follow that guiding light, which is the Word of God.

And if you still believe the NWO theory, I'm still wondering why I'm still having to work and pay bills... As a Master Mason, if we're taking over, I'm not seeing it... I have bills and owe a lot on my car and can barely afford gas. Masonry has been around for centuries... Where is this NWO?

I'm a dedicated Christian very much into Apologetics, Theology, and Masonry. I love history. George Washington was a Freemason. Remember Burl Ives? He song some mighty good gospel songs. How about the American Pledge, "One Nation under God"? The was written by a Freemason, Francis Bellamy a Baptist Minister.

In Masonic History, you will find many, many individuals who played important roles throughout world history and were Christians. In the Lodge, you will learn historical moments throughout history that you won't learn in the classroom or on the web.

It's not evil. It's not satanic or witch craft. It's a Fraternity, Brotherhood, of religious men who enjoy doing good deeds, working hard, raising a good family, and supporting each other. Everybody joins a club... Why not one that is active, ancient, and has helped shape the Free world.

If want the truth, you'll need to do the research, not the web search or flipping of the channels. Ask a Mason. Visit a Lodge. Read some books - lots of Masonic books out there. Like me, you'll learn a lot of history.

I have yet to see any evil, but have met many wonderful Christian brothers and their family. I've seen them help each other with no questions asked. I've seen them do a great many charitable deeds and be that upstanding role model for their children, without any need for recognition. And if you open up that Bible, you'll see that they follow it very well.

Faith, Hope an Charity.
Friendship and Brotherly Love.
Morality and Equality among all men.

Does it still sound scary? Does it still sound evil and a conspiracy to take over the world? If any of what the Anti-Masonic people say is true, then why did so many die fighting for equality? Why did so fight against corruption of government and church? Freedom of Religion, remember? Think about that.

 

[Sabbathiel]

What I meant by Freedom of Religion is that government cannot corrupt a church or take control and that a bad or corrupt church control government. If you read the news, you know as well as I that there are a lot of false churches or bad congregations out there...

Masons, in the 1300's fought against such... It's about equality and freedom to worship God without fear of persecution and fascism.

 

[Sabbathiel]

Freemasons of the Nation's Capital Champion Fight Against Breast Cancer

Grand Lodge of Free And Accepted Masons of the District of Columbia sponsors awareness and donates $25,000 to Susan G. Komen For the Cure.
May 20, 2008 -- The Freemasons of the nation's capital, the Grand Lodge of Free And Accepted Masons of the District of Columbia, are championing breast cancer awareness and prevention in partnership with Susan G. Komen For The Cure during the National Race For The Cure on June 7th, 2008.

Spearheading the drive is Ms. Lourdes Elias, wife of the Grand Master of Masons of D.C., Akram R. Elias. Ms. Elias, a breast cancer survivor, has already donated over $4,000 with her fundraising team. In addition, the Grand Lodge of D.C. donated $25,000 to Susan G. Komen For the Cure in a special ceremony during the recent 9th World Conference of Masonic Grand Lodges held May 7 - 10 in Washington.

As the world's oldest and largest fraternal society with more than half of its membership residing in the United States, Freemasonry has a rich history of involvement in the founding of America and her development for over two hundred and fifty years. In an unprecedented effort, the Freemasons of D.C. wish to further the awareness and prevention of breast cancer within the greater Washington Metropolitan area, as the brotherhood believes that strengthening the community is a key component in building a good civil society.

 

[visionary]

Forked tongue.

 

[Sabbathiel]

How so?
Quick to judge without knowledge of one's heart? Many have through times past, and many have mislead groups of innocents from a pulpit of lies using ignorance against those who read not the word of God, ie Westboro Baptist Church. Did not Christ warn us of such things?

"Since the Torah is a finite book expressing the will of an infinite God, many lessons must be derivable from each passage from all the infinite angles."
Using that quote alone, many believe you to be evil and that belief is the sole cause of countless deaths throughout the world. You alone are accused of holding society back from progressing because of you, being accused of anti-Science and pro-Creationism.

And just because you have that belief in God, you are not fit to be any kind of parent because the "Religious" brainwash their children, teaching them backwards thinking.

That's a popular belief in militant Atheism. Dawkins and Harris have stated those accusations time and time again. Hitchens "Religion poisons everything" crusade would have one believe that Christianity is really very evil...

If I didn't study Christianity, know its history, studied the Bible, and been a Christian my entire life, those three Atheist authors would have been very convincing because my ignorance would have allowed me to believe a bunch of false allegations, propaganda, and blinding me from seeing the truth.

Accusing an entire group of men that fought for freedom to believe in God and helped shape the free world (USA) we live in today of being evil "Satanist" makes no sense to me. That's the same as Hitchens accusing you and your church of the 911 tragedy. It's absurd.

"The founding fathers of the United States were Christians." Have you heard that before. It's true, they did believe in God. But they were Freemasons too...
What evil did George Washington do? What evil did Benjamin Franklin do? Thomas Jefferson? Many say that he was an Atheist but the truth is that he too is documented at a Lodge in the USA as a Master Mason, a religious man...
What evil did he do?
How about Gerald Ford? Did that president of the USA rule with an iron fist to dominate the world for the NWO?
Andrew Jackson! Oh no, burn that 20 dollar bill as Satan is all over it! Better yet, send me all of your twenties before they consume your soul... I'll take those twenties off your hands.

DAVEY CROCKET! U.S. Representative from Tennessee and infamous in American History. Tell me, was he really conspiring to take over the world for Satan?

Clark Gable, was he such an evil actor for his time? I guess Satan directed "Gone with the wind."

King Camp Gillette! Throw out those disposable razors for the good of your soul. You can't have an item that was crafted and funded by such an evil king.

Louis Armstrong, Aw man...that Jazz player is a Mason too? Yes sir, that evil jazz player... Sorry Armstrong fans, Satan is behind all of that trumpet playing, according to some Christians. I'm sure Armstrong and Marylin Manson would be best of buds today, don't you think?

John Wayne... Not the Duke! Yep, that patriotic cowboy was a Freemason.

Mozart. But he was a Catholic! Yep, and a Freemason.

I don't... For one, Marylin Manson is an Atheist and a member of the Church of Satan. The men I just listed believe and worshiped God and had done great things... But those are just few and are names most everyone knows. Just think, there a millions throughout the world.

Also think about this. A group of Freemasons lead a marathon for years to help raise millions of dollars toward the Cerebral Palsy Research on a Fox network. I guess Satan was behind that too...And they continue to help disabled children today.

Oh, by the way.. Don't eat at KFC... Yep, you guessed it... The founder was a Mason too...

If you read and study the history, you too would laugh at the conspiracy theories and "Satanic" crap people come up with...Some people have to be very gullible to fall for it...

Learn the true enemies of Christianity, the ones who want to close the doors of every church in America and silence every Christian. It's not Freemasons as many of them fought for the right to even own a Bible and learn to read it!

I believe my subtle point about the true "Satanists" was obvious...Look up New Atheism. Read some articles by Sam Harris and Christopher Hitchens. Listen to those who call themselves "Militant Atheists".

Do a comparison...and let me know what you've learned...

 

[e. barrett]

I don't know enough about Masonry (the lodge kind, not the construction kind ) to have made up my mind one way or another. However I did hear Greg Koukl on Stand to Reason make a good argument that some of the Masonic vows may be in conflict with the Christian faith. I don't remember all the arguments off the top of my head but it basically came down to the "you can only serve one master" argument.

That said, I don't really think the conspiracy theories about Masons are true at all.

 

[Sabbathiel]

I've never made a vow to serve a certain deity. I wouldn't if they required it, I wouldn't be Mason in that scenario... It's a requirement that you are not an "Atheist". Freemasonry is not a religion... So, how then can the argument be made that Masons "Must" believe in a pagan deity?

Again, look at Francis Bellamy, an example of a Baptist Minister as a Mason. If that argument was true, then the United States of America was founded by a group of pagan followers... I don't think so...

Throughout American history, did not each President take an oath on the Holy Bible? Our Currency quotes, "In God we Trust?" That's "God", not "A god we trust or Satan."

In no way does Freemasonry conflict with your Faith, Family, Health, or Job. That's by strict law of the organization...

 

[Sabbathiel]

As I stated earlier, satanists are truly Atheists - check out the Church of Satan website. We Christians need to be looking at some of the real enemies of our Religion rather than those who, throughout history and today, compliment it and stand to fight for it.

Here are some Peter Singer (Atheist) quotations from his books Rethinking Life and Death and Writings on an Ethical Life.
On how mothers should be permitted to kill their offspring until the age of 28 days: "My colleague Helga Kuhse and I suggest that a period of twenty-eight days after birth might be allowed before an infant is accepted as having the same right to life as others."
On why abortion is less morally significant than killing a rat: "Rats are indisputably more aware of their surroundings, and more able to respond in purposeful and complex ways to things they like or dislike, than a fetus at ten or even thirty-two weeks gestation."
On why pigs, chickens and fish have more rights to life than unborn humans: "The calf, the pig, and the much-derided chicken come out well ahead of the fetus at any stage of pregnancy, while if we make the comparison with a fetus of less than three months, a fish would show more signs of consciousness."
On why infants aren't normal human beings with rights to life and liberty: "Characteristics like rationality, autonomy and self-consciousness...make a difference. Infants lack these characteristics. Killing them, therefore, cannot be equated with killing normal human beings."

You'll never find a Freemason thinking such things as Masons rejoice and hold true the gift that God gave us - Life - and hope for that gift which Christ promises us - Life Eternal.

 

[Jester4kicks]

Sabb has a rather long-winded way of saying it... but he's _basically_ right. Masonry is not a religion, and the variety of entertaining conspiracy theories are usually from people that have little understanding of the fraternity.

As for the illuminati... the group existed, but the common consensus is that the group disolved a long time ago.

As for the "New World Order"... it's usually just a bunch of conspiracy-theories from folks that like watching for black helicopters.

Travel well.

 

[Senachwine]

Yup

 

[Senachwine]

Double Yup

 

[Senachwine]

Yup n double yup

 

[gracechick]

I remember a friend of my father's passing away quite a few years back. My parents were suprised to see at his service that there were masonic symbols. He was a nice man with a lovely family. He and his family were very active in the church and community. The children still are actively involved.
I didn't understand this at the time myself. It has only been the past few years that I have come across material suggesting that there are many levels. And only those that are chosen or have a certain type of potential reach the top level to find the lodge is quite different then they have been led to believe.

As for the secret societies I believe they definetly do exist. And they are quickly steering the world's ship to hell for whatever reasons they have. Greed, desire for power and prestige and some because they have chosen to worship evil over good.

If one googles President Bush and other powerful families there are many interesting articles to that come up. They are involved in questionable things. Someone posted not long ago an article with a pic about the wild parties some leaders have partaken of that included about everything from idol worship to blantant immorality.

Finally all I can say is Repentance is the order of the day. And even then I add Lord have mercy on us all...

 

[Texas Lynn]

Freemasonry is a men's fraternal organization primarily composed of conservative businessmen.

The "Illuminati" were a short-lived "secret society" founded by an Austrian Jesuit professor supposedly with goals to improve the world but were quickly supressed by the Catholic Church and the Hapsburg manarchs.

"NWO" or "New World Order" is a concept of the changing world and the powers that run things most recently famously articulated by the elder George Bush in his nomination acceptance speech in 1988. It does, of course, date from the Enlightenment of which our Revolution and the French's were part. Indeed, the slogan on the back of the $1 bill "Novo Ordum Seculorum" (A New Order for the Ages) refers to American idealism to reform the world which more often fell short of the mark given our own checkered history. As Bush and others articulated it, it merely means "change is afoot; good things are happening and we're behind them". Opposition to the elite has often led to conspiracy theories attaching sinister motives to these articulations. No doubt the opposition to Shah Mohammed Reza Pahlavi's regime in Iran also railed against such elite-directed change. It's fun speculation but not a serious response to things. A power elite exists; it can be conservative and progressive as needed. More importantly, it can be influenced. speculation and fear is often as futile as any misapprehension that either the younger Bush or Barak Obama are antichrists.

 

[visionary]

Clinton like mentioning His New World Order in the State of the Union Address.

 

[gracechick]

I had forgoten how George Bush senior had repeated NWO many times in his speeches until I saw a clip recently. One interesting tidbit is to google G Bush senior and see how many secret societies he apparently belongs too and his nickname is "Magog". An odd choice for a Christian I have think...
That is often the case. Well meaning people implementing plans outside the will of God have caused chaos and problems throughout history. All in the name of making this world a better place. Never works unless the heart is humble and the ingredients of the plan are from God's Word, bcause the flesh always is a selfish and untamed animal.

 

[Texas Lynn]

I had forgoten how George Bush senior had repeated NWO many times in his speeches until I saw a clip recently. One interesting tidbit is to google G Bush senior and see how many secret societies he apparently belongs too and his nickname is "Magog". An odd choice for a Christian I have think...
That is often the case. Well meaning people implementing plans outside the will of God have caused chaos and problems throughout history. All in the name of making this world a better place. Never works unless the heart is humble and the ingredients of the plan are from God's Word, bcause the flesh always is a selfish and untamed animal.

OTOH, it is possible it is the elite advancing the "Will of God" while it is the conspiracy theorists seeking to thwart it. Any judgment something is or is not "within the will of God" is entirely a matter of opinion.

The biggest objection conspiracyists have against the elite is that they're not them. The name of the game is power. Whenever some talk show host or political preacher starts going on about what's in the "Will of God" and what isn't it's time to check to make sure you still have your wallet.