Fossil Record Shows Evolution as an Errant Fabricated Mess

[Subduction Zone]

The geologic record says there is. To envision it one has to compose the narrative a little differently.

Hebrew (with added vowels)

"inthebeginninggodcreatedtheheavensandtheearthandtheearthwasemptyandviod......" ( the restoration of earth's surface follows).

English, with title and subtitle:

In The Beginning God Created The Heavens And The Earth.

But The Earth Became An Empty Wasteland.

( The restoration of earth's surface follows).


The writers weren't inspired to reveal what happened during the period(s) of destruction, save that the earth was originally created for the angels.

Then tell me, what reasonable test could show Gap Theory to be wrong?

 

[OldWiseGuy]

Then tell me, what reasonable test could show Gap Theory to be wrong?

Scientific test or biblical test?

 

[Subduction Zone]

Scientific test or biblical test?

A scientific test of course. You did call it a theory after all.

 

[tas8831]

Another thing struck me about this - bolded for emphasis:

What is the purpose of the heart sending signals directly to the esophagus?

"The extrinsic cardiac ganglia, located in the thoracic cavity, have direct connections to organs such as the lungs and esophagus and are also indirectly connected via the spinal cord to many other organs, including the skin and arteries."

So the high-IQ creationist concluded that because the things called the "extrinsic cardiac ganglia" send nerve fibers to the esophagus, that the heart was sending fibers to the esophagus. Because words.

Extrinsic cardiac ganglia are clusters of sympathetic neuron cell bodies (primarily) that receive motor input from the sympathetic trunk and then re-send those iputs to, in this case, the heart (or esophagus).

The heart does not 'send' information to these ganglia .

Since creationists can only seem to understand analogies, lets use this on to demonstrate how wrong OWG is -

Your house and your neighbor's house both dump sewage into the main sewer lines, and your sewage eventually gets to the sewage treatment plant. If OWG's interpretation of the passage he quoted has merit, then we would have to conclude that when OWG's neighbor flushes his toilet, his poop goes into OWG's house. I mean, it has to since they are both directly connected to the sewage treatment facility!

 

[OldWiseGuy]

A scientific test of course. You did call it a theory after all.

In layman's terms it's an 'idea'.

 

[OldWiseGuy]

Another thing struck me about this - bolded for emphasis:

So the high-IQ creationist concluded that because the things called the "extrinsic cardiac ganglia" send nerve fibers to the esophagus, that the heart was sending fibers to the esophagus. Because words.

Extrinsic cardiac ganglia are clusters of sympathetic neuron cell bodies (primarily) that receive motor input from the sympathetic trunk and then re-send those iputs to, in this case, the heart (or esophagus).

The heart does not 'send' information to these ganglia .

Since creationists can only seem to understand analogies, lets use this on to demonstrate how wrong OWG is -

Your house and your neighbor's house both dump sewage into the main sewer lines, and your sewage eventually gets to the sewage treatment plant. If OWG's interpretation of the passage he quoted, then we would have to conclude that when OWG's neighbor flushes his toilet, his poop goes into OWG's house. I mean, it has to since they are both directly connected tot eh sewage treatment facility!

Just brainstorming the idea that reflexive vocalizations are possible. Why get all upset over it?

 

[OldWiseGuy]

. The parasympathetic nervous system is interconnected with the brain obviously. But all nerves are otherwise they wouldn’t work . Without the brain you’d get random firings . You’d probably twitch and maybe your blood pressure would rise dangerously. ( this happens in quadriplegics)

What carries signals in reflexive movements?

 

[Brightmoon]

Reflex signals go to the spine and back out to the limb . This is why when you touch something hot your hand pulls away before you actually feel the pain . The signal also travels up to the brain and thats when you feel it and why you feel it later! By the time you feel the pain, you would’ve been more seriously injured by the heat rather than just that little sting you got, if your reflexes didn’t work

 

[Subduction Zone]

In layman's terms it's an 'idea'.

Since we are having a discussion about one of the sciences it is proper to use scientific terminology rather than layman's terms. You could always call your "idea" what it is. It is just a WAG (Wild Donkeyed Guess)>

 

[tas8831]

Just brainstorming the idea that reflexive vocalizations are possible. Why get all upset over it?

Because you keep ignoring the multiple explanations and refusing to use the simple tools at your disposal (the interwebs!) regarding the implausibility of your 'brainstorming'? Because of your history of disingenuous exchange?

Can you now admit that you have made a series of rather dopey implication/suggestions/brainstorms regarding things like the function and relevance of the extrinsic cardiac ganglia premised on your ignorance of biology and anatomy and physiology?

 

[tas8831]

What carries signals in reflexive movements?

See.... this is what I mean...

This is BASIC stuff - we go through reflexes in BI 101, for crying out loud. Why would someone so 'intelligent' try to jump into a pool 10 feet deep despite having never waded into water more than a few inches deep?

Here you go - learn something:

 

[OldWiseGuy]

Since we are having a discussion about one of the sciences it is proper to use scientific terminology rather than layman's terms. You could always call your "idea" what it is. It is just a WAG (Wild Donkeyed Guess)>

I can go with that.

 

[OldWiseGuy]

Reflex signals go to the spine and back out to the limb . This is why when you touch something hot your hand pulls away before you actually feel the pain . The signal also travels up to the brain and thats when you feel it and why you feel it later! By the time you feel the pain, you would’ve been more seriously injured by the heat rather than just that little sting you got, if your reflexes didn’t work

I know that. I'm angling for a reflexive vocal response as well.

 

[OldWiseGuy]

See.... this is what I mean...

This is BASIC stuff - we go through reflexes in BI 101, for crying out loud. Why would someone so 'intelligent' try to jump into a pool 10 feet deep despite having never waded into water more than a few inches deep?

Here you go - learn something:

I know that. I learned it on this site.

Biology for Kids: Nervous System in the Human Body

The knee jerk response isn't a good example of what I want as there is no surprise and no pain.

 

[OldWiseGuy]

A scientific test of course. You did call it a theory after all.

It's called the Gap Theory, but I didn't name it.

If the theory comports with a scientific ancient earth what's the problem? Are you trying to shoehorn everyone into young earth creationism?

 

[tas8831]

I know that. I'm angling for a reflexive vocal response as well.

No such thing, as I explained to you more than a month ago.

In the 2 minutes and 30 seconds I have before I have to leave for class, I googled "reflexive vocal response" and found... Nothing. There were a few of these, though - read and try to learn:

Interactions between social stress and morphine in the periaqueductal gray: effects on affective vocal and reflexive pain responses in rats

https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0166432807001490

And for kicks:

Evidence to Suggest that Copulatory Vocalizations in Women Are Not a Reflexive Consequence of [bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse]

I eagerly await your analysis.

 

[tas8831]

The knee jerk response isn't a good example of what I want as there is no surprise and no pain.

So why did you write:

"What carries signals in reflexive movements?"

See what I mean about how disingenuous you are? And besides - reflexes are ALL like the knee jerk reflex, the knee jerk reflex is just one of the simplest (monosynaptic) reflexes.

 

[Subduction Zone]

It's called the Gap Theory, but I didn't name it.

If the theory comports with a scientific ancient earth what's the problem? Are you trying to shoehorn everyone into young earth creationism?

I know, ignorant Christians did. I will not accuse you of being ignorant since you are trying at least a little.

The problem with so called Gap theory is that it is ill defined and most believers of it are still science deniers. They deny LUCA the Last Universal Common Ancestor:

Last universal common ancestor - Wikipedia

It fails because it does not agree with evidence. And no, I am not trying to make everyone a YEC, just as I am not making everyone a Flerther, though that is the extreme one gets if one takes the Bible literally. There are different degrees of being wrong. I think that we can all agree that Flerthers are bat-poop crazy wrong. An Old Earth Creationist is merely less wrong than a YEC.

 

[OldWiseGuy]

No such thing, as I explained to you more than a month ago.

In the 2 minutes and 30 seconds I have before I have to leave for class, I googled "reflexive vocal response" and found... Nothing. There were a few of these, though - read and try to learn:

Interactions between social stress and morphine in the periaqueductal gray: effects on affective vocal and reflexive pain responses in rats

https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0166432807001490

And for kicks:

Evidence to Suggest that Copulatory Vocalizations in Women Are Not a Reflexive Consequence of [bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse]

I eagerly await your analysis.

I haven't found any references either, but I'll keep exploring the idea.

 

[OldWiseGuy]

I know, ignorant Christians did. I will not accuse you of being ignorant since you are trying at least a little.

The problem with so called Gap theory is that it is ill defined and most believers of it are still science deniers. They deny LUCA the Last Universal Common Ancestor:

Last universal common ancestor - Wikipedia

It fails because it does not agree with evidence. And no, I am not trying to make everyone a YEC, just as I am not making everyone a Flerther, though that is the extreme one gets if one takes the Bible literally. There are different degrees of being wrong. I think that we can all agree that Flerthers are bat-poop crazy wrong. An Old Earth Creationist is merely less wrong than a YEC.

So you saying that you can't have an old earth without also accepting evolution?