Fossil Challenge for Evolutionists

lifepsyop

Regular Member
Jan 23, 2014
1,820
414
✟56,963.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Private
Evolutionists have long claimed that the order of fossils in the rock layers directly supports Evolution, and that their theory even gives them the power to predict specifically where certain types of fossils will or will not be found.

So, evolutionists, this challenge begins with a thought experiment:

Imagine that scientists have thoroughly studied all living things, but nobody has ever gone digging for fossils. So, you know everything about human,mammal,bird,reptile,amphibian,etc. anatomy, but no fossils have been dug up yet.

Now, since you love to claim that Evolution "predicts" the order of the fossil record in the geologic column.... tell us where you expect to find different types of fossilized animal groups, and provide specific arguments for your predictions. Keep in mind our thought experiment: You know all about living animal anatomy, but have zero prior knowledge of fossil appearances in the rock record. Therefore, these should be true predictions of the fossil record, supported with well-reasoned arguments.

Here are just some examples of the types of questions you should be able to answer:


-When do the mammals evolve? Where do you specifically expect to find them in the geologic column?
-More specifically, when do hominids evolve? Is it possible that hominids were an early innovation within mammals, or could they have only appeared very recently?
-What about other sub-groups? Lions, tigers, horses, rabbits?
-Do birds evolve long before, at the same time, or long after mammals evolve? Why?
-How about turtles? Did they evolve very early on, or could they be a relatively recent evolutionary innovation only found in the upper rock layers?
-Can fossils be out of order? (i.e. can you find the remains of the grandchildren in rock layers older than the grandparents?)
-Is there any sensible fossil order at all? Or do major contemporaneous radiation events confuse it? (e.g. the selection pressures for mammals, dinosaurs, birds, etc. all manifest in relatively the same timeframe, causing their fossils to be mixed in with one another) Explain why you do or do not expect to find traces of such a pattern.


(Remember... Evolution theory supposedly "predicts" a specific order of fossils. So you should be able to argue for such a fossil order without prior knowledge of it.)
 
  • Agree
Reactions: marineimaging

VirOptimus

A nihilist who cares.
Aug 24, 2005
6,814
4,421
53
✟250,677.00
Faith
Atheist
Marital Status
Married
Evolutionists have long claimed that the order of fossils in the rock layers directly supports Evolution, and that their theory even gives them the power to predict specifically where certain types of fossils will or will not be found.

So, evolutionists, this challenge begins with a thought experiment:

Imagine that scientists have thoroughly studied all living things, but nobody has ever gone digging for fossils. So, you know everything about human,mammal,bird,reptile,amphibian,etc. anatomy, but no fossils have been dug up yet.

Now, since you love to claim that Evolution "predicts" the order of the fossil record in the geologic column.... tell us where you expect to find different types of fossilized animal groups, and provide specific arguments for your predictions. Keep in mind our thought experiment: You know all about living animal anatomy, but have zero prior knowledge of fossil appearances in the rock record. Therefore, these should be true predictions of the fossil record, supported with well-reasoned arguments.

Here are just some examples of the types of questions you should be able to answer:


-When do the mammals evolve? Where do you specifically expect to find them in the geologic column?
-More specifically, when do hominids evolve? Is it possible that hominids were an early innovation within mammals, or could they have only appeared very recently?
-What about other sub-groups? Lions, tigers, horses, rabbits?
-Do birds evolve long before, at the same time, or long after mammals evolve? Why?
-How about turtles? Did they evolve very early on, or could they be a relatively recent evolutionary innovation only found in the upper rock layers?
-Can fossils be out of order? (i.e. can you find the remains of the grandchildren in rock layers older than the grandparents?)
-Is there any sensible fossil order at all? Or do major contemporaneous radiation events confuse it? (e.g. the selection pressures for mammals, dinosaurs, all manifest in relatively the same timeframe, causing their fossils to be mixed in with one another) Explain why you do or do not expect to find traces of such a pattern.


(Remember... Evolution theory supposedly "predicts" a specific order of fossils. So you should be able to argue for such a fossil order without prior knowledge of it.)

We are not responsible for your education.
 
Upvote 0

Speedwell

Well-Known Member
May 11, 2016
23,928
17,625
81
St Charles, IL
✟347,270.00
Country
United States
Faith
Other Religion
Marital Status
Married
Evolutionists have long claimed that the order of fossils in the rock layers directly supports Evolution, and that their theory even gives them the power to predict specifically where certain types of fossils will or will not be found.

So, evolutionists, this challenge begins with a thought experiment:

Imagine that scientists have thoroughly studied all living things, but nobody has ever gone digging for fossils. So, you know everything about human,mammal,bird,reptile,amphibian,etc. anatomy, but no fossils have been dug up yet.

Now, since you love to claim that Evolution "predicts" the order of the fossil record in the geologic column.... tell us where you expect to find different types of fossilized animal groups, and provide specific arguments for your predictions. Keep in mind our thought experiment: You know all about living animal anatomy, but have zero prior knowledge of fossil appearances in the rock record. Therefore, these should be true predictions of the fossil record, supported with well-reasoned arguments.

Here are just some examples of the types of questions you should be able to answer:


-When do the mammals evolve? Where do you specifically expect to find them in the geologic column?
-More specifically, when do hominids evolve? Is it possible that hominids were an early innovation within mammals, or could they have only appeared very recently?
-What about other sub-groups? Lions, tigers, horses, rabbits?
-Do birds evolve long before, at the same time, or long after mammals evolve? Why?
-How about turtles? Did they evolve very early on, or could they be a relatively recent evolutionary innovation only found in the upper rock layers?
-Can fossils be out of order? (i.e. can you find the remains of the grandchildren in rock layers older than the grandparents?)
-Is there any sensible fossil order at all? Or do major contemporaneous radiation events confuse it? (e.g. the selection pressures for mammals, dinosaurs, birds, etc. all manifest in relatively the same timeframe, causing their fossils to be mixed in with one another) Explain why you do or do not expect to find traces of such a pattern.


(Remember... Evolution theory supposedly "predicts" a specific order of fossils. So you should be able to argue for such a fossil order without prior knowledge of it.)
I think you are confusing "predicts" with "is confirmed by" or "is consistent with."
 
Upvote 0

GodsGrace101

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
Apr 17, 2018
6,713
2,298
Tuscany
✟231,507.00
Country
Italy
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
Evolutionists have long claimed that the order of fossils in the rock layers directly supports Evolution, and that their theory even gives them the power to predict specifically where certain types of fossils will or will not be found.

So, evolutionists, this challenge begins with a thought experiment:

Imagine that scientists have thoroughly studied all living things, but nobody has ever gone digging for fossils. So, you know everything about human,mammal,bird,reptile,amphibian,etc. anatomy, but no fossils have been dug up yet.

Now, since you love to claim that Evolution "predicts" the order of the fossil record in the geologic column.... tell us where you expect to find different types of fossilized animal groups, and provide specific arguments for your predictions. Keep in mind our thought experiment: You know all about living animal anatomy, but have zero prior knowledge of fossil appearances in the rock record. Therefore, these should be true predictions of the fossil record, supported with well-reasoned arguments.

Here are just some examples of the types of questions you should be able to answer:


-When do the mammals evolve? Where do you specifically expect to find them in the geologic column?
-More specifically, when do hominids evolve? Is it possible that hominids were an early innovation within mammals, or could they have only appeared very recently?
-What about other sub-groups? Lions, tigers, horses, rabbits?
-Do birds evolve long before, at the same time, or long after mammals evolve? Why?
-How about turtles? Did they evolve very early on, or could they be a relatively recent evolutionary innovation only found in the upper rock layers?
-Can fossils be out of order? (i.e. can you find the remains of the grandchildren in rock layers older than the grandparents?)
-Is there any sensible fossil order at all? Or do major contemporaneous radiation events confuse it? (e.g. the selection pressures for mammals, dinosaurs, birds, etc. all manifest in relatively the same timeframe, causing their fossils to be mixed in with one another) Explain why you do or do not expect to find traces of such a pattern.


(Remember... Evolution theory supposedly "predicts" a specific order of fossils. So you should be able to argue for such a fossil order without prior knowledge of it.)
I agree with your thinking.
WHEN did animals go from being totally blind to seeing?

How long did it take?
Which animal fossil shows that this even happened?

Many scientists are beginning to abandon the theory of evolution...which leaves them with what??
God?
 
Upvote 0

marineimaging

Texas Baptist now living in Colorado
Jul 14, 2014
1,449
1,228
Ward, Colorado
Visit site
✟90,207.00
Country
United States
Faith
Baptist
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Republican
I think you are confusing "predicts" with "is confirmed by" or "is consistent with."
I don see that he is asking for anyone to educate him and also see validity in his question. It only finds assumed confirmation based on time. And if the time is proven wrong then the order can be wrong too.
 
Upvote 0

VirOptimus

A nihilist who cares.
Aug 24, 2005
6,814
4,421
53
✟250,677.00
Faith
Atheist
Marital Status
Married
I don see that he is asking for anyone to educate him and also see validity in his question. It only finds assumed confirmation based on time. And if the time is proven wrong then the order can be wrong too.

Nope, its plain old ignorance.
 
Upvote 0

GodsGrace101

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
Apr 17, 2018
6,713
2,298
Tuscany
✟231,507.00
Country
Italy
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
Nope, its plain old ignorance.
Ignorance is when one is too dumb to even ask a question.

Asking a question shows a person is not ignorant.

Asking an intelligent question shows a person does more thinking than most....
 
  • Agree
Reactions: Kenny'sID
Upvote 0

Speedwell

Well-Known Member
May 11, 2016
23,928
17,625
81
St Charles, IL
✟347,270.00
Country
United States
Faith
Other Religion
Marital Status
Married
I agree with your thinking.
WHEN did animals go from being totally blind to seeing?

How long did it take?
Which animal fossil shows that this even happened?

Many scientists are beginning to abandon the theory of evolution...which leaves them with what??
God?
God was always available to them whether they "abandoned" the theory of evolution or not.
 
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

USincognito

a post by Alan Smithee
Site Supporter
Dec 25, 2003
42,058
16,810
Dallas
✟870,771.00
Country
United States
Faith
Atheist
Marital Status
Private
I don see that he is asking for anyone to educate him and also see validity in his question. It only finds assumed confirmation based on time. And if the time is proven wrong then the order can be wrong too.
Neither the time nor the order have ever been "proven" wrong.
 
Upvote 0

sfs

Senior Member
Jun 30, 2003
10,712
7,752
64
Massachusetts
✟341,660.00
Country
United States
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Married
Upvote 0

VirOptimus

A nihilist who cares.
Aug 24, 2005
6,814
4,421
53
✟250,677.00
Faith
Atheist
Marital Status
Married
Ignorance is when one is too dumb to even ask a question.

Asking a question shows a person is not ignorant.

Asking an intelligent question shows a person does more thinking than most....

There is no intelligent questions in the OP.
 
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

marineimaging

Texas Baptist now living in Colorado
Jul 14, 2014
1,449
1,228
Ward, Colorado
Visit site
✟90,207.00
Country
United States
Faith
Baptist
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Republican
Neither the time nor the order have ever been "proven" wrong.
I apologize for having hijacked the OP's intent. I had a direction with my comments that was interrupted several times by failures in the internet service to stay up so I was making no sense. The end result is that you can't reason faith in God and creation because it wasn't gained by reason, offered by reason, blessed by reason, or accepted by reason. Have a blessed day.
 
Last edited:
Upvote 0

marineimaging

Texas Baptist now living in Colorado
Jul 14, 2014
1,449
1,228
Ward, Colorado
Visit site
✟90,207.00
Country
United States
Faith
Baptist
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Republican
I remember D. James Kennedy making this proclamation from the pulpit 30 years ago.
People will believe what they want to believe. That is the priceless value of God giving us each choice because it makes my belief in Jesus even more valuable. Once a person experiences an encounter with the Holy Spirit and begins to walk with Christ then it is nearly impossible to not want to make the rest of your walk through life at His side. I have had many experiences with our Lord and try as I might, I cannot fully express the pure joy at not having to waste another moment wondering which is true.
 
  • Like
Reactions: lifepsyop
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

pitabread

Well-Known Member
Jan 29, 2017
12,920
13,372
Frozen North
✟336,823.00
Country
Canada
Faith
Agnostic
Marital Status
Private
Given the exponential rates of decay the further you go back the potential for old earth, young creation is even more plausible than single evolution.

That's not true. The only way to accept a young Earth is to flat out ignore findings in every branch of the natural sciences, among other things.

Heck, even the Institute for Creation Research (a YEC organization) admits to hundreds of millions of years worth of radioactive decay per the findings in their RATE project.

The only way to believe in a Young Earth is to fundamentally reject an objective universe; which means rejecting the basis on which scientific inquiry is performed.
 
Upvote 0