Flying Spaghetti Monster

[Smidlee]

There's a Boobzilla? I haven't seen that japanese flick...I can only imagine what monster she fights....

You didn't know about Boobzilla. The reptile who rebel against his family by growing long hair and boobs singing " I'm hot blooded"

 

[Ana the Ist]

You didn't know about Boobzilla. The reptile who rebel against his family by growing long hair and boobs singing " I'm hot blooded"

Lol nope....never heard of it. Is this from a chick tract?

 

[FoxyRoxy]

Well then maybe you are on the wrong team.

what? because I adhere to simple rules of logic I am unable to join your club?

 

[Colter]

Yea sure.

It is what it is, I just enjoy the show.

You know you never answered my question.

Are former Christian who are now non believers delusional?

Good gosh bhsmt? I keep telling you, I was referring to Christians not ex-Christians.

Here is what I said, read slowly:

"If the tradition that you had before was nothing more than the byproduct of delusional people then in the end all that they had was death.

Now what you have culminates in death. Nothing lost, nothing gained."

Get it? No! I do not think atheist are delusional, just sadly wrong.

 

[Colter]

what? because I adhere to simple rules of logic I am unable to join your club?

No, because you are siding with Atheist in their battle against God, you have a Christian label on your page. Was thinking you were Christian.

 

[Colter]

They certainly do. It's a shame though, they're often infested with christians.

I like your sharp wit

 

[DogmaHunter]

* Ultimately meaningless to the individual. There is no recollection in death, the self is gone. All that was lofty, noble and good in the life of those who promote the godless ideal, is extinguished by death. Even that work left behind that benefits other selves is ultimately meaningless in that those selves will be extinguished by death. Its a philosophy of pessimistic despair.

I don't see how this is different from what I said.
You seem to agree with me that it's not meaningless at this point, while we are alive. So, what is your point?

* Even if the religionist were merely imagining the perfection ideals of divinity that he hungers for, those ideals are greater than the doctrines of death promoted by atheist. As a way of life you just don't have anything appealing that the religionist would want as a philosophy to live by.

I don't have any "doctrines of death". I value life a lot. So I have no idea what you are talking about.

 

[DogmaHunter]

We have evidence of our faith, Jesus had evidence, but for those committed to godlessness no amount of evidence will convince you and frankly there are no short cuts to spiritual growth. I find atheist to be intellectually dishonest people riddled with pride of self.

Share the evidence then. And try doing it without engaging in logical fallacies to undermine this supposed evidence.

Yes, I know people who fell in love with their own rationalism and became adherents to the doctrines of pessimistic despair. The greatest was Lucifer who lost his faith and in turn mislead the whole world.

I wasn't talking about "doctrines of pessimistic despair". I was merely talking about not believing in fantastical stories without evidence.

 

[DogmaHunter]

This is Bill W. a former hopeless, bankrupt, unemployed skeptical alcoholic. Bill had a spiritual awakening in the privacy of his hospital room at Towns Hospital in 1934. Not only did he remain sober from the experience but he carried the message to others who also found revolutionary change through faith.


This is the 2000 international convention of AA, people who found God as they understand him like bill did.



An intellectually honest person would be able to see this as a form of proof of the God that these people have found.

Appeal to popularity is a fallacy.

 

[Colter]

Share the evidence then. And try doing it without engaging in logical fallacies to undermine this supposed evidence.



I wasn't talking about "doctrines of pessimistic despair". I was merely talking about not believing in fantastical stories without evidence.

Life itself is a fantastical story, but that is lost on the terminally unique.

 

[Colter]

Appeal to popularity is a fallacy.

Its not an appeal to popularity, its evidence of how literally millions of hopeless drunks and other kinds of addicts found sobriety through faith in a God personal to them.

If you don't believe in God yourself, you could at least be intellectually honest enough to acknowledge the works in the lives of those who do.

"If I do not the works of God, believe me not, but if I do the works of God, even though you believe not in me, I should think you would believe the works." Jesus​

 

[Colter]

"The mind of man can attain high levels of spiritual insight and corresponding spheres of divinity of values because it is not wholly material. There is a spirit nucleus in the mind of man — the Adjuster of the divine presence. There are three separate evidences of this spirit indwelling of the human mind:

1. Humanitarian fellowship — love. The purely animal mind may be gregarious for self-protection, but only the spirit-indwelt intellect is unselfishly altruistic and unconditionally loving.

2. Interpretation of the universe — wisdom. Only the spirit-indwelt mind can comprehend that the universe is friendly to the individual.

3. Spiritual evaluation of life — worship. Only the spirit-indwelt man can realize the divine presence and seek to attain a fuller experience in and with this foretaste of divinity.​

The human mind does not create real values; human experience does not yield universe insight. Concerning insight, the recognition of moral values and the discernment of spiritual meanings, all that the human mind can do is to discover, recognize, interpret, and choose.

The moral values of the universe become intellectual possessions by the exercise of the three basic judgments, or choices, of the mortal mind:

1. Self-judgment — moral choice.

2. Social-judgment — ethical choice.

3. God-judgment — religious choice.​

Thus it appears that all human progress is effected by a technique of conjoint revelational evolution.

Unless a divine lover lived in man, he could not unselfishly and spiritually love. Unless an interpreter lived in the mind, man could not truly realize the unity of the universe. Unless an evaluator dwelt with man, he could not possibly appraise moral values and recognize spiritual meanings. And this lover hails from the very source of infinite love; this interpreter is a part of Universal Unity; this evaluator is the child of the Center and Source of all absolute values of divine and eternal reality.

Moral evaluation with a religious meaning — spiritual insight — connotes the individual’s choice between good and evil, truth and error, material and spiritual, human and divine, time and eternity. Human survival is in great measure dependent on consecrating the human will to the choosing of those values selected by this spirit-value sorter — the indwelling interpreter and unifier. Personal religious experience consists in two phases: discovery in the human mind and revelation by the indwelling divine spirit. Through oversophistication or as a result of the irreligious conduct of professed religionists, a man, or even a generation of men, may elect to suspend their efforts to discover the God who indwells them; they may fail to progress in and attain the divine revelation. But such attitudes of spiritual nonprogression cannot long persist because of the presence and influence of the indwelling Thought Adjusters." UB 1955

 

[quatona]

If you don't believe in God yourself, you could at least be intellectually honest enough to acknowledge the works in the lives of those who do.

I have never had a problem acknowledging that countless people have personally benefitted from various faiths that I personally don´t hold (in the same way many people personally benefitted from various faiths you don´t hold).
That´s never been the point of the discussion, though.

 

[Colter]

I have never had a problem acknowledging that countless people have personally benefitted from various faiths that I personally don´t hold (in the same way many people personally benefitted from various faiths you don´t hold).
That´s never been the point of the discussion, though.

That is the closest thing to "proofs" that religionist can offer, their God revealed in the lives that they live. I share faith in God with every other person who has faith in a vast universe which I believe to be teaming with inhabited worlds. My understanding of God is personal to me, I have NO monopoly on truth.

 

[bhsmte]

No, because you are siding with Atheist in their battle against God, you have a Christian label on your page. Was thinking you were Christian.

Does it bother you when someone else of faith can also use logic to acknowledge reality?

 

[FireDragon76]

Science isn't a belief. It is a process. It can definitely be shown to exist by showing all things that science has produced. What you are claiming is analogous to saying mathematics doesn't exist. Uh.... Yes it does.

If you don't think science, as done in the real world, comes from a particular culture with its own prejudices and naïve assumptions, you are mistaken.

As for the FSM- it's a reductio ad absurdum. It takes a whole spectrum of ways of being a believer in God and tries to distill it to a false essence, one that only the intellectually naïve could accept as valid. That so called "brights" cling to this as an explanation for religious belief, just shows the problems I've talked about in my previous paragraph. Sometimes people can't see the forest through all the trees they study under their electron-powered microscopes.

 

[Colter]

Does it bother you when someone else of faith can also use logic to acknowledge reality?

Of coarse not.

 

[PsychoSarah]

That is the closest thing to "proofs" that religionist can offer, their God revealed in the lives that they live. I share faith in God with every other person who has faith in a vast universe which I believe to be teaming with inhabited worlds. My understanding of God is personal to me, I have NO monopoly on truth.

Then you should be fine with the fact that your arguments are hardly substantiated enough to convince people

 

[Colter]

Then you should be fine with the fact that your arguments are hardly substantiated enough to convince people

I've maintained that I have no absolute proof. The unwise will always be with us.

 

[bhsmte]

If you don't think science, as done in the real world, comes from a particular culture with its own prejudices and naïve assumptions, you are mistaken.

As for the FSM- it's a reductio ad absurdum. It takes a whole spectrum of ways of being a believer in God and tries to distill it to a false essence, one that only the intellectually naïve could accept as valid. That so called "brights" cling to this as an explanation for religious belief, just shows the problems I've talked about in my previous paragraph. Sometimes people can't see the forest through all the trees they study under their electron-powered microscopes.

You know what helps clear up the forest? Objective verifiable evidence, that supports scientific theories. Some are willing to acknowledge the same, others are threatened by it.