Flood Physics.

[tas8831]

And if Joseph built the pyramids with God's help ...

My gosh, you people HAVE to rely on your silly magic and poofery to even have half a chance of being taken seriously - which, of course, actually undermines your whole attempt AT being taken seriously!

sensible person:'How do you explain this discrepancy?'
religious fanatic: 'DIVINE INTERVENTION! (aka magic poofery)'
sensible person:

 

[AV1611VET]

My gosh, you people HAVE to rely on your silly magic and poofery to even have half a chance of being taken seriously - which, of course, actually undermines your whole attempt AT being taken seriously!

If you feel this strongly about it, you're more than welcome to stop asking questions.

But you can't, can you?

It's the scientific way.

Just like it's the scientific way to ridicule our beliefs by Arab phoning our terminology.

You know? "miracles" to "magic" or "poofery"?

And you wonder why my caption reads: SCIENCE CAN TAKE A HIKE in big letters?

Your science can go to Hell.

 

[inquiring mind]

It doesn’t seem that way.




Not just any art, architecture, and religion - one that matches the people who allegedly died in the flood. Despite the fact they’re descendants of Noah.



Historical Estimates of World Population



If all you’re going to say in the face of contrary evidence is ‘magic!’ and make stuff up, then there’s not much point in discussion, now is there? You’re going to believe what you want to believe, and it doesn’t matter what shows it to be wrong.




They’re advancement isn’t the point. The point is that they match the civilization that came after. If what you say is true, we wouldn’t expect them to have the same system of writing as the people that would settle on the exact same area - but they do. And it’s the same for the Chinese. It’s the same for other cultures, even ones on different continents, which they shouldn’t have even been able to get to after the flood.

If what you say is true, we should the developement of cultures all through the world abruptly stop at the flood, only to be replaced by new cultures...but that’s not what we see. Instead, we see culture’s continually growing, without any interruption. We see languages developing. We see cultures and beliefs building on what came before.

But, again, if you’re just going to say ‘Gd did it’ and use that to wave away anything, that’s fine. But at least admit the evidence isn’t on your side.

Divine intervention or not? The circular arguments regarding this stuff is evidence enough of questionability from both sides. Estimates often involve pre-conceived notions. In the case of the world population study you provided, for example, are the back-projecting figures taking into consideration the flood? I doubt it, don’t you?

 

[VirOptimus]

Divine intervention or not? The circular arguments regarding this stuff is evidence enough of questionability from both sides. Estimates often involve pre-conceived notions. In the case of the world population study you provided, for example, are the back-projecting figures taking into consideration the flood? I doubt it, don’t you?

We should entertain magic as an explanation? Are you serious?

 

[inquiring mind]

We should entertain magic as an explanation? Are you serious?

Magic??? Magic is pulling a rabbit out of a hat.

 

[VirOptimus]

Magic??? Magic is pulling a rabbit out of a hat.

”Divine intervention” is magic.

 

[lasthero]

Divine intervention or not? The circular arguments regarding this stuff is evidence enough of questionability from both sides. Estimates often involve pre-conceived notions. In the case of the world population study you provided, for example, are the back-projecting figures taking into consideration the flood? I doubt it, don’t you?

You can look up how they got their estimates. The references are there. You could even look online and ask someone with experience on the matter how they arrive at such figures, if you actually care.

But, be honest - do you actually care how they came up with these estimates?

And you still haven’t given any explanation for why we see continuous, uninterrupted development of culture, how we see languages developing in areas over time despite a flood washing it all away, how people ended up on continents on the other side of the world shortly after the flood, how we got from a group of 8 people to multiple civilizations who worship different gods, speak entirely different languages, et cetera...

 

[inquiring mind]

”Divine intervention” is magic.

Divine intervention is Divine intervention.

 

[VirOptimus]

Divine intervention is Divine intervention.

And the same as magic.

 

[inquiring mind]

You can look up how they got their estimates. The references are there. You could even look online and ask someone with experience on the matter how they arrive at such figures, if you actually care.

But, be honest - do you actually care how they came up with these estimates?

And you still haven’t given any explanation for why we see continuous, uninterrupted development of culture, how we see languages developing in areas over time despite a flood washing it all away, how people ended up on continents on the other side of the world shortly after the flood, how we got from a group of 8 people to multiple civilizations who worship different gods, speak entirely different languages, et cetera...

It's almost like the answers are beyond our understanding.

 

[VirOptimus]

It's almost like the answers are beyond our understanding.

Maybe yours, but not ours.

 

[lasthero]

It's almost like the answers are beyond our understanding.

Again, if all you’re going to do in the face of contrary evidence is make stuff up and say it happened anyway, fine. But at least admit that’s what you’re doing.

You’re using ‘divine intervention’ as a Get Out Of Evidence Free card.

 

[Jimmy D]

No, the flood happened in 3298 BC

Yeah, right!

Timeline for the Flood
"Using the Bible, well-documented historical events, and some math, we find that the Flood began approximately 4,359 years ago in the year 1656 AM or 2348 BC. Some may look for an exact date (i.e., month and day), but we are not given that sort of precision in Scripture."

The Date of Noah’s Flood - creation.com
Genesis 11:10 tells us that Shem was 100 years old, 2 years after the Flood had finished. When was Noah’s Flood? 1,981 years to AD 1 plus 967 years to the founding of Solomon’s Temple plus 480 years to the end of the Exodus plus 430 years to the promise to Abraham plus 75 years to Abraham’s birth plus 350 years to Shem’s 100th birthday plus 2 years to the Flood. The Biblical data places the Flood at 2304 BC ± 11 years.

A Universal Flood: 3000 B.C.
The Sumerian King List begins with Kish immediately after the Flood. Georges Roux says the kingdom of Kish began in approximately 2700 BC (Roux 1966: 120). H.W.F. Saggs points out that when the city of Kish was excavated, the earliest level was from the Jemdet Nasr period (Saggs 1962: 51, 60, ca. 2800-2400 BC).
The epic hero Gilgamesh was king of Uruk at about 2700 BC and, as the legend goes, was actually able to speak with a survivor of the Flood. (This would be impossible with a much earlier 10,000 BC date for the Flood.) The experiences of Gilgamesh, coupled with the Sumerian King List (in which he is mentioned), suggest a Flood date close to 3000 BC.

Global Flood – an astronomical date
Of the twenty-four calculated dates, five fall within the astronomical range of 3290 BC ± 100 years. All five are consistent only with the Long Sojourn in Egypt. Four are consistent with the LXX, three are consistent with the Late Birth of Abraham, and three (not all the same three) are consistent with Ussher’s chronology of the Hebrew Kings. The one calculated date that matches all four of these assumptions is 3343 BC. This is well within the expected 100-year error.

Noah's Ark and the dated events of The Flood in Genesis 6-11.
This is the DFC date for Noah’s 600th birthday. This date is 600 years and 120 days from the date of Noah’s birth. This day is also the DFC date of the death of Methuselah and fifty-four days before it starts to rain “in the second month, the seventeenth day of the month”. At this point in time, 1,656 364-Day years plus 331 days have passed since Creation Day 3 of Creation Week in 4115 BC. This is an exact match to the 1,656 years stated in the text of Scripture from Creation Week until the start of The Flood. CD#331 is one-fifth of the number of years since Creation Week. CD#331 is the DFC date for events happening between 2461 BC and 2457 BC.

 

[HitchSlap]

It's almost like the answers are beyond our understanding.

I think that’s the point... there is mountains of evidence suggesting a global flood as described in the Bible is impossible. We understand this. We’re trying to help you understand as well. It’s not simply a case of you believe x and we believe y, and we both have good reasons. There are zero reasons to believe x, let alone good ones.

There’s a reason the other theist in this thread must willingly ignore the evidence.

 

[tas8831]

In the case of the world population study you provided, for example, are the back-projecting figures taking into consideration the flood? I doubt it, don’t you?

LOL!

Why WOULD such myths be taken into real-world accounts?

Hilarious!

 

[tas8831]

Yeah, right!

Timeline for the Flood
"Using the Bible, well-documented historical events, and some math, we find that the Flood began approximately 4,359 years ago in the year 1656 AM or 2348 BC. Some may look for an exact date (i.e., month and day), but we are not given that sort of precision in Scripture."

The Date of Noah’s Flood - creation.com
Genesis 11:10 tells us that Shem was 100 years old, 2 years after the Flood had finished. When was Noah’s Flood? 1,981 years to AD 1 plus 967 years to the founding of Solomon’s Temple plus 480 years to the end of the Exodus plus 430 years to the promise to Abraham plus 75 years to Abraham’s birth plus 350 years to Shem’s 100th birthday plus 2 years to the Flood. The Biblical data places the Flood at 2304 BC ± 11 years.

A Universal Flood: 3000 B.C.
The Sumerian King List begins with Kish immediately after the Flood. Georges Roux says the kingdom of Kish began in approximately 2700 BC (Roux 1966: 120). H.W.F. Saggs points out that when the city of Kish was excavated, the earliest level was from the Jemdet Nasr period (Saggs 1962: 51, 60, ca. 2800-2400 BC).
The epic hero Gilgamesh was king of Uruk at about 2700 BC and, as the legend goes, was actually able to speak with a survivor of the Flood. (This would be impossible with a much earlier 10,000 BC date for the Flood.) The experiences of Gilgamesh, coupled with the Sumerian King List (in which he is mentioned), suggest a Flood date close to 3000 BC.

Global Flood – an astronomical date
Of the twenty-four calculated dates, five fall within the astronomical range of 3290 BC ± 100 years. All five are consistent only with the Long Sojourn in Egypt. Four are consistent with the LXX, three are consistent with the Late Birth of Abraham, and three (not all the same three) are consistent with Ussher’s chronology of the Hebrew Kings. The one calculated date that matches all four of these assumptions is 3343 BC. This is well within the expected 100-year error.

Noah's Ark and the dated events of The Flood in Genesis 6-11.
This is the DFC date for Noah’s 600th birthday. This date is 600 years and 120 days from the date of Noah’s birth. This day is also the DFC date of the death of Methuselah and fifty-four days before it starts to rain “in the second month, the seventeenth day of the month”. At this point in time, 1,656 364-Day years plus 331 days have passed since Creation Day 3 of Creation Week in 4115 BC. This is an exact match to the 1,656 years stated in the text of Scripture from Creation Week until the start of The Flood. CD#331 is one-fifth of the number of years since Creation Week. CD#331 is the DFC date for events happening between 2461 BC and 2457 BC.

Come now - "inquiring" mind has ALL the pro-bible stories down pat - he is the leading authority on the biblical timeline, those hacks at AIG be darned!

 

[Jimmy D]

If you feel this strongly about it, you're more than welcome to stop asking questions.

But you can't, can you?

It's the scientific way.

Just like it's the scientific way to ridicule our beliefs by Arab phoning our terminology.

You know? "miracles" to "magic" or "poofery"?

And you wonder why my caption reads: SCIENCE CAN TAKE A HIKE in big letters?

Your science can go to Hell.

It's not just "science" asking questions, it's anyone who is prepared to think critically about the subject without being constrained by the yoke of biblical inerrancy.

I realize "science" is a convenient bogeyman though,you can tell us to "go to hell" while still maintaining the illusion of moral superiority.

 

[Subduction Zone]

Divine intervention or not? The circular arguments regarding this stuff is evidence enough of questionability from both sides. Estimates often involve pre-conceived notions. In the case of the world population study you provided, for example, are the back-projecting figures taking into consideration the flood? I doubt it, don’t you?

Why would they take into account a mythical event?

Here is a serious question. When did the God magic end? Are you going to pull an AV and simply yell 'magic" every time that you run into a problem? Do you not see how you are actually denigrating your own version of God by turning him into a magician?

 

[inquiring mind]

You’re using ‘divine intervention’ as a Get Out Of Evidence Free card.

There are zero reasons to believe x, let alone good ones.

Why WOULD such myths be taken into real-world accounts?

It's not just "science" asking questions, it's anyone who is prepared to think critically about the subject without being constrained by the yoke of biblical inerrancy.

Do you not see how you are actually denigrating your own version of God by turning him into a magician?

How many times has evidence put innocent people in jail? There will be endless questions on your part, with no satisfactory answers. Color-blind people can’t determine difference in colors, and the blind cannot see them at all, but that doesn’t mean they aren’t there. In the same way unbelievers cannot understand Moses and the prophets, and are blind to the gospel.

 

[VirOptimus]

How many times has evidence put innocent people in jail? There will be endless questions on your part, with no satisfactory answers. Color-blind people can’t determine difference in colors, and the blind cannot see them at all, but that doesn’t mean they aren’t there. In the same way unbelievers cannot understand Moses and the prophets, and are blind to the gospel.

Belivers have extrasensory powers?