Fish finger fossils show the beginnings of hands

[Ophiolite]

Thanks for your theory on what a theory is.

I don't get to define how Biblical hermeneutics are conducted. You don't get to define how a scientific theory is constructed.

 

[crossnote]

And evolution is also a fact, which is why a theory was developed to explain it. But my point was that your position is based on your reading of Genesis. It has nothing to do with the larger question of whether there is a God or not. Trying to make the creation/evolution debate into a theism/atheism debate is dishonest and offensive.

Your opinion.
If there is a God and He has revealed Himself in the Scriptures then evolution is false or He is lying.

 

[Speedwell]

Depends. What are we supposed to be 'evolving' towards? 'Evolve' usually carries the concept of betterment.

In biological evolution it is improved reproductive fitness in the immediate environment.

 

[crossnote]

Most Christians disagree.

Most Christians disagree with hell and the virgin birth. There are many who claim the name but deny His plain Word.

 

[Subduction Zone]

He may have misunderstood what he saw. For example, a small museum may have a single dinosaur tooth. It has been identified as belong to such and such a species. The morphology of this species is known from many other specimens found in other areas. The curators reconstruct its appearance based upon those other data. Perfectly reasonable, but if a visitor to the museum fails to read the fine print, as it were, they may go away with the impression the lone tooth was the sole source of information.

Most deniers of anything stop researching when they find what they want to find. For example Sovereign Citizens often refer to an old definition in Black's Law Dictionary of what "driving" is. The definition uses the term "employed". They rationalize that since they are not getting paid for driving that they cannot be employed and therefore they are legally not driving. The problem is that they stop too soon. If they had looked up the definition of "employed" in the same Black's Law Dictionary they would see it means 'actively engaged at' (paraphrase by me). If they had kept researching they would have seen that their arguments were not sound. But then we could not binge watch Sovereign Citizen videos on days like this. So I guess that is a win for us.

 

[pitabread]

Most Christians disagree with hell and the virgin birth. There are many who claim the name but deny His plain Word.

If there is one common theme in Christianity, it's Christians constantly accusing other Christians of not being real Christians.

 

[Speedwell]

Your opinion.
If there is a God and He has revealed Himself in the Scriptures then evolution is false or He is lying.

...and He has revealed Himself in the Scriptures in the way that you claim...

But that's just your claim.

 

[Subduction Zone]

Most Christians disagree with hell and the virgin birth. There are many who claim the name but deny His plain Word.

An overly literalistic approach to the Bible is self defeating. That is not a wise approach to the Bible.

And remember, not even the Bible claims to be "God's Word". Those that claim that usually have very little knowledge of the history of the Bible.

 

[Subduction Zone]

Ah ah ah.... You asked when evolution became a fact. I told you in the early 19th century. And pointed to the law of faunal succession. A fact about biology that was later successfully explained by the biological theory of evolution.

I had no need to refer to 'the geologic column' and made no claim as to whether it 'really exists' as opposed to being a useful idea in the science of geology.

I would qualify that with when it was recognized to be a fact. Gravity always was a fact, but it was not recognized as a fact until when? Galileo? Newton? Einstein? They all clarified our understanding of the fact of gravity.


As to the geologic column, the strawman version of creationist does not exist, but of course they exist in reality. They act as if there had to be one overarching "Geologic Column" everywhere, but that was never the claim.

 

[Speedwell]

Most Christians disagree with hell and the virgin birth. There are many who claim the name but deny His plain Word.

That is just plain false. "Most Christians" are Roman Catholics, Orthodox or Oriental Christians who constitute the majority of Christians worldwide. None of them have denied the existence of hell or the Virgin Birth.

 

[Ophiolite]

So you can 'throw up' yours and I can throw up mine The Geologic Column: Does it exist? - creation.com
and then?

The authors of this article either do not understand what is meant by "The Geologic Column" or are deliberately presenting a misleading definition of it.

• At no time during my acquisition of an honours degree in geology was it ever stated or implied that the geological column was continuous.
• At no time in any of the many text books I read on stratigraphy, sedimentology and historical geology was it ever stated or implied that the geological column was continuous.
• At no time in the many scores of peer reviewed research papers I read on related topics was it ever stated or implied that the geological column was continuous.
• At no time in the decades since have I seen in any textbook, peer reviewed research paper, video lecture, or other pertinent source any statement or implication that the geological column was continuous.

In short, the article attacks a faulty definition of The Geologic Column and it should be disregarded.

 

[crossnote]

Once again, you should try to understand the meaning of the terms that you use.

In the sciences an idea does not become a "theory" until it has been tested and confirmed countless times. There is more evidence for the theory of evolution than there is for gravity. By your standards gravity is not a thing either. And though you may not like it there is little difference between a creationist and a Flat Earther. They both deny almost exactly the same science, though Flat Earthers do go just a little bit further in their literalistic interpretation of the Bible.

Ok, what was once a theory is now called a fact and what was once called a fact is now a theory.
So when this forum calls it the theory of evolution, they take it for a fact. Sometime since I was in college (in the '60's) the definition of theory has changed to mean what once was called 'fact'. Oh well.
BTW how many repeated observations has evolution undergone?

 

[Ophiolite]

Most deniers of anything stop researching when they find what they want to find. For example Sovereign Citizens often refer to an old definition in Black's Law Dictionary of what "driving" is. The definition uses the term "employed". They rationalize that since they are not getting paid for driving that they cannot be employed and therefore they are legally not driving. The problem is that they stop too soon. If they had looked up the definition of "employed" in the same Black's Law Dictionary they would see it means 'actively engaged at' (paraphrase by me). If they had kept researching they would have seen that their arguments were not sound. But then we could not binge watch Sovereign Citizen videos on days like this. So I guess that is a win for us.

Since I have never heard of Sovereign Citizens I found your post a useful warning to avoid all contact with them.

 

[Subduction Zone]

LOL, my dad use to say it was a bunch of monks conspiring together. All fanciful and unfounded claims.

Ditto with the Scriptures.

Depends. What are we supposed to be 'evolving' towards? 'Evolve' usually carries the concept of betterment.

As to your last claim, no. That is not the case. Evolution is merely change over time. Usually as a result of changing environments. Creationists often misinterpret evolution that way. There is no ultimate goal to evolution. There are only results.

Now as to what your father claimed we cannot comment. He may or may not have made the claims that you said that he did. You may have misinterpreted what he said. I doubt if he was a biblical scholar. Have you looked into what actual biblical scholars say?

 

[Subduction Zone]

Ok, what was once a theory is now called a fact and what was once called a fact is now a theory.
So when this forum calls it the theory of evolution, they take it for a fact. Sometime since I was in college (in the '60's) the definition of theory has changed to mean what once was called 'fact'. Oh well.
BTW how many repeated observations has evolution undergone?

Your question is poorly worded, but gravity is an excellent example.

 

[Ophiolite]

BTW how many repeated observations has evolution undergone?

Many millions.

 

[Subduction Zone]

Since I have never heard of Sovereign Citizens I found your post a useful warning to avoid all contact with them.

Oh no, if you have some time to kill you do want to watch their videos. I promise. Let me find a choice one for you.

 

[essentialsaltes]

Ok, what was once a theory is now called a fact and what was once called a fact is now a theory.

We've explained it to you carefully several times, but we can't understand it for you. You need to make a little honest effort.

 

[crossnote]

In biological evolution it is improved reproductive fitness in the immediate environment.

Is that a 'survival of the fittest' concept?

 

[Speedwell]

Is that a 'survival of the fittest' concept?

The survival of the fittest to reproduce.