Feeling Overwhelmed

[darkwing70]

I've been reading this forum for a few months now trying to work up the courage to submit this post. I was saved in 1991 but did not stick with the Lord and after I joined the army in 1993 I was no longer walking with him and had returned to a sinful lifestyle. I woman I married grew up as a Catholic but is not saved and hasn't attended any church since we've been married. We married in 1996 and have three children. I have suffered from mild depression since 1997, but last year the depression worsened and I began to suffer from anxiety problems as well. This resulted in conviction from the Holy Spirit and I repented of my backslidden state and very rapidly changed my life. This did not go over well with my wife and for the first few months she hated me. We fought and she would tell me she hated me, curse me, she told me she wanted me to leave and that she wanted a divorce. This has gotten somewhat better. It took a few months but I have been taking my children to church every Sunday and my 11 year old son is very receptive and I believe he may be close to salvation. I have prayed constantly for my wife over the last year and it seems as though she has really softened up lately, but last night after a relatively mild argument she said she still wanted a divorce. She never has filed and it seems as though she only says it to hurt me. I do love her and do not want to put all of us through the devastation of a divorce. She says these things in front of the children and has my oldest scared to death. I am still suffering from depression and really need to see a Christian counselor but that is another discussion altogether, but this situation is only compounding my depression and I'm really feeling as though this is all my fault, which because I married her in a backslidden state, it really is. I don't really know what I'm searching for from anyone reading this, but I don't really have any Christian friends or relatives that I can confide in.

May the Lord richly bless you all.

Don

 

[Pepperoni]

Hi! You'll fit right in here.

I can relate to much of your story. I, too, married someone who (I thought) was Catholic, only to have him announce himself as an atheist some time later. I'm glad to hear you're still praying for your wife. I'm afraid I've quit praying for my husband.

Like you, I've been put on anti-anxiety medication. I'm still taking it but it's not helping. I've come to the conclusion that there is no help for me. Seriously though, no amount of medication can undo the way I've screwed up my life, or correct the wrong choices I've made.

Yet . . . I don't believe in putting myself or my personal happiness above my marriage. My life is a mere blip in the scheme of eternity, and it's more important that I do the right thing rather than what I want to do, or what I personally think is best for me. Your situation is a bit different; if your wife wants a divorce, or wants to leave, that's her choice. It takes two people to get married, but only one to end it.

I hope for your sake and your family's sake that it doesn't come to that!

I'm not good at giving advice (and even worse about following it), but the only thing I can tell you is to keep praying. And keep in mind the verse in Romans--about all things working together for good. Who are we to doubt God's plans for us? Our finite minds can't conceive of it, but God can do anything and He really does have a purpose for us if we are open to it.

 

[AbidingInHim]

Hi Don,

Please join in on our discusison thread you are very welcome.

I don't have much to say and am sure the boys will be by in time to give you much wisdom with love.

I would like to make a couple of observations.

1. Do you have a home based church?

Churches are important, they are for your support, encouragement, AND accountability. I know you said you'd been taking your son to church but you also said that you have no Christian friends. Is that because you are going to service but not getting invovled? I recognize the scenario, I've been there. I would encourage you to commit yourself to a church and once you've planted yourself, get connected. Make roots, not just for your own needs but for your kids too.

2. I would have to say, as a husband you need to lay down the law, that she not say anything like that in front of your kids again unless she means it, and you need to be able to back it up. Make it clear to her she either needs to act or be quiet. It's most likely a manipulative and punitive tactic, however, it's not just damaging you, you have a responsibility to raise your children in the way they should go so that when they are old they will not depart from it. proverbs. When they see disrepect and manipulation modeled they will follow. They need to be protected form such negative influences even if it is thier own mother.

3. Go to the reading list thread.....get educated....there are a lot of books that can help you, such as boundies in marriage....

4. Remember, a women want to feel loved and appreciated...reflect upon if you are treating her that way, she sounds very much like a hurting woman....I found that I was not being respectful to my husband mainy because my love for him had disappeared...I was saved after marriage and was really disgusted with his drunken, hurtful behavior, and avoidance.....I gave it to God with all the bagage of past arguments, I forgave him for his ways and asked God to fill me with His love for my husband, and He has been faithful to answer that prayer for me, nearly 8 years later. I do love my husband and want only the best for him, I hurt when he hurts and really desire for his salvation for he's sake, not mine......men need respect, women need love....are you able to forgive and show her the love she needs to feel? 5 love languages would be a good book to appoach that topic

Praying for you, glad you got the courage to post, hope you have the courage to stay and get the support we can give each other here.

God Bless
Roxanna

 

[AbidingInHim]

Here are some verses to hide in your heart for your depressed state......

1Pe 5:7 casting all your care upon Him, for He cares for you.
1Pe 5:8 Be sober, be vigilant; because[fn3] your adversary the devil walks about like a roaring lion, seeking whom he may devour.
1Pe 5:9 Resist him, steadfast in the faith, knowing that the same sufferings are experienced by your brotherhood in the world.



Mat 6:34 Therefore do not worry about tomorrow, for tomorrow will worry about itself. Each day has enough trouble of its own.

Col 3:1 Since, then, you have been raised with Christ, set your hearts on things above, where Christ is seated at the right hand of God.
Col 3:2 Set your minds on things above, not on earthly things.
Col 3:1 Since, then, you have been raised with Christ, set your hearts on things above, where Christ is seated at the right hand of God.
Col 3:2 Set your minds on things above, not on earthly things.
Col 3:15 Let the peace of Christ rule in your hearts, since as members of one body you were called to peace. And be thankful.
Col 3:16 Let the word of Christ dwell in you richly as you teach and admonish one another with all wisdom, and as you sing psalms, hymns and spiritual songs with gratitude in your hearts to God.
Col 3:17 And whatever you do, whether in word or deed, do it all in the name of the Lord Jesus, giving thanks to God the Father through him.
Psa 94:19When anxiety was great within me, your consolation brought joy to my soul. Ecc 11:10So then, banish anxiety from your heart and cast off the troubles of your body,Mat 11:28 “Come to me, all you who are weary and burdened, and I will give you rest.
Mat 11:29 Take my yoke upon you and learn from me, for I am gentle and humble in heart, and you will find rest for your souls.
Mat 11:30 For my yoke is easy and my burden is light.”
Then there is all of John 14 and 1 and 2 John, I recommend you sit down and read them...they will bring you joy.

I pray, you find peace and solice in His word and promises to us....the Psalms as will are a place to go for comfort and uplifting ones sorrow

 

[free4all]

Darkwing,

That's great that you are taking your children to church! Well done!

As far as your wife mentioning divorce in front of the children, you can do a couple things.
1. Talk to her privately and ask her not to mention it in front of the children. She may anyway, but all you can do is ask.
2. When she threatens it, agree to it. Seriously. Agree to it with the stipulation that if she files, you will accept. Call her bluff, and go through with it if she does. As was mentioned, it only takes one to destroy a marriage. If she is intent on it, you cannot stop her. If she's bluffing, call her bluff. You can expect her to play that card more often if she sees it affects you, and if she wants to be cruel.

My wife did this for many years until I got so sick of it I finally agreed. Vehemently. Found her a female lawyer, and then the next time she threatened divorce, I slapped half a dozen of the lawyer's business cards down and said, "Let's do it!" And meant it. That is my standard answer now when she says she wants divorce. She stopped saying it almost totally since I reacted that way, although on occasion she will revert. But not for long once she sees I'm willing to do it immediately.

You can't force your wife to love you, or to want to stay. I understand you don't want divorce, but it's not all up to you. If your wife is intent on it, you will be divorced. The good news is that if she chooses that, God is bigger than divorce. He might lead you to a wonderful Christian wife, and then you two could be a great example to your children of what a marriage could be. I realize that's getting ahead of where you are now, but my point is that if you lose your fear of divorce, your wife's threats will cease to have power over you. She may try something else, or she may begin to address the real issues, which is what you want.

I'm not making light of your situation. I know the pain of conflict, and the fear of putting children through divorce. When I first came to CF I read where someone said, "Divorce is hard on children, but some marriages are harder on children than divorce." I believe that. Divorce is not the end of the world. I'm not advocating it or treating it lightly, but it happens, and it happens to good people who don't want it. You cannot force another adult to make the right choices. If your wife chooses that, accept it, move on, and make the best life you can for your children.

I know you will certainly continue praying for your wife and trying to make all the right choices. Again, I commend you for taking the children to church and going when she won't. I did that for 9 straight years before dw started going to church with us. I endured flack, criticism, and alienation for years because I attended church. I did not let that persecution stop me. I was right to take my daughter and go, and you are right to take your children and go. Very well done.

Feel free to share as little or as much as you like. Comment in any thread or join us in the check-in thread where we usually converse with each other.

May God give you wisdom.

Oh, and welcome to CF and the Unequally Yoked forum!

 

[cory533]

Don,Welcome to uy forum. as the others have said please do join in.My first advice is forget the blame nonsence. certainly we reap what we sow butall we can do is repent and move on. guilt that brings us to repentance may be of God after that it is of the enemy. You made a mistake as many of us have now make the best of it. you are not responsible for the actions of another human being. I have been through much of what you describe except that I am not usually prone to depression.If you have specific questions I will gladly render an opinion in pm or in forum. I could relate my personal testimony in this but as you have been here awhile you likely have seen parts of it already if not try the introductions thread. I agree the best way to stop the divorce threats is to call her bluff as the bible does list this as one of the two legitimate couses for divorce. In fact it says if you are married to an unbeliever and they want to go you should let them go. I am tired and must go to bed I forget the exact biblical reference I am sure someone here can provide it. that said if you can stay married in Gods will then I would encourage that so long as you can find equalibrium that does not damage you or the children.Good night,peace in Christ ,Cory

 

[free4all]

Don,Welcome to uy forum. as the others have said please do join in.My first advice is forget the blame nonsence. certainly we reap what we sow butall we can do is repent and move on. guilt that brings us to repentance may be of God after that it is of the enemy. You made a mistake as many of us have now make the best of it. you are not responsible for the actions of another human being. I have been through much of what you describe except that I am not usually prone to depression.If you have specific questions I will gladly render an opinion in pm or in forum. I could relate my personal testimony in this but as you have been here awhile you likely have seen parts of it already if not try the introductions thread. I agree the best way to stop the divorce threats is to call her bluff as the bible does list this as one of the two legitimate couses for divorce. In fact it says if you are married to an unbeliever and they want to go you should let them go. I am tired and must go to bed I forget the exact biblical reference I am sure someone here can provide it. that said if you can stay married in Gods will then I would encourage that so long as you can find equalibrium that does not damage you or the children.Good night,peace in Christ ,Cory

Excellent advice, as was Pepperoni's and Roxanna's. Concerning when an unbelieving mate wants to leave the marriage and divorce, this is the passage Cory was referring to:
[bible]1 corinthians 7:12-15[/bible]
Note specifically this verse:
[bible]1 corinthians 7:15[/bible]
"...let him (or her) depart." (The next sentence mentions "a brother or a sister is not under bondage", thus including men and women in the previous sentence.)

Letting an unbelieving mate leave the marriage, if they desire, is a command and not an option. Not that one could stop them anyway, but there is no point in begging or losing your mind if someone chooses to leave the marriage.

Our command is to let them go, draw nearer to God, and get on with life.

 

[darkwing70]

Hi Don,

Please join in on our discusison thread you are very welcome.

I don't have much to say and am sure the boys will be by in time to give you much wisdom with love.

I would like to make a couple of observations.

1. Do you have a home based church?

Churches are important, they are for your support, encouragement, AND accountability. I know you said you'd been taking your son to church but you also said that you have no Christian friends. Is that because you are going to service but not getting invovled? I recognize the scenario, I've been there. I would encourage you to commit yourself to a church and once you've planted yourself, get connected. Make roots, not just for your own needs but for your kids too.

2. I would have to say, as a husband you need to lay down the law, that she not say anything like that in front of your kids again unless she means it, and you need to be able to back it up. Make it clear to her she either needs to act or be quiet. It's most likely a manipulative and punitive tactic, however, it's not just damaging you, you have a responsibility to raise your children in the way they should go so that when they are old they will not depart from it. proverbs. When they see disrepect and manipulation modeled they will follow. They need to be protected form such negative influences even if it is thier own mother.

3. Go to the reading list thread.....get educated....there are a lot of books that can help you, such as boundies in marriage....

4. Remember, a women want to feel loved and appreciated...reflect upon if you are treating her that way, she sounds very much like a hurting woman....I found that I was not being respectful to my husband mainy because my love for him had disappeared...I was saved after marriage and was really disgusted with his drunken, hurtful behavior, and avoidance.....I gave it to God with all the bagage of past arguments, I forgave him for his ways and asked God to fill me with His love for my husband, and He has been faithful to answer that prayer for me, nearly 8 years later. I do love my husband and want only the best for him, I hurt when he hurts and really desire for his salvation for he's sake, not mine......men need respect, women need love....are you able to forgive and show her the love she needs to feel? 5 love languages would be a good book to appoach that topic

Praying for you, glad you got the courage to post, hope you have the courage to stay and get the support we can give each other here.

God Bless
Roxanna

Yes, I have a church but I'm sure that it's the right one. It's a Pentacostal Church of God. My kids love their Sunday school classes and children's church and everyone is very close and caring. The problem I have is that the majority of the congregation are significantly older mature christians with grown up children of their own. There are a few younger couples but I seem to be the only UY father there. I really sort of feel out of place. I'm also not sure I agree with some of the teachings of the Church of God, but that's really for another forum altogether. One of the things that I struggle with is having the time to get involved. I work full time and then spend my evenings taking care of my children. I do most of the cooking and cleaning and home repair as well. On weekends there's most importantly church on Sunday, but with three children there's always birthday parties, baseball games, and lots of other stuff. I feel as though my family is really my most important ministry right now but I also feel guilty that I'm not reaching out to others and helping out at church too. Anyway, I hope this all sorts itself out soon. I'll try and get ahold of some of the books you mentioned, especially Boundaries in Marriage, and Five Love Languages. I'd probably have to say that my biggest problem with me in regards to my wife is that I'm not as affectionate and loving as I should be. I've always been non-confrontational as well and my wife is very outspoken and yells a lot. She's also very money oriented, meaning if she has money she's in a good mood, if she's broke, look out. I had to separate our finances about six years ago because she was spending too much money and eventually I missed a mortgage payment. I've taken on all the bills. She pays for the kids day care, some groceries, and she pays for the medical insurance through her employer. I pay for everything else and it has really been a strain on me. My finances have suffered and I'm dealing with some debt collectors right now. I'll get through it but it's just another stressor for me at the moment.

Sorry for rambling, I probably shouldn't be saying these things, but they have been building up for years and I'm tired of it all. My fear of divorce is the prospect of losing my children. They are the most important part of my life and without them I would be devastated. I'm also concerned they wouldn't grow up in Lord the way they should if they only lived with their mother.

I could go on for hours but I must stop for now. Thank you everyone for your words of advice. Thank you also for the scriptures. I also really need to go back to some of my lessons on spiritual warfare.

 

[rainbowpromises]

Yes, I have a church but I'm sure that it's the right one. It's a Pentacostal Church of God. My kids love their Sunday school classes and children's church and everyone is very close and caring. The problem I have is that the majority of the congregation are significantly older mature christians with grown up children of their own. There are a few younger couples but I seem to be the only UY father there. I really sort of feel out of place. I'm also not sure I agree with some of the teachings of the Church of God, but that's really for another forum altogether. One of the things that I struggle with is having the time to get involved. I work full time and then spend my evenings taking care of my children. I do most of the cooking and cleaning and home repair as well. On weekends there's most importantly church on Sunday, but with three children there's always birthday parties, baseball games, and lots of other stuff. I feel as though my family is really my most important ministry right now but I also feel guilty that I'm not reaching out to others and helping out at church too. Anyway, I hope this all sorts itself out soon. I'll try and get ahold of some of the books you mentioned, especially Boundaries in Marriage, and Five Love Languages. I'd probably have to say that my biggest problem with me in regards to my wife is that I'm not as affectionate and loving as I should be. I've always been non-confrontational as well and my wife is very outspoken and yells a lot. She's also very money oriented, meaning if she has money she's in a good mood, if she's broke, look out. I had to separate our finances about six years ago because she was spending too much money and eventually I missed a mortgage payment. I've taken on all the bills. She pays for the kids day care, some groceries, and she pays for the medical insurance through her employer. I pay for everything else and it has really been a strain on me. My finances have suffered and I'm dealing with some debt collectors right now. I'll get through it but it's just another stressor for me at the moment.

Sorry for rambling, I probably shouldn't be saying these things, but they have been building up for years and I'm tired of it all. My fear of divorce is the prospect of losing my children. They are the most important part of my life and without them I would be devastated. I'm also concerned they wouldn't grow up in Lord the way they should if they only lived with their mother.

I could go on for hours but I must stop for now. Thank you everyone for your words of advice. Thank you also for the scriptures. I also really need to go back to some of my lessons on spiritual warfare.

I am glad you said these things. I had a good friend who went through a similar situation as you. He hinted to us what was going on, but never told us. The whole situation went badly and his kids have suffered the most. So all I can say is please talk about it and let us hold you up in prayer.
Annette

 

[kayd1966]

Welcome to our little corner of CF!

As has already been said, please come and join us in the Check-In forum. It's always a constant line of support. Being UY can be very lonely because we have no one to turn to regarding spiritual things and if our desire is to follow God in all aspects of our lives, we can feel very separated from those around us. Keeping in touch with other believers is crucial so please take advantage of the threads here.

I agree with what has been said so will not add much more right now.

God Bless...

 

[Jenniewren]

Hi Darkwing and welcome
I know it isn't always easy to talk about problems, bcause we wonder sometimes if we should. Since I have been sharing on UF it is as if a dam has burst inside me. You need support right now and you need to let all this out so God can begin to heal you.

 

[darkwing70]

I'm really confused. My wife has told me of all kinds of things that I have done to wrong her. Some are valid and I have apologized for. One point is that I disagree with many of the Catholic teachings and have told her as much. I should have been more respectful to her about it. She tells me that I have no desire to find a church with her that we can all go to. This is not true and I have told her that I would like that. She expects me to find this church. We need to find one together but she has not been willing to get out of bed on a Sunday morning to go. But I still feel guilty.

She says that I never include her in anything. This is not true, I don't do anything outside of the family. Everything we do, we do together. She says I walk around with an attitude toward her. I walk around sometimes feeling hurt after she says things to me like I hate you, or I want a divorce. Does she think I'm supposed to walk around like everything's peachy after she says things like this? I have never said a hateful or derogatory word to her ever. I have argued with her, who hasn't, but she takes it to a cruel level and then acts as though nothing has happened. And then she tells me I only think of myself. From my perspective I have dedicated my life to her and my children. I've actually taken it maybe too far. I don't have any friends and I don't do anything outside of the family. I give her everything she asks for and very rarely ask for anything in return.

I take my son to a counselor because he has ADHD. My wife doesn't go so I usually share with her what the counselor has discussed but she never seems to be interested. Then yesterday I mentioned that I was going into the session with my son for about 15 minutes to participate because he wanted me to. Her reaction stunned me, she said it was nice of me to tell her this now and hung up on me. She felt like I was purposely leaving her out. It's like all of a sudden it's important, but only because she thinks I left her out of something. I think it should be important to her and she should be there with us and being actively involved. But from what I have seen she doesn't want to be bothered with it, just as she has never wanted to be bothered by my depression. She thinks the medication he's on should be good enough and that he just needs to straighten up. Being someone who suffers from emotional problems I know this is the wrong attitude and can be harmful. I have told her this but she takes it as though I'm just being mean to her.

She hates the church I go to. It's a wonder I haven't had more trouble taking the kids. I sort of suspect the only reason she doesn't fight me about it is because she get three hours to herself on Sunday morning. But if something else is going on such as a birthday party then that's more important and they go there instead. I told her how much the kids like church and she tells me the only reason they like it is because they get toys. They usually do get little toys like bubbles or something else small but that's because they participate and enjoy the lessons. They are always asking me questions about Jesus. they are also very loved in church and they know this. It breaks my heart when my wife says things like this.

There are lots of other things I need to get off my chest but I have to go now. Thanks again for your words of encouragement and yours prayers. I have been struggling to stay in the word and am going through one of those spells where I'm not connecting with God's word like I normally do. I'm trying to get through it and rely on His strength.

God bless you.

Don

 

[cory533]

Don, You said you know what it's like to have emotional problems and need help. Do you also recognise that the wife you described is in need of professional help? has she ever submitted to councel? I would strongly recomend trying to get her to see someone. If she won't it still would help you to get councel. You need to get some more outside freindships, she will pitch a fit but you need the perspective. this of course is all just my oppinion and that is skewed by only hearing one side of things.peace,Cory

 

[darkwing70]

Don, You said you know what it's like to have emotional problems and need help. Do you also recognise that the wife you described is in need of professional help? has she ever submitted to councel? I would strongly recomend trying to get her to see someone. If she won't it still would help you to get councel. You need to get some more outside freindships, she will pitch a fit but you need the perspective. this of course is all just my oppinion and that is skewed by only hearing one side of things.peace,Cory

A few years ago we went through a rough patch where we were fighting all the time. She wanted us to go to marriage counseling. At the time I was backslidden and I didn't believe we had any problems. I chalked it up to the stress of raising three small children. Then last year after I returned to the Lord we had problems again. This time I was seeing a psychologist for depression. We did do a couple sessions together as marriage counseling but she ended up walking out. I stopped seeing this particular counselor soon after because he wasn't a Christian and when I started talking to him about my faith he would start going on about how the Christian religion is about making people feel guilty and other things that just completely turned me off to him. I've told my wife I'm absolutely willing for us to get counseling but now she just doesn't want to. I will find a counselor for myself, I just don't know of any good Christian psychologists. Finding the right one can be a long process as well.

I realize that you only get one side of the story which is why I'm trying to be as careful as I can with what I write down. I do not claim to be an innocent victim in all of this, I have my faults like anyone else, but I'm willing to acknowledge them and try to make a difference. I also have no anger or unforgiveness for her. I do love her and want for this to work out, but living this way holding everything in is becoming unbearable.

 

[cory533]

I do understand. I put the disclaimer in not to question your vorasity but just to define what my oppinion was based on. My wife has bpd it sounds a bit like what you describe.

 

[free4all]

Hi darkwing,

I don't have all the answers for you, and maybe none, but I do have a few comments. Your situation sounds similar to what I've been through with my wife.

She tells me that I have no desire to find a church with her that we can all go to. This is not true and I have told her that I would like that. She expects me to find this church. We need to find one together but she has not been willing to get out of bed on a Sunday morning to go. But I still feel guilty.

Then place the blame at her feet and leave it there. And stop carrying the false guilt. You are willing, she isn't: end of discussion, until she's willing to make an effort.

She says that I never include her in anything. This is not true, I don't do anything outside of the family. Everything we do, we do together. She says I walk around with an attitude toward her. I walk around sometimes feeling hurt after she says things to me like I hate you, or I want a divorce. Does she think I'm supposed to walk around like everything's peachy after she says things like this? I have never said a hateful or derogatory word to her ever. I have argued with her, who hasn't, but she takes it to a cruel level and then acts as though nothing has happened. And then she tells me I only think of myself. From my perspective I have dedicated my life to her and my children.

I could have written this exactly.

I've actually taken it maybe too far.

I agree.

I don't have any friends and I don't do anything outside of the family.

Then find a hobby, some friends from church, or something to do away from her. I was faced with the exact situation you just described. I took up jogging in the woods, lost 25 pounds, and it helped my mental health also. I found a few friends, although that was more the result of one man inviting me to his house than the result of my friend-finding abilities. I eventually found another hobby and periodically I'll spend some time away from home enjoying it.

Your description I just quoted described me exactly until recently.

I give her everything she asks for and very rarely ask for anything in return.

Then make some changes. Marriage isn't supposed to be a one-way street.

It's a wonder I haven't had more trouble taking the kids. ...They are always asking me questions about Jesus. they are also very loved in church and they know this.

I'm glad you are taking the kids to church. I know you wish your wife would join you, but that decision isn't yours. Keep doing the best you can with the decisions that are yours.

There are lots of other things I need to get off my chest but I have to go now.

Drop in any time. A year ago I got a lot of things off my chest here, sometimes going on for pages and pages. I eventually found peace and a better strategy for dealing with my disrespectful wife.

We did do a couple sessions together as marriage counseling but she ended up walking out.

Refusing marriage counseling, or walking out, is, in my opinion, a pretty good indication that one isn't interested in correcting their own behavior.

I've told my wife I'm absolutely willing for us to get counseling but now she just doesn't want to. I will find a counselor for myself, I just don't know of any good Christian psychologists. Finding the right one can be a long process as well.

Good for you. I hope you are successful.

I do not claim to be an innocent victim in all of this, I have my faults like anyone else, but I'm willing to acknowledge them and try to make a difference.

That's the key point. When one refuses counseling, they are saying they are unwilling to change.

I also have no anger or unforgiveness for her. I do love her and want for this to work out, but living this way holding everything in is becoming unbearable.

I know the feeling. You need relief, you need a change.

Are you a reader? I'd like to recommend a couple books:
Boundaries in Marriage, by Cloud and Townsend, and Love Must Be Tough, by Dr. James Dobson.

Your wife sounds like mine, in that she doesn't respond to love, gentleness, patience, logic, or common sense. At the point she becomes rude or unbearing, perhaps you can allow the consequences of her behavior to be felt by her. This is the only thing in 18 years of marriage that has influenced my wife to change her poor behavior: if I apply consequences and her life is impacted. I wish it weren't so. I wish she loved me enough to act loving, or was willing to look beyond the hurt in her life and stop willfully hurting others. But that isn't reality at this point. Sometimes I feel like an adult trying to teach a 2-year-old how to be nice to other people, and to realize what is acceptable and what isn't. But sometimes that's where she is emotionally and relationally. I sense a familiarity in your wife's actions as in mine.

Her reaction stunned me, she said it was nice of me to tell her this now and hung up on me.

Just to give one small example of allowing someone to feel the repercussions of their actions, periodically my wife would get mad and hang up rudely in the middle of a conversation with me. So when she would do that, I would choose not to accept her phone calls for a long time afterwards. Invariably she would need something from me and try to call, but I let her calls go to voice mail. See, I couldn't force her to be polite to me on the phone, but I could enforce consequences when she wasn't. And they have to be consequences that affect her personally to get her attention. She rarely does that now because she knows at some point she will regret it.

How nice it would have been to have married an adult, someone who loved rather than one who is full of anger and delights in hurting others. But that's not the way it is now. We can pray for our mates, but it takes more than that. We are absolutely entitled to hold them accountable for their poor decisions. If you were out running around with other women, or spending lots of money on gambling or alcohol, she would have every right to confront you and hold you accountable. You also have every right to confront her and hold her accountable for her disrespect. Forget about trying to get along with her while she's running from God and trying to fight your authority in the home. It can get better, but I think you need to stop coddling her. If she's always talking about divorce, prepare yourself emotionally. Realize that although divorce is bad on children, some marriages are worse. And divorce is not the end of the world. The God you serve is bigger than divorce. Divorce and peace is better than marriage and continual war. My life changed when I lost the fear of divorce and began confronting my wife over her unacceptable behavior, behavior I had tolerated far too long.

Darkwing, I hope I haven't come across as too strong for you. I wasted 17 years of my life waiting for my wife to do the right thing and act reasonable, but she didn't... not until I began confronting her repeatedly and applying consequences for her poor treatment of me. I see how frustrated you are, and I see you trying to do the right things by going to counseling and going to church. You speak of us only getting one side of the story: that is true, but when one spouse agrees to counseling and church, and the other doesn't... that speaks volumes about who is the major contributor to the difficulties in a marriage, in my opinion.

Even if you don't agree with anything I've said, I hope you will check out those two books I mentioned. If you can't find them or money is tight, pm me and I'll mail you a copy of each.

God bless,
Wayne

 

[Pepperoni]

Can’t argue with anything that’s been said here.

But allow me to comment. Take it for what it’s worth, coming from a woman who has neither said nor heard the “d” word in 16 years of marriage.

Women who repeatedly toss this word around are not looking for a divorce. Consider the context in which these words are said. Are they said in anger? Or are they being said during a rational discussion? In the first instance, it is being said to either: 1) get a reaction, or 2) threaten/manipulate their husband into giving them their own way in an argument. Or both. It is most definitely a manipulative gesture, and calling their bluff is entirely appropriate in this situation, as Wayne said in the 5th post of this thread. Fearing divorce and acting like it would be the end of the world only encourages this behavior, and you can expect more of it in the future. In the second case (meaning, hearing the word "divorce" during a rational discussion), you may have reason to take it seriously.

But I’m sorry to read of husbands, or any partner, having to endure this. I realize I’m only hearing one side of the story, but my honest opinion is that it’s undeserved—in any situation. There are much better ways to resolve conflict than making idle and manipulative threats.

 

[darkwing70]

Hi darkwing,

I don't have all the answers for you, and maybe none, but I do have a few comments. Your situation sounds similar to what I've been through with my wife.


Then place the blame at her feet and leave it there. And stop carrying the false guilt. You are willing, she isn't: end of discussion, until she's willing to make an effort.


I could have written this exactly.


I agree.


Then find a hobby, some friends from church, or something to do away from her. I was faced with the exact situation you just described. I took up jogging in the woods, lost 25 pounds, and it helped my mental health also. I found a few friends, although that was more the result of one man inviting me to his house than the result of my friend-finding abilities. I eventually found another hobby and periodically I'll spend some time away from home enjoying it.

Your description I just quoted described me exactly until recently.


Then make some changes. Marriage isn't supposed to be a one-way street.


I'm glad you are taking the kids to church. I know you wish your wife would join you, but that decision isn't yours. Keep doing the best you can with the decisions that are yours.


Drop in any time. A year ago I got a lot of things off my chest here, sometimes going on for pages and pages. I eventually found peace and a better strategy for dealing with my disrespectful wife.


Refusing marriage counseling, or walking out, is, in my opinion, a pretty good indication that one isn't interested in correcting their own behavior.


Good for you. I hope you are successful.


That's the key point. When one refuses counseling, they are saying they are unwilling to change.


I know the feeling. You need relief, you need a change.

Are you a reader? I'd like to recommend a couple books:
Boundaries in Marriage, by Cloud and Townsend, and Love Must Be Tough, by Dr. James Dobson.

Your wife sounds like mine, in that she doesn't respond to love, gentleness, patience, logic, or common sense. At the point she becomes rude or unbearing, perhaps you can allow the consequences of her behavior to be felt by her. This is the only thing in 18 years of marriage that has influenced my wife to change her poor behavior: if I apply consequences and her life is impacted. I wish it weren't so. I wish she loved me enough to act loving, or was willing to look beyond the hurt in her life and stop willfully hurting others. But that isn't reality at this point. Sometimes I feel like an adult trying to teach a 2-year-old how to be nice to other people, and to realize what is acceptable and what isn't. But sometimes that's where she is emotionally and relationally. I sense a familiarity in your wife's actions as in mine.


Just to give one small example of allowing someone to feel the repercussions of their actions, periodically my wife would get mad and hang up rudely in the middle of a conversation with me. So when she would do that, I would choose not to accept her phone calls for a long time afterwards. Invariably she would need something from me and try to call, but I let her calls go to voice mail. See, I couldn't force her to be polite to me on the phone, but I could enforce consequences when she wasn't. And they have to be consequences that affect her personally to get her attention. She rarely does that now because she knows at some point she will regret it.

How nice it would have been to have married an adult, someone who loved rather than one who is full of anger and delights in hurting others. But that's not the way it is now. We can pray for our mates, but it takes more than that. We are absolutely entitled to hold them accountable for their poor decisions. If you were out running around with other women, or spending lots of money on gambling or alcohol, she would have every right to confront you and hold you accountable. You also have every right to confront her and hold her accountable for her disrespect. Forget about trying to get along with her while she's running from God and trying to fight your authority in the home. It can get better, but I think you need to stop coddling her. If she's always talking about divorce, prepare yourself emotionally. Realize that although divorce is bad on children, some marriages are worse. And divorce is not the end of the world. The God you serve is bigger than divorce. Divorce and peace is better than marriage and continual war. My life changed when I lost the fear of divorce and began confronting my wife over her unacceptable behavior, behavior I had tolerated far too long.

Darkwing, I hope I haven't come across as too strong for you. I wasted 17 years of my life waiting for my wife to do the right thing and act reasonable, but she didn't... not until I began confronting her repeatedly and applying consequences for her poor treatment of me. I see how frustrated you are, and I see you trying to do the right things by going to counseling and going to church. You speak of us only getting one side of the story: that is true, but when one spouse agrees to counseling and church, and the other doesn't... that speaks volumes about who is the major contributor to the difficulties in a marriage, in my opinion.

Even if you don't agree with anything I've said, I hope you will check out those two books I mentioned. If you can't find them or money is tight, pm me and I'll mail you a copy of each.

God bless,
Wayne

Thank you so much for sharing your experiences and opinions with me. It helps. You are 100% right that I need to get over the fear of divorce and start holding her accountable for her behavior. I will read the two books you mentioned.

 

[free4all]

I wish you well, darkwing. Expect your wife to not react well to you holding her accountable for poor behavior. Decide to continue expecting better from her regardless of how she reacts. Learn to confront, repeatedly if necessary. If she isn't interested in your opinion of matters in the daytime, I find waking someone from a deep sleep gets their attention quickly.

This is not a game. You are dealing with how you want to be treated for the rest of your life. Expect better. You cannot force someone to treat you better, but you CAN hold them accountable and impose consequences when they don't. It works. Period. If someone is mistreating you and you find that unacceptable, you can try loving them to reality... but that often doesn't work. It often doesn't work with rebellious children, nor does it always work with rebellious mates.

You are absolutely entitled to confront a family member over poor behavior, repeatedly if necessary. You determine what is acceptable behavior, not them.

My wife has changed her behavior considerably over the last year only because I made it very uncomfortable for her when she was disrespectful to me. Some have questioned her motivation: I can't alter her motivation, but in the end it really doesn't matter. What matters is how she treats me. I keep hoping at some point she will treat me well because it's the right thing to do, or because she loves me, rather than because she knows I'll object if she doesn't. But in the end, better treatment is better treatment. I'll let God deal with her about her motivation.

You determind what is acceptable to you in your marriage, not your wife. This is a battle you will win, if you choose to confront and confront consistently. It doesn't matter if she becomes uncomfortable. That's the whole point. Let her know you find her conduct unacceptable. If she's smart or if she loves you, she'll be concerned about how you feel. If she doesn't care, that's all the more reason to confront her and make her life uncomfortable, until perhaps some day she will remember and fulfill her wedding vows to love and respect.

You determine the parameters and boundaries you are willing to accept, not her. If you are not bound by fear of divorce or of starting over with little money, she will have no hold on you. In my opinion, it is better to start over with nothing than to live with a rebellious mate. If I start over now, at some point I may find a respectful wife or I may live alone the rest of my life. Either option is FAR better than living with a disrespectful mate. I've made my decision, and it makes the daily decisions of whether to confront or not so much easier.

I am not bound by fear any longer. I pray you are not either. Only then will you know true freedom, and only then will you have the freedom to battle your wife's rebellion without reservation, which it sounds like what is needed. In my opinion, the best thing you can do for your marriage, your wife, and yourself is to establish more appropriate boundaries for how she is treating you. And stand firm when she begins to sputter. It's okay to be in a heated discussion with someone if that's the only way to get their attention. Lose any guilt about confrontation, and lose any guilt about displaying anger. Both are okay. Jesus displayed both, often.

It doesn't take much reading in the New Testament to realize that the image of Jesus being a wimply, peace-seeking-at-all-costs, pacifist is a total lie. Nor should you and I conform to the lie. Confrontation is okay. Sometimes it is the only way.

 

[Spy]

Darkwing, how is it going?

If you still suffer from anxiety, maybe check out this book:

Don't Forget To Look Up : A Christian's Guide to Overcoming Anxiety and Panic Attacks by Angela K. Brittain

I wish you well, darkwing. Expect your wife to not react well to you holding her accountable for poor behavior. Decide to continue expecting better from her regardless of how she reacts. Learn to confront, repeatedly if necessary. If she isn't interested in your opinion of matters in the daytime, I find waking someone from a deep sleep gets their attention quickly.

This is not a game. You are dealing with how you want to be treated for the rest of your life. Expect better. You cannot force someone to treat you better, but you CAN hold them accountable and impose consequences when they don't. It works. Period. If someone is mistreating you and you find that unacceptable, you can try loving them to reality... but that often doesn't work. It often doesn't work with rebellious children, nor does it always work with rebellious mates.

You are absolutely entitled to confront a family member over poor behavior, repeatedly if necessary. You determine what is acceptable behavior, not them.

My wife has changed her behavior considerably over the last year only because I made it very uncomfortable for her when she was disrespectful to me. Some have questioned her motivation: I can't alter her motivation, but in the end it really doesn't matter. What matters is how she treats me. I keep hoping at some point she will treat me well because it's the right thing to do, or because she loves me, rather than because she knows I'll object if she doesn't. But in the end, better treatment is better treatment. I'll let God deal with her about her motivation.

You determind what is acceptable to you in your marriage, not your wife. This is a battle you will win, if you choose to confront and confront consistently. It doesn't matter if she becomes uncomfortable. That's the whole point. Let her know you find her conduct unacceptable. If she's smart or if she loves you, she'll be concerned about how you feel. If she doesn't care, that's all the more reason to confront her and make her life uncomfortable, until perhaps some day she will remember and fulfill her wedding vows to love and respect.

You determine the parameters and boundaries you are willing to accept, not her. If you are not bound by fear of divorce or of starting over with little money, she will have no hold on you. In my opinion, it is better to start over with nothing than to live with a rebellious mate. If I start over now, at some point I may find a respectful wife or I may live alone the rest of my life. Either option is FAR better than living with a disrespectful mate. I've made my decision, and it makes the daily decisions of whether to confront or not so much easier.

I am not bound by fear any longer. I pray you are not either. Only then will you know true freedom, and only then will you have the freedom to battle your wife's rebellion without reservation, which it sounds like what is needed. In my opinion, the best thing you can do for your marriage, your wife, and yourself is to establish more appropriate boundaries for how she is treating you. And stand firm when she begins to sputter. It's okay to be in a heated discussion with someone if that's the only way to get their attention. Lose any guilt about confrontation, and lose any guilt about displaying anger. Both are okay. Jesus displayed both, often.

It doesn't take much reading in the New Testament to realize that the image of Jesus being a wimply, peace-seeking-at-all-costs, pacifist is a total lie. Nor should you and I conform to the lie. Confrontation is okay. Sometimes it is the only way.