Faith vs Love

[COG2013]

Faith vs. Love – The Great Debate​

​

The Roman Church was an organization that started out as the Church of Jesus Christ, but over a few hundred years it became quite the opposite. The Roman Church became the most powerful influence in the world, and thru a campaign of fear, amassed more wealth than any monarchy on the planet.

What started out as love based soon became greed based, and as love faded away, faith became the prevalent focus. Faith in the Roman Church, in their purpose and position in the Kingdom of God, was soon bringing in revenue from the rich and poor.

How did this work? How do you convince someone who has very little to virtually nothing, to give what they have to an organization whose leaders are living a lifestyle of incredible wealth? FEAR!

Fear-based faith is what brought millions of people to the Roman Church. People were told that they could basically buy their salvation and the salvation of their families. They were told that failing to give to the Church would bring down God’s curse and wrath on them. The people were taught not to trust God, but to trust the Church. They were told lies like the Pontiff was the Vicar of Jesus Christ on the Earth and his words were the words of Almighty God.

The church was stealing from the poor, using not a sword, but fear. As the rich got richer and the poor got poorer, the power and corruption of the church grew. What had started out as being about Jesus, was now about the sitting Pontiff.

The reason I am bringing this up is because the Roman Church is the source of all the doctrines, practices, beliefs and rituals of the modern Christian Church. The Roman Church is responsible for removing love as the primary focus of God’s children, and replacing it with fear and hope-based faith.

Everybody knows that God IS love, but the main focus of the modern Christian Church is faith. Faith is so prevalent in the modern church that it has taken on a completely new meaning – religion. “What is your faith?” “So and so is of the Christian Faith.” WHAT ABOUT LOVE?

If you think I am downplaying faith, you are absolutely correct. I am downplaying it because the focus on it is actually keeping people distant from God. You can not be close to God on faith alone. Faith opens the door to your relationship with God, but then love MUST take over. Without love, you are left there staring at an open door.
You can not just say and think love and expect to get thru the door. You must feel and live love to come into the presence of God.

I’m not saying we don’t need faith. Faith is the source of our salvation – it is an absolute requirement! But, it is not everything. Love is everything of, for and in God.

Faith is like a key. You use it to open the door to God’s Kingdom. But, once the door is open, you put the key in your pocket, turn your love on and go thru the door.

PEOPLE, IT IS TIME WE PUT LOVE BACK AS THE PRIMARY FOCUS AND PURPOSE OF GOD’S PEOPLE!!!! It is not just a word or thought. It is a lifestyle of kindness.

 

[timewerx]

You cannot truly love without faith.

Without faith, love is mere emotions and feelings only. You cannot please God by mere emotions and feelings, another human you could, but not God.

Even faith alone does not save. Faith without works is dead.

 

[SilentShadow100]

Faith alone, love alone, or works alone will not get you into the kingdom. The only way to enter the kingdom is to have faith, love out of faith, and do works out of faith and love. As Jesus himself said, if you fail to do God's will (works out of faith and love), you will be denied by God. It is also taught that love is required, and that if you cannot love God then you cannot know God. It is then taught that without faith, you cannot do anything. Faith is a foundation for many things, including love and works.

 

[COG2013]

You cannot truly love without faith.

Without faith, love is mere emotions and feelings only. You cannot please God by mere emotions and feelings, another human you could, but not God.

Even faith alone does not save. Faith without works is dead.

"Bullwackie"

 

[Exjunkman]

To the OP:
I belive your premise is correct. I think that the meaning of life is the lesson to learn to love,

 

[Martinius]

Without getting into an argument about what effect the Catholic church has had on how all Christian churches approach salvation, I think one must add the power of the sacraments to the formula. The Catholic church has in the past tended to instill fear into its members but then offered the sacraments (which they of course have exclusive control over) as a way to alleviate that fear.

But that is a side comment and not the main point of my post here. It is to respond to this:

...Everybody knows that God IS love, but the main focus of the modern Christian Church is faith. Faith is so prevalent in the modern church that it has taken on a completely new meaning – religion. “What is your faith?” “So and so is of the Christian Faith.” WHAT ABOUT LOVE?

I agree that Christians in general have made "belief" the cornerstone of their religion. I think we tend to confuse and combine "faith" and "belief". The main focus of the modern church is "belief", the idea that a Christian is one who proclaims and adheres to certain beliefs. As you say, our beliefs, rather than our faith, has become our religion (the importance of the Creed is an excellent indicator of that). Initially, and for many centuries, the need for "faith" was dominant, but that has morphed into an emphasis on "belief" and in changing the definition of "faith" to meaning the same as "belief".

When we say someone belongs to the "faith" isn't that usually understood as meaning that they are "believers"? Then ask yourself what Jesus meant when he said someone had "great faith". Read those Gospel passages in the context of what was happening and the interactions that were occurring. I think one should readily see that Jesus (and his disciples) understood "faith" to be different then "belief". In fact, Jesus roundly and severely condemned those who emphasized their strong beliefs, external practices and words as evidence of their faith, saying that it wasn't appearances and what they said that were important, but what was in their hearts.

It is quite clear that Jesus focused on love of God and love of neighbor as the key to faith, so yes love should be the center of our lives and of our faith. Belief is really something else, and we know that many people can claim to follow Jesus in their "beliefs" but demonstrate very little love for God or others in their lives.

In the third chapter of his first epistle, John admonishes us to "love not in word or speech, but in deed and truth", to do more than proclaim our faith in God, but to let that faith shine from us in deeds of love.

 

[Yarddog]

The reason I am bringing this up is because the Roman Church is the source of all the doctrines, practices, beliefs and rituals of the modern Christian Church.

Incorrect, if one is talking about the physical Church itself. The Orthodox Church and the Roman Catholic Church were One at one time and together formed the doctrines based on what the Apostles handed to the Church.

The Roman Church is responsible for removing love as the primary focus of God’s children, and replacing it with fear and hope-based faith.

Also incorrect. The Catholic Church(CC) teaches a Gospel based on the love of Jesus Christ. This is what brought me to the CC. There was no preaching against other Churches or condemnation of sinners but only love expressed during the Mass.

Everybody knows that God IS love, but the main focus of the modern Christian Church is faith.

Faith is a great gift of the Holy Spirit but LOVE is the greatest.

I admire your call for Christians to love but you have little knowledge about the Catholic Church.