Evolution's Brick Wall

[AV1611VET]

There are some crazy people on this forum, just be mindful.

They've got rocks in their head?

 

[TheBear]

I wonder why, Mr .6 Posts Per Day?

Probably because he doesn't obsessively post in the non-discussion numbers threads, (1, 2, 3, 4...), in order to get his post count up, like you do. Perhaps he's like most of us, where quality of post is important, and quantity of posts means nothing.

 

[AV1611VET]

Probably because he doesn't obsessively post in the non-discussion numbers threads, (1, 2, 3, 4...), in order to get his post count up, like you do. Perhaps he's like most of us, where quality of post is important, and quantity of posts means nothing.

Either that, or he's myopic and ... as he said ... doesn't see me on the other threads.

 

[doubtingmerle]

That’s not what we find in the fossil record. Humans are very sudden in the record as well as starts and stops of preveous life forms.

Ever scan through a movie in fast forward where you see only some of the frames? Are you baffled why there are stops and starts in motions?

In the fossil record, we are not seeing all the "frames".

 

[AV1611VET]

Ever scan through a movie in fast forward where you see only some of the frames? Are you baffled why there are stops and starts in motions?

In the fossil record, we are not seeing all the "frames".

QV please:

The fossil record, if photographed and made into an fps book, would demonstrate instant arrival of species.

 

[Heissonear]

The fossils that we find represent mutations from one stage in evolution to the next as opposed to gradual changes each day or year or hundred years etc. there is no 1.5 in a “mutation” .

Why do you think one or two beneficial mutations bridges the gap between any two creatures listed on any Tree of Life? That is silly, a couple of mutations changed a deer into an X (dog, etc.)

In turn, show the sequence of morphologically detailed fossils between any two creatures listed on any Tree of Life diagram. No macro-assemblages.

 

[pitabread]

I'm referring to the genetic mutations that lead to new orders of life. There are NO intermediate fossils to find because it was a mutation as opposed to the gradual accumulation of small variations.

I still have no idea what you are trying to say and I suspect it's a terminology issue.

Can you define the word "mutation"? What do you think a mutation is?

 

[Colter]

I still have no idea what you are trying to say and I suspect it's a terminology issue.

Can you define the word "mutation"? What do you think a mutation is?

“a distinct form resulting from a change in the structure of a gene.”

Example, mutation: Primate parents suddenly birthing a form much closer to human than the parents as opposed to each generation gradually becoming more and more human.

 

[Jimmy D]

Why do you think one or two beneficial mutations bridges the gap between any two creatures listed on any Tree of Life? That is silly, a couple of mutations changed a deer into an X (dog, etc.)

In turn, show the sequence of morphologically detailed fossils between any two creatures listed on any Tree of Life diagram. No macro-assemblages.

View attachment 237215

You do realise that that is little more than a kid’s wall chart right?

 

[inquiring mind]

I’ll say one thing, you guys sure are covering the bases... a gradual & very lengthy direct line to human; larger more rapid jumps in the direct line to human; and sort of a complex stream of interwoven paths (from the video I cited) in which a direct line may be impossible to find. Seriously, with that much variety and unexplained gaps, I don’t understand why, even from the scientific perspective, you wouldn’t want to include Creation in your mix of possibilities?

 

[Job 33:6]

I’ll say one thing, you guys sure are covering the bases... a gradual & very lengthy direct line to human; larger more rapid jumps in the direct line to human; and sort of a complex stream of interwoven paths (from the video I cited) in which a direct line may be impossible to find. Seriously, with that much variety and unexplained gaps, I don’t understand why, even from the scientific perspective, you wouldn’t want to include Creation in your mix of possibilities?

Here is my quarrel...

Imagine that we have the succession below...

paleomastodon
gompotherium
primelephas
mammut
mammuthus
and todays indian and african elephants.

Ken miller made this statement before and I agree.


Evolution makes sense because mutations do not define a direct path for life to proceed. Mutations can turn life forms toward any given direction, and therefore result in variation in sometimes seemingly random ways, if observed without natural selection.

So the fossil succession, makes sense in light of this. Because we see seemingly random twists and turns and offshoots and braided streams etc.

If we were to ponder what it would mean if evolution were the not the case...what would that look like?

An inconsistent God? A God who creates, then 50k years later says no no, this isnt good, God destroys what he created and starts over again. Then God does this...perhaps 100 times every million years, over 500 million years...

It would assume that God created and destroyed life over and over and over and over again somewhat rapidly.

But with evolution, we visibly see speciation occur in todays world. We visibly see mutations. Our genetics maintain alterations with the appearance as if they had mutated. And along with other lines of evidence such as the common chromosome 2 fusion, ERVs, cytochrome C graphs and the correlation of phylogeny between all of these fields....

We end up with several lines of evidence indicating that the fossil succession is a product of evolution. Versus some sort of baseless idea that God is perhaps indecisive about what He wants to create, so he keeps destroying it over and over again.

 

[Job 33:6]

Also, from a scientific perspective, we dont have evidence for creation. Its not like life just appears out of thin air for us to observe and study.

When a new species comes into existence, it is through mutations and it is observed as such. However, nobody witnesses a new species coming into being out of thin air, rather they are always observed to be born into existence from their parents ie common descent.

 

[pitabread]

Seriously, with that much variety and unexplained gaps, I don’t understand why, even from the scientific perspective, you wouldn’t want to include Creation in your mix of possibilities?

You need a mechanism first (specifically one that could be scientifically tested) . How would a new species appear out of thin air?

 

[tas8831]

Well, since you apparently don’t approve of videos, maybe it’d be a richer experience for you to debate your viewpoint with someone at a local bookstore.

So precious how the creationist dodges and ducks upon having their pseudo-clever OP topic exposed as ignorance-based hubris.

 

[tas8831]

The leviathan would look like a fire breathing dragon.

If it were real. Pity there are no fossils, therefore, did not exist.

 

[AV1611VET]

If it were real. Pity there are no fossils, therefore, did not exist.

God's word trumps any fossil anytime.

Take "Homo sapiens" for example.

Supposedly there's a gap between "Homo erectus" (or "Homo ergaster" or "Homo whatever") and "Homo sapiens."

Notice though they're all "Homos."

That is, they're all the same genus.

Put another way, they're still humans.

So all these different "Homos" are nothing more than descendants of Adam & Eve, who had a bone-altering "wonderful plagues" placed on them and their ancestors in the past.

Deuteronomy 28:59 Then the LORD will make thy plagues wonderful, and the plagues of thy seed, even great plagues, and of long continuance, and sore sicknesses, and of long continuance.

King David died of something that was altering his bone structure and messing him up from the inside out (see Psalm 38).

Even the size of skulls were altered by some malady.

Leviticus 26:16a I also will do this unto you; I will even appoint over you terror, consumption, and the burning ague, that shall consume the eyes, and cause sorrow of heart:

 

[tas8831]

Seriously, with that much variety and unexplained gaps, I don’t understand why, even from the scientific perspective, you wouldn’t want to include Creation in your mix of possibilities?

As was written to you before, because there is ZERO evidence for creation, thus it is not even in the running.
Seriously, you actually want something that rests solely on the say-so of ancient middle eastern numerologists to be considered alongside that for which there is reams of evidence, from several scientific disciplines, solely because we cannot fill in every blank in a manner that you think they should be?

This is why I asked about your background and how much you understand things like fossilization - I can see why you only replied to those requests with poor attempts at wittiness.

 

[pitabread]

God's word trumps any fossil anytime.

Unfortunately nobody can seem to agree on what "God's word" means.

 

[Heissonear]

I’ll say one thing, you guys sure are covering the bases... a gradual & very lengthy direct line to human; larger more rapid jumps in the direct line to human; and sort of a complex stream of interwoven paths (from the video I cited) in which a direct line may be impossible to find. Seriously, with that much variety and unexplained gaps, I don’t understand why, even from the scientific perspective, you wouldn’t want to include Creation in your mix of possibilities?

May I say, you threw a knock out. Caught them cover the spectrum of how evolution can occur.

We might also say with such broad positioning with the evolutionists that they spewed conjecture. They are all use to basing their posts on conjecture. And many so far lack the integrity to face up to their ways.

 

[Heissonear]

Unfortunately nobody can seem to agree on what "God's word" means.

I was once godless, without God in this world, and thought the Bible was fiction.

But things changed dramatically once I was born again by His Spirit - baptized by His Spirit. Verse by verse of the Bible started to come alive, as He by the Spirit wrote them on the tablets of my heart.

Yes, it more than just a Book and mental reading comprehension. It is enlightenment from heaven.

It is by heavenly anointing the Bible comes alive.

You sound unfamiliar with how the heavens can open, and being taught by Him. When will this position change for you?