Eternity?

[Eudaimonist]

probably?

thats not the point hes getting at

I get his point. I just want my question answered a little more directly.


eudaimonia,

Mark

 

[bricklayer]

That is not my hope.

 

[rosenherman]

Okay, let's say that you are sinless in heaven. Wouldn't you want to think about your perfected self at least some of the time?


eudaimonia,

Mark

IMHO a great deal of sin comes from thinking about your self (perfected or otherwise). In heaven there'd be no need to think about self. We'll have no needs, so what is the use in thinking about self?

 

[bricklayer]

Apart from God is only the horror of sin.

We will begin as a people who never forget the horror of sin or the hero of Christ.
And all of this, from Adam to the bride of Christ,
is just out bloody birth.

 

[david_x]

Okay, let's say that you are sinless in heaven. Wouldn't you want to think about your perfected self at least some of the time?


eudaimonia,

Mark

If you did that i'm not sure you would be perfect.

 

[ToddNotTodd]

If you did that i'm not sure you would be perfect.

I don't know about that. I think about myself quite a bit, and I'm perfect.

 

[david_x]

I don't know about that. I think about myself quite a bit, and I'm perfect.

Clearly.

 

[Eudaimonist]

If you did that i'm not sure you would be perfect.

Why is that?


eudaimonia,

Mark

 

[Eudaimonist]

IMHO a great deal of sin comes from thinking about your self (perfected or otherwise). In heaven there'd be no need to think about self. We'll have no needs, so what is the use in thinking about self?

That means that we'd have no need for God, so why worship him? If one has no needs, why do anything at all?


eudaimonia,

Mark

 

[rosenherman]

That means that we'd have no need for God, so why worship him? If one has no needs, why do anything at all?


eudaimonia,

Mark

That reduces, eventually to a circular argument. God fulfills all our needs in heaven. So if we have no needs, we don't need God and we don't need to worship Him. But God fulfills . . .

 

[rosenherman]

I don't know about that. I think about myself quite a bit, and I'm perfect.

Well, you're certainly the most you possible. Whether that is perfect is up for debate.

 

[Eudaimonist]

That reduces, eventually to a circular argument. God fulfills all our needs in heaven. So if we have no needs, we don't need God and we don't need to worship Him. But God fulfills . . .

There is circularity there, but it is not mine. I suppose one must recraft that to say people do have needs in heaven and God fulfills all those needs, except that at least some of this fulfillment requires deliberate action on the part of the denizen of heaven. The denizen must, at least, engage in the act of worship.

But I wonder how it could be that God could fulfill all needs. It seems that we have to be significantly nonhuman in heaven, because we as human beings have self-awareness, and have a need to be aware of our own existence. If we were completely un-self-aware in heaven, we would be diminished -- we would be living at a lower form of consciousness similar to that of many animal species.


eudaimonia,

Mark

 

[david_x]

Why is that?


eudaimonia,

Mark

Ideally someone thinks of others first, selfishness is not a virtue.

 

[Eudaimonist]

Ideally someone thinks of others first, selfishness is not a virtue.

Ah, then I think we've been miscommunicating. I interpreted "thinking of oneself" in the much more literal sense of self-reflection. It seems that the Christians here mean prioritizing one's own interests above the interests of others.

(Note: I don't think it is true that ideally one thinks of others first. But that is irrelevant here.)


eudaimonia,

Mark

 

[bricklayer]

The revelation of God's glory is not a means to another end,
it is the end, the fulfillment, of God's purpose for His creation.

This is not an anthropocentric creation.

The "Matrix Moment" comes when we understand that WE ARE the means to another end.

 

[rosenherman]

There is circularity there, but it is not mine. I suppose one must recraft that to say people do have needs in heaven and God fulfills all those needs, except that at least some of this fulfillment requires deliberate action on the part of the denizen of heaven. The denizen must, at least, engage in the act of worship.

But I wonder how it could be that God could fulfill all needs. It seems that we have to be significantly nonhuman in heaven, because we as human beings have self-awareness, and have a need to be aware of our own existence. If we were completely un-self-aware in heaven, we would be diminished -- we would be living at a lower form of consciousness similar to that of many animal species.


eudaimonia,

Mark

I disagree. We can certainly be self-aware without being self-centered. In heaven we'll be God-centered, as we Christians hope to strive for here on earth. Since God created us and everything that exists, how could He not fulfill all needs. We'll have no needs in heaven because we will be in the presence of the source of all power, all beings.

 

[Inviolable]

What would you do for an eternity?

Look at that funky triangle thing you got going in your avatar.

 

[Eudaimonist]

I disagree. We can certainly be self-aware without being self-centered. In heaven we'll be God-centered, as we Christians hope to strive for here on earth. Since God created us and everything that exists, how could He not fulfill all needs. We'll have no needs in heaven because we will be in the presence of the source of all power, all beings.

See post 94. I mistook Christians to mean self-aware (not self-centered).


eudaimonia,

Mark

 

[FimpN]

i pritty much doesent do anything untill the last secound, and if i had an eternity to do things nothing would be done...

So i guess i wouldent do anything for an eternity xD

 

[Penumbra]

I guess I just don't "get" the idea of worship.

An egotistical person demands worship or respect because he or she is weak, has insecurities, and is prideful.

Something like an omnipotent god- I don't see how it would have use of worship. Would this god's happiness level be increased by mortals worshiping it? If so, then its happiness is partially dependent on mortals, and it is weak. If its happiness level is not increased by worship, then why bother worshiping it? It would be like a bunch of people standing around a trillionaire handing him $1 bills.

If God can be benefited from worship, then he is not God. If worship only benefits humans doing the worshiping, then worship is all about the self. If worship benefits neither, then why do it?

-Lyn