Eschatological Views

[Kingdom_Come]

Revelation is not altogether a literal prophesy to lay out as a road to show that such and such will happen at this time or that time.

While many of the things in Revelations are "symbolic", the end of Revelations is quite clear. It leaves little room for doubt or misunderstanding. The other things in that book may be interpreted different ways by different people, but rest assured there is only one correct interpretation. These things were given to God's people so that they might know when the time is near and so that they might know He is truly God.

 

[FreeinChrist]

While I don't disagree that we should heed that which is written in it you mention the OT prophets which, with the exception of Daniel, either give prophecy concerning Christ's first coming or events that were to come in their time. The 1000 years is mentioned only as a completion of time not a literal 1000 years.

What do you mean, "with the exception of Daniel"?

And you have geiven me no reason not to beleive that when 1000 years is mentioned 6 times, it doesn't mean 1000 years.

40 years meant 40 years. 70 years meant 70 years.
a Sabbath rest every 7 years for the land meant a Sabbath rest every 7th year.

 

[FreeinChrist]

Revelation is not altogether a literal prophesy to lay out as a road to show that such and such will happen at this time or that time. I never said I didn't believe that Satan was not a created being, but he has been in effect. We are all sinners and tempted to sin each and every day. Just because we are saved by our confession of Christ does not mean that we are not still sinners.

I guess you miss my point. In the prophecy about the 1000 years, it says that Satan is bound and shut in (sealed) in the abyss for that 1000 years.


Most amillennialists I know beleive we are in a figurative 1000 years and many try to claim that Satan is in the abyss and not active in the world.

They have yet to show me why today is different from Paul's day, where he was 'hindered' by Satan, and warned Christians about spiritual warfare, and referred to Satan as the prince of the power of the air.

So as you are Lutheran, are you amillennial?

Did you know that a very respected Lutheran minister was premillennial? His name is Joseph Seiss, and a book was made of his sermons about Revelation called "The Apocolypse". It was recently reprinted.

 

[FreeinChrist]

Tell me what happens to the OT saints?

They are saved the same as the church - for they are saved by grace through faith in a future Messiah, promised by God as early as Genesis 3:15. They may not have known His name was Jesus, but they had faith in God's promise. See Hebrews 11.

So they are included in the "dead in Christ".

 

[sweetsarge]

Thank you all for responding to my question and taking the time to quote the many verses related to this subject. I have read all of your answers not once, but twice and will read them again as I ponder over all the new enlightment you have shared with me. I Praise God for ...people like you who are there to help with questions and Answers. You are great!

Sweet

 

[vinsight4u]

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[vinsight4u]

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[SPALATIN]

They are saved the same as the church - for they are saved by grace through faith in a future Messiah, promised by God as early as Genesis 3:15. They may not have known His name was Jesus, but they had faith in God's promise. See Hebrews 11.

So they are included in the "dead in Christ".

Give me scripture in the New Testament that says that. You won't because you can't. The OT saints are not the "Dead in Christ" The "dead in Christ" are only those who knew him. The OT saints did not know him. They had the promise of him, but they didn't know him and in fact his own generation rejected him as Messiah. Only his disciples and those who came to faith that he was the Messiah and have died are the "dead in Christ."

Jesus said to them, "Most assuredly, I say to you, unless you eat the flesh of the Son of Man and drink His blood, you have no life in you. Whoever eats My flesh and drinks My blood has eternal life, and I will raise him up at the last day." -John 6:53-54

Has the OT saint done this? No he hasn't.

And as they were eating, Jesus took bread, blessed and broke it, and gave it to the disciples and said, "Take, eat; this is My body." Then He took the cup, and gave thanks, and gave it to them, saying, "Drink from it, all of you. For this is My blood of the new covenant, which is shed for many for the remission of sins." -Matthew 26:26-28.

Does the Spirit of Christ dwell in the OT saint?

"He who eats My flesh and drinks My blood abides in Me, and I in him." -John 6:56 But you are not in the flesh but in the Spirit, if indeed the Spirit of God dwells in you. Now if anyone does not have the Spirit of Christ, he is not His. -Romans 8:9

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Are ALL the saints of ALL the ages ONE BODY, drinking of the SAME Spirit?

The cup of blessing which we bless, is it not the communion of the blood of Christ? The bread which we break, is it not the communion of the body of Christ? For we, though many, are one bread and one body; for we all partake of that one bread. -1 Cor 10:16-17



For by one Spirit we were all baptized into one body-- whether Jews or Greeks, whether slaves or free--and have all been made to drink into one Spirit. -1 Cor 12:13.

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[SPALATIN]

I guess you miss my point. In the prophecy about the 1000 years, it says that Satan is bound and shut in (sealed) in the abyss for that 1000 years.


Most amillennialists I know beleive we are in a figurative 1000 years and many try to claim that Satan is in the abyss and not active in the world.

They have yet to show me why today is different from Paul's day, where he was 'hindered' by Satan, and warned Christians about spiritual warfare, and referred to Satan as the prince of the power of the air.

So as you are Lutheran, are you amillennial?

Did you know that a very respected Lutheran minister was premillennial? His name is Joseph Seiss, and a book was made of his sermons about Revelation called "The Apocolypse". It was recently reprinted.

If you think about it, Satan's power was bound up at Christ's death and Resurrection. He has no power over those who believe unless they give it to him.

Yes, I am Amillenial. I have read all the Left Behind books except the last one and I will not read it ever because it is full of eschatological errors. There are a lot of Lutherans who probably believe in a Pre-millenial rapture, and just because someone has written a book about it doesn't mean I am going to rush out and buy it and read it. He probably doesn't have a cross in his church either.

Scott Strohkirch

 

[vinsight4u]

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[SPALATIN]

Read Daniel 11:14-21

At verse 15........it shows the situation in Iraq must change a lot as
the ruler is able to leave his own country and attack others

So his throne seems to be secure then.


the king of the north
?Iraq
shall come
take the most fenced cities
?Israel

shall stand in the glorious land
which by his hand shall be consumed

This is all to happen years before the time of the beast!

Quit cross-referencing todays Newspaper with the bible. It sounds foolish. Instead pray that the Lord be with you and help you not to sin today.

Scott Strohkirch

 

[vinsight4u]

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[vinsight4u]

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[vinsight4u]

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[vinsight4u]

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[SPALATIN]

I think my username says it all!

I suppose you believe the Anti-Christ will be a political figure too?

 

[SPALATIN]

Yes. I believe that the Antichrist will come from the European Union. And yourself?

No not a political figure and nowhere in scripture does it say that? If you can find it provide it.

 

[vinsight4u]

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[vinsight4u]

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[vinsight4u]

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