Enoch and Elijah

[benedictaoo]

I'm not advocating for any politician. If your position is that we cannot support any legislation that does not specifically reference God, I don't agree.

We can't make laws that are in direct opposition to Him. If we don't reference Him are no better then Communism. Godless society that thinks we don't need Him.

 

[benedictaoo]

God's ability is without limit. I have limits. I always fall short of perfection in service. I am glad that you don't.

And you and us all, will keep falling short if our society is godless, if we do not give Him His place in society. He can not be a private matter.

 

[MikeK]

I said because you're debating this. And I didn't accuse you, its what i concluded from your post because of the debating. So I asked you to help me understand if I'm mistaken, i asked nicely too. Thank you for answering.

You're very welcome, and thank you for asking. I welcome direct questions and will always try to answer them to the best of my ability, being an honest, open person is important to me and I think it's an important part of our witness. When people see Christians cower and refuse to answer direct questions, it reflects negatively on all of Christinity. We need to set the example.

 

[MikeK]

And you and us all, will keep falling short if our society is godless, if we do not give Him His place in society. He can not be a private matter.

I agree. Our worship of Him, our service to Him and our praise of Him isn't private or secret. When we cooperate with Him, it will be evident in all areas of our lives. Why do we help children at risk of abortion? Because we love them. Why do we love them? Because God made them and wants them to live and we love God.

 

[LivingWordUnity]

Pope Francis, Morning Meditation in the Chapel of the Domus Sanctae Marthae, (28 November 2013)

At this time of the liturgical year, the Pope continued, “the Church turns our thoughts to the end of this world, since it will come to and end, for the world as we know it is passing away”. The Gospel tells us that “all these things will occur”, but, he asked, how long must we wait? In St Luke (cf 21:20-28) we hear: “until the times of the Gentiles are fulfilled”. For, he said, “even the pagans have a fullness of time … they have a kairós, the final triumph: the destruction of Jerusalem”. In the Gospel of St Luke we read: “And there will be signs in sun and moon and stars, and upon the earth distress of nations in perplexity at the roaring of the sea and the waves, men fainting with fear and with foreboding of what is coming on the world; for the powers of the heavens will be shaken” (Lk 21:25-26).

“It is a calamity,” the Pope said. “However, when Jesus speaks of this calamity in another passage, he tells us that it will be a profanation of the temple, a profanation of the faith, of the people. It will be an abomination. It will be the abomination of desolation (Dan 9:27). What does this mean? It will appear to be the triumph of the prince of this world, the defeat of God. It will seem, in that final moment of calamity, as though he has taken over the world” and has become “master of the world”.

Pope Francis then explained how “this battle between the living God and the prince of this world” can also be traced out in the first Reading from the Book of Daniel (6:12-28). Essentially, he said, “Daniel is condemned only for worshipping, for worshipping God. And the abomination of desolation is called prohibition against worship”.

The Pope then explained, “in that time one could not speak about religion: it was a private matter”. Religious symbols were removed and taken down, and the people had to obey the orders that came from “worldly powers”. The worship of God was forbidden. This was “the kairós of this pagan attitude”. But “when this time is fulfilled, then He will come”, as we read in the Gospel, “then they will see the Son of man coming in the cloud with power and great glory”.

The word of God reminds us, he said, how “Christians that suffer through times of persecution, through times when worship is prohibited, are a prophetic sign of what will happen to everyone”. However, precisely in moments such as these, when the times of the pagans are being fulfilled, “raise your heads, because your redemption is drawing near”.

(Read more)​

 

[pdudgeon]

Pope Francis, Morning Meditation in the Chapel of the Domus Sanctae Marthae, (28 November 2013)

At this time of the liturgical year, the Pope continued, “the Church turns our thoughts to the end of this world, since it will come to and end, for the world as we know it is passing away”. The Gospel tells us that “all these things will occur”, but, he asked, how long must we wait? In St Luke (cf 21:20-28) we hear: “until the times of the Gentiles are fulfilled”. For, he said, “even the pagans have a fullness of time … they have a kairós, the final triumph: the destruction of Jerusalem”. In the Gospel of St Luke we read: “And there will be signs in sun and moon and stars, and upon the earth distress of nations in perplexity at the roaring of the sea and the waves, men fainting with fear and with foreboding of what is coming on the world; for the powers of the heavens will be shaken” (Lk 21:25-26).

“It is a calamity,” the Pope said. “However, when Jesus speaks of this calamity in another passage, he tells us that it will be a profanation of the temple, a profanation of the faith, of the people. It will be an abomination. It will be the abomination of desolation (Dan 9:27). What does this mean? It will appear to be the triumph of the prince of this world, the defeat of God. It will seem, in that final moment of calamity, as though he has taken over the world” and has become “master of the world”.

Pope Francis then explained how “this battle between the living God and the prince of this world” can also be traced out in the first Reading from the Book of Daniel (6:12-28). Essentially, he said, “Daniel is condemned only for worshipping, for worshipping God. And the abomination of desolation is called prohibition against worship”.

The Pope then explained, “in that time one could not speak about religion: it was a private matter”. Religious symbols were removed and taken down, and the people had to obey the orders that came from “worldly powers”. The worship of God was forbidden. This was “the kairós of this pagan attitude”. But “when this time is fulfilled, then He will come”, as we read in the Gospel, “then they will see the Son of man coming in the cloud with power and great glory”.

The word of God reminds us, he said, how “Christians that suffer through times of persecution, through times when worship is prohibited, are a prophetic sign of what will happen to everyone”. However, precisely in moments such as these, when the times of the pagans are being fulfilled, “raise your heads, because your redemption is drawing near”.

(Read more)​

what a beautiful homily!

 

[pdudgeon]

You're very welcome, and thank you for asking. I welcome direct questions and will always try to answer them to the best of my ability, being an honest, open person is important to me and I think it's an important part of our witness. When people see Christians cower and refuse to answer direct questions, it reflects negatively on all of Christinity. We need to set the example.

not quite.
there were times when Jesus didn't answer His critics,
and times when He told them flat out that all they would receive from Him were parables.

you know Mike, i really can't figure out what your motive is here...
trying to take over the thread,
trying to get the mods to shut down the thread,
or trying to get us to leave the forum in utter disgust.
all of it reflects negatively on Christianity.

 

[MikeK]

not quite.
there were times when Jesus didn't answer His critics,
and times when He told them flat out that all they would receive from Him were parables.

you know Mike, i really can't figure out what your motive is here...
trying to take over the thread,
trying to get the mods to shut down the thread,
or trying to get us to leave the forum in utter disgust.
all of it reflects negatively on Christianity.

No need to be so contrary. My motive is to stand for truth and to stand for Christ. Christ was not a coward, and Christ's occasional refusal to answer direct questions was never because He was afraid of being proven wrong or afraid that the Truth was contrary to His transient Earthly political beliefs. Don't use "but Christ pulled out a whip in the temple" to excuse threatening to whip people in Church and don't use Christ's perfect wisdom to excuse human cowardice and dishonesty.

 

[LivingWordUnity]

No need to be so contrary. My motive is to stand for truthful to stand for Christ.

Here was the first response in this thread:

Ooh, I loves me a carefully-selected, vague prophesy.

Jesus never talked in that way.

 

[pdudgeon]

No need to be so contrary. My motive is to stand for truthful to stand for Christ. Christ was not a coward, and Christ's occasional refusal to answer direct questions was never because He was afraid of being proven wrong or afraid that the Truth was contrary to His transient Earthly political beliefs. Don't use "but Christ pulled out a whip in the temple" to excuse threatening to whip people in Church and don't use Christ's perfect wisdom to excuse human cowardice and dishonesty.

but you forgot to mention that He was mocked and accused of cowardness and a lot else besides that by His detractors.
so which side are you on again?

 

[benedictaoo]

I agree. Our worship of Him, our service to Him and our praise of Him isn't private or secret. When we cooperate with Him, it will be evident in all areas of our lives. Why do we help children at risk of abortion? Because we love them. Why do we love them? Because God made them and wants them to live and we love God.

God still can not be kept out of the public square if we have any chance at stopping this runaway train. You should really read the last three popes, what they said about the matter. It doesn't matter though. Scripture says these godless things will happen. Just make sure which side you'll be on. Those who feel we're going in the right direction with secularism and God forsaken laws, they'll be on the left.

 

[benedictaoo]

Pope Francis, Morning Meditation in the Chapel of the Domus Sanctae Marthae, (28 November 2013)

At this time of the liturgical year, the Pope continued, “the Church turns our thoughts to the end of this world, since it will come to and end, for the world as we know it is passing away”. The Gospel tells us that “all these things will occur”, but, he asked, how long must we wait? In St Luke (cf 21:20-28) we hear: “until the times of the Gentiles are fulfilled”. For, he said, “even the pagans have a fullness of time … they have a kairós, the final triumph: the destruction of Jerusalem”. In the Gospel of St Luke we read: “And there will be signs in sun and moon and stars, and upon the earth distress of nations in perplexity at the roaring of the sea and the waves, men fainting with fear and with foreboding of what is coming on the world; for the powers of the heavens will be shaken” (Lk 21:25-26).

“It is a calamity,” the Pope said. “However, when Jesus speaks of this calamity in another passage, he tells us that it will be a profanation of the temple, a profanation of the faith, of the people. It will be an abomination. It will be the abomination of desolation (Dan 9:27). What does this mean? It will appear to be the triumph of the prince of this world, the defeat of God. It will seem, in that final moment of calamity, as though he has taken over the world” and has become “master of the world”.

Pope Francis then explained how “this battle between the living God and the prince of this world” can also be traced out in the first Reading from the Book of Daniel (6:12-28). Essentially, he said, “Daniel is condemned only for worshipping, for worshipping God. And the abomination of desolation is called prohibition against worship”.

The Pope then explained, “in that time one could not speak about religion: it was a private matter”. Religious symbols were removed and taken down, and the people had to obey the orders that came from “worldly powers”. The worship of God was forbidden. This was “the kairós of this pagan attitude”. But “when this time is fulfilled, then He will come”, as we read in the Gospel, “then they will see the Son of man coming in the cloud with power and great glory”.

The word of God reminds us, he said, how “Christians that suffer through times of persecution, through times when worship is prohibited, are a prophetic sign of what will happen to everyone”. However, precisely in moments such as these, when the times of the pagans are being fulfilled, “raise your heads, because your redemption is drawing near”.

(Read more)​

This is scary actually. At least the pope validates my feelings about this.

 

[pdudgeon]

This is scary actually. At least the pope validates my feelings about this.

we've certainly seen the scriptures Luke wrote fulfilled this year in the weather.

 

[LivingWordUnity]

but you forgot to mention that He was mocked and accused of cowardness and a lot else besides that by His detractors.
so which side are you on again?

The first of the devil's temptations was to try to get Jesus to live on bread alone.

And then the devil basically called Jesus a coward with the very next temptation.

Matthew 4:5-7

Then the devil took him to the holy city, and set him on the pinnacle of the temple, and said to him, “If you are the Son of God, throw yourself down; for it is written,

‘He will give his angels charge of you,’

and

‘On their hands they will bear you up,
lest you strike your foot against a stone.’”

Jesus said to him, “Again it is written, ‘You shall not tempt the Lord your God.’”
.

 

[benedictaoo]

The popes compare Jesus temptation to this world. The temptations we face is like that of Jesu's and if you're not a person that recognizes this, you're more than likely on the left. Its never too late to get on the right side of Jesus.

 

[Mountain_Girl406]

The popes compare Jesus temptation to this world. The temptations we face is like that of Jesu's and if you're not a person that recognizes this, you're more than likely on the left. Its never too late to get on the right side of Jesus.

If you are on the political left, can you not be on the right side of Jesus?

 

[LivingWordUnity]

The popes compare Jesus temptation to this world. The temptations we face is like that of Jesu's and if you're not a person that recognizes this, you're more than likely on the left. Its never too late to get on the right side of Jesus.

The devil keeps using the same old methods.

 

[LivingWordUnity]

If you are on the political left, can you not be on the right side of Jesus?

There can be individual exceptions, but in general, the political left takes pride in its godlessness. And the political right is generally Christian and unashamed to confess our belief in Jesus.

 

[benedictaoo]

If you are on the political left, can you not be on the right side of Jesus?

If you are a person who feels God is the problem and/or Christianity is the cause of oppression, if we need to get Him out of the way so we can grant rights and laws that are in direct opposition to Divine laws, if you think apostasy is the answer to suffering and other ills of society, then I would reevaluate my conscious. We can not solve poverty with sin. We can not end discrimination with sin. We can not give equality with sin. We can not achieve peace in our world with sin.

 

[Mountain_Girl406]

If you are a person who feels God is the problemcan not solvend/or Christianity is the cause of oppression, if we need to get Him out of the way so we can grant rights and laws that are in direct opposition to Divine laws, if you think apostasy is the answer to suffering and other ills of society, then I would reevaluate my conscious. We can not solve the poverty with sin. We can not end discrimination with sin. We can not give equality with sin. We can not achieve peace in our world with sin.

What sin is being promoted as a tool to end poverty, achieve peace or stop discrimination?