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Ellen White: Inspired?

SabbathBlessings

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A prophet that He does rise up would not contradict His already written word. When that happens we know it is not of God and ought not be followed
True, which is why the Sabbath commandment was never changed in the scripture because God said not to add or subtract from His commandments Deut 4:2 and doing so is a contradiction to the Word of God and something we are warned about Proverbs 30:5-6 Isaiah 8:20. What a real messenger will do is bring light back on God’s Word and not on themselves. Statements like being “above the Bible” would have me concerned if that was the religion I followed considering the Word is to be the light to our path Psalms 119:105
 
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The Liturgist

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One thing we should never compromise on is biblical Truth. We are only sanctified by the Truth of God’s Word John 17:17 and only God can sanctify us Ezekiel 20:13 casting aside biblical Truth is never a good idea 2 Thes 2:10-12. Jesus tells us to teach each other the commandments Matthew 5:19 and if we love our neighbor we will teach them Truth, that many cast aside for the sake of unity.

On this point you, I, and the Roman Catholic Church again agree.
 
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The Liturgist

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True, which is why the Sabbath commandment was never changed in the scripture because God said not to add or subtract from His commandments Deut 4:2 and doing so is a contradiction to the Word of God and something we are warned about Proverbs 30:5-6 Isaiah 8:20. What a real messenger will do is bring light back on God’s Word and not on themselves. Statements like being “above the Bible” would have me concerned if that was the religion I followed considering the Word is to be the light to our path Psalms 119:105

The Sabbath commandment hasn’t been changed by the Orthodox churches, in that Holy Saturday is understood as the Great Sabbath, when the Incarnate Word of God rested in a tomb, after His Passion and Crucifixion and before His resurrection.

The point of Sunday worship, for the Orthodox, is not to replace the Sabbath as a day of rest (although some Protestants I have encountered consider Sunday the Sabbath), but rather to celebrate the Resurrection of Christ our God. “Arise O God and let Thy enemies be scattered.”
 
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SabbathBlessings

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The Sabbath commandment hasn’t been changed by the Orthodox churches, in that Holy Saturday is understood as the Great Sabbath, when the Incarnate Word of God rested in a tomb, after His Passion and Crucifixion and before His resurrection.

The point of Sunday worship, for the Orthodox, is not to replace the Sabbath as a day of rest (although some Protestants I have encountered consider Sunday the Sabbath), but rather to celebrate the Resurrection of Christ our God. “Arise O God and let Thy enemies be scattered.”
Agree, the Sabbath has not changed, but yet the corporate day of worship for the majority, was changed as it was predicted in the Holy Scriptures Daniel 7:25 and we see a denomination taking credit for this change in corporate worship, admitting it did not come from the Authority of the Holy Scriptures just as it was predicted.

There is no scripture that says the first day is for a day of worship, God made the first day to do works and labors. Exodus 20:9. While we should worship God everyday, there is only one holy day that God sanctified and blessed Genesis 2:1-3 Exodus 20:8-11 as the day we are to honor God on God's holy day, Isaiah 58:13 the day God set aside for holy communion so we can spend a full day with God. God commanded us to work six days and keep one day holy, the seventh day Sabbath. Exodus 20:8-11
 
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The Liturgist

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Jesus came to save us from our sins, not in them Matthew 1:21. God sent prophets because He has compassion for His people

2 Cor 36:15 The Lord, the God of their ancestors, sent word to them through his messengers again and again, because he had pity on his people and on his dwelling place

But this is how people responded

2 Cor 2:16 But they mocked God’s messengers, despised his words and scoffed at his prophets until the wrath of the Lord was aroused against his people and there was no remedy

A prophet helps people prepare their way for Christ‘s return. While spreading the good news of Jesus Christ returning is important, we also need to teach people how to live for Christ so we can be prepared for the Second Coming of Jesus.

Indeed, however, the fact remains that Luke 24:13-48 clearly establishes that the entire Old Testament is Christological prophecy.

By the way, out of curiosity, why is it that I seldom see SDA members quote from Luke or Acts, compared to other Gospels and the Pauline epistles? In particular I have never seen an Adventist quote from Luke ch. 1, or offer an exegesis of either Luke ch. 1 or John ch. 1, which I find perplexing, because these two books are all about the Advent.

I would be very interested if @BobRyan , @SabbathBlessings or another SDA Christian could provide a verse by verse exegesis of Luke ch. 1, and John 1:1-17
 
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SabbathBlessings

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Indeed, however, the fact remains that Luke 24:13-48 clearly establishes that the entire Old Testament is Christological prophecy.

By the way, out of curiosity, why is it that I seldom see SDA members quote from Luke or Acts, compared to other Gospels and the Pauline epistles? In particular I have never seen an Adventist quote from Luke ch. 1, or offer an exegesis of either Luke ch. 1 or John ch. 1, which I find perplexing, because these two books are all about the Advent.

I would be very interested if @BobRyan , @SabbathBlessings or another SDA Christian could provide a verse by verse exegesis of Luke ch. 1, and John 1:1-17
You must not be very familiar with the SDA church because we believe in all of God's Word including Acts and Luke that is studied and quoted just like all of God's Word.

Here's my pastor's past sermons on Acts....This is just one pastor among the thousands of SDA pastors. Did you want to try again on another book in the bible? We as a church study each book of the bible over a 4–5-year period in Sabbath School which is a bible study before church service starts, once we finish the bible we start over again. In addition to Sabbath School the church has lots of other bible studies and vespers.


Here's my pastor's past sermons on Luke....

 
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The Liturgist

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admitting it did not come from the authority of the Holy Scriptures just as it was predicted
There has been no such admission on the part of the Orthodox church (if any individual Orthodox, whether clergy or laity said that, it would not count, for the only definitive statements of Orthodox doctrine are contained in the Ecumenical Councils and the prayers and hymns of the Orthodox Liturgy, both the Divine Liturgy and the Divine Office (Vespers, Matins, etc, indeed, daily Matins contains the most information of any of the Orthodox services overall, although the most important parts of the Orthodox faith are encoded in the invariant text of the Divine Liturgy, which is the same whether celebrated on Saturday, Sunday or a weekday, and also the propers, that is, those parts which do change on each day of the year, such as the appointed Scripture lessons).

The worship of the Orthodox on Saturday continues and the worship on Sunday, which by the way has also always been a day of worship for the Jews, since the Jews actually pray in the Synagogue not just on Friday evening and Saturday morning but indeed have services every day a week, any time they have a Minyan (a quorum of ten Jewish men who have had their Bar Mitzvah; our Lord has established for Christians a minyan of two (“Wherever two or three are gathered together in my name, there I am in the midst of them”) for corporate worship.

The extreme importance of Sunday worship however is fully Scripturally justified, for as the Gospels make clear, our Lord rose from the dead on Sunday. Indeed this is prophesized in Genesis 1:3-5 , for Jesus Christ is the Word, the Way, the Truth and the Light according to the Gospel of God, and thus, Let there be Light.

Indeed Luke 24:13-48 makes it quite clear that Genesis 1 is as much a prophecy of the passion and resurrection of Christ and His recreation of the world, as He destroyed death and will make all things anew, as it is of the original creation.
 
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The Liturgist

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You must not be very familiar with the SDA church because we believe in all of God's Word including Acts and Luke that is studied and quoted just like all of God's Word.

Here's my pastor's past sermons on Acts....This is just one pastor among the thousands of SDA pastors. Did you want to try again on another book in the bible? We as a church study each book of the bible over a 4–5-year period in Sabbath School which is a bible study before church service starts, once we finish the bible we start over again. In addition to Sabbath School the church has lots of other bible studies and vespers.


Here's my pastor's past sermons on Luke....


I am not denying that Adventists accept all 27 books of the New Testament as canon, this much is obvious. Rather, what I am remarking on is that I seldom see Adventists quite in debates of this sort from the Gospel of Luke, or Acts, or or especially Luke ch 1, and John 1:1-18. I seriously have no idea how Adventists even interpret these texts. But beyond that, I would like to see Adventists address question of Ellen White’s interpretation and every other theological issue we have discussed, for example, the days of worship, specifically analyzed in the context of Luke ch. 1 and 24, and John ch. 1.

I would also separately like to see a verse by verse Adventist exposition of Luke chapter 1, Luke chapter 24, Acts chapters 1 and 2 and John 1:1-17.
 
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SabbathBlessings

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There has been no such admission on the part of the Orthodox church (if any individual Orthodox, whether clergy or laity said that, it would not count, for the only definitive statements of Orthodox doctrine are contained in the Ecumenical Councils and the prayers and hymns of the Orthodox Liturgy, both the Divine Liturgy and the Divine Office (Vespers, Matins, etc, indeed, daily Matins contains the most information of any of the Orthodox services overall, although the most important parts of the Orthodox faith are encoded in the invariant text of the Divine Liturgy, which is the same whether celebrated on Saturday, Sunday or a weekday, and also the propers, that is, those parts which do change on each day of the year, such as the appointed Scripture lessons).

The worship of the Orthodox on Saturday continues and the worship on Sunday, which by the way has also always been a day of worship for the Jews, since the Jews actually pray in the Synagogue not just on Friday evening and Saturday morning but indeed have services every day a week, any time they have a Minyan (a quorum of ten Jewish men who have had their Bar Mitzvah; our Lord has established for Christians a minyan of two (“Wherever two or three are gathered together in my name, there I am in the midst of them”) for corporate worship.

The extreme importance of Sunday worship however is fully Scripturally justified, for as the Gospels make clear, our Lord rose from the dead on Sunday. Indeed this is prophesized in Genesis 1:3-5 , for Jesus Christ is the Word, the Way, the Truth and the Light according to the Gospel of God, and thus, Let there be Light.

Indeed Luke 24:13-48 makes it quite clear that Genesis 1 is as much a prophecy of the passion and resurrection of Christ and His recreation of the world, as He destroyed death and will make all things anew, as it is of the original creation.
Where is the scripture that says because Jesus rose on the first day, that we should now make that a day of worship? I have yet to find one scripture that says the first day is holy, sanctified or blessed by God. God commanded us to work six-days Exodus 20:9 and to only keep holy one day. Exodus 20:8-11 The same cycle of creation and we are to follow God because we are made in His image to follow Him. Genesis 1 Genesis 2:1-3

You seem to be reading into the account of Creation week that it somehow makes the first day something different than what God personally commanded Exodus 20:9. There's lots of creative ways we can read into scripture that's not plainly written, but it's never a good idea.
 
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SabbathBlessings

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I am not denying that Adventists accept all 27 books of the New Testament as canon, this much is obvious. Rather, what I am remarking on is that I seldom see Adventists quite in debates of this sort from the Gospel of Luke, or Acts, or or especially Luke ch 1, and John 1:1-18. I seriously have no idea how Adventists even interpret these texts. But beyond that, I would like to see Adventists address question of Ellen White’s interpretation and every other theological issue we have discussed, for example, the days of worship, specifically analyzed in the context of Luke ch. 1 and 24, and John ch. 1.

I would also separately like to see a verse by verse Adventist exposition of Luke chapter 1, Luke chapter 24, Acts chapters 1 and 2 and John 1:1-17.
Perhaps doing a search, I know I quote a lot on these books, but a couple SDA posters do not represent 22 million people, which is why if you want to know what the SDA church believes just go to our official website...https://www.adventist.org/beliefs/

I don't think a good argument is I don't see someone quoting this verse or that verse to make it mean what you want it to mean. I already showed you we believe in the book of Acts and Luke and quote and study those books, feel free to view any of those sermons- there is a dozen on Luke Chapter 1 and John Chapter 1 which is here for your reference John | Amazing Facts You stated you didn't see the SDA quote these books and as I proven to you, that's not correct.

Anway, need to run for now, thanks for the chat.
 
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The Liturgist

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Where is the scripture that says because Jesus rose on the first day, that we should now make that a day of worship? I have yet to find one scripture that says the first day is holy, sanctified or blessed by God. God commanded us to work six-days Exodus 20:9 and to only keep holy one day. Exodus 20:8-11 The same cycle of creation and we are to follow God because we are made in His image to follow Him. Genesis 1 Genesis 2:1-3

You seem to be reading into the account of Creation week that it somehow makes the first day something different than what God personally commanded Exodus 20:9. There's lots of creative ways we can read into scripture that's not plainly written, but it's never a good idea.

Genesis 1:3 and Luke 24 clearly state that the First Day is blessed by God, and furthermore regarding the sanctity of days other than Saturday and their suitability as occasions for corporate prayer in the churches, did our Lord not command us to pray without ceasing? And why were the disciples gathered on the First Day in Acts 2?

It’s one thing to say we should continue to worship on the Sabbath, and indeed I agree with that; it is another thing to say we should primarily worship on the Sabbath , and I disagree with that, but I understand where Adventists are coming from, but the suggestion that the First Day of the Week, or indeed any of the Seven Days, but especially Wednesday, Thursday, Friday and Sunday, are unholy, and unfit for corporate prayer, is completely erroneous and contrary to the plain sense of Scripture.

And it seems to me like you are saying that the First Day is unholy, correct me if I am wrong.

Since this thread is about the prophecies of Ellen White however and not the Sabbath, or the correct way of worship, I would really like to know if Ellen White ever said that the First Day of the Week is unholy and that it is wrong for Christians who primarily worship on the Seventh Day to also secondarily worship on the First Day, or days other than Saturday.
 
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SabbathBlessings

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Genesis 1:3 and Luke 24 clearly state that the First Day is blessed by God, and furthermore regarding the sanctity of days other than Saturday and their suitability as occasions for corporate prayer in the churches, did our Lord not command us to pray without ceasing? And why were the disciples gathered on the First Day in Acts 2?

It’s one thing to say we should continue to worship on the Sabbath, and indeed I agree with that; it is another thing to say we should primarily worship on the Sabbath , and I disagree with that, but I understand where Adventists are coming from, but the suggestion that the First Day of the Week, or indeed any of the Seven Days, but especially Wednesday, Thursday, Friday and Sunday, are unholy, and unfit for corporate prayer, is completely erroneous and contrary to the plain sense of Scripture.

And it seems to me like you are saying that the First Day is unholy, correct me if I am wrong.

Since this thread is about the prophecies of Ellen White however and not the Sabbath, or the correct way of worship, I would really like to know if Ellen White ever said that the First Day of the Week is unholy and that it is wrong for Christians who primarily worship on the Seventh Day to also secondarily worship on the First Day, or days other than Saturday.
Can you show me where it says that..... Jesus is not a day. I have yet to find one verse in all of God's Word that says the first day God made holy, sanctified or blessed.

Genesis 1:1 In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth. 2 The earth was without form, and void; and darkness was on the face of the deep. And the Spirit of God was hovering over the face of the waters. 3 Then God said, “Let there be light”; and there was light. 4 And God saw the light, that it was good; and God divided the light from the darkness. 5 God called the light Day, and the darkness He called Night. So the evening and the morning were the first day.

Jesus is not a created being- He is the Creator, not the creation. There is nothing that says God blessed the first day, sanctified it or made it holy.

These are God's Words about the seventh day which is the only day God blessed and sanctified- set apart for holy use and He tells us why He did that and commands us to follow this same pattern. Exodus 20:8-11 because man was made in His image to follow Him.

Genesis 2:1 Thus the heavens and the earth, and all the host of them, were finished. 2 And on the seventh day God ended His work which He had done, and He rested on the seventh day from all His work which He had done. 3 Then God blessed the seventh day and sanctified it, because in it He rested from all His work which God had created and made.

We have free will to believe what we want, but imho I think we should be careful and allow scripture to interpret itself.
 
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HIM

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Genesis 1:3 and Luke 24 clearly state that the First Day is blessed by God,


Just inserting what you want in the text? Or Maybe clearly state means something different to you than what it actually means? Because no it is not. Don't add what is not.
and furthermore regarding the sanctity of days other than Saturday and their suitability as occasions for corporate prayer in the churches, did our Lord not command us to pray without ceasing? And why were the disciples gathered on the First Day in Acts 2?

Worship everyday but the 7th day is the Sabbath of our Lord and God. In it we shall not work.
It’s one thing to say we should continue to worship on the Sabbath, and indeed I agree with that; it is another thing to say we should primarily worship on the Sabbath , and I disagree with that, but I understand where Adventists are coming from, but the suggestion that the First Day of the Week, or indeed any of the Seven Days, but especially Wednesday, Thursday, Friday and Sunday, are unholy, and unfit for corporate prayer, is completely erroneous and contrary to the plain sense of Scripture.

God had not sanctified any of them, set them apart for a special purpose and blessed them. Once again do not add what is not.
And it seems to me like you are saying that the First Day is unholy, correct me if I am wrong.

It was not sanctified, set apart and blessed ACCORDING to the Holy Writ.
Since this thread is about the prophecies of Ellen White however and not the Sabbath, or the correct way of worship, I would really like to know if Ellen White ever said that the First Day of the Week is unholy and that it is wrong for Christians who primarily worship on the Seventh Day to also secondarily worship on the First Day, or days other than Saturday.
As long as the Seventh day and the sanctity of it our known it does not matter. But if the Seventh day is not understood as being set apart and blessed yes there is a problem. If she states other wise she should not have.
 
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SabbathBlessings

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Scriptures donot support her doctrine of the Seventh day, so I do not see how she can be classified as a true woman of God. She had plenty other beliefs as well that arent backed up by God's word.

God wrote and God spoke this, not EGW

Exodus 20:10 but the seventh day is the Sabbath of the Lord your God.
 
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HIM

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I am and I am not a sda. I came to realize I needed God in 95. During that time God hit me with what I thought was an extremely profound thought. One God, one Bible so one truth.

In that spirit my journey began prayerfully seeking truth. With no preconceived notions or ideas I study with various groups and found the sda church made the most sense. So I was baptized.

Ellen White as many others in the church had and have the spirit and therefore prophesied. Was everything she penned or said inspired? No that would imply infallibility and that is not possible on this side.

I no longer go to a sda church primarily. And since my journey has begun do not subscribe to labels. Hence my opening statement.
 
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splish- splash

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God wrote and God spoke this, not EGW

Exodus 20:10 but the seventh day is the Sabbath of the Lord your God.

The question is though, when were these commandments given and to whom were they aimed at?

If you insist on observing the 10 commandments, then best make sure that, you belong to this group. Now as far as I know, Mrs White belonged to the gentile group just as myself and most people, so she had no business involving herself in any of this, as she did not even meet the criteria for one single bit. So, before we even look at exodus 20, exodus 19 alone disqualifies her totally.

Exodus 19:
3 Then Moses went up to God, and the Lord called to him from the mountain and said, “This is what you are to say to the descendants of Jacob and what you are to tell the people of Israel: : 4 ‘You yourselves have seen what I did to Egypt, and how I carried you on eagles’ wings and brought you to myself. 5 Now if you obey me fully and keep my covenant, then out of all nations you will be my treasured possession. Although the whole earth is mine, 6 you[a] will be for me a kingdom of priests and a holy nation.’ These are the words you are to speak to the Israelites.”
 
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splish- splash

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God wrote and God spoke this, not EGW

Exodus 20:10 but the seventh day is the Sabbath of the Lord your God.

Then, for those whose roots can be traced back to Jacob, they indeed are Israelites. But again if they are still observing these commandments, where then does that leave Christ and the cross?

Hebrews 7:12 For when the priesthood is changed, the law must be changed also.

& yet this has not been so with Adventists. I'm referring to hebrews 7:12 there..
 
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SabbathBlessings

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The question is though, when were these commandments given and to whom were they aimed at?
God's moral law is aimed for everyone. Do you think God only wants some people to only worship Him, or to keep His name holy and not bow to idols? Only some people to not covet or murder and for others it's okay. I have yet to come across a verse that says this.
If you insist on observing the 10 commandments, then best make sure that, you belong to this group.
God is the one who commanded us to keep His Ten Commandments Exodus 20:6, Exodus 32:16 and its what points out sin. Romans 7:7 Jesus does not want His children to sin but wants us to do what is righteous 1 John 3:7 and all of God's commandments are righteous Psalms 119:172
Now as far as I know, Mrs White belonged to the gentile group just as myself and most people, so she had no business involving herself in any of this, as she did not even meet the criteria for one single bit. So, before we even look at exodus 20, exodus 19 alone disqualifies her totally.

Exodus 19:
3 Then Moses went up to God, and the Lord called to him from the mountain and said, “This is what you are to say to the descendants of Jacob and what you are to tell the people of Israel: : 4 ‘You yourselves have seen what I did to Egypt, and how I carried you on eagles’ wings and brought you to myself. 5 Now if you obey me fully and keep my covenant, then out of all nations you will be my treasured possession. Although the whole earth is mine, 6 you[a] will be for me a kingdom of priests and a holy nation.’ These are the words you are to speak to the Israelites.”
Sorry I'm not following. Jesus told us to teach each other the commandments quoting right from the Ten Matthew 5:19-30 so there is no disqualification for anyone to not teach them. I believe God means what He says and regardless of who is teaching us God's Truth, its better to be reminded now, than before its too late because once Jesus comes our fates will be sealed and we want to hear this Revelation 22:14 instead of this Revelation 22:15. If we love Jesus we should keep His commandments and Jesus and God are one, so are their commandments, which is why Jesus taught to keep them and kept them including the Sabbath commandment as our example to follow. 1 John 2:6 Luke 4:16 John 15:10 The biggest hoax in Christianity is that we do not need to keep God's commandments, which should be kept though love and faith. 1 John 5:3, John 14:15, Romans 3:31 Revelation 14:12
 
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SabbathBlessings

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Then, for those whose roots can be traced back to Jacob, they indeed are Israelites. But again if they are still observing these commandments, where then does that leave Christ and the cross?

Hebrews 7:12 For when the priesthood is changed, the law must be changed also.

& yet this has not been so with Adventists. I'm referring to hebrews 7:12 there..
It's a bit strange you are adding the law that changed in Hebrews 7 was the Sabbath commandment when not one mention of the Sabbath in this entire chapter. If one were to carefully read this chapter would see the law being referred to is the priesthood. Thats the law that changed because Jesus is now our High Priest ministering on our behalf in His Heavenly Kingdom, not an earthy priest.
 
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